Ryanair - 7
Join Date: Oct 2006
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daz211 - whether your on a package or not the legislation is quite clear your airline has a duty of care. If the Ryanair business model is simply to drive costs to the bone and does have built in contingency plans to cover emergencies then thats the airlines problems I am afraid and not the fare paying public.
As for the matter of going to court then I am afraid MOL does not have a leg to stand on. Its not a case of asking a judge to interpret the law as its set out in black and white I am afraid.
One final point, is it not too much to ask Europes most profitable airline (MOLs own words not mine) to look after its passengers?
As for the matter of going to court then I am afraid MOL does not have a leg to stand on. Its not a case of asking a judge to interpret the law as its set out in black and white I am afraid.
One final point, is it not too much to ask Europes most profitable airline (MOLs own words not mine) to look after its passengers?
But was it the governments that denied travel or NATS and their respective counterparts in Europe?
Join Date: Jul 2006
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ncleflights
We will see I stand by what I said at the end of the day the law is there to be challanged and there is no way on this earth Any Airline is fault full stop.
Ryanair has done everthing possable to keep passengers informed and will get passengers back home infact they have done all they could do.
Ryanair has done everthing possable to keep passengers informed and will get passengers back home infact they have done all they could do.
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racedo - see my previous post, your talking complete rubish. If you take time to check the CAA's own regulations. The ultimate decision to close airspace in instances such as this lies with NATS. Remember the whole of Northern Europes airspace was closed. Was this a conspiracy of every government in Northern Europe? To achieve what?
Youve been watching far too much of the X files
Youve been watching far too much of the X files
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daz211 - As usual with those that worship in the church of Ryanair and think they can do no wrong you not letting the facts get in the way of the truth.
How on earth are Ryanair doing everything they can to get passengers home they are the last airline to get flying in Northern Europe!! While easyjet, jet2, ba the list goes on have been flying all day Ryanair arnt commencing ops in Northern Europe until tomorrow. Come on wake up to the reality that this airline provides poor customer service and provides zero duty of care.
How on earth are Ryanair doing everything they can to get passengers home they are the last airline to get flying in Northern Europe!! While easyjet, jet2, ba the list goes on have been flying all day Ryanair arnt commencing ops in Northern Europe until tomorrow. Come on wake up to the reality that this airline provides poor customer service and provides zero duty of care.
Reading the text in English of regulation 261/2004, paragraph 12 states:
Article 5, paragraph 3 on the subject of cancellation states
Getting Ryanair to pay compensation beyond the cost of the ticket is likely to involve a court - perhaps small claims or magistrate. In a court, I suspect that an airline would claim the eruption of a volcano for the first time in 200 years causing the closure of much of European airspace to be an extraordinary circumstance. It would be difficult to show to a court that this is not an extraordinary circumstance.
The trouble and inconvenience to passengers caused by cancellation of flights should also be reduced. This should be achieved by inducing carrier to inform passengers of cancellations before the scheduled time of departure and in addition to offer them reasonable re-routing, so that the passengers can make other arrangements. Air carriers should compensate passengers if they fail to do this, except when the cancellation occurs in extraordinary circumstances which could not have been avoided even if all reasonable measures had been taken..
An operating air carrier shall not be obliged to pay compensation in accordance with Article 7, if it can probve that the cancellation is caused by extraordinary circumstances which could not have been avoided even if all reasonable measures had been taken.
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Right im not saying all airlines should pay except Ryanair Im saying no airline should so you can stop getting personal with the "worship in the church of Ryanair" thing
Ryanair needed more time to sort things out re crew and A/C remember they have more A/C than most and its not always the best thing to jump back in with both feet first Easyjet have been giving passenger one hours notice of some flights from what I have seen on the news where Ryanair passengers can see when flights will restart.
THE REGULATION !
when the cancellation occurs in extraordinary circumstances which could not have been avoided even if all reasonable measures had been taken..
is there anything more EXTRAORDINARY than closing Airspace for almost a week due to a volcano and the direction of the wind ?
Ryanair needed more time to sort things out re crew and A/C remember they have more A/C than most and its not always the best thing to jump back in with both feet first Easyjet have been giving passenger one hours notice of some flights from what I have seen on the news where Ryanair passengers can see when flights will restart.
THE REGULATION !
when the cancellation occurs in extraordinary circumstances which could not have been avoided even if all reasonable measures had been taken..
is there anything more EXTRAORDINARY than closing Airspace for almost a week due to a volcano and the direction of the wind ?
racedo - see my previous post, your talking complete rubish. If you take time to check the CAA's own regulations. The ultimate decision to close airspace in instances such as this lies with NATS. Remember the whole of Northern Europes airspace was closed. Was this a conspiracy of every government in Northern Europe? To achieve what?
