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Avion Express

Old 27th Nov 2023, 23:42
  #181 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Ragneir
Funny. Not only their base is 800-1000Ä, their perdiems are awful. And over that, they still have their stupid multiplier depending on the base you are. So using their arbritrary scale and scope of living, you might even be getting less than what they offer.
It's also funny you're talking about those wages when both me and a few others from Avion were invited for Wizzair and got offered exactly what I mentioned.
No, I'm not full of it. Just feels like people all around are jelly from not taking from Avion's pie when it's hot. It's no surprise Wizzair is the worst paying company in Europe.
I worked in a variety of bases with them, and while I hold no love for the company, your statements are just flat out wrong. Starting out with wizzair you will be getting 1400 per month to be trained (so approximately 8 weeks for your TR and then 1-2 months for your line training to be completed) after that your salary based on average KM will be about 4-4.3k per month (-415 if you got them to type rate you) and after tax it works out at about 3k per month with full social security coverage etc. 1500 hours later youíre earning +500-800 per month.

No one is jealous of not working for Avion, itís a bad company that actively works to reduce the salaries of European pilots to make more profits for themselves.
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Old 28th Nov 2023, 15:01
  #182 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Ragneir
Funny. Not only their base is 800-1000Ä, their perdiems are awful. And over that, they still have their stupid multiplier depending on the base you are. So using their arbritrary scale and scope of living, you might even be getting less than what they offer.
It's also funny you're talking about those wages when both me and a few others from Avion were invited for Wizzair and got offered exactly what I mentioned.
No, I'm not full of it. Just feels like people all around are jelly from not taking from Avion's pie when it's hot. It's no surprise Wizzair is the worst paying company in Europe.
at the end of the day, money might not be the dealbraker here. For a lot of pilots in mid thirties having a family a thousand euro on the top of the salary is not worth to be away from family for 20-30 days.. it is not surprising then when some insta youngster writes about the good deal making 1000 EUR gross on the top of the salary selling a whole week off days to the avion.. Simply this is the easiest way how to burn-out and loose the family, kids and at the end of the day ruin your life....
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Old 28th Nov 2023, 15:20
  #183 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Ragneir
Funny. Not only their base is 800-1000Ä, their perdiems are awful. And over that, they still have their stupid multiplier depending on the base you are. So using their arbritrary scale and scope of living, you might even be getting less than what they offer.
It's also funny you're talking about those wages when both me and a few others from Avion were invited for Wizzair and got offered exactly what I mentioned.
No, I'm not full of it. Just feels like people all around are jelly from not taking from Avion's pie when it's hot. It's no surprise Wizzair is the worst paying company in Europe.
In Wizzair I get paid a net salary after taxes and social security, and don't have to constantly find a way with my accountants to scratch some extra expenses in order to issue an extra invoice for my LLC so that I can pay less income taxes.
Also I am not spending 20 days in a row (at least) every month away from home in airport hotels, getting crappy (cheap) rooms above the lobby bar and right next to the 20 y.o. cabin crew room where the party goes on till 4 am, eating airport food or room service. I am home every night, sleep in my bed and bring my own food to work and eat lunch/dinner at home.
Horses for courses.
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Old 28th Nov 2023, 15:50
  #184 (permalink)  

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Originally Posted by BTMS_OVHT
youngster writes about the good deal making 1000 EUR gross on the top of the salary selling a whole week off days to the avion.. Simply this is the easiest way how to burn-out and loose the family, kids and at the end of the day ruin your life....
You got me confused there. What I saw was a WIZZ aficionado telling us about a captain-like (or above, considering both EW-EU and RYR-PL+ operations) salary thanks to Out-of-Base, not an Avion fanboy (of which I haven't seen any here).

Now, at the same time, a person in the Insta phase of development (*) is probably below 27, single and deep in training debt - how is that a less worthy choice of involvement?
+ See another city and country
+ Experience a different base environment and route structure
+ Yield to a different pack of LTIs
+ Learn yet another set of taxation responsibilities
+ Enlarge the pond of prospective life-partners
+ Reduce the financial burden faster
+ Walk the full mile while young, and get ready to make well-informed choices later.

Sayin' here, as long as we are honest to ourselves, there is no such thing as a despicable choice.

In case the GIF above don't display, I found Ragneir first post refreshing, glass-more-than-half-full, pure, and healthy. That part of my social bubble with personal experience with the baltic ACMI operators (having completed 4 seasons of under LY CAA myself) concurs that Lynx is for people choosing more money, less free days and bigger promises, whereas AVX is the moderately happy choice from the available set.

BTW, did the quoting netiquette fell victim to NCoV-19 as well?

* = previous generations don't get a pass just because there was no Insta decades ago

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Old 19th Dec 2023, 15:13
  #185 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by nickler
airport hotels, getting crappy (cheap) rooms above the lobby bar and right next to the 20 y.o. cabin crew room where the party goes on till 4 am, eating airport food or room service. I am home every night, sleep in my bed and bring my own food to work and eat lunch/dinner at home.
Horses for courses.
I didn't know Hilton, Best Western, Mariott have crappy (cheap) rooms. But hey, I guess nothing can get to your standards.

