Ryanair - 6
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Now that Madrid South (Cuidad Real) airport is open, don't be surprised if Ryanair show up there. They talked about it being their "Madrid" destination a few years ago, once it opened......and they can probably do a deal at a new airport.
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Ryanair to close Valencia base - | MSN News UK - news & weather
Ryanair to close Valencia base
Budget airline Ryanair announced it is shutting its base in Valencia, Spain, with the loss of 70 weekly flights following a row with the local council.
The Irish carrier flew from Valencia to 10 destinations including three in England - Stansted, East Midlands and Liverpool.
Flights on all 10 routes, which were used by 750,000 passengers a year, will be cancelled from November 4, Ryanair said. A total of 750 local jobs will be lost.
Ryanair blamed the decision on "the refusal of the Comunitat Valenciana to engage in constructive discussions in relation to the promotion of the airport and its routes across Ryanair's network in Europe".
The airline said its investment of more than 140 million dollars (about £85 million) would be moved to another of its bases, with an announcement expected next week.
Ryanair, which announced its new Valencia base in August last year, said it had been seeking to co-operate with the tourism department of the Comunitat Valenciana with a view to promoting the region across Europe.
The airline said: "At the same time as the Comunitat Valenciana was telling Ryanair that no funds were available for such co-operative activity, they were granting a 12 million euro (about £9.6 million) award of marketing support to the local airline, Air Nostrum, who delivered neither growth nor international passengers to the region.
"Furthermore, the Comunitat Valenciana ignored Ryanair's request for engagement on these important promotional issues and indeed more recently turned down all reasonable requests for meetings."
Ryanair deputy chief executive Michael Cawley said: "This is a very black day for the airport of Valencia and the city and region which it serves. Without any assistance or co-operation from the local tourism board, Ryanair has already shown the possibilities which are uniquely available through its low fares."
He went on: "However, the naked subsidisation by the Comunitat Valenciana of competitor airlines at the expense of Ryanair and the refusal by the same party to engage in any meaningful discussion with Ryanair have meant that continuation of our base at the airport is untenable."
Ryanair to close Valencia base - | MSN News UK - news & weather
Ryanair to close Valencia base
Budget airline Ryanair announced it is shutting its base in Valencia, Spain, with the loss of 70 weekly flights following a row with the local council.
The Irish carrier flew from Valencia to 10 destinations including three in England - Stansted, East Midlands and Liverpool.
Flights on all 10 routes, which were used by 750,000 passengers a year, will be cancelled from November 4, Ryanair said. A total of 750 local jobs will be lost.
Ryanair blamed the decision on "the refusal of the Comunitat Valenciana to engage in constructive discussions in relation to the promotion of the airport and its routes across Ryanair's network in Europe".
The airline said its investment of more than 140 million dollars (about £85 million) would be moved to another of its bases, with an announcement expected next week.
Ryanair, which announced its new Valencia base in August last year, said it had been seeking to co-operate with the tourism department of the Comunitat Valenciana with a view to promoting the region across Europe.
The airline said: "At the same time as the Comunitat Valenciana was telling Ryanair that no funds were available for such co-operative activity, they were granting a 12 million euro (about £9.6 million) award of marketing support to the local airline, Air Nostrum, who delivered neither growth nor international passengers to the region.
"Furthermore, the Comunitat Valenciana ignored Ryanair's request for engagement on these important promotional issues and indeed more recently turned down all reasonable requests for meetings."
Ryanair deputy chief executive Michael Cawley said: "This is a very black day for the airport of Valencia and the city and region which it serves. Without any assistance or co-operation from the local tourism board, Ryanair has already shown the possibilities which are uniquely available through its low fares."
He went on: "However, the naked subsidisation by the Comunitat Valenciana of competitor airlines at the expense of Ryanair and the refusal by the same party to engage in any meaningful discussion with Ryanair have meant that continuation of our base at the airport is untenable."
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Now that Madrid South (Cuidad Real) airport is open, don't be surprised if Ryanair show up there. They talked about it being their "Madrid" destination a few years ago, once it opened......and they can probably do a deal at a new airport.
