CORK
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Good and Bad News for Cork Airport
Good News - Seems Aer Lingus have quietly been having the PCN and ACN runway ratings checked at ORK to see if they can op a 330 to JFK ex ORK to challenge the new entrants. How daft - 300+ seats to New York from ORK. Daft.
Bad News - the Malev loads to Budapest are very poor and Malev feel that no effort is being made to help them by ORK airport mgt. They may pull it as soon as Autumn. They also not so happy about being left on distant stands.
Good News - Current Chairman Gantly is going to get shafted by Fianna Fail. He is creating lots of potential unfair dismissal cases with the local staff. Sad that he also recently collapsed on a flight returning from a holiday. Hope he gets better soon but takes a breather from ORK board - if you can't stand the heat.....
Bad News - Major changes on cards for Aer Arann services in Autumn 2005 ex ORK. They are really fed up of the way they are being treated - being parked out on the old short runway etc... Uk routes losing shedloads of cash. BHX is crap. Major changes afoot.
Good News - Ryanair looking at new service DUB-ORK just to hammer RE for PSO debacle. That will teach them a lesson.
Bad News - no sign of a replacement for John Smyth.
Bad News - the Malev loads to Budapest are very poor and Malev feel that no effort is being made to help them by ORK airport mgt. They may pull it as soon as Autumn. They also not so happy about being left on distant stands.
Good News - Current Chairman Gantly is going to get shafted by Fianna Fail. He is creating lots of potential unfair dismissal cases with the local staff. Sad that he also recently collapsed on a flight returning from a holiday. Hope he gets better soon but takes a breather from ORK board - if you can't stand the heat.....
Bad News - Major changes on cards for Aer Arann services in Autumn 2005 ex ORK. They are really fed up of the way they are being treated - being parked out on the old short runway etc... Uk routes losing shedloads of cash. BHX is crap. Major changes afoot.
Good News - Ryanair looking at new service DUB-ORK just to hammer RE for PSO debacle. That will teach them a lesson.
Bad News - no sign of a replacement for John Smyth.
Hi all
Why would Ryanair "punish" RE for operating the DUB-ORK route? Ryanair hadn't a ghost of a chance of ever getting a PSO. As for using remote stands,it's up to RE to kick ass and take names if they feel they are getting short-changed.
Maybe the Hungarian Tourist Board need to spend a few quid touting their wares in Cork.If they have a few cheap apartments for sale...
regards
TDD
Why would Ryanair "punish" RE for operating the DUB-ORK route? Ryanair hadn't a ghost of a chance of ever getting a PSO. As for using remote stands,it's up to RE to kick ass and take names if they feel they are getting short-changed.
Maybe the Hungarian Tourist Board need to spend a few quid touting their wares in Cork.If they have a few cheap apartments for sale...
regards
TDD
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I had a look at the Pavement Classification Numbers and the Aircraft Classification Numbers a number of months ago when a very large Jepp book came my way.
Looks only just barely within limits with ORK-JFK kinds of weights. Sure, EI would be the most credible on a Cork New York but with an A330? No way, boy, as they'd say in Cork. The wrong aeroplane. Too many seats to fill.
Malev are picking up a little. Their billboards ads locally are appearing again - it would need to be something more though than just a photo of an airliner meal and an upside down Budapest travel guide! Yes, they must be mad as hell at having to park in Togher especially when they see CSA parking in stands two and three!
Hope Mr Gantley is feeling better soon. Sure enough, Cork Airport is a tormenting sort of place. Sure, it has me driven half cracked!
Aer Arann are no longer parking their aircraft on runway 25 overnight at the weekends. The practice ended last weekend. Nothing wrong with the South Ramp for parking if so needed?
Ryanair Cork - Dublin? Interesting! Base an aircraft at Cork and start a whole series of new routes? Nice in theory and ORK-DUB would be another good source of hours building for new low hours FR pilots? But in practise not so sure?
WW BHX is beginning to outperform EMA. Cant see the two routes continuing being timed so closely together every evening.
Cork Airport continues to remain in a sorry state since John Smyth's departure. Agreed, this is the worst negative.
Malev have good connections to China. Would make a good marketing strong point to have an EI codeshare via BUD to Bejing and Shanghai?
