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IAG: BA restructuring may cost 12,000 jobs

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IAG: BA restructuring may cost 12,000 jobs

Old 25th Jul 2020, 09:25
  #1361 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
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polax52

Allegedly, IAG has about a year of liquidity (survival) if it did nothing.
Cargo and repatriation flights continue, and gradually people are flying again.
New route to Montego Bay announced.

If IAG became desperate, there would be a rights issue.
Also, Qatar have said they would inject more equity into IAG if necessary.
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Old 25th Jul 2020, 09:59
  #1362 (permalink)  
 
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777JRM: "If IAG became desperate, there would be a rights issue."
Yes indeed....
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/b...ssue-zrddj95kh

Last edited by slast; 25th Jul 2020 at 11:25. Reason: clarification
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Old 25th Jul 2020, 12:15
  #1363 (permalink)  
 
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On a more mundane issue for some but of great concern to many is what is happening to the pension deficit ? I agree that BA need to take action as it is extremely unprofessional to keep the workforce in this dreadful limbo!
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Old 26th Jul 2020, 09:15
  #1364 (permalink)  
 
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Makes sense to do the rights issue from a place of relative strength (existing liquidity). This is the announcement I’d been waiting for. Assuming it is successful this gets us through the winter and into (with luck) vaccine territory.
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Old 26th Jul 2020, 12:25
  #1365 (permalink)  
 
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HZ123

I know this much, from their latest missive. NAPS lost 10% of it's value, now I'm no pensions expert, but that doesn't sound good.
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Old 26th Jul 2020, 12:45
  #1366 (permalink)  
 
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Don’t forget, pensioners are drawing on it, and since 2018 nobody is contributing to it (apart from BA to fund the deficit).
Also some people are taking it all out as a Cash Equivalent Transfer Value, to invest elsewhere.

The concern some may have is that if BA were to become insolvent, or create a situation, that would force NAPS into the Govt’s PPF.
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Old 26th Jul 2020, 13:39
  #1367 (permalink)  
 
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Ex Cargo Clown

Short term liquidity is good .Its the long term that has to be addressed.
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Old 26th Jul 2020, 16:07
  #1368 (permalink)  
 
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All the guys taking VR will be going with a pension, this global sum for each pilot has to be transferred out of the fund to pay for their pension. A glass wall transaction in effect Obviously this reduces the funds value, but at the same time reduces the funds liabilities NAPS has been in deficit with the Trustees expectation that BA had a number of years to make good.
This has not happened forcing BA to make emergency payments This will have been a major consideration in BA decision to offer a less than generous VR payments
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Old 26th Jul 2020, 19:24
  #1369 (permalink)  
 
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Lots of chat on voluntary redundancy just wondered what package has been negotiated for those made compulsory redundant ?
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Old 27th Jul 2020, 00:08
  #1370 (permalink)  

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I believe it is the statutory minimum which is capped at 16,140. There was no negotiation.
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Old 27th Jul 2020, 07:43
  #1371 (permalink)  
 
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That is not correct.
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Old 27th Jul 2020, 09:33
  #1372 (permalink)  
 
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If it is incorrect, how about explaining why it is incorrect?
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Old 27th Jul 2020, 09:49
  #1373 (permalink)  
 
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Walnut


I believe the pension is only safe when you reach the nominated age for drawing it, ie, 55 or 60.

No money is transferred out unless a member has used an IFA to request a CETV transfer.
The ‘pot’ stays with BA Pensions who are very good investors.
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Old 27th Jul 2020, 12:37
  #1374 (permalink)  
 
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Christopher Robin

Statuatory plus Pay In Lieu Of Notice (PILON).

That figure will depend on your age, how many years worked at different ages plus the notice period. Three months seem to be the norm here. Gov website has a calculator that will work it out for you. I was quite surprised that even though I have been in full time employment for forty years I hadn't hit the cap.
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Old 27th Jul 2020, 17:00
  #1375 (permalink)  

Controversial, moi?
 
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Jumpjim

So what is incorrect?

The compulsory redundancy pay, as I understand it, is the statutory minimum redundancy payment.

TURIN states that it is plus PILON. PILON is just that, payment instead of of working your notice period, which is not redundancy pay.

I believe my statement is correct that compulsory redundancy payment is the statutory minimum unless you know otherwise.
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Old 27th Jul 2020, 17:43
  #1376 (permalink)  
 
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777JRM

I believe you are wrong when a person draws a pension either through early retirement eg ill health, NRA, or VR as is the case here the pension becomes crystallised. The money does indeed stay in the scheme BUT it is ring fenced, so if the scheme is in deficit as NAPS is then the employer has to make good the individuals shortfall. As I suspect the majority of the VR’s are over 55 and in NAPS, BA will have a cost here
One consideration is if BA folds and NAPS moves into the PPS, these pensions already in payment are protected fully, only any future index linking would be capped
if a person requests a CETA then the sum available will be reduced if a scheme is in deficit.
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Old 27th Jul 2020, 19:10
  #1377 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2020
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Lucky escape

Hard to know how to feel about all this collapse now.
Back in the days of FPP I almost got in, and am still pretty certain the deciding factor in my failure was being mid 30s and unmarried - as they specifically asked the question about whether working short hall from Gatwick would suit my young family.
The next year I didn't even get invited to the flight school assessment, which kind of suggests I scored a black mark.
Feels like a lucky reprieve now. Would almost certainly have just lost my job with a chunk of the training loan left to pay and be so out of date on my other world skill set as to be unemployable in the current environment.
Looks like those who keep their jobs will be on significantly lower salaries too - compounding the reduced salary bands when I was applying.
Funny how you think something was a disaster, then it turns out a lucky escape.
I also took great pleasure in posting what happened at the team game assessments here after the apparent black balling. Always wondered if they changed the hike through the US desert after that.
And now for those keeping their jobs in the current crisis, what next? If A350s have achieved fully autonomous flight, how long before passengers start to feel automation is safer than human pilots?
Hard to know how to feel about the collapse, but not hard to know how I'd feel about being in it.
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Old 27th Jul 2020, 19:44
  #1378 (permalink)  
 
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I believe that it is true that ill-health can trigger the pension before age 55.

I hear that, for an individual quote, CETVs have jumped nearly 30% in value since last year.
Apparently this is based on the future bond/gilt yields, and might encourage pilots to transfer out now, just in case BA does fold.

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Old 27th Jul 2020, 20:23
  #1379 (permalink)  
 
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It’s also has under funding. as a major driver, if someone wants to leave then the money he takes out is what his individual share is of the scheme. If these numbers you quote are true then the scheme is in serious default
A pilot who takes VR which is accepted by BA could be making a wise decision as it’s BA making up the shortfall
With a few years to NRA or 60yrs then his pension is locked in
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Old 28th Jul 2020, 07:50
  #1380 (permalink)  
 
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VR update:

BA said people would be notified last week wether their VR would be granted or not.

That then changed to being notified this week.

It is now changed to be no later than 17th Aug, a mere two weeks notice of wether you will be flying a BA jet on 1st Sept or not.


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