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If this cloud has a silver lining (and assuming that flights to/from Stansted continue) we'll have seen the last of the mayhem which sometimes occurs when several Ryanair flights depart within a short period of time, with late gate changes compounding the problem from time to time.
I see from the "Heathrow" thread that Clickair is abandoning the LHR-VLC route. Will BA resurrect its plan to fly from Gatwick, I wonder? The other player from London, of course, is easyJet. It'll be interesting to see its schedules to Valencia.
The figure of 750 local jobs being lost quoted on Ryanair's website is pretty much in line with the numbers I've read in the local press. I can see local businesses putting considerable pressure on the regional government to get back round the table with Ryanair.
I see from the "Heathrow" thread that Clickair is abandoning the LHR-VLC route. Will BA resurrect its plan to fly from Gatwick, I wonder? The other player from London, of course, is easyJet. It'll be interesting to see its schedules to Valencia.
The figure of 750 local jobs being lost quoted on Ryanair's website is pretty much in line with the numbers I've read in the local press. I can see local businesses putting considerable pressure on the regional government to get back round the table with Ryanair.
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The solution is maybe not far from VLC. Ask Villareal CF: Aeroport Castello 
Bienvenidos a la página web del Aeroport Castelló
Bienvenidos a la página web del Aeroport Castelló
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Ciudad Real is 55 minutes from Madrid by expensive high-speed train; Terminals 1-2-3 at Barajas are roughly 12 minutes and 2 euros from Madrid by metro.
On the other hand, the new airport at Castellon might look attractive to Ryanair, although I understand that Air Berlin recently announced that it has no plans to serve it (unlike Ciudad Real).
I think Ryanair should also look at Salamanca. The domestic airfares to/from that city are truly gobsmacking!
On the other hand, the new airport at Castellon might look attractive to Ryanair, although I understand that Air Berlin recently announced that it has no plans to serve it (unlike Ciudad Real).
I think Ryanair should also look at Salamanca. The domestic airfares to/from that city are truly gobsmacking!
Last edited by Seat62K; 24th Oct 2008 at 11:41. Reason: clarity
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Ciudad Real
They talked about it being their "Madrid" destination a few years ago
Or was it just us PPRUNErs who assumed it all... (?)
PS - Is the high speed train connection already in place?
Regarding Valencia - exciting times indeed!
Where will be the new base? When will operations start there?
Ryanair to Ciudad Real ?
To get from Barajas to central Madrid on the metro costs 2.75 euros with a very frequent service.
To get from Ciudad Real station to Madrid (ignoring the metro):
Slow train (only 2 of these per day) takes about 3 hours and costs 17.1 euros one way
Fast trains cost either 19.2 or 34.7 euros if bought at the station depending on the train you take, go approx every hour and take an hour. Tickets for about half these trains can be bought in advance on the web for around 20 euros one way (about 16 pounds). For a very small number of trains, you can buy a ticket in advance for 13 euros - but be prepared to wait a few hours between your plane arriving and the train departing
Yes, in both Oslo and Stockholm, Ryanair flies to the middle-of-nowhere - but neither Gardemoen nor Arlanda are on the metro and trains to the city centre are expensive, meaning transport costs from Torp or Skavsta are competitive.
Given the time and cost involved, if flying to Madrid I'd need a pretty good reason - or very cheap airfare - to choose Ciudad Real airport over Madrid Barajas.
To get from Ciudad Real station to Madrid (ignoring the metro):
Slow train (only 2 of these per day) takes about 3 hours and costs 17.1 euros one way
Fast trains cost either 19.2 or 34.7 euros if bought at the station depending on the train you take, go approx every hour and take an hour. Tickets for about half these trains can be bought in advance on the web for around 20 euros one way (about 16 pounds). For a very small number of trains, you can buy a ticket in advance for 13 euros - but be prepared to wait a few hours between your plane arriving and the train departing
Yes, in both Oslo and Stockholm, Ryanair flies to the middle-of-nowhere - but neither Gardemoen nor Arlanda are on the metro and trains to the city centre are expensive, meaning transport costs from Torp or Skavsta are competitive.
