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Old 6th Dec 2011, 16:33
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Disagree Joe. Very much against EDI's interest, in the short term at least, for its owners not to be developing it, even worse to be pushing an alternative. Those of us who care about it's future should therefore be hoping that the sale goes through pdq.

PS Not quite sure what you mean by a "tied airport"
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Old 6th Dec 2011, 17:54
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Disagree Joe. Very much against EDI's interest, in the short term at least, for its owners not to be developing it, even worse to be pushing an alternative. Those of us who care about it's future should therefore be hoping that the sale goes through pdq.
BAA are hardly likely to shoot themselves in the foot by further developing EDI long haul when they broadcast the fact that GLA is Scotland's long haul gateway. If they did, it would be one almighty faux pax...

PS Not quite sure what you mean by a "tied airport"
Let's put it this way, if BA were to push any airport before EDI's impending sale, it would not be EDI.

Last edited by Joe Curry; 6th Dec 2011 at 17:57. Reason: typo
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Old 6th Dec 2011, 18:49
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Whats BA got to do with it ?
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Old 6th Dec 2011, 19:00
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Joe, we're coming from the same place - of course BAA won't shoot themselves in the foot and that's the problem. And it's why they need to sell it quickly so that EDI's new owners can shoot Glasgow where it hurts and continue with our Capital airport's increasing dominance as the country's No 1.
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Old 6th Dec 2011, 20:12
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Whats BA got to do with it ?
Typo..Should read BAA
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Old 6th Dec 2011, 20:27
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[QUOTE]Joe, we're coming from the same place - of course BAA won't shoot themselves in the foot and that's the problem. And it's why they need to sell it quickly so that EDI's new owners can shoot Glasgow where it hurts and continue with our Capital airport's increasing dominance as the country's No 1
/QUOTE]

Personally I feel that BAA have made a terrible decision to sell EDI rather than GLA. Short term gain indicates just how desperate their finances are,
EDI will eventually emerge as Scotland's only central belt airport. Abbotsinch's
value in the future will, IMHO, rest in Real Estate, a McArthurGlen type Mall?

Last edited by Joe Curry; 6th Dec 2011 at 20:28. Reason: typo
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Old 6th Dec 2011, 21:03
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You cant honestly believe that ? If so, I am afraid you are deluded. There would be a lot more airport real estate shopping malls in the UK before Glasgow. Your comments will be interesting I suspect when the PIK portfolio changes
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Old 6th Dec 2011, 22:32
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Your comments will be interesting I suspect when the PIK portfolio changes
We shall see in due course. Finger pointing at PIK betrays an underlying
uncertainty about future eventualities. Personally I think that Abbotsinch
offers the best commercial development opportunities. PIK, by it's very location, a more Eco friendly site for a Glasgow airport. If PIK were for sale,
would BAA be among the bidders?. Ironic given they previously owned it and
put their pennies into Abbotsinch.? The history of BAA in the Glasgow area
has been one of 'Airport's for Dummies'. EDI will of course - given new owner's investment commitments - emerge as Scotland's Heathrow.
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Old 6th Dec 2011, 23:15
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Personally I think that Abbotsinch
offers the best commercial development opportunities

Looking at your previous comments, that fails to surprise me.
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Old 6th Dec 2011, 23:51
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Looking at your previous comments, that fails to surprise me.
The best idea is not to reply as it just encourages him.

Ex
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Old 6th Dec 2011, 23:59
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Air France to add a 4 daily CDG flight next summer.

CDG 10.05-EDI 11.05
EDI 11.50-CDG 14.50
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Old 7th Dec 2011, 00:10
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has been one of 'Airport's for Dummies'. EDI will of course - given new owner's investment commitments - emerge as Scotland's Heathrow.
Didn't Delta manage to make the other Heathrow pay year round though? Turnhouse vs Abbotsinch ne RNAS Sanderling is localism gone mental and deserves to be parked in the 1970s from whence it came.

The closest Scotland could come to a hub airport would be a Central Scotland twin runway new build with fast rail to Queen St and Waverly as well as Inverness and Aberdeen. However the tragic loss of prestige with the two big cities no longer having "local" airports means it won't happen. Strategy? Whit's that then? Oh and there's no money either.
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Old 7th Dec 2011, 16:14
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The closest Scotland could come to a hub airport would be a Central Scotland twin runway new build with fast rail to Queen St and Waverly
Why a new build? EDI meets the criteria - with a future twin runway -
plus the Dalmeny Chord will allow pax from Glasgow Queen Street, Edinburgh
Waverley and all Scottish towns and cities, access to the airport from 3 tram/rail interchanges at Edinburgh's, Gogar, Edinburgh Park and Haymarket.
Planned electrified rail will whisk pax from Glasgow to these interchanges in around 30 minutes.
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Old 7th Dec 2011, 16:30
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Only a single Central Scotland Airport with both EDI and GLA becoming shopping malls and PIK redeveloped as an aviation engineering hub of some sort, would give us the numbers to make a real impact but it sadly isn't going to happen.

