I think there's some law about closing recruitments before the published closing date for applications has been passed. Any interviews going on at present would IMHO be unlikely to be the first and last of it.

Does anyone know of a thread in the PPRuNe archives on the Shamrock interview process? Or (dare I ask) can any of the lucky ones interviewed thus far shed any light on the day out?

Cheers and good luck to all,

VFE.

What salary could you expect starting at LGW or BFS?

Atreyu

Sounds like another [insert name of large FTO] lockout. God this industry is depressing sometimes if your not wearing the right tie.

I've heard that they interviewed some guy with about 200 hours no type rating and currently not working for an airline so it seems the process is completely random. Is there anyone out there at all that might be able to give us an insight into just what the hell they are asking in this interview?!!!!!!!!!!! :ugh:

I know a guy finished training about 8months ago,no job, has 200 hours and got called for an interview,so who knows really

have you lost the plot completely superpilot!!?? :D No matter what "experience" shamrock require, you will not be seen as experienced!!

Really they are calling low hundred hrs guys???I guess They wouldn't be the mostly suitable for EI according to their website, but maybe i'm wrong:ugh:

Anyway any guess or any infos about the interview? I've applied, but still with no news from EI..

Thanks guys

London calling, get a grip. You don't want to be lectured by a low houred pilot! WTF! With an attitude like that I hope your long term contract is renewed because I can't see you getting work elsewhere. To all with their names in the hat, Good Luck. The market is picking up. Keep the faith.
Rgds
no slot

Keep your pants on everyone. To the people that got the call; what is your experience level? Up until now I haven't seen anyone with experience saying that they have been contacted. I'm sure they're going through a shedload of applications as it is. So give it some time.

I wouldn't be surprised if in the end I don't get a call, despite having experience and currently working for an airline. That's the market nowadays and it is completely random. Maybe they even get enough applicants through the process before they ever reach my application.


In the end of the day, sit it out and see. It's not the best deal in the world but it would be a hell of a start for lowtimers. Good luck to everyone that got called. One word of advice though: Don't **** up, you don't get opportunities like this every day. ;-)

Hey there,

Well in the past EI have had a mixture of guys from those just about to finish flt training to those with type ratings low hours and those with type rating high hours I do know of 2 guys that were in Oxford, EI came over & Oxford recommended a few & 2 guys were subsequently chosen. Another guy was chosen with a TR hardly any hours... I can go on giving examples.(On last years recruitment with EI...I did see the head of Oxford Training and another guy incharge of marketing getting out of a taxi & heading into the sim block of EI, where they said to the security guy that they 'had a meeting scheduled with the Cheif Pilot' & I later found out that the meeting was to see how many they could put forward for selection with EI).
I know for a fact that EI used to like to chose a cross section as it they felt that 'Some guys from already with other airlines may have picked yp bad habits' so thats why the cross section...they could have the option of bringing guys straight on line with a few hours line training & then groom the less experienced guys to fit the EI mould.

Regarding this one guy that I've already spoken of he's only got 200hrs and just out of flight training no type rating etc. So yes it seems EI have already called guys for selection & wheather these guys know 'the right people' I have no idea. I just wish Good luck to everyone & if anyones decent enough to post a report about the interview I'd be very appreciative. They've been lucky enough to be selected for interview so posting something online is not going to impinge on their being put forward for the sim (might even be good Karma!!! :O ) but it would give the rest of us a insight...

Alt Crz Green (or well passed it?)

At no point did I lay the claim that my experience level gave me an advantage. Can you not read??? I simply remarked that this type of experience level seems to be once again being overlooked. Early days, sure. This was said in the context of the previous 5 or 6 posts where people were claiming totally fresh out of school and non type rated pilots were being invited. That's all and nothing more! I eventually gave up trying to get through to you and londoncalling(the lights are on, but nobody's home)2009 by removing my comments.

And as for londoncalling who seems to think that all wannabes are interested in "flying jets". You might have had your lucky break sunshine but you know **** all about the state of the recruitment industry in Europe and especially the UK. There are no GA jobs for unconnected 250 hour pilots! none! zero! zilch! So don't lecture me for attempting to improve my situation by gaining a TR of my own back. I did it at a time when it was working for many then the recession bit. At least, I chose NOT to sit on my arse. A mistake! seems to work for many.

hi all, ive downloaded the pdf but I am unable to write onto the form,
can anybody help, i'm abit crap with pc's,
thanks in advance

gunit,

Dear me, have to say that's an awful admission to make as a would-be FO!! :O

Suggest you wade through some earlier posts on this thread to find the answers - they are there if you look hard enough. I like to think I'm pretty PC-savvy, but I resorted to the old-fashioned way - printing the pdf off, writing (yes, using a pen!) and mailing it to EI at Dublin Airport. This is an option if you look at the application instructions on the EI website and IMHO is very possibly less likely to be 'deleted' than an email app.

