Another thing is that once SAIL malaga base will be open the pay deal and roster will be even worse than uk...

6/3 roster with overnights in scandinavia operating SAS routes and seems like unions are not doing anything about it...

Haha....Ok, only thing is its NOT double pay. I rest my case.

CP

Just the fact that BIT offers a higher salary for flying a Q400 in a country with low living expenses, than flying an Airbus out of London.

It’s a bit sad where SAS has transformed into during the past years.

With multi-union system in Scandinavia failing to negotiate with the company the results are obvious. All the young guys sold out by older colleagues, B-scales created, even more subcontractors with social dumping etc.

I think we can all agree that what happened wasn’t that pilots or company hated each others even tho it had something to do with it, but the fact that both parties failed miserably to change when everything changed around them. Now they are desperately trying to hold on what they have or reach something they would like to have.

When they were supposed to work together and change things back to sustainable they continued arguing even more. Aviation industry evolved, SAS didn’t.

As I said earlier, it’s really sad and hopefully other companies and unions can learn something from this. As long as this continue SAS will have the cheapest pilots in Europe.

No GScapture, we can´t agree on that!

The company demanded a B-scale in the period of some 10 years when SAS didn´t hire any new pilots. The unions were forced to accept it, but when new pilots started being hired again, the unions managed to get rid of the B-scale. This was done at the expence of the older guys.
So much for selling out younger guys, right!

The company has been union busting for years and years, and the unions have been played out against each other. They have been more or less power less and had no way of stopping SAIL, etc, etc.

The pay scheme I have seen includes bonus and dividend, whereby the gross salary for captains reach +9000 euros.

I do not say, that Air Baltic is perfect, but they react and adapt, when they have to.

The idea of SAS Ireland is out of sync. They could have gotten away with it five years ago, but now every company is screaming for pilots. Primarily Easyjet will absorb any good vacant Airbuspilot in Europe.

So where are you going then?

Anyone chosing sail over easyjet should have their medical revoked, end of story.

Understood Flygare, then I’ve must got wrong information regarding that. Sorry about that.

I’ve heard similar stories about the company playing with unions and trying to bust them. Regardless what’s going on the company structure and business strategy must been a bit off if they came down to this level that it is absolutely necessary to outsource everything, undermine everything. Not a lot “Scandinavian equality” in there. Or then it is just extremely badly run company. But that’s a whole different story and this topic is about SAIL.

-GS-

So after 16 pages on Pprune and three months of operations what's the overall assessment of this new "low cost" carrier operating on behalf of SAS. It sounds mixed to say the very least and more like a Ryanair set up than anything resembling SAS mainline

New chairman of the board of SAS just got a 61% increase in financial compensation '-to restore pre-2012 levels'

Good way of leading the way forward :rolleyes:

Aer Lingus offers 2000€ more in basic salary for FO's.

Malaga base postponed indefinitely.

5 brand new Neo's arrived. They fly on average 9 sectors per day. 1,8 sector per aircraft per day is the SAS way of optimizing things.

:ok:

Malaga start date has been confirmed.

Aircraft flying considerably more sectors per day than you state. A quick click here will prove that! (Looks like 5 sectors a day - each!) https://www.flightradar24.com/data/aircraft/ei-sie

Where are you getting your rubbish from? Facebook?

Does anyone know anything about contract length on SAIL AGP base? I am just curious about what the guys there will be doing during the winter as SAS has verry few flights to mainland Spain in the snowy season.

BR

No worries, in the winter you'll be sent to Scandinavia to operate flights on SAS network, expect to stay in hotels in CPH, ARN and OSL.

I see that Captains for the AGP base are offered a 6/3 schedule where as F/O's are offered a 5/4 rotation.

Social contributions
 

Is there anybody here who can shed some light on social contributions if you live and work in Spain? I've been looking at the contract in Malaga and was just wondering if Parc is paying any social contributions as employer because if not, as far as I know, you need to set up your own business and pay a lot. A breakdown would be very much appreciated.

In Spain CAE/PARC are responsible to deduct both your social contributions and income tax at source:

“For employed persons, their contributions are withheld from their pay, and transferred to the General Social Security Revenue Office by their employer together with his own contributions”

Employers pay the majority of the contribution, 23.6%, you pay 4.7% (figures may have increased, but same ratio).

Here is a guide for your/family social benefits in Spain – Link:

http://ec.europa.eu/employment_socia...20Spain_en.pdf

Income tax is graduated with the highest rate on earnings above 65K at 45% - Link:

Spanish tax rates and allowances for 2018.

You may want to review the Spanish Beckham’s Law (no joke):

“The Special Displaced Workers Regime, the original name of the Beckham Act, was approved in 2004 in Spain with the aim of boosting the national economy by attracting executives and qualified personnel from abroad. The incentive was that, under that regime, the displaced workers who changed their tax residence to Spain would have a tax reduction in their Spanish Income tax (IRPF). Specifically, it allowed them to be taxed as non-residents at the general rate of 24% instead of 43% [now 45%]” - Link:

Beckham Law: Can I Take Advantage of It? (UPDATED IN 2017)

And of course, the mandatory; didn’t you see this coming?
The shameful attack on the terms and conditions of the once envied Scandinavian work/life balance started in 2012, the time when a certain core group of pilots in Norway naively made a precarious agreement with a certain smiling rock-ape to use outsourced pilots at a new base in Finland.

Promises were made the airline would hire all the outsourced pilots when the base became profitable. More bases opened using more outsourced pilots and more false promises made. To the delight of the airline, unions in each country formed separate alliances between outsourced pilots and their service provider employer. Flights increased to/from the Norway hub.

A day of infamy arrived when the original core group of pilots became outsourced pilots themselves. Today they fight a legal battle to restore their former airline employee status and associated employee rights. It’s unfortunate they lacked foresight and fortitude in 2012.

History has shown people are slow to act whenever a regime or megalomaniac seeks to undermine the lives of a particular group, whether directly by force or perhaps disguised as an innovative labour model. We usually stand idly by until irrevocable harm is done, acting at the very last moment. The airline employee is an endangered species due to these abhorrent atypical employment schemes.

Save A Scandinavian.

Thanks so much Direct Bondi, very useful stuff!

About the last part, I must say I’m in doubt about the contract because of this. Just that this is something that is anyway happening in aviation. For instance if easyJet or Ryanair would start competing with SAS directly, which they do, and offer their pilots less, which they also do, wouldn’t that be the exact same thing? I think it’s seriously time that we pilots start to think about organising ourselves properly and collectively (so not only inside airlines but throughout the industry) and lobby to make laws against the abuse of pilots..

A previous poster mentioned that the new contract would be on par with Easyjet

Well it's nowhere near. A massive thumbs down by the troops. They have tried to engage with CAE to no avail. Other agencies looking after TUI and TCX Palma have now improved their package due to lack of interest. Well CAE seem to be in denial, nothing to see here, move on. Maybe they were relying on the Monarch pool which has now dried up. People are not joining in the numbers required, CAE may soon have to pay penalties for not meeting their obligations.

BALPA are now meeting with CAE in April. Here's to a positive outcome. It could become q decent operation.

Except they don’t. Both EZ and FR pilots make more than the Scandinavian SAS pilots, with better rosters, etc. Wouldn’t be very nice if SAIL offered better terms than core SAS. That would sort of remove the entire reason for SAIL, which was established due to the «high cost» of the Scandinavian employees. 4% of the total costs for SAS...