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Flybe-V2

Old 13th Apr 2022, 15:04
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Same directors who were heavily involved with the old airline's owners. (Peachey and the now resigned Farrell)

So, we've aircraft with the same name on their fuselage, with the same staff and the same directors.

I guess using that logic BA Euroflyer are a completely new airline all because they've a new companies house registration?

A new legal entity does not mean you're a completely new airline.
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Old 13th Apr 2022, 15:08
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To which airports and on what routes should they fly Skipness. And yes some staff who've been unemployed for two years particularly pilots, now have flying jobs again. You begrudge them that do you?
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Old 13th Apr 2022, 15:33
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Originally Posted by cavokblues
Same directors who were heavily involved with the old airline's owners. (Peachey and the now resigned Farrell)

So, we've aircraft with the same name on their fuselage, with the same staff and the same directors.

I guess using that logic BA Euroflyer are a completely new airline all because they've a new companies house registration?

A new legal entity does not mean you're a completely new airline.
If I buy the Jolly Fryer fish shop down the road, people will still come in through the door because the name is over the door but I might change the fish, the batter and the oil. In a very obscure place (plaice?) will be a sign telling people that there is a very different owner but most people won't notice.

If there is a business out there called the Jolly Fryer, what I have just said has absolutely no connection to your business.
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Old 13th Apr 2022, 15:40
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I get the analogy but it's missing an important point. You had a fish shop called the Jolly Fryer. But, despite your best efforts to turn it around, you fail for reasons outside your control and the fish shop was placed into administration. You then set up a new company, buy the new Jolly Fryer name from the administrators and then set up a new company at companies house and then transfer the old companies name to the new company. It's still the same fish shop, except now it files its accounts under a different company registration.

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Old 13th Apr 2022, 15:45
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Exactly. Different company, different airline, only bearing the same name. If anyone is aggrieved from Flybe v1, they should vent in that thread not here.. and speak to the Joint Administrators to whom they have a claim
Follow the money. Who's paying?
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Old 13th Apr 2022, 15:48
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Originally Posted by cavokblues
Same directors who were heavily involved with the old airline's owners. (Peachey and the now resigned Farrell)

So, we've aircraft with the same name on their fuselage, with the same staff and the same directors.

A new legal entity does not mean you're a completely new airline.
But setting up a entirely new Airline with an entirely new AOC and approvals and licenses from the CAA does. Give it a rest.

& Farrell and Peachy were not the ones responsible for Flybe v1's demise. They came onboard with Cyrus (the owners.. the shareholders) to try and save the airline before Covid. Why not blame the likes of Christine Ourmières-Widener, Jim French et al for all the missteps.. rather than bleat on and on in here; the Flybe v2 thread.

Agenda after agenda, I tell you.

New Flybe is airborne!!! All the naysayers and doubters need a huge slice of humble pie.
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Old 13th Apr 2022, 15:58
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Originally Posted by RogueOne
But setting up a entirely new Airline with an entirely new AOC and approvals and licenses from the CAA does. Give it a rest.

& Farrell and Peachy were not the ones responsible for Flybe v1's demise. They came onboard with Cyrus (the owners.. the shareholders) to try and save the airline before Covid. Why not blame the likes of Christine Ourmières-Widener, Jim French et al for all the missteps.. rather than bleat on and on in here; the Flybe v2 thread.

Agenda after agenda, I tell you.

New Flybe is airborne!!! All the naysayers and doubters need a huge slice of humble pie.
Well said. And it was Virgin and Stobart who pulled the plug. Farrell has leftbanyway
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Old 13th Apr 2022, 15:59
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Originally Posted by JobsaGoodun
Why would they? This is a brand new compnay that just shares the old brand name.
Perhaps your question should be directed at British Airways who left a large hole in this scheme when they transferred BAConnect to Flybe back on 2007.
Yep, a big boy done it and ran away!
Flybe took on the liabilities as part of the deal, it was on them to manage the fund going forward.
Maybe a new company by law, but it's the same rattling skeleton underneath.
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Old 13th Apr 2022, 16:01
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Originally Posted by RogueOne
But setting up a entirely new Airline with an entirely new AOC and approvals and licenses from the CAA does. Give it a rest.

& Farrell and Peachy were not the ones responsible for Flybe v1's demise. They came onboard with Cyrus (the owners.. the shareholders) to try and save the airline before Covid. Why not blame the likes of Christine Ourmières-Widener, Jim French et al for all the missteps.. rather than bleat on and on in here; the Flybe v2 thread.

Agenda after agenda, I tell you.

New Flybe is airborne!!! All the naysayers and doubters need a huge slice of humble pie.
So we have assets that are used within the business which can be aircraft, vehicles etc. but also include goodwill. I think goodwill is a difficult concept when the company has gone spectacularly bust owing people money. The assets have an owner which can be a person or a body corporate. Whilst a person would generally have unlimited liability, the liability of a limited liability company is limited to the capital invested in the company. So long as they don't trade whilst insolvent, the liability of the directors and shareholders is limited to their investment. If my name is John Smith, I am not liable for the debts of any other John Smith. In the same way a new airline is not liable for any debt of any identically named old airline even though they have bought the goodwill entitling them to trade under an identical name.
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Old 13th Apr 2022, 16:11
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Lots of other nice articles online, Birmingham Mail, a couple from Belfast, plus nice gifts for the passengers.