Looks only just barely within limits with ORK-JFK kinds of weights. Sure, EI would be the most credible on a Cork New York but with an A330? No way, boy, as they'd say in Cork. The wrong aeroplane. Too many seats to fill.
Malev are picking up a little. Their billboards ads locally are appearing again - it would need to be something more though than just a photo of an airliner meal and an upside down Budapest travel guide! Yes, they must be mad as hell at having to park in Togher especially when they see CSA parking in stands two and three!
Hope Mr Gantley is feeling better soon. Sure enough, Cork Airport is a tormenting sort of place. Sure, it has me driven half cracked!
Aer Arann are no longer parking their aircraft on runway 25 overnight at the weekends. The practice ended last weekend. Nothing wrong with the South Ramp for parking if so needed?
Ryanair Cork - Dublin? Interesting! Base an aircraft at Cork and start a whole series of new routes? Nice in theory and ORK-DUB would be another good source of hours building for new low hours FR pilots? But in practise not so sure?
WW BHX is beginning to outperform EMA. Cant see the two routes continuing being timed so closely together every evening.
Cork Airport continues to remain in a sorry state since John Smyth's departure. Agreed, this is the worst negative.
Malev have good connections to China. Would make a good marketing strong point to have an EI codeshare via BUD to Bejing and Shanghai?
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I worked with First Choice Airways last year in Cork and the parking situation for us was pretty poor. We were frequently stuck right down at the end of the apron next to the Cargo buildings. Seemed a bit crap seeing we were the only based charter airline in the airport, yet Futura and Spanair got parked right beside the terminal. It wasn't very pleasant for our customers to have to run in the howling wind and rain just to get onto the aircraft.
And we wonder why FCA didn't go back to Cork this year...
And we wonder why FCA didn't go back to Cork this year...
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Can't help but feel that if this is how EI are thinking, a wingleted 757 is the answer, together with a few more for SNN services, with the entire 330 fleet being kept in Dublin. Either that or some 310s if cargo is a requirement. bmi are replacing their 330 MAN-IAD with a leased 757 because they want to expand LHR services.
The more I see CO make use of them the more I like the idea for non-DUB services. The A320/321 don't have the legs and a 319 seems a bit small for a JFK run unless it was configured mostly business class in a semi-LH/Privatair kind of way - and niche ex Cork didn't really work out for Jetmagic.
As for pilots for these 310s/757s - have the 146 pilots been sorted yet?
The more I see CO make use of them the more I like the idea for non-DUB services. The A320/321 don't have the legs and a 319 seems a bit small for a JFK run unless it was configured mostly business class in a semi-LH/Privatair kind of way - and niche ex Cork didn't really work out for Jetmagic.
As for pilots for these 310s/757s - have the 146 pilots been sorted yet?
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A few observations:-
- It's not greatly surprising Malev's early loads are poor. They only started selling tickets in February. People won't have made plans to travel on a service that didn't seem to exist. Hopefully, loads will start picking up now.
- Would Aer Lingus code-share with Malev now that they are coming into OneWorld? Personally, I doubt it. I see no benefit for them. How will Malev's entry to OneWorld affect the Dublin-Budapest market where both operate?
- If Aer Arann are getting hurt on Birmingham by BMIBaby, is there any possibility of them taking an arrangement like Air Wales have on the Cardiff route?
- Is DUB-ORK going to continue being a money-spinner for Aer Arann even without Ryanair's involvement? With the improvement in the rail service planned for the fourth quarter of this year, it will be difficult to justify flying to Dublin unless taking a connecting flight or travelling to somewhere very near Dublin Airport. Scarily, Irish Rail have a better record for punctuality than Aer Arann.
- Will Cork ever consider getting buses? A lot of people have mentioned how far the remote stands are from the terminal. Otherwise, I spent 25 minutes waiting to get off EI845 last Friday because they didn't want us to walk to the terminal when other aircraft were manoeuvring.
- It's not greatly surprising Malev's early loads are poor. They only started selling tickets in February. People won't have made plans to travel on a service that didn't seem to exist. Hopefully, loads will start picking up now.
- Would Aer Lingus code-share with Malev now that they are coming into OneWorld? Personally, I doubt it. I see no benefit for them. How will Malev's entry to OneWorld affect the Dublin-Budapest market where both operate?
- If Aer Arann are getting hurt on Birmingham by BMIBaby, is there any possibility of them taking an arrangement like Air Wales have on the Cardiff route?