Still not heard anything though, but not sure I'm too bothered given that the country's well and truly in the poo at the mo. There could be a lot better places to get a job than Ireland right now......)

HW

cheers HW,
honesty in the best policy eh;)
you make a valid point,
do you think its worth going down in person??

Agree wholeheartedly with ACG.

Also you need to consider how you will demonstrate to AL that you will go about settling in Ireland (if that's your base choice) should you get offered a position. Did anyone take the time to include a covering letter or email outlining any connections to Ireland or how you would overcome the big move? With a number of fo's leaving I can see this being a bigger issue for AL given their "perceived" investment in training. Don't get me wrong we have a mix of nationalities working in AL but each one has a "story".

Regarding cover letters etc, AL explicitly state that no such representations were going to be considered. Only the app form.

I might have missed it in all of this, and I've read ppjn, but can anybody shed some light on the monthly roster pattern/working schedule?

TVM

Rostering
 

Right to start off "pattern" isn't a word I would use to describe the AL rosters.

I am yet to meet anyone who actually definitively KNOWS how our rosters are produced. There is lots of hearsay about how they are manually prepared or that they are computer produced. The fact of the matter is that we aren't getting what we asked for and in fact what is agreed with the union.

So here is my take on our rosters. Firstly we have a roster close out date by which we would have entered into Carmen (AL calls it PBS = Preferential Bidding System) our bids for the forthcoming roster period. it closes out on a Sunday night and the following Friday a roster will be released. It is available from AIMS so you can download it electronically into whatever format you like and put it onto your phone, pc etc. Once the new roster is published you will have 6 weeks of work showing which reduces down to 2 weeks before the next one is due to be out. Not great considering the winter/summer schedules are published so far in advance so AL knows which flights it will be operating many many months in advance. How much you get of your bids will depend on your seniority as the system tries to achieve a certain satisfaction ratio. I think the most senior pilots would expect something like 80% and the most junior much lower.

As I said your bids are entered by yourself into the Carmen system. You can bid for any manner of things such as times to check in by/check out/overnights/flights to specific countries/regions and individual flight numbers. You also get to bid for golden days off and request free days. Generally it is two golden days per roster period. If you don't get your golden days in the current roster then supposedly you get bumped up the list to get them next time around. We also had a request book into which we entered days off that we really really wanted off eg: birthdays etc. The company unilaterally decided to withdraw this without any agreement with the union which is another breach of our working conditions. Apparently we can now email someone and it will work the same. I fail to see how any transparency will be achieved and you will get what you ask for but there you go.

So the above is how it is meant to work. In essence a pc programme will spit out your work. It would be 5 on 2 off or any manner of combinations. The worst would be 6 on 1 off. You can do swaps if you like to try and "fix" your roster. Obviously you can't swap off training and checking duties but pretty much any regular flying can be swapped.

We overnight in ORK, SNN and LHR. If this doesn't float your boat you can generally offload them. ORK are easier to offload. LHR used to be handy enough duties although a number of the couplings changed over the summer which made them really long duty days often involving a continental flight from Dublin ending up in LHR with minimum rest. Ocasionally we might be sent over to cover for LGW or BFS although on the FO side this is rare. Captains tend to see those places more often as they don't seem to have enough LHS in those bases.

On the positive side of things our free days are our free days. Once they are published they are cast in stone and cannot be changed or taken off you. Crew control can "friday change" your forthcoming weeks roster but cannot touch any free days. There are also various rules restricting the amount of tinkering that they can do to your work based on the amount of notice you are given. Generally this is limited to 1-2 hours of what was rostered. Anything more and you start negotiating or ultimately can refuse the duty.

Finally there is a project ongoing to provide us with a fixed pattern roster. The union is leading towards a 5/3 pattern and allegedly it will be coming in for summer next year.

Did anyone actually hear anything back from shamrock??? i didnt...1400hrs on type current.