Everyone looks really happy in all the photos online, on twitter and linkedin.

https://www.independent.co.uk/travel...-b2057073.html
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Old 13th Apr 2022, 16:28
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Why does having a new AOC make you a brand new airline? So Ryanair UK and BA Euroflyer are brand new airlines entirely?

I'm not blaming Peachey and Farrell, or anyone, for the old airline's demise. I just profoundly disagree with the assertion this is a new airline with no connections whatsoever.

Edit: Just noticed the headline of the Independent article is 'Flybe Returns.' Please can those outraged by this make sure you write to the journalist Simon Calder and tell him he has an 'agenda.'

Last edited by cavokblues; 13th Apr 2022 at 21:30. Reason: Spelling
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Old 13th Apr 2022, 16:53
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Originally Posted by cavokblues
Why does having a new AOC make you a brand new airline? So Ryanair UK and BA Euroflyer are brand new airlines entirely?

I'm not blaming Preachey and Farrell anyone for the old airline's demise. I just profoundly disagree with the assertion this is a new airline with no connections whatsoever.

Edit: Just noticed the headline of the Independent article is 'Flybe Returns.' Please can those outraged by this make sure you write to the journalist Simon Calder and tell him he has an 'agenda.'
Read the bloody article
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Old 13th Apr 2022, 16:56
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I've read the 'bloody' article, old bean. A nice quote from the BHX MD welcoming the airline back. Make sure you let him know how angry his quote makes you.
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Old 13th Apr 2022, 17:07
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Originally Posted by cavokblues
I've read the 'bloody' article, old bean. A nice quote from the BHX MD welcoming the airline back. Make sure you let him know how angry his quote makes you.
Put your money where your mouth is, write to Flybe and give them your opinion instead of deliberately being provocative on here
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Old 13th Apr 2022, 17:28
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It's unlikely either faction of the new business v's continuation of the old business are going to convince the other that they are right - its just repetitive.
Legally, Flybe is a new business, morally each to their own but given the numbers of forward ticket sales Joe Public doesn't care.

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Old 13th Apr 2022, 17:32
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Just seen the report on UTV Live.
Water Cannon from the fire service and Flybe German biscuits.
It's bound to be a success !
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Old 13th Apr 2022, 17:33
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Disagreeing with you old bean isn't being deliberately provocative anymore than some of your remarks on here have been.

I think Jamie2009 has hit the nail on the head. If the product and price are good Joe Public won't give a hoot. As I've said before, I wish the airline well. Any new airline offering people jobs in this superb industry is to be welcomed.

Last edited by cavokblues; 13th Apr 2022 at 17:45.
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Old 13th Apr 2022, 17:42
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Originally Posted by Jamie2009
It's unlikely either faction of the new business v's continuation of the old business are going to convince the other that they are right - its just repetitive.
Legally, Flybe is a new business, morally each to their own but given the numbers of forward ticket sales Joe Public doesn't care.
Thank you. Sense at last
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Old 13th Apr 2022, 18:05
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So let's park it from boths sides and see how they do. I don't think they deserve to succeed, as failed businesses really should stay failed IMHO. There's a bad smell about reneging on your debts and relaunching and many, many do not buy the "it's a different airline" line. The public will likely buy tickets and the losers may end up being the airlines who didn't renege on their debts and kept afloat during the toughest of times. The winner may well be the debt free "new" flybe, the public doesn't care. Any job losses at Loganair, Eastern, Aurigny or Blue Islands at the door of flybe2 will be especially hard to swallow. I am no left wing socialist but some business practices are clearly legal and IMHO, unethical.
But please stop the pretence that's they've got nothing to do with the failed original, it's not believable.
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Old 13th Apr 2022, 21:23
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Originally Posted by Skipness One Foxtrot
So let's park it from boths sides and see how they do. I don't think they deserve to succeed, as failed businesses really should stay failed IMHO. There's a bad smell about reneging on your debts and relaunching and many, many do not buy the "it's a different airline" line. The public will likely buy tickets and the losers may end up being the airlines who didn't renege on their debts and kept afloat during the toughest of times. The winner may well be the debt free "new" flybe, the public doesn't care. Any job losses at Loganair, Eastern, Aurigny or Blue Islands at the door of flybe2 will be especially hard to swallow. I am no left wing socialist but some business practices are clearly legal and IMHO, unethical.
But please stop the pretence that's they've got nothing to do with the failed original, it's not believable.
Last word because I'm losing the will to live.

Both sides are correct. They have bought the continuing business reputation of the old business so are continuing the old business but haven't bought a going concern.
It is a new company with a new AOC and a new Operating Licence so is clearly a new airline so that is correct also.

ENDS
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