Given the time and cost involved, if flying to Madrid I'd need a pretty good reason - or very cheap airfare - to choose Ciudad Real airport over Madrid Barajas.
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Valencia 0 ryanair 1
Everyone is having a go at Ryanair over this issue but i personally feel that they are fully entitled to leave Valencia behind as a hub - how can one be expected to progress if the local government officials do not support an Airline which would not only work to promote the city of Valencia but give local business's & local people much improved work prospects .
You only have to look at the transformation at Gerona Airport and within the Costa Brava tourist industry to see the huge benefits of having a budget airline use your airport as a major hub .
The first year the Ryanair flights where available into Gerona we found the coast very quiet with 1 or 2 hotels open in the likes of Calella , Lloret de Mar , Roses etc and the airport was tiny .
Now these towns are booming - tourism which was once dead in the winter is now alive & well and the Catalan government offices have worked tirelessly with Ryanair to promote this . Hotels that once closed in October are now open all year round therefore local bars & shops now stay open . Dont forget local bus services & taxi companys who also benefit from the increase in tourism - plus of course the tobacconists !!!
The airport is expanding all the time , building work & improvements ongoing - bigger & better facilitys .
All of this can only be good news for Gerona and its occupants .
So thats why i find it incredible that the people of Valencia could be so very let down by their own local government office's .
I think it is a sad day for a Valencia and for all the other citys that where linked to it via Ryanair routes - I for one flew to Malta via Valencia in Febuary and had an amazing time and had a very interesting conversation with a few locals on the flight .
They where so enthusiastic about being able to travel all over Europe for very reasonable fares & at not being held to ransom by national airlines ( iberia etc ) & international ( Ba etc ) anymore .
I think its a total cockcup and Ryanair have every right to be miffed off by other Airlines getting huge grants to promote their services whilst their investment is ignored and i hope the people responsible get kicked out of office .
I do however hope that matters can be resolved because i think Valencia & its people have so much more to offer traveller's like myself
You only have to look at the transformation at Gerona Airport and within the Costa Brava tourist industry to see the huge benefits of having a budget airline use your airport as a major hub .
The first year the Ryanair flights where available into Gerona we found the coast very quiet with 1 or 2 hotels open in the likes of Calella , Lloret de Mar , Roses etc and the airport was tiny .
Now these towns are booming - tourism which was once dead in the winter is now alive & well and the Catalan government offices have worked tirelessly with Ryanair to promote this . Hotels that once closed in October are now open all year round therefore local bars & shops now stay open . Dont forget local bus services & taxi companys who also benefit from the increase in tourism - plus of course the tobacconists !!!
The airport is expanding all the time , building work & improvements ongoing - bigger & better facilitys .
All of this can only be good news for Gerona and its occupants .
So thats why i find it incredible that the people of Valencia could be so very let down by their own local government office's .
I think it is a sad day for a Valencia and for all the other citys that where linked to it via Ryanair routes - I for one flew to Malta via Valencia in Febuary and had an amazing time and had a very interesting conversation with a few locals on the flight .
They where so enthusiastic about being able to travel all over Europe for very reasonable fares & at not being held to ransom by national airlines ( iberia etc ) & international ( Ba etc ) anymore .
I think its a total cockcup and Ryanair have every right to be miffed off by other Airlines getting huge grants to promote their services whilst their investment is ignored and i hope the people responsible get kicked out of office .
I do however hope that matters can be resolved because i think Valencia & its people have so much more to offer traveller's like myself
Valencia v Gerona
Gerona airport has historically been used for holiday charters. Barcelona is about 90 mins drive away and has a large airport supported by a hefty city population. One can think of Gerona airport as really a sort of overflow facility for Barcelona that happens to be near some beaches. The area that's nearer to Gerona airport than Barcelona is largely rural
Valencia on the other hand is a large city. Not quite as large as Barcelona, but definitely a big city none the less. It also has a large airport.
Unlike with Girona, where originating passengers are few - and thus an airline cannot get bi-directional traffic, Valencia is a commercial centre, has the tourist attractions, is on the coast, and has locally originating traffic.
