Virgin Recruiting
Joined: Aug 2018
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
From: Lydd International
Thanks for the response!
I think if TUI came knocking it would be hard to turn them down vs VAA, again I'm just nervous about the financial position of TUI, whether that be justifiably or not. Knocked off the throne by Jet2, the sole charter airline still going, still making losses since pandemic (who isn't!), a large boom in hiring, especially lower hour pilots which on the face of it is seems good, but all seemingly on these full time yet part time contracts, which doesn't scream 'we can afford to hire full time crew'., something doesn't sit right with any of the options (if I were to have them). IMO the safest jobs are either BA, Ryanair or Jet2.
I feel like I've become a pessimist in looking for a reasons to doubt in every company, Dammit!!
I think if TUI came knocking it would be hard to turn them down vs VAA, again I'm just nervous about the financial position of TUI, whether that be justifiably or not. Knocked off the throne by Jet2, the sole charter airline still going, still making losses since pandemic (who isn't!), a large boom in hiring, especially lower hour pilots which on the face of it is seems good, but all seemingly on these full time yet part time contracts, which doesn't scream 'we can afford to hire full time crew'., something doesn't sit right with any of the options (if I were to have them). IMO the safest jobs are either BA, Ryanair or Jet2.
I feel like I've become a pessimist in looking for a reasons to doubt in every company, Dammit!!
Joined: Oct 2021
Posts: 14
Likes: 0
From: UK
Thanks for the response!
I think if TUI came knocking it would be hard to turn them down vs VAA, again I'm just nervous about the financial position of TUI, whether that be justifiably or not. Knocked off the throne by Jet2, the sole charter airline still going, still making losses since pandemic (who isn't!), a large boom in hiring, especially lower hour pilots which on the face of it is seems good, but all seemingly on these full time yet part time contracts, which doesn't scream 'we can afford to hire full time crew'., something doesn't sit right with any of the options (if I were to have them). IMO the safest jobs are either BA, Ryanair or Jet2.
I feel like I've become a pessimist in looking for a reasons to doubt in every company, Dammit!!
I think if TUI came knocking it would be hard to turn them down vs VAA, again I'm just nervous about the financial position of TUI, whether that be justifiably or not. Knocked off the throne by Jet2, the sole charter airline still going, still making losses since pandemic (who isn't!), a large boom in hiring, especially lower hour pilots which on the face of it is seems good, but all seemingly on these full time yet part time contracts, which doesn't scream 'we can afford to hire full time crew'., something doesn't sit right with any of the options (if I were to have them). IMO the safest jobs are either BA, Ryanair or Jet2.
I feel like I've become a pessimist in looking for a reasons to doubt in every company, Dammit!!
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 146
Likes: 4
From: UK
Thanks for the response!
I think if TUI came knocking it would be hard to turn them down vs VAA, again I'm just nervous about the financial position of TUI, whether that be justifiably or not. Knocked off the throne by Jet2, the sole charter airline still going, still making losses since pandemic (who isn't!), a large boom in hiring, especially lower hour pilots which on the face of it is seems good, but all seemingly on these full time yet part time contracts, which doesn't scream 'we can afford to hire full time crew'., something doesn't sit right with any of the options (if I were to have them). IMO the safest jobs are either BA, Ryanair or Jet2.
I feel like I've become a pessimist in looking for a reasons to doubt in every company, Dammit!!
I think if TUI came knocking it would be hard to turn them down vs VAA, again I'm just nervous about the financial position of TUI, whether that be justifiably or not. Knocked off the throne by Jet2, the sole charter airline still going, still making losses since pandemic (who isn't!), a large boom in hiring, especially lower hour pilots which on the face of it is seems good, but all seemingly on these full time yet part time contracts, which doesn't scream 'we can afford to hire full time crew'., something doesn't sit right with any of the options (if I were to have them). IMO the safest jobs are either BA, Ryanair or Jet2.
I feel like I've become a pessimist in looking for a reasons to doubt in every company, Dammit!!
I’m not sure what the latest is, but the Canada contract is/ has ended. The, recently stepped down DFO, was trying to use that as stick.
TUI was good, the crew 99% brilliant. VS doesn’t sound like a particularly happy ship, but that’s only from a couple of people I know there. VS were brutal over covid, TUI didn’t make any redundancies.
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 26
Likes: 5
From: EU
FTA process currently between the CC and management, indicative ballots on potential future action are always part of that process to provide leverage for the union. It's good to see though that union membership has recovered, indeed it's stronger than it has ever historically been at VS, and that the CC are fighting hard to get back to pre-covid Ts&Cs.It's a long game though and as always, management don't like spending money....
