CORK - 4
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Mod note. Continuation of the Cork thread. Previous thread: http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=236710
Whats going on @ EICK at the mo....I just dont understand. About six months-to a year- ago the route announcements were arriving thick and fast. Now its nothing but bad news....or no news.
Has the new terminal and its associated stresses caused the team on teh hill to loose the plot? Look at the advertising, its rubbish...
I saw an ad for Galway Airport in the Cork Indo this week, and they were able to inform all and sundry of their new routes....and how they ahve "Ireland and the UK covered"
Hmmm....methinks its time to get over the terminal and get on with finding new arilines and routes. BE, LS, RE, U2, FR, EI, AZ, LH, BA, CO, DL ANYBODY, to ANYWHERE, there are loads of routes that would be viable...Im sick of listing them.
Oh and while the're on the phone they might give John A Woods a shout as well...several hundred square meteres of concrete(and a covered walkway!) wouldn't go astray either.
Whats going on @ EICK at the mo....I just dont understand. About six months-to a year- ago the route announcements were arriving thick and fast. Now its nothing but bad news....or no news.
Has the new terminal and its associated stresses caused the team on teh hill to loose the plot? Look at the advertising, its rubbish...
I saw an ad for Galway Airport in the Cork Indo this week, and they were able to inform all and sundry of their new routes....and how they ahve "Ireland and the UK covered"
Hmmm....methinks its time to get over the terminal and get on with finding new arilines and routes. BE, LS, RE, U2, FR, EI, AZ, LH, BA, CO, DL ANYBODY, to ANYWHERE, there are loads of routes that would be viable...Im sick of listing them.
Oh and while the're on the phone they might give John A Woods a shout as well...several hundred square meteres of concrete(and a covered walkway!) wouldn't go astray either.
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The likes of BAW and AZA shouldnt be hard to come by......SK either.
The thing with Cork is, its not Ryanair that will chase these lads, its Aer Lingus! Theyre just as bad.......remember what they did to that nice little airline called jetmagic??
The thing with Cork is, its not Ryanair that will chase these lads, its Aer Lingus! Theyre just as bad.......remember what they did to that nice little airline called jetmagic??
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Rallye EI-BFP
What - did EI sit on top of Cork to Belfast, London City, Liverpool or Brussels, their "flagship" routes? Don't kid yourself that anything other than Jet Magic themselves led to the demise of Jet Magic. JM could have worked with the right network and launch timing - presumptions about when the Embraer 135 would be ready for London City, totally dreadful estimates of demand on Cork Brussels and assuming Arran would walk away from Edinburgh were all contributing factors, but overall the financial planning and cash burn did the damage.
What - did EI sit on top of Cork to Belfast, London City, Liverpool or Brussels, their "flagship" routes? Don't kid yourself that anything other than Jet Magic themselves led to the demise of Jet Magic. JM could have worked with the right network and launch timing - presumptions about when the Embraer 135 would be ready for London City, totally dreadful estimates of demand on Cork Brussels and assuming Arran would walk away from Edinburgh were all contributing factors, but overall the financial planning and cash burn did the damage.
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Charges
Cork will find it very difficult to get any continental airlines now that FR and EI have a base there. They can pounce at anytime and undermine a new route.
The sharp increase in airport charges was a massive blunder and is probably the biggest factor in the decline of growth since April.
Cork has a state of the art terminal but it's not Heathrow Dublin or Schiphol and airlines will not fly there unless its costs and charges are competitive.
The CAA should take a close look at their costs and make whatever changes are neccessary.
The sharp increase in airport charges was a massive blunder and is probably the biggest factor in the decline of growth since April.
Cork has a state of the art terminal but it's not Heathrow Dublin or Schiphol and airlines will not fly there unless its costs and charges are competitive.
The CAA should take a close look at their costs and make whatever changes are neccessary.
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New routes
Hi im a first time user so it may take me a while to get into the swing of things!
With regard to continental european airlines flying into Cork, I think an Air Baltic ,twice weekly (possibly) to Riga could be on the cards. With LAL after announcing there Vilnius- Shannon route, I do believe there is also a market for this type of service?????
Also, with regard to USA flights, I think AA to boston or Delta Airways to JFK are the most likely routes. I doubt Continental would risk diluting their loads on their Shannon-Newark route.
With regard to continental european airlines flying into Cork, I think an Air Baltic ,twice weekly (possibly) to Riga could be on the cards. With LAL after announcing there Vilnius- Shannon route, I do believe there is also a market for this type of service?????
Also, with regard to USA flights, I think AA to boston or Delta Airways to JFK are the most likely routes. I doubt Continental would risk diluting their loads on their Shannon-Newark route.
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taxes and charges
I was looking at flying to dub from Cork on Ryanair, 99c each way didnt sound to bad.
But the ticket ends up at 46 euros (credit card charge no included) at the end with taxes and charges.
Cork Airport wont be long making up the debt with those prices or conversly getting more in debt due to loss of pax due to high charges.