The Valencia Govt know that a Spanish regional carrier like Air Nostrum needs to have significant operations at Valencia and will stick with it for the long haul. Ryanair does not need Valencia. Whether the regional Govt gives a subsidy to Air Nostrum is debatable (there may be a public service need to ensure flights to places in Spain), but under EU law it would be extremely difficult to justify taxpayers money going to Ryanair. Would it be justifiable for Birmingham council to subsidise Ryanair ?
Valencia on the other hand is a large city. Not quite as large as Barcelona, but definitely a big city none the less. It also has a large airport.
Unlike with Girona, where originating passengers are few - and thus an airline cannot get bi-directional traffic, Valencia is a commercial centre, has the tourist attractions, is on the coast, and has locally originating traffic.
The Valencia Govt know that a Spanish regional carrier like Air Nostrum needs to have significant operations at Valencia and will stick with it for the long haul. Ryanair does not need Valencia. Whether the regional Govt gives a subsidy to Air Nostrum is debatable (there may be a public service need to ensure flights to places in Spain), but under EU law it would be extremely difficult to justify taxpayers money going to Ryanair. Would it be justifiable for Birmingham council to subsidise Ryanair ?
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East Midlands - Ryanair
Just had a look at Ryanair.com, all flights to valencia from East Midlands cancelled untill the 28th March 09, and then it returns to 4x weekly again, so maybe just a Winter cutback on some routes?
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Originally Posted by dicksorchard
how can one be expected to progress if the local government officials do not support an Airline which would not only work to promote the city of Valencia but give local business's & local people much improved work prospects
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Forli - bye bye Ryanair
Let's see...
No need to translate this, presumably 
Still having doubts about Forli's future as the FR base? Do not bother. Some minutes ago Forli Airport did confirm the retreat of Ryanair, you can read it in Italian here.
E' ufficiale: Ryanair dice addio a Forlì.
Still having doubts about Forli's future as the FR base? Do not bother. Some minutes ago Forli Airport did confirm the retreat of Ryanair, you can read it in Italian here.
Last edited by eu01; 24th Oct 2008 at 13:30.
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Hooray for Girona !
davidjohson6 wrote: Gerona airport has historically been used for holiday charters.
No it hasn't, unless by "historically" you mean the past few years. "Historically" there were a few flights each summer and the airport was unutilised for almost half the year.
Barcelona is about 90 mins drive away and has a large airport supported by a hefty city population. One can think of Gerona airport as really a sort of overflow facility for Barcelona that happens to be near some beaches.
One can think this, but it isn't true. the beaches at Barcelona are within 2 kms of the airport; at Girona the nearest beaches are 55 kms away.
The area that's nearer to Gerona airport than Barcelona is largely rural.
Completely false. Past the farming area, and you'll find the area near Girona airport (by the way, Girona is the correct spelling) is a mass of industrial estates, light industry especially, and I usually do the drive (SALT to GRN) in 10 minutes. OTOH, the industrial area of Barcelona isn't anywhere near the airport (which is south of the city) but is north of Barcelona, about an hour's drive away.
Valencia on the other hand is a large city. Not quite as large as Barcelona, but definitely a big city none the less. It also has a large airport.
And you think Girona a small city ?
Unlike with Girona, where originating passengers are few - and thus an airline cannot get bi-directional traffic, Valencia is a commercial centre, has the tourist attractions, is on the coast, and has locally originating traffic.
The majority of SLF's using Girona are (a) tourists staying on the Costa Brava and (b) businessmen from Girona, followed by (c) from Barcelona. Hardly "few originating passengers". As for the implications that Girona doesn't have the tourist attractions - think again, better still, go there.
In sum: another posting from someone who doesn't know what he's talking about.
And my rant qualifications ? Well, I live a few kms from GRN and we use the airport on average 30 times a year. And I read Catalan newpapers and business reports.
Ryanair has been a godsend for us, injecting capital and stimulating enterprise as nothing else could have done. Sure, travelling on FR is cheap and not-so-very-cheerful, but what the heck, it's never more than three hours to anywhere in Europe from GRN, so I can stand their cattle class.