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 451
Likes: 6
From: the land of chocolate
Couple of questions about working for Virgin:
1. What is the % union membership at the moment?
2. What is the union fighting for? reduced hours, Increase pay or also other issues?
3. What is the Check and training culture like in the company?
4. What are some of the major issues facing the pilots at this time?
5. How many people are leaving or looking to leave? Where are they going?
1. What is the % union membership at the moment?
2. What is the union fighting for? reduced hours, Increase pay or also other issues?
3. What is the Check and training culture like in the company?
4. What are some of the major issues facing the pilots at this time?
5. How many people are leaving or looking to leave? Where are they going?
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 26
Likes: 5
From: EU
1. Good, at a historical high (VS pilots had been split across 2 unions in the past) and improving all the time. Actual numbers/% are confidential, for reasons of industrial strategy.
2. Yes. But the current FTA is about lifestyle protections, some of which were given up for Covid but not yet restored, and introducing others to mitigate fatigue/improve sustainability away from the covid-survival-mode of 2020-2022.
3. Subjective, but overall positive in my experience, and certainly light years away from the bad old days; significant focus on training and development, and extra support is always there if needed in LIFUS/CMD etc. No ‘chop’ culture and no tw@ts in training that I’ve come across - mates on the other fleet tend to confirm the same there.
4. See 2.
5. Confidential; management won’t say (except to say ‘not very many’) and it’s just anecdotal on the pilot side. A few have gone to the ME, and as always pilots are full of talk, but in my peer group numbers leaving seem small. People always have different reasons for leaving, especially when lots of recruiting is going on elsewhere; more often than not it’s the pull rather than the push (ME salary, Jet2 northern bases etc).
2. Yes. But the current FTA is about lifestyle protections, some of which were given up for Covid but not yet restored, and introducing others to mitigate fatigue/improve sustainability away from the covid-survival-mode of 2020-2022.
3. Subjective, but overall positive in my experience, and certainly light years away from the bad old days; significant focus on training and development, and extra support is always there if needed in LIFUS/CMD etc. No ‘chop’ culture and no tw@ts in training that I’ve come across - mates on the other fleet tend to confirm the same there.
4. See 2.
5. Confidential; management won’t say (except to say ‘not very many’) and it’s just anecdotal on the pilot side. A few have gone to the ME, and as always pilots are full of talk, but in my peer group numbers leaving seem small. People always have different reasons for leaving, especially when lots of recruiting is going on elsewhere; more often than not it’s the pull rather than the push (ME salary, Jet2 northern bases etc).
Last edited by Rostermouse; 19th July 2023 at 14:13.
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 451
Likes: 6
From: the land of chocolate
1. Good, at a historical high (VS pilots had been split across 2 unions in the past) and improving all the time. Actual numbers/% are confidential, for reasons of industrial strategy.
2. Yes. But the current FTA is about lifestyle protections, some of which were given up for Covid but not yet restored, and introducing others to mitigate fatigue/improve sustainability away from the covid-survival-mode of 2020-2022.
3. Subjective, but overall positive in my experience, and certainly light years away from the bad old days; significant focus on training and development, and extra support is always there if needed in LIFUS/CMD etc. No ‘chop’ culture and no tw@ts in training that I’ve come across - mates on the other fleet say the same.
4. See 2.
5. Confidential; management won’t say (except to say ‘not very many’) and it’s just anecdotal on the pilot side. A few have gone to the ME, and as always pilots are full of talk, but in my peer group numbers leaving seem small. People always have different reasons for leaving, especially when lots of recruiting is going on elsewhere; more often than not it’s the pull rather than the push (ME salary, Jet2 northern bases etc).
2. Yes. But the current FTA is about lifestyle protections, some of which were given up for Covid but not yet restored, and introducing others to mitigate fatigue/improve sustainability away from the covid-survival-mode of 2020-2022.
3. Subjective, but overall positive in my experience, and certainly light years away from the bad old days; significant focus on training and development, and extra support is always there if needed in LIFUS/CMD etc. No ‘chop’ culture and no tw@ts in training that I’ve come across - mates on the other fleet say the same.
4. See 2.
5. Confidential; management won’t say (except to say ‘not very many’) and it’s just anecdotal on the pilot side. A few have gone to the ME, and as always pilots are full of talk, but in my peer group numbers leaving seem small. People always have different reasons for leaving, especially when lots of recruiting is going on elsewhere; more often than not it’s the pull rather than the push (ME salary, Jet2 northern bases etc).
