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Gatwick-3

Old 26th Sep 2023, 09:24
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Originally Posted by lfc84
Their ops at LGW is tiny
Thats not the point.
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Old 26th Sep 2023, 09:36
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Originally Posted by Charley B
Excellent article from Michele Robson who was a controller for NATS for over 20 years

Gatwick launches flight curb due to ATC staffing

Great article, thanks for sharing this
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Old 26th Sep 2023, 10:53
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Glad it was enjoyed..after ready many OTT newspaper ones ,that was well written and to the point ..I know that a good few NATS controllers left the tower in 2014 and it seems the German Co did not recruit many after they took over ..leaving NATS very short now
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Old 26th Sep 2023, 10:57
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Good to see an article with actual statistics and reasoning behind it... Just need a few more controllers which is easier said then done
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Old 26th Sep 2023, 11:15
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Originally Posted by Splat
I do wonder if all this goes back to that t@at MOL pushing fares down. Eventually everyone’s costs are squeezed so low either other ancillaries such as drop off charges are needed, or there is a reduction in service levels which is where we are at.
The impact was more that full service carriers introduced the bundling concept in pursuit of maintaining market share even though their business models are not competitive on price. Ryanair delivers to expectations, some full service carriers with legacy brands do not.
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Old 26th Sep 2023, 11:47
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But Ryanair have lead the charge on airport costs
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Old 26th Sep 2023, 11:57
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Originally Posted by Splat
I do wonder if all this goes back to that t@at MOL pushing fares down. Eventually everyone’s costs are squeezed so low either other ancillaries such as drop off charges are needed, or there is a reduction in service levels which is where we are at.
You're clearly confused. This is NATS, nothing to do with Ryanair. This seems to be just gross mismanagement and a board (including some prominent airlines BA, Easyjet etc) prioritising shareholder return over system/staff investment. £550 million returned to shareholders over the last few years with an ever-decreasing service to the airline community from which they derive their income.
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Old 26th Sep 2023, 12:13
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Originally Posted by TartinTon
You're clearly confused. This is NATS, nothing to do with Ryanair. This seems to be just gross mismanagement and a board (including some prominent airlines BA, Easyjet etc) prioritising shareholder return over system/staff investment. £550 million returned to shareholders over the last few years with an ever-decreasing service to the airline community from which they derive their income.
NATS have to compete to get the LGW ATC contract, so will be looking to provide it at the lowest cost. They may not be directly involved, but Ryanair have been at the vanguard of the push to reduce airport costs leading to reduced T&C's and lower staffing levels which are now across the industry. This is the point being made. As we regularly see there is now little flex in the system for when sh*t happens, and we all know it happens often enough
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Old 26th Sep 2023, 21:12
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Ground handling

Anyone know who has the contract for Air Mauritius/Ethiopian/China Southern?
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Old 26th Sep 2023, 21:43
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Funny how Ryanair end up getting the blame for everything, it’s obviously nothing to do with Ryanair.

I read somewhere that some airlines may be operating from alternative Airports for a short period, I can’t find it now and not sure if I read it properly, has anyone heard anything along those lines or was I imagining it.
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Old 27th Sep 2023, 05:06
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Originally Posted by SWBKCB
NATS have to compete to get the LGW ATC contract, so will be looking to provide it at the lowest cost.
Compete with whom exactly?
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Old 27th Sep 2023, 06:56
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Originally Posted by Dannyboy39
Compete with whom exactly?
Quite simple, the exact answer is they have to compete with other Air Navigaton Service Providers who could/would bid on the service provision contract.
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Old 27th Sep 2023, 18:39
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Originally Posted by Dannyboy39
Compete with whom exactly?
Other ANSPs like DFS. NATS lost the Gatwick contract in 2014 to DFS, as Gatwick Airport obviously wanted a cheaper option. DFS bailed out last year and didn't complete the contract and NATS have had to go back in and sort it out. If Gatwick airport had left NATS in the tower they probably wouldnt have been in this mess now.
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Old 27th Sep 2023, 18:49
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The concept of ATC based on price is weapons grade foolishness. There are some things that should be open to competitive tendering but ATC provision has VERY few specialist providers of which NATS is one.
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Old 27th Sep 2023, 19:40
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Railtrack
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Old 27th Sep 2023, 21:31
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The other week several of us on here were debating possible long haul contenders at LGW.

We discussed several possible candidate's including China Southern Airlines which we eventually dismissed.

How things change in such a short space of time.

China Southern Airlines announces Zhengzhou to London Gatwick.

Effectivel 12 December 2023 and operated twice weekly by B788.

CZ653 CGO 14.00 LGW 17.20 days 26 788
CZ654 LGW 20.20 CGO 15.00+1 days 26 788

Meanwhile Sri Lankan Airways want to add an additional three flights between Colombo and LHR. The airline currently operates the route on a daily basis but wants to increase it to 10 weekly.

The airline has recently stated in the travel media that those extra three flights might be difficult to obtain at LHR due to a lack of available and suitable slots.

Debating the topic again, could Sri Lankan Airlines be a possible future contender for LGW. Of course, it would be a service resumption for the airline. Air Lanka which the airline was previously known as flew to LGW from 1979 to 1991.

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Old 27th Sep 2023, 23:31
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Sri Lankan have 9 weekly LHR slots in winter I think? UL505 runs weekends in addition to the daily UL 503.
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Old 28th Sep 2023, 00:16
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Originally Posted by Skipness One Foxtrot
Sri Lankan have 9 weekly LHR slots in winter I think? UL505 runs weekends in addition to the daily UL 503.
To be totally honest Skip when I originally read the article regarding those extra three flights I was sort of under the impression that they flew at least twice daily on certain day's during the winter.

They were leasing some slots at some point. Perhaps it's those extra flights during the winter season that they want to make permanent.

On side note. It's great to see the beautiful country of Sri Lanka on the rebound after such a tormented period. There has been a lot of positive coverage of the country on TV over the last year and lots of YouTube footage. After previously visiting Sri Lanka on several occasions I can only hope that the increase in trade as well as travel and tourism will benefit the entire country.
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Old 28th Sep 2023, 13:31
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So much for flow control restrictions this week, taking a Jet2 diversion today, Ok it was PAN so emergency but STN only up road - and a BizJet arrival today. Couldn't the later movement been used for an Easyjet canx flight?
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Old 28th Sep 2023, 13:48
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Originally Posted by pabely
So much for flow control restrictions this week, taking a Jet2 diversion today, Ok it was PAN so emergency but STN only up road - and a BizJet arrival today. Couldn't the later movement been used for an Easyjet canx flight?
in the jet2 diversion case this was a medical emergency that required immediate medical intervention - STN might only be up the road but so too is EMA it’s final destination. The flight deck must have deemed it serious enough to get straight on the ground otherwise surely 10mins more and they could have been at EMA. There are also a lot more factors to consider in a medical divert and going to a base where there is no Jet2 ground staff is again not advised unless in an emergency and clearly this was.
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