R
No it hasn't, unless by "historically" you mean the past few years. "Historically" there were a few flights each summer and the airport was unutilised for almost half the year.
Barcelona is about 90 mins drive away and has a large airport supported by a hefty city population. One can think of Gerona airport as really a sort of overflow facility for Barcelona that happens to be near some beaches.
One can think this, but it isn't true. the beaches at Barcelona are within 2 kms of the airport; at Girona the nearest beaches are 55 kms away.
The area that's nearer to Gerona airport than Barcelona is largely rural.
Completely false. Past the farming area, and you'll find the area near Girona airport (by the way, Girona is the correct spelling) is a mass of industrial estates, light industry especially, and I usually do the drive (SALT to GRN) in 10 minutes. OTOH, the industrial area of Barcelona isn't anywhere near the airport (which is south of the city) but is north of Barcelona, about an hour's drive away.
Valencia on the other hand is a large city. Not quite as large as Barcelona, but definitely a big city none the less. It also has a large airport.
And you think Girona a small city ?
Unlike with Girona, where originating passengers are few - and thus an airline cannot get bi-directional traffic, Valencia is a commercial centre, has the tourist attractions, is on the coast, and has locally originating traffic.
The majority of SLF's using Girona are (a) tourists staying on the Costa Brava and (b) businessmen from Girona, followed by (c) from Barcelona. Hardly "few originating passengers". As for the implications that Girona doesn't have the tourist attractions - think again, better still, go there.
In sum: another posting from someone who doesn't know what he's talking about.
And my rant qualifications ? Well, I live a few kms from GRN and we use the airport on average 30 times a year. And I read Catalan newpapers and business reports.
Ryanair has been a godsend for us, injecting capital and stimulating enterprise as nothing else could have done. Sure, travelling on FR is cheap and not-so-very-cheerful, but what the heck, it's never more than three hours to anywhere in Europe from GRN, so I can stand their cattle class.
R
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Your post was excellent until that last paragraph of loony tunes. Reassuringly expensive? That reminds me of another infamous remark 'Oh, what a lovely war!' or perhaps something like in the bad old days at Cork when the only folk flying to Heathrow on EI were Cork's elite whom we shall describe for brevity as the sheepskin coat brigade along with local Aer Lingus and Aer Rianta staffers on jollies heading off halfway around the world on near freebies being paid for by taxpayers on quite modest incomes being taxed to the hilt at high rates.
To hell with the days of reassuringly expensive air fares.
To hell with the days of reassuringly expensive air fares.
Last edited by Tom the Tenor; 24th Oct 2008 at 15:52.
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Tom,
do you honestly think that Ryanair makes its profits out of their mostly really low fares? I dont. They make their money also out of tax cuts, EU subsidies, local subsides and on cut to nonexistant airportfees etcetc.
Look at Hahn, where they dont pay for anything at all. Running an Airport does cost a penny. The burden is on the taxpayer and the other airlines and users who pay for the missed income from Ryanair.
So the cheap fares are not so cheap in the end. One can debate if the "old system" was good, but at least it was more or less honest.
The day Ryanair does not receive any taxmoney, pays for the airports on an even level and still writes at least a black ink zero, I´ll withdraw all critism.
do you honestly think that Ryanair makes its profits out of their mostly really low fares? I dont. They make their money also out of tax cuts, EU subsidies, local subsides and on cut to nonexistant airportfees etcetc.
Look at Hahn, where they dont pay for anything at all. Running an Airport does cost a penny. The burden is on the taxpayer and the other airlines and users who pay for the missed income from Ryanair.
So the cheap fares are not so cheap in the end. One can debate if the "old system" was good, but at least it was more or less honest.
The day Ryanair does not receive any taxmoney, pays for the airports on an even level and still writes at least a black ink zero, I´ll withdraw all critism.
Not so (sorry folks to go back and forward on this). Back in the 1970s Gerona had a huge inbound charter programme from the UK and elsewhere. You could sometimes find half the fleet of major UK charter operators on the ground there all together. It gradually ran down over the decades following as passengers got fed up with the Costa Brava tat and discovered more interesting places.