- Is DUB-ORK going to continue being a money-spinner for Aer Arann even without Ryanair's involvement? With the improvement in the rail service planned for the fourth quarter of this year, it will be difficult to justify flying to Dublin unless taking a connecting flight or travelling to somewhere very near Dublin Airport. Scarily, Irish Rail have a better record for punctuality than Aer Arann.
- Will Cork ever consider getting buses? A lot of people have mentioned how far the remote stands are from the terminal. Otherwise, I spent 25 minutes waiting to get off EI845 last Friday because they didn't want us to walk to the terminal when other aircraft were manoeuvring.
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Cork Airport likes to pin the blame for having no buses back on the airlines instead of the airport itself getting involved in providing buses. A tongue in cheek sort of attitude if there ever was one? I bet if Shannon wanted a few buses....
However, the latest is that Cork is to provide covered walkways along the pedestrain paths to the stands. It is a start and is something that would not have been acceded to except for agitation? Cheaper too than buying buses and paying wages to drivers, no doubt!
I just cannot help wondering how long the covered walkways will last at Cork in gusts of 50 plus knots!
However, the latest is that Cork is to provide covered walkways along the pedestrain paths to the stands. It is a start and is something that would not have been acceded to except for agitation? Cheaper too than buying buses and paying wages to drivers, no doubt!
I just cannot help wondering how long the covered walkways will last at Cork in gusts of 50 plus knots!
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If Bhx-Ork loads are So Bad why don't they operate a BHX-BRS-ORK once a day giving BRS and ORK the needed route people are begging for also you may find a few pax for the BRS-BHX sector
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Does anyone know anything about the new entrants for the ORK-JFK - what are Slatterys like - are these the same that are doing the DUB-CPT?? Will Aer Lingus move in on to the route now that they have started it?
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Slatterys have been on the go for decades. They are a Tralee, Co Kerry based company and their reputation is generally good. Among other things they would have been well known in the 1980s for the Tralee, Cork coach service via the ferry at Rosslare-Pembroke to London. Remember, these were the days of massively high Aer Lingus and British Airways fares between Ireland and London and the bleeding heart from EI saying the huge price was as low as the price could possibly be!
Many's the emigrating Paddy from the south Munster area would have used the coach and ferry serivce in the eighties heading off to London when the Irish economy was really in a bad, bad way. The thing is a lot of those emigrants have now returned, a lot of whom are now doing well and will be easily able to try the Slatterys organised charter to New York.
There are regular ads in the local media in Cork promoting the New York service so the concept is certainly forming in people's imagination. By launch date Cork, her airport and her people along with the neighbouring travelling public from elsewhere in the south Munster area will be ready and at long last the Shannon stranglehold on the North Atlantic will be brought to an end.
As much as it would be attractive EI may look at the PCNs and ACNs all they like but it is hard to see full A330s flying out of Cork to New York. A 757 or perhaps a 767-200 service is more credible.
Yes, Slatterys are the operator for Dublin-Cape Town.
Many's the emigrating Paddy from the south Munster area would have used the coach and ferry serivce in the eighties heading off to London when the Irish economy was really in a bad, bad way. The thing is a lot of those emigrants have now returned, a lot of whom are now doing well and will be easily able to try the Slatterys organised charter to New York.
There are regular ads in the local media in Cork promoting the New York service so the concept is certainly forming in people's imagination. By launch date Cork, her airport and her people along with the neighbouring travelling public from elsewhere in the south Munster area will be ready and at long last the Shannon stranglehold on the North Atlantic will be brought to an end.
As much as it would be attractive EI may look at the PCNs and ACNs all they like but it is hard to see full A330s flying out of Cork to New York. A 757 or perhaps a 767-200 service is more credible.
Yes, Slatterys are the operator for Dublin-Cape Town.
Last edited by Tom the Tenor; 31st May 2005 at 18:28.
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from Breakingnews.ie
Ryanair in talks on new Cork flights
01/06/2005 - 15:06:43
Ryanair has opened talks with the Cork Airport Authority to see if a deal can be struck to open up cheap flights to destinations on mainland Europe.
Michael Cawley, the deputy chief executive of the budget airline, told the Evening Echo a new route had been opened up to Liverpool out of Cork and there was a lot more passenger capacity on the London route.