Captain Spam Can

The closing date isn't until the 10th Dec :ugh:

are the figures posted on ppjn what one would be looking at? what would the differences be for ROI, UK based pilots? Thanks for your replies

Only today I got the receipt to the e-mail I sent on the 21st...

"Your message was read on Tuesday, November 30, 2010 2:49:10 PM (GMT)"

Dear Santa

I know you are really busy at this time of the year so please don't take up too much time with an interview at AL...just a job offer from them would be great...go on...you know it makes sense.;)
I have been really good all year...and my Mum says that you will be in real trouble if you let me down.

Mailed Application
 

I sent my application from here in Belgium to EI via mail (snail mail!) because of the my scanner is u/s! I sent it on Nov. 20th and as of yet have not received any acknowledgment from EI.
Has anyone else sent the application via mail as opposed to email?
Thanks.

Yep, I did and no reply either as yet......

HW

Me too, no reply yet.

Likewise Muvo

That's funny :ok: Airperator.. hahaha

Maybe a good idea to send your app via secure post. That way it can be tracked and you're pretty much guaranteed it will arrive at the address you sent it to. If you have'nt then I suggest you give The HR Dept a quick call, just for POM. Application gives 10th Dec closing date so I guess they have a !!!! load of applications to process. Sit tight, I guess you guys will hear something soon. Anyone know if EI provide a bond agreement or is it mastercard only !

You're not the only one confused. Given that the application process is not yet complete, I suspect that they may have probed some of the schools for the right stuff in addition to wanting to hire experience.

What makes me laugh is their great effort to show that they are an equal opps employer on the application form. However, if rumours are to be believed, the reality is the usual nudge and wink via the same old networks is the real requirement.

As mentioned earlier, the application form asked for such basic details that I cant see how anybody can stand out if they are a 200 hr newbie.

EK

Agree.

It's so basic it's probably just a HR arse covering exercise - the old boy FTO network will provide the actual numbers :E

Right-o, I've been called for interview pretty soon and can't find any info on what questions to expect and what to brush up on. I've been fairly proactive and I'm brushing up on all ATPL subjects and the Airbus tech stuff. Also Aer Lingus history and whatever else.

I would however thank anyone who's been through the grinder recently if they could provide some information to focus my studies.

Thanks!

-Polo

Polo

What's your background if you don't mind me asking? (hrs/type etc)

Actually they have and I have been around long enough to see it. It is easier to ask a respected FTO with whom you placed cadets previously to recommend a few of the better individuals and avoid having to wade through reams of CVs from hopeful wannabees. But you are correct there is no network as such. The individuals concerned had no link to AL. But it never does any harm to have a good reference from within or from certain FTOs. But Aer Lingus is not unique in that.

There are also known for favouring integrated over modular when hiring recent graduates. They are of course entitled to do so. That's just a heads up for applicants. Doesn't apply to experienced type rated pilots.

To anyone that's been invited to interview so far could you tell me whether you were invited via email or over the phone? I've had a number of phone calls from 'Unknown' numbers over the last couple of days and as a matter of course I never answer these, just wondering if I need to start doing so now?

Total pish. Over the last years they have been bringing in a mix of ab-initio, zero time peeps and some already with time and ratings.

AL have a long history of giving new starters their first leg up into the industry, quite honourable. I'm just sorry I missed out when I first started off.

I've been a really good boy this year though, fingers crossed Santa comes through this time! Best of luck to all in the system!

Alt Crz Green,

Chill out.

I make a simple point; the information requested on the application form is so minimal that there cannot be any meaningful way of selecting one 200hr applicant from another. As there ARE low houred guys being called up, there must be some other selection criteria being favoured. The strong suspicion is that you need to have gone to the right school(s). This is the 'network' of which I speak.

As mentioned earlier, that's fine. Except (as was my point) they bang on about equal opps and a transparent selection process. Which is clearly not the case. Its just management speak and HR drivel. I think there is very little doubt that this is the case.

If your age is to be believed, you are obviously too old to remember several FOs that EI have taken from said schools with 170hrs NOT on a cadet scheme in recent years. Just take a look at their stats.

I'm really not too sure why you contest this obvious point and get so uptight about it?

EK

EKs argument is both logical and in all probability correct

Alt Crz Green - 0, Young Wannabes Utd - 2

You are right though Alt Crz Green, generally there is no prior connection to ALT as I made clear in my posts. But it's no secret that they can and do cherrypick to suit their own idea of what constitutes an Aer Lingus pilot. No conspiracies. It's just the way it's done.