CORK - 5
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Please take note: This thread will close unless some of you stop using it as a personal board to post YOUR own views.
PPRuNe is a place to post things of aviation interest NOT for whims and fancies.
AA&R Mods
PPRuNe is a place to post things of aviation interest NOT for whims and fancies.
AA&R Mods
Cool Mod
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You see! That is what we mean. Some think they have a devine right to post what they want. Let me make it clear that you don't.
You do your worst and we will do our best. Your call.
AA&R mods
You do your worst and we will do our best. Your call.
AA&R mods
Join Date: Mar 2005
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The question is what that means. If there's no cover from 1am to 5am, it won't make a massive amount of difference, but make that midnight to 6am and you will start running into problems, especially when things start running late. Even this evening, there's an 00:15 arrival from Alicante, so I can't imagine they will be looking to make a change that will impact on existing schedules, but with the IAA, who knows.
Join Date: Aug 2000
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It has struck me that the IAA may be chancing their arm on this one - let's see if the IAA want to shut down snn for a few hours over night. One can only imagine the clamour if that was to pass but then again that would not fit in with the new cosy arrangements put in place for snn.
This seems to me to be another stinker - has it not been the case that the IAA does very well, thank you very much, with fees from all the overflying traffic between the UK, Europe and North America every day.
I wonder are there ATC staffing issues going on as well - I know that in the RAF the controllers have in the past needed to have a higher IQ than pilots!
It is a curious one all right.
This seems to me to be another stinker - has it not been the case that the IAA does very well, thank you very much, with fees from all the overflying traffic between the UK, Europe and North America every day.
I wonder are there ATC staffing issues going on as well - I know that in the RAF the controllers have in the past needed to have a higher IQ than pilots!
It is a curious one all right.
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To be fair Shannon is classed as an Atlantic emergency diversion airport so the chances of it ever losing its 24hr cover is close to zero. All I can say about speculation over cover hrs at Cork is I can't see airlines kicking up a fuss, Ryanair do not operate between 12am and 6am, Aer Lingus are only ever scheduled to be as late as 12:15am with the latest this season being an Arkefly flight from Las Palmas at 12:45am. I think theres been one night so far this season a flight has touched down after 2am and it was a delayed Aer Lingus Alicante flight during the Portuguese general strike. As Ryan2000 points out the only problem this proposal faces is when theres delayed flights if they're going to be forced to divert to Shannon well then thats just not acceptable, if the IAA were to pursue say a 1am to 5am closure during Summer and 12am to 6am during Winter but would allow for cover during delays i.e. when flights are scheduled before closure but incur delay and are facing an arrival after closure - Then I believe this would be accepted.
the IAA does very well, thank you very much, with fees from all the overflying traffic between the UK, Europe and North America every day.
IAA is a commercial entity so if the numbers are not there??
Remember that the CAR instructed the IAA to reduce its landing charges.
If the DAA want to subsidize the IAA so be it, if not then savings must be made.
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Who ever designated Shannon as a transatlantic emergency airport? Not sure if such a designation exists although I have heard the argument used when ever 24hr opening is called into question. In the past when Cork closed at 2300 in Winter and Midnight in Summer, it was anybody's guess whether ATC would provide cover if inbound flights got delayed. Sometimes aircraft ended up in Shannon or Dublin with ongoing disruption the following morning. Of course if ATc is withdrawn between 0000 and 0600, what will the point of rostering Fire Crews etc.
I've a feeling the IAA may be inadvertently opening a can of worms here.
I've a feeling the IAA may be inadvertently opening a can of worms here.
Last edited by ryan2000; 25th Jul 2013 at 21:07.
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@ryan
You designate yourself more or less whilst meeting the usual criteria etc. SNN make a nice few Euro out of the OMNI flights, freight carriers, private, Transaero and others for maintenance/ overhaul etc and until recently was the the first choice of landing for the space shuttle in Europe if there was a hiccup. Not saying that ORK should not operate 24/7 but where is the justification to remain open? Same could be said for SNN perhaps but SNN does generate income in the 12- 6am period .
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I agree that Shannon makes an effort to generate night business.
The 24 hr opening at Cork seems to have been introduced for bookeeping reasons rather than to cater for night traffic.
Cork has up to 10 based aircraft in the Summer and 7 in Winter. It is unrealistic to expect all of them to be home before midnight. The IAA will have to ensure that there is adequate cover for delays.
The 24 hr opening at Cork seems to have been introduced for bookeeping reasons rather than to cater for night traffic.
Cork has up to 10 based aircraft in the Summer and 7 in Winter. It is unrealistic to expect all of them to be home before midnight. The IAA will have to ensure that there is adequate cover for delays.
Last edited by ryan2000; 26th Jul 2013 at 05:48.
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Most airports with a curfew have a fine for late carriers rather than a requirement to divert. The fine covers things like extended control cover, plus any noise pollution breaches.
If the curfew was set for midnight, no airline would want to operate a service that was scheduled to arrive after 11pm (arguable EIR would need to go with 10pm), if it meant a diversion. Delays happen and as often as not one of the aircraft arriving back into Cork at night has a delay of around an hour on the flight.
Looking at today's flights, we already see 45 mins on the aircraft operating the BRS flight.
If the curfew was set for midnight, no airline would want to operate a service that was scheduled to arrive after 11pm (arguable EIR would need to go with 10pm), if it meant a diversion. Delays happen and as often as not one of the aircraft arriving back into Cork at night has a delay of around an hour on the flight.
Looking at today's flights, we already see 45 mins on the aircraft operating the BRS flight.
Last edited by 840; 26th Jul 2013 at 11:17.
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Another light aircraft crashed due to engine failure in Co. Down yesterday reported on RTE news but nothing on the media on last weekend`s crash of a light aircraft departing Cork airport on its way back to the north where it was based...strange.