“We are in discussions with the airport. The new management is very good and they are obviously busy getting the new terminal organised.”
Mr Cawley, originally from the South Douglas Road in the city, said he hoped that when the new terminal is up and running, management at Cork Airport will come up with a landing charge package to entice Ryanair to open scheduled services to France, Germany, Italy, Spain and Scandinavian countries.
Mr Cawley said any decision to open a hub at Cork would all depend on costs.
“If there was a suitable cost structure in place, we would be very keen to do it,” he said.
If a discount deal could be done on landing charges, Mr Cawley predicted Ryanair would fly as many routes from Cork as it does from Shannon — to between 12 and 14 destinations.
“I would be very hopeful it will come about.”
The average price of a one-way ticket with Ryanair is now down to €40.
Mr Cawley denied reports it was considering going head to head with Aer Arann on the busy Cork-Dublin commuter air service.
“We will not be doing it at the moment. I’d never say never — but not in the next couple of years,” added Mr Cawley.
Ryanair in talks on new Cork flights
01/06/2005 - 15:06:43
Ryanair has opened talks with the Cork Airport Authority to see if a deal can be struck to open up cheap flights to destinations on mainland Europe.
Michael Cawley, the deputy chief executive of the budget airline, told the Evening Echo a new route had been opened up to Liverpool out of Cork and there was a lot more passenger capacity on the London route.
“We are in discussions with the airport. The new management is very good and they are obviously busy getting the new terminal organised.”
Mr Cawley, originally from the South Douglas Road in the city, said he hoped that when the new terminal is up and running, management at Cork Airport will come up with a landing charge package to entice Ryanair to open scheduled services to France, Germany, Italy, Spain and Scandinavian countries.
Mr Cawley said any decision to open a hub at Cork would all depend on costs.
“If there was a suitable cost structure in place, we would be very keen to do it,” he said.
If a discount deal could be done on landing charges, Mr Cawley predicted Ryanair would fly as many routes from Cork as it does from Shannon — to between 12 and 14 destinations.
“I would be very hopeful it will come about.”
The average price of a one-way ticket with Ryanair is now down to €40.
Mr Cawley denied reports it was considering going head to head with Aer Arann on the busy Cork-Dublin commuter air service.
“We will not be doing it at the moment. I’d never say never — but not in the next couple of years,” added Mr Cawley.
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Is it a coincidence that Michael Cawley said this the day after the story about landing fees in Dublin going up by 40%?
I'd like to think not, but I can't quite convince myself.
I'd like to think not, but I can't quite convince myself.
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The opening quote from Mr Cawley is comic.
Now, if FR wish to try new routes from Cork that is fine but let them be genuinely new routes and not a spineless cut at trying to destroy Cork's good routes by going to places like BVA etc.
A lot of hard work has gone in to getting some of Cork's continental routes up and running over the last number of years and it would be deplorable if any Cork airport management be it new, old or whatever did any kind of deal with Ryanair that would harm any of Cork Airport's more choice destinations.
It would be an insult to the hard work all ready done by Mr John Smyth.
I should hope Cork is not for sale in the same way Shannon is and that no suicide deals are entered in to with Ryanair. Remeber, the only reason FR went back up to 4 daily on Cork - Stansted was because easyJet started LGW - Cork. They were quick enough to dump that fourth Stansted service when it did not suit.
Ryanair's Mr Cawley would need to remember that words are cheap and actions speak louder than words.
Now, if FR wish to try new routes from Cork that is fine but let them be genuinely new routes and not a spineless cut at trying to destroy Cork's good routes by going to places like BVA etc.
A lot of hard work has gone in to getting some of Cork's continental routes up and running over the last number of years and it would be deplorable if any Cork airport management be it new, old or whatever did any kind of deal with Ryanair that would harm any of Cork Airport's more choice destinations.
It would be an insult to the hard work all ready done by Mr John Smyth.
I should hope Cork is not for sale in the same way Shannon is and that no suicide deals are entered in to with Ryanair. Remeber, the only reason FR went back up to 4 daily on Cork - Stansted was because easyJet started LGW - Cork. They were quick enough to dump that fourth Stansted service when it did not suit.
Ryanair's Mr Cawley would need to remember that words are cheap and actions speak louder than words.
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Is there nobody else there capable of doing the job?