But the ticket ends up at 46 euros (credit card charge no included) at the end with taxes and charges.
Cork Airport wont be long making up the debt with those prices or conversly getting more in debt due to loss of pax due to high charges.
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The last easyJet flight from Cork has just departed off Cork's runway 35 returning to London Gatwick as the EZY788. The flight is being flown by Airbus A319 G-EZEK.
A bad night for Cork Airport. easyJet and Loganair both gone within a week or so of each other.
Adieu, easyJet.
A bad night for Cork Airport. easyJet and Loganair both gone within a week or so of each other.
Adieu, easyJet.
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I would hope that ,once Ryanair and CAA sort out their differences (Re:costs), Ryanair would see sense and open a ORK-PIK route and, if ryanair don't do it, then Aer Arann (given that they already operate to PIK from donegal) would seize the oppertunity.
Not sure would that affect their Edinburgh loads though.
Not sure would that affect their Edinburgh loads though.
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Delta....absolutely. They are losing so much money....they will start any route i spose...
Their B763's would be ideal, although the Song B757s have been reabsorbed so they could be used (are they ETOP's?). All the B762's are to go....some to freighter conversion I understand.
With regards to EZY... Shannon still has a LGW flight showing for tommorow? Or else they have forgotten to remove it from the system
Their B763's would be ideal, although the Song B757s have been reabsorbed so they could be used (are they ETOP's?). All the B762's are to go....some to freighter conversion I understand.
With regards to EZY... Shannon still has a LGW flight showing for tommorow? Or else they have forgotten to remove it from the system
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ok It did slip my mind that Delta's, like Continental's, existing SNN/DUB-New York routes would be affected
, so that might just leave AA with a B757 although given the fact they cancelled a similar service to Newcastle which, if im not mistaken, would have had a larger catchment area, this may be a tad optimistic
, so that might just leave AA with a B757 although given the fact they cancelled a similar service to Newcastle which, if im not mistaken, would have had a larger catchment area, this may be a tad optimistic
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When (if? 
) open skies come in, I'd imagine that a few of those airlines won't have a Shannon service to dilute. In fact Cork might make a decent use of a freed up rotation.
For the record, my money is on Continental with Aer Lingus possibly starting as a reaction later.
) open skies come in, I'd imagine that a few of those airlines won't have a Shannon service to dilute. In fact Cork might make a decent use of a freed up rotation.For the record, my money is on Continental with Aer Lingus possibly starting as a reaction later.
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True, but I read a newspaper article on Delta Airlines when they started up their SNN/DUB/JFK route and from that article it seemed they were comitted to Shannon and I do believe continental are happy with their SNN services too....so AA maybe?
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The inadequacies of the new airport have been getting alot of play in the press and radio in Cork recently. My own experience of using the airport is that working trollies are hard to come by. The followring article was in the Irish Independent today.
Airport denies claims of trolley shortage
JUST 400 trolleys are available for passengers flying to and from Cork Airport, despite the addition of a €160m terminal.
A spokesman for the airport has defended the low numbers available, even though there has been a 12pc increase in passengers numbers this year to three million.
However workers say their "hearts are broken" with passengers complaints about the shortfall.
"We're satisfied that there are sufficient trolleys in place," said marketing director Kevin Cullinane.
"As soon as passengers finish with them we have service personnel to bring them back to the terminal."
Despite the claims that the service is adequate, some passengers were not happy with their experiences at the airport.
Adrian Moloney from Gort, Co Galway, said problems for their party began before they departed for Tenerife but were compounded by confusion and delays on their return.
"I informed the Aer Rianta member of staff at the information desk about the delay in trying to get a trolley and her response was, 'we have had four flights arriving at the same time'," he said.
Edel Kennedy
Airport denies claims of trolley shortage
JUST 400 trolleys are available for passengers flying to and from Cork Airport, despite the addition of a €160m terminal.
A spokesman for the airport has defended the low numbers available, even though there has been a 12pc increase in passengers numbers this year to three million.
However workers say their "hearts are broken" with passengers complaints about the shortfall.
"We're satisfied that there are sufficient trolleys in place," said marketing director Kevin Cullinane.
"As soon as passengers finish with them we have service personnel to bring them back to the terminal."
Despite the claims that the service is adequate, some passengers were not happy with their experiences at the airport.
Adrian Moloney from Gort, Co Galway, said problems for their party began before they departed for Tenerife but were compounded by confusion and delays on their return.
"I informed the Aer Rianta member of staff at the information desk about the delay in trying to get a trolley and her response was, 'we have had four flights arriving at the same time'," he said.
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FR Takeover Bid
Is the FR takeover bid a worry for ORK?
Early days yet as the competition authorities would need to examine the bid but should FR gain a controlling interest in EI, will they downgrade EI services at ORK in order to boost their yields at SNN?
ORK management should preempt this and attract a broader range of airlines at the airport in order to prevent over reliance on the shamrock.