When I started work at GLA in 1967 there were moves by several people in the industry to promote the Central Scotland Airport idea (if I remember correctly Mike Bishop was one of them) but it was Glasgow Corporation, who had just invested heavily in building the new airport at Abbotsinch, who unsurprisingly scuppered it. Edinburgh, or more correctly Turnhouse as it was at the time, was owned by the Ministry of Civil Aviation who had invested zilch in it and would probably have been happy to see it go.

We need to face the fact that we don't have enough passenger and cargo throughput to support two major and one minor airport in the central belt and so the nearest we are going to get to a proper hub with global scheduled services is a developed Edinburgh. I say that simply because of its geographic location between Glasgow and Edinburgh (not on the wrong side of one of them), nearer to Dundee and the Stirling/Falkirk conurbation with excellent motorways linking it with all of these places, and its proximity to rail infrastructure (when the Cogar interchange opens) which will allow through train services to get there from all parts of the country as well as the North of England. I am afraid that Prestwick is doomed as a commercial airport of any significance but I do see Glasgow living on with limited scheduled services on busy, mainly domestic, routes, but predominently as the country's bucket and spade holiday charter airport as well as it picking up most of PIK's cargo business.

Now off to don hard hat and avoid incoming flak from west of Ballieston.....

Link to an interesting paper on the subject from the David Hume Institute.
http://homepages.ed.ac.uk/mainbg/Files/csa%20study.pdf

Last edited by theredbarron; 7th Dec 2011 at 16:48. Reason: Add link to study paper
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Old 7th Dec 2011, 17:05
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EDI meets the criteria
Politically and realistically? Hardly. Glasgow and Edinburgh both have too much civic pride to allow a strategic decision of this magnitude to go forward.
Neither airport is really purpose built for the 21st century, however both are passable local airports. "local" airports.

I am afraid that Prestwick is doomed as a commercial airport of any significance but I do see Glasgow living on with limited scheduled services on busy, mainly domestic, routes, but predominently as the country's bucket and spade holiday charter airport as well as it picking up most of PIK's cargo business.
Prestwick has never been a commercial success and I don't see how it can be. However the idea of Glasgow taking B744s on a regular basis is not likely.
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Old 7th Dec 2011, 19:22
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S1E I dont think it will be up to EDI or GLA to "allow the strategic decision to go forward". The passengers and airlines will decide and there will be very little that the airport owners can do about it. That, although admittedly only on a European scale so far, is what has boosted Edinburgh to its predominant position in Scotland. Inbound tourists want to fly there from the major population centres in Europe, and our businesmen want to fly out to these self same cities. Best of both worlds for the airlines.

Edinburgh not a 21st Century airport? Arguable, but since its most recent developments I'd put it way ahead of all of the comparably sized and smaller English regionals (BHX, LTN, EXT, BRS, EMA, NCL, etc) that I've flown through in the last few years. As for LHR and LGW, probably the worst major national hubs in Europe, both completely snookered for further development, and no relief coming from new build elsewhere in the SE to offer relief if the government keeps to its present policy. That fact too will be of help to Edinburgh as airlines are forced to go elsewhere.
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Old 7th Dec 2011, 21:30
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Why is there a disproportionate number of rose tinted spec wearing super sensitive EDI supporters compared to any other UK field ?
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Old 7th Dec 2011, 21:45
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CC, I was marveling at how there always seems to be a disproportionate number of sceptics waiting in the wings to pour cold water on any suggestion that EDI might advance beyond its current situation!

I'm not saying I agree with everything stated here by the EDI "supporters" who seem to have upset you, but, with the sale of EDI coming up next year there should be plenty of opportunities to develop a variety of new routes, including one or two long haul ones. Will China come before the Middle East? Doubtful, in my view, but never say never.
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Old 8th Dec 2011, 10:16
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Ah CC, but the proof of the pudding is in the comparative growth of both airports in recent years, and you don't need rose tinted specs to read these numbers.
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Old 8th Dec 2011, 11:05
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Yes , since the Scottish "Government" took it's place in Edinburgh, the growth at EDI "over recent years" has been remarkable !
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