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Aurigny Air Services

Old 15th Jul 2017, 22:17
  #1441 (permalink)  
 
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I'm sure that I read somewhere (on here maybe) that there is a problem with the length of time required on the ground for the engines to cool before restarting, not with the short length of the flight.
Having seen, and used, Winair's operations out of St Maarten, I don't think that's it either. Maybe kcockayne has got it with the crosswind factor.
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Old 16th Jul 2017, 06:52
  #1442 (permalink)  
 
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Bottom line is Aurigny should not be operating 3 different types of a/c - it is grossly remiss of the management to think they can run an airline with the types of pax numbers they have with the fixed costs for operating 3 types, let alone if any of the crew go sick, take holiday, or hand in their notice to go to another airline.... that is just bonkers! For inter island its not the crew cost that will hurt or the cycles - its the SOPS's for operating in a salt water environment, dont get them right and dont take care of the comp unit and your world will be plagued by being in the hangar, this along with the fixed cost of processing the aircraft with terminal infrastructure.... The only viable a/c for inter-island shuttles in the C.I. is the C208B which is proven without doubt to be safe - I would still run it 2 pilot though - but you have to operate it as a self handled a/c outside of the NASP as you can in Scotland, from a portakabin with the crew doing the checkin and boarding / after all its only 9 pax and will be bale to ensure a 10 minute turnaround.
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Old 16th Jul 2017, 10:32
  #1443 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Jetscream 32 View Post
Bottom line is Aurigny should not be operating 3 different types of a/c - it is grossly remiss of the management to think they can run an airline with the types of pax numbers they have with the fixed costs for operating 3 types, let alone if any of the crew go sick, take holiday, or hand in their notice to go to another airline.... that is just bonkers! For inter island its not the crew cost that will hurt or the cycles - its the SOPS's for operating in a salt water environment, dont get them right and dont take care of the comp unit and your world will qbe plagued by being in the hangar, this along with the fixed cost of processing the aircraft with terminal a infrastructure.... The only viable a/c for inter-island shuttles in the C.I. is the C208B which is proven without doubt to be safe - I would still run it 2 pilot though - but you have to operate it as a self handled a/c outside of the NASP as you can in Scotland, from a portakabin with the crew doing the checkin and boarding / after all its only 9 pax and will be bale to ensure a 10 minute turnaround.
Please show me how you can fly 500+ PAX into Gatwick on the 6 slots available, 100 ish to Manchester, 50 to Stansted, Bristol, Leeds and East Midlands each day and about 50 to ACI with a fleet of C208B or Twotters. Aurigny aircraft mix is dictated by the very different characteristics of the the routes they serve and the demands placed on them by the islanders. Remember there are only 60k people living there. A mixed fleet is inevitable - I don't see how they could do differently.
PS I understand the problem with the twotters and why they were rejected was engine thermal cycling times.

Last edited by cobopete; 16th Jul 2017 at 12:16.
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Old 16th Jul 2017, 10:40
  #1444 (permalink)  
 
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Prang at Gatwick

Apparently there's been a ground handling incident with the Embraer at Gatwick. Schedule has gone to cock (again)
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Old 16th Jul 2017, 10:52
  #1445 (permalink)  
 
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The Embraer is out of action - it was struck by ground equipment at Gatters.
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Old 16th Jul 2017, 17:20
  #1446 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Jerbourg View Post
The Embraer is out of action - it was struck by ground equipment at Gatters.
Aurigny don't seem to have succeeded in chartering a replacement a/c. There are a lot of disgruntled passengers posting on their Facebook page. There are also problems with flights to/from ACI due to the weather which are attracting adverse comment.
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Old 16th Jul 2017, 21:13
  #1447 (permalink)  
 
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Apparently a Titan 737 operating LGWGCILGWGCILGW from GR601 but it will be approx 2hrs late but hoping to catch up sector by sector
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Old 17th Jul 2017, 02:27
  #1448 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by bricquebec View Post
The economics may also have had something to do with it, the Otters requiring two flight crew.
Well when Brymon operated Twotters is was, legally, a single crew (pilot) operation up to 9 passengers and in excess of 9 still single pilot but a flight attendant was required.