Youve been watching far too much of the X files
Youve been watching far too much of the X files
Assumming that they can do what they want without reference to the Govt is a nice idea but far from reality.
Afterall why would Lord Adonis make the initial announcement if it was only CAA and nothing to do with Government whether it reopened.
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Some people on this thread seem incapable of reading the regulations. The duty of care laid out in article 9 applies regardless of extraordinary circumstances, and even Ryanair does not have the brass neck to deny this. If it really does try to limit this duty of care to the price of the ticket it will be laughed out of court.
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daz211 - i take you would therefore wish to see no airline have a duty of care towards the folks that keep them flying - the passenger. With regard to Ryanair and there slow resumption of flying and your comparison to easyjet. I can only speak from our experience here at Newcastle but it was certainly the case that no flights operated 'giving a only an hours notice'. All ezy based aircraft operated near full ops, thats getting people home quicker by the way, to timetable. I can not normally draw a compaison to Ryanair ops and the quality airlines that have bases at NCL as we dont have the experiance of a Ryanair base in the NE - thankfully.
racedo - sorry to repeat my earlier post but CAA guidelines are clear decisions on whether to close airspace due to weather etc lie solely with NATS I suggest you check with the CAA tomorrow if you still wish to go along with this ridiculous assumption that this was a political decision - why would the collective governments of the UK, France, Austria,
Germany, Denmark etc wish to close down their airspace!!
apaul - agree 100%
racedo - sorry to repeat my earlier post but CAA guidelines are clear decisions on whether to close airspace due to weather etc lie solely with NATS I suggest you check with the CAA tomorrow if you still wish to go along with this ridiculous assumption that this was a political decision - why would the collective governments of the UK, France, Austria,
Germany, Denmark etc wish to close down their airspace!!
apaul - agree 100%
Join Date: Aug 2007
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I think we all agree the regulations didn't envisage compensation on this scale but then again MOL can't have it both ways... High price carriers have been paying the bills already hence their larger costs for the downtime...
Make no mistake this issue is so large and the EU have already flagged this issue up they won't get away with their stance no matter how much I tend to agree with part of their arguement.....
I hope genuime claims are honoured where costs have been kept to a reasonable figure and those that think sod it and exagerate their claim receive nothing....
Make no mistake this issue is so large and the EU have already flagged this issue up they won't get away with their stance no matter how much I tend to agree with part of their arguement.....
I hope genuime claims are honoured where costs have been kept to a reasonable figure and those that think sod it and exagerate their claim receive nothing....
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people talk
lots of people away over the school break will have been messed up and will talk for months about how they were treated. it seems ryanair have been the least helpful and slowest to restart flights. I am sure when people compare notes they will rate ryanair very poor compared to others. Come next easter break we will see who gets the best load factors.
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Come next Easter, nobody will remember. MOL knows that.
Cant stand the bloke or his airline but agree with him this time.
However the law is the law. I can't see how he can avoid these payments.
Just heard on the BBC that MOL has backed down and agrees he will pay.
Cant stand the bloke or his airline but agree with him this time.
However the law is the law. I can't see how he can avoid these payments.
Just heard on the BBC that MOL has backed down and agrees he will pay.
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MOL is the first to use EU laws on competition issues etc when it suits but then attacks EU rules when it doesn't suit him.... Of course he has backed down as all airlines will now pass the bill to the EU...in other words you and I as tax payers.
The rules are an ass we agree but its the same for all carriers..... Its good to see HSBC and some others taking adverts to say in these exceptional circumstances they will cover reasonable claims... we'll see.
The rules are an ass we agree but its the same for all carriers..... Its good to see HSBC and some others taking adverts to say in these exceptional circumstances they will cover reasonable claims... we'll see.
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At the end of the day the airlines will claim these extra costs back from their respective governments as compensations therefore us tax payers will pay through the nose again, just like the banks.
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Ryanair say they will now refund expenses, source: RTÉ News: LIVE - Travel Updates
Ryanair spokesperson Stephen McNamara has said Michael O'Leary 'got it wrong' when he said the airline would limit its refunds to stranded passengers.
The airline today said it was happy to work within the EU regulations which allow passengers to claim reasonable expenses.
Extra staff have been drafted in to deal with the expenses claims.
Passengers are asked to send in copies of their receipts when they return home.
It is hoped that they will be refunded within a number of weeks.
The airline today said it was happy to work within the EU regulations which allow passengers to claim reasonable expenses.
Extra staff have been drafted in to deal with the expenses claims.
Passengers are asked to send in copies of their receipts when they return home.
It is hoped that they will be refunded within a number of weeks.