Good inside info, thanks a lot! Much appreciated.
Is the union trying to get the 750 hour limit back?
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 26
Likes: 5
From: EU
A return to a credit hours system is on the wishlist but not in danger of happening soon. Crewing are moving to AIMS next month which promises some better rostering functionality in future, but no-one’s counting chickens just yet. That said, I’ve never done more than 700hrs in a year on the post-covid 900hrs contract, and that’s with extra trips/working days off.
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 156
Likes: 42
From: UK
A return to a credit hours system is on the wishlist but not in danger of happening soon. Crewing are moving to AIMS next month which promises some better rostering functionality in future, but no-one’s counting chickens just yet. That said, I’ve never done more than 700hrs in a year on the post-covid 900hrs contract, and that’s with extra trips/working days off.
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 1,092
Likes: 47
RARA9 -
Our virgin mate in the pub last friday said big balpa recently shut down the individual company councils 'bulletin board' forum's that members regularly used to exchange rants views and knowledge. Replaced by some useless disorganised twitter-type can-of-worms nonsense. He says posts can be removed by nameless mods, without trace or explanation, but its difficult to be sure when you can't find anything anyway.
Some half-baked reasons given but widely believed, especially by the BA members, that it was because the forums were being used to express public criticism of the NEC. No forums = no criticism = rosy garden. Management heaven.
As a result, angry members are resorting to private whatsapp groups tovent their anger express their views.
He said it is difficult to know what is going on unless you are in a group but they tend to be one-fleet ponies. A bonus is - you can be in a group without being in balpa.
In his view, the upcoming rumpus at VS should include pay, intolerable scheduling and use of inexperienced second officer cruise pilots to fiddle the FTLs. But a very long way off a strike ..... especially if you were around in 2011, or looking over the fence at BA in 2018.
LFH
a friend of mine in the company said that potential strike action is on the cards ? me being nosey wanted to see if this is the case ?
Some half-baked reasons given but widely believed, especially by the BA members, that it was because the forums were being used to express public criticism of the NEC. No forums = no criticism = rosy garden. Management heaven.
As a result, angry members are resorting to private whatsapp groups to
He said it is difficult to know what is going on unless you are in a group but they tend to be one-fleet ponies. A bonus is - you can be in a group without being in balpa.
In his view, the upcoming rumpus at VS should include pay, intolerable scheduling and use of inexperienced second officer cruise pilots to fiddle the FTLs. But a very long way off a strike ..... especially if you were around in 2011, or looking over the fence at BA in 2018.
LFH
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 26
Likes: 5
From: EU
The BALPA comms revamp has been really badly handled by the NEC. Possibly for the reasons you suggest, however the old VS forums are still working, it’s just the BA ones and the ‘general discussion’ boards that have closed. New website is crap though.
0/0 yeah I hear you. My 700hrs is all 2-pilot/no crew rest, and 4-5 trips a month (guess the fleet
). So fewer hours but still flat out, maybe just (slightly) shorter flights perhaps.
0/0 yeah I hear you. My 700hrs is all 2-pilot/no crew rest, and 4-5 trips a month (guess the fleet
). So fewer hours but still flat out, maybe just (slightly) shorter flights perhaps.
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 26
Likes: 5
From: EU
Can’t see typical rosters for every fleet but it’s a rostered-days-per-year airline now, not target-hrs-per-year as per pre-covid, so days off seem roughly the same everywhere. You now get blocks of standby or rsv if you are rostered up to your hours target, unlike the old days when you got extra days off. One of the reasons VACC is advocating a return to a credit hours system, but company not enthusiastic, unsurprisingly.
Lifestyle contracts - expect to wait years. Hints that they’ll ask for expressions of interest again sometime in 2024, but no other timescale offered.
Lifestyle contracts - expect to wait years. Hints that they’ll ask for expressions of interest again sometime in 2024, but no other timescale offered.
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 528
Likes: 62
From: everywhere
I see virgin have reopened hiring and this time open to EU citizens with visa sponsorship. UK citizens are at a huge disadvantage on the job market if more UK airlines start to do this because I can't see any European carrier doing it.
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 122
Likes: 27
From: World
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 68
Likes: 0
From: LaLaLand
Can anyone tell me how commutable the FO roster is? Airbus rated, so likely I'd end up in Airbus fleet? Also if you do happen to live outside the UK, are your various insurances only valid if living in the UK?
Finally, is c.£86,000 about right all in for a SFO?
Finally, is c.£86,000 about right all in for a SFO?