I recall hearing at the time that AUR gave up on the Twotters because they weren't ready for turbine engines being an otherwise all piston engined outfit at the time
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Old 17th Jul 2017, 08:17
  #1449 (permalink)  
 
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TITAN to the rescue
B737-300 G-ZAPW is currently positioning from Stansted to Gatters in order to provide cover for today for the damaged EMB195. Does anyone know how long the EMB will be u/s?
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Old 17th Jul 2017, 08:36
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Could be anything between a week to months depending what damage has been done.
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Old 17th Jul 2017, 09:11
  #1451 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by cobopete View Post
Please show me how you can fly 500+ PAX into Gatwick on the 6 slots available, 100 ish to Manchester, 50 to Stansted, Bristol, Leeds and East Midlands each day and about 50 to ACI with a fleet of C208B or Twotters.
If you read my post I clearly mention the C208B's for inter island not off island jaunts that would never make sense in any ones eyes....
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Old 17th Jul 2017, 10:08
  #1452 (permalink)  
 
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With an avg of 860 passengers a day on the GCI/LGW route with an available capacity of nearly 1200 you can see why the finances are going south - and thats without any of the other issues... all anyone can do is hope that they begin to chart a new course soon, especially as Waves this morning has announced GCI/JER on demand for 65 each way in the C208B
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Old 17th Jul 2017, 11:43
  #1453 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Jetscream 32 View Post
With an avg of 860 passengers a day on the GCI/LGW route with an available capacity of nearly 1200 you can see why the finances are going south - and thats without any of the other issues... all anyone can do is hope that they begin to chart a new course soon, especially as Waves this morning has announced GCI/JER on demand for 65 each way in the C208B
Oh yes, a single engine over water, they'll all be queuing up for that one!
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Old 17th Jul 2017, 11:54
  #1454 (permalink)  
 
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Well to be honest a modern single engine turbine V trilander I know which one I would want my family in.

If the Trilander is MTW exactly the same thing is going to happen if an engine goes. Piston engines fail more often than turbine.

So if the locals were more happy in the tri than a C208B more fool them.
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Old 17th Jul 2017, 12:12
  #1455 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by tescoapp View Post
Well to be honest a modern single engine turbine V trilander I know which one I would want my family in.

If the Trilander is MTW exactly the same thing is going to happen if an engine goes. Piston engines fail more often than turbine.

So if the locals were more happy in the tri than a C208B more fool them.
But AUR don't have any Trilanders, they have twin engined turbines!
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Old 17th Jul 2017, 12:23
  #1456 (permalink)  
 
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For years they were happy with those noise heaps of poo with extremely questionable performance in the event of a engine failure.

Cessna 208B is better than they had.

To be honest I am surprised they didn't go for LET 410's, type rating is 3 days. They never seem to break. Perf A.
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Old 17th Jul 2017, 12:25
  #1457 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Jetscream 32 View Post
If you read my post I clearly mention the C208B's for inter island not off island jaunts that would never make sense in any ones eyes....
But the point was you were critisising them flying more than one aircraft type?
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Old 17th Jul 2017, 13:00
  #1458 (permalink)  
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2 types: High frequency ATRs to the mainland, plus C208B's inter island and ACI-SOU is the solution. The latter can be done with careful routing, altitude and synthetic vision options. 1 P&W PT6 is far more favourable than 2/3 piston engines: locals have idolised the BN2/3 with single crew for 30 years, so single point of failure has been the choice for a generation. And I'd choose 1 PT6 over a fully laden piston variant every time. Better still, 1 PT6 and 2 crew.
IFSD rate is quoted as 1 per 12.4m flight hours.
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Old 17th Jul 2017, 13:41
  #1459 (permalink)  
 
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Back when Aurigny operated the Twotter they were running many, many more inter-island flights than there are today. I believe it all came down to the fact that the PT6 was lifed by start cycles. There were about 5 to the flight hour as the average JER-GCI was 12 minutes.
That was what I was told back then anyway.
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Old 17th Jul 2017, 14:28
  #1460 (permalink)  
 
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to my knowledge the engine itself is 3000 hours TBO for hot section for a reconditioned engine and 5000 hours for a new one for a PT6.

They are not in the same league as say the garrets with their direct shaft for getting hot on start.

Starter generators might have a limit but as there was no requirement in techlogs to record engine starts it might not be the case.
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