Good question.
No.
Again, actions speak louder than words. Still no replacement for John Smyth and if trying to make any kind of funny deal with FR is as far as Cork has come since Mr Smyth's departure that speaks volumes? Another thread has news of EZY announcing new routes ex Belfast and from other airports on the British mainland at frequencies of two and three per week. Great news I am sure. The kind of deals Cork may have been in line for with easy if the cat had not been let out of the bag to the Sunday Tribune?
Good question.
No.
Again, actions speak louder than words. Still no replacement for John Smyth and if trying to make any kind of funny deal with FR is as far as Cork has come since Mr Smyth's departure that speaks volumes? Another thread has news of EZY announcing new routes ex Belfast and from other airports on the British mainland at frequencies of two and three per week. Great news I am sure. The kind of deals Cork may have been in line for with easy if the cat had not been let out of the bag to the Sunday Tribune?
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I've been told that the real reason we were held on EI845 for 25 minutes was because there was a number of flights in at the same time, it was raining and the immigration queues were already stretching out of the terminal building onto the apron.
If this is true, the sooner the new terminal opens the better.
If this is true, the sooner the new terminal opens the better.
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Unwelcome arrival at Cork Airport
There was one hell of a letter in yesterday's edition of the Cork based broadsheet daily newspaper, Irish Examiner, from a Canadian visitor about their recent experience at Cork Airport.
I have no idea on how to create links etc so I type out in full. The letter speaks for itself:-
"Dear Sir,
We read all the time about the chaos at Dublin Airport but have you experienced the chaos at Cork Airport?
I arrived into this shamble of an airport at 9.15 pm, after walking 300m in the rain from the plane. It was dusk and hard to see equipment which was left all over the place.
Then were arrived at immigration, which had long queues out onto the ramp - with passengers all standing out in the rain.
Once inside, there are only two baggage belts, with people running from one to the other - chaos.
I sought a manager but none was available. 'He left,' I was told. I wonder why - he must have seen the chaos.
They told me they were building a new airport - I only hope it is miles away from this one. From what I saw, parking also seems to be a nightmare, and any type of planning seems to be non-existent. In addition, doors to the building were blocked by people smoking and the place was filthy.
How can people invest in Cork if its airport is so bad? I will avoid Cork Airport in the future.
Jonathan Zdilla
Lakehead University
Thunder Bay
Ontario P7B 5EI
Canada."
None of this kind of above history happens overnight. There has been decades and decades of neglect at Cork Airport. A certain kind of attitude prevailed where the place was hardly looked on as an airport at all. Nationally and locally the focus was all Shannon. Whatever Shannon wanted Shannon got.
Look at all the recent fuss at Cork about a couple of airbridges?
Cork Airport did not matter in the mindset of protecting Shannon at all costs.
Cork Airport was screwed big time.
I have no idea on how to create links etc so I type out in full. The letter speaks for itself:-
"Dear Sir,
We read all the time about the chaos at Dublin Airport but have you experienced the chaos at Cork Airport?
I arrived into this shamble of an airport at 9.15 pm, after walking 300m in the rain from the plane. It was dusk and hard to see equipment which was left all over the place.
Then were arrived at immigration, which had long queues out onto the ramp - with passengers all standing out in the rain.
Once inside, there are only two baggage belts, with people running from one to the other - chaos.
I sought a manager but none was available. 'He left,' I was told. I wonder why - he must have seen the chaos.
They told me they were building a new airport - I only hope it is miles away from this one. From what I saw, parking also seems to be a nightmare, and any type of planning seems to be non-existent. In addition, doors to the building were blocked by people smoking and the place was filthy.
How can people invest in Cork if its airport is so bad? I will avoid Cork Airport in the future.
Jonathan Zdilla
Lakehead University
Thunder Bay
Ontario P7B 5EI
Canada."
None of this kind of above history happens overnight. There has been decades and decades of neglect at Cork Airport. A certain kind of attitude prevailed where the place was hardly looked on as an airport at all. Nationally and locally the focus was all Shannon. Whatever Shannon wanted Shannon got.
Look at all the recent fuss at Cork about a couple of airbridges?
Cork Airport did not matter in the mindset of protecting Shannon at all costs.
Cork Airport was screwed big time.
Last edited by Tom the Tenor; 5th Jun 2005 at 22:45.