While most speculators believed that EI would downgrade their transatlantic services in SNN in the next few years to the possible advantage of ORK, an FR controlled EI might see the advantage of retaining transatlantic services at SNN to feed into their expanding shorthaul services.
Any thoughts?
Early days yet as the competition authorities would need to examine the bid but should FR gain a controlling interest in EI, will they downgrade EI services at ORK in order to boost their yields at SNN?
ORK management should preempt this and attract a broader range of airlines at the airport in order to prevent over reliance on the shamrock.
While most speculators believed that EI would downgrade their transatlantic services in SNN in the next few years to the possible advantage of ORK, an FR controlled EI might see the advantage of retaining transatlantic services at SNN to feed into their expanding shorthaul services.
Any thoughts?
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Cork's future
The problem is that airlines like AZ, IB, LH,etc have no interest in Cork Airport.
Other low costs carriers will be very cautious after the Easyjet experience.
I agree that Ryanair will almost certainly try to boost their low yield flights at SNN and Cork people have travelled there in their tens of thousands for years if it meant saving a few bob (euro since 2002).
Huge challenges facing Cork now.
Other low costs carriers will be very cautious after the Easyjet experience.
I agree that Ryanair will almost certainly try to boost their low yield flights at SNN and Cork people have travelled there in their tens of thousands for years if it meant saving a few bob (euro since 2002).
Huge challenges facing Cork now.
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'Cork Airport Flying low, with with rock bottom passenger figures,' will be the new slogan for Cork!
I mean it, if ryanair downgrade EI's services at Cork I'll shoot Michael O' Leary.
We're doomed.
I mean it, if ryanair downgrade EI's services at Cork I'll shoot Michael O' Leary.
We're doomed.
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Indeed I would expect that FR and EI are looking into expanding at ORK, FR certinly would base extra a/c at EICK if the price was right, and its no secret that EI may well base a fifth a320 at Cork in the near future.
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The problem is the price is not right for RYR at Cork.
Ryanair are very happy with Shannon and wish to keep it that way.
T/A flights with EIN ex Cork will be very restricted, not just due runway but due to other restrictions and stresses that would be placed on the 330's as if they are not stressed enough.
Ryanair are very happy with Shannon and wish to keep it that way.
T/A flights with EIN ex Cork will be very restricted, not just due runway but due to other restrictions and stresses that would be placed on the 330's as if they are not stressed enough.
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I still can't see the takeover happening, but on the assumption that it does...
It could be looked at as an opportunity as much as a threat. Cork would have more based aircraft than Shannon and becomes a bigger priority for Ryanair. It would be challenging for the airport nonetheless.
As for other points made. The only possibilities I can see for European flag carriers are SN Brussels restarting Brussels and Lufthansa to Frankfurt. Cork doesn't feature for others. Admittedly, if Ryanair really started acting the bollocks and withdrew from Amsterdam after a takeover, KLM would be onto the route like a shot, but would serve it more frequently with smaller aircraft.
A more practical option is to woo Air Berlin.
Transatlantic? Leaving aside any takeover, EI won't look at it until someone else does. A parallel taxiway would probably be required first too.
It could be looked at as an opportunity as much as a threat. Cork would have more based aircraft than Shannon and becomes a bigger priority for Ryanair. It would be challenging for the airport nonetheless.
As for other points made. The only possibilities I can see for European flag carriers are SN Brussels restarting Brussels and Lufthansa to Frankfurt. Cork doesn't feature for others. Admittedly, if Ryanair really started acting the bollocks and withdrew from Amsterdam after a takeover, KLM would be onto the route like a shot, but would serve it more frequently with smaller aircraft.
A more practical option is to woo Air Berlin.
Transatlantic? Leaving aside any takeover, EI won't look at it until someone else does. A parallel taxiway would probably be required first too.
Last edited by 840; 6th Oct 2006 at 08:52.
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'IF' Ryanair do complete the takeover...its not going to change the charges that CAA charge the airlines so it's very doubtful that RYR are going to launch any major expansion at ORK in the near future. SNN is ticking over quite nicely for them and I think RYR will concentrate most of their south-west Ireland Growth in SNN . However, there is some routes that RYR and ORK could make a mint on such as ORK-PIK and I do hope that CAA lower their charges for ORK's sake as the airport has a lot of potential.
I agree completly with the previous post about possible new airlines/routes. Lufthansa (cityline maybe???) with an early morning (over-nighter??) CRJ200 to FRA could be a success and also Air Berlin could exploit some of the low-cost potential that ORK has that Ryanair, to date, have not taken advantage of.
I agree completly with the previous post about possible new airlines/routes. Lufthansa (cityline maybe???) with an early morning (over-nighter??) CRJ200 to FRA could be a success and also Air Berlin could exploit some of the low-cost potential that ORK has that Ryanair, to date, have not taken advantage of.
Last edited by shannon55; 6th Oct 2006 at 13:39.