And once again, I'm not fanboying for Avion. They're just a company which I'm taking full advantage of. It's going to be pretty nice trying to apply to other companies with something like 1000 hours and one of my fun facts will be "I already operated in 5 out of 6 continents".
Sure not everyone likes commuting contracts, and I miss my dog and my family a lot, BUT I LIKE IT HERE. Because whenever I'm home I am on full vacation mode until the next rotation (every 2 works days gives us 1 off day).
As I said, I just find it funny that people are bashing a company that has had exponential growth the last 3 years and they are going to grow even further this year. Sure, we're contractors, but even Ryanair has contractors.
I dont mind paying something like 200€ per month to an accountant to tell me how I should present my expenses.
Sure, they cheap out on some stuff, but most of that stuff is pretty much invisible and untouchable to the crew. Don't forget that Avion supplies crew and planes, the rest is given by the client. And Avion has certain minimum demands (which are quite high) that the client must meet.

As I said, Germany hotels are all 4* and up. Super comfortable, good cleaning, great breakfast.
I'm in Chile right now, Best Western Premier and I have a nice view out of my room, daily cleaning, breakfast is great aswell, and the city is amazing to visit - Yes, because since we're here for a bunch of days, we get to see cities I've never ever planned on visiting.
In Antalya, Turkey it was a bit worse. However, everything was paid for, so if I didn't want to, I wouldn't have to spend any money living there.
The Resort was meh (it's Turkey), however the food was nutritive enough to maintain a good diet. Location could be better and the rooms were comfortable (mine was just missing a comfortable chair). People complained, and for the next season we'll have a different location.
In Mexico we're lodged in NH Monterrey La Fe in case of MTY base. Is that a cheap crappy hotel? It really doesn't look like it.

I could go on. As I said, my question to you would be, have you been in Avion and flew here or are you just spewing crap for no reason? It's not a perfect company, but from what I read I expected utter crap when I first joined, and have so far been pleasantly surprised.

Last edited by Ragneir; 19th Dec 2023 at 15:24.
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Old 30th Dec 2023, 11:57
  #186 (permalink)  
 
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Hello there,

I am about to do the assessment for avion. I am f/o with 1000 hrs on type. Any heads up?
Thank you!
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Old 18th Jan 2024, 15:24
  #187 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by LEALLEMD
Is anybody waiting for the online assessment (1st stage)? Looking for feedback on the technical part if someone can help! I am NTR.
Hey I have it in two weeks and would like to know about it and the sim assessment. Heard its all ATPL question bank.
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Old 19th Jan 2024, 11:03
  #188 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Ragneir
I didn't know Hilton, Best Western, Mariott have crappy (cheap) rooms. But hey, I guess nothing can get to your standards.
This did make me chuckle. After 20 odd years of airline hotel rooms I've had everything from seaview suites to mould infested ruins. Sometimes it is just bad luck. Often it is the airline intention to save a $ or so. The trouble here is that a constant tension over hotac really lowers morale. A consistent and fair hotac policy would be a key feature if I was looking to join an airline with a lot of away stays.
As for Hilton etc., they sure do all have crappy crew rooms, particularly at airport hotels. My memory of sticky carpets and very suspect kettles at the Hilton LGW haunts my dreams!
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Old 19th Jan 2024, 12:00
  #189 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by macdo
This did make me chuckle. After 20 odd years of airline hotel rooms I've had everything from seaview suites to mould infested ruins. Sometimes it is just bad luck. Often it is the airline intention to save a $ or so. The trouble here is that a constant tension over hotac really lowers morale. A consistent and fair hotac policy would be a key feature if I was looking to join an airline with a lot of away stays.
As for Hilton etc., they sure do all have crappy crew rooms, particularly at airport hotels. My memory of sticky carpets and very suspect kettles at the Hilton LGW haunts my dreams!

The good thing is, avion does cheap out on some things, like any airline, but they don't pay for the hotels. The client airline does, and they enforce certain standards.

As I said, I spent my time in Best Western Premier in Santiago de Chile and I was extremely comfortable, just like everyone else. The breakfast got old midway, but that's just a negative point of living in a hotel.

I did 2 layovers, one in Buenos Aires in the NH Buenos Aires, and another layover in Rio, staying in Hilton Copacabana.

If you're so annoyed at this why are you still here? Because I know anything I say won't be anough for whatever gatekeeping standards you have.
People are here happy, some come and some go. Some want to leave and others want to stay. The airline has lots of things working almost flawlessly, and other things working less well.

I'm just sharing my experience, which so far has been pretty good. If you don't like this type of flying, just go somewhere and talk there? Aren't there any threads for BA or Lufthansa or something?
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Old 24th Jan 2024, 11:26
  #190 (permalink)  
 
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Guys, like many I`m thinking to move from pink ulcc to avion. Pros are well known - money obviously (2-2,5k net vs 5,5-6 makes difference). Cons, a bit as well.
However, how looks command upgrade in Avion? In my pink company I found it as a biggest advantage, 3000h and you go LHS ( even some plans to command with 2500h). I wouldn`t like to be happy with 6000 eur, and no perspective for command.
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Old 25th Jan 2024, 02:27
  #191 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by wa320
Guys, like many I`m thinking to move from pink ulcc to avion. Pros are well known - money obviously (2-2,5k net vs 5,5-6 makes difference). Cons, a bit as well.
However, how looks command upgrade in Avion? In my pink company I found it as a biggest advantage, 3000h and you go LHS ( even some plans to command with 2500h). I wouldn`t like to be happy with 6000 eur, and no perspective for command.
Does anybody get 2,5 net in Wizz except cadets? 6000 in Avion is gross, check the tax rules where you are tax resident to estimate your net income.
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Old 25th Jan 2024, 08:07
  #192 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by uberfly
Does anybody get 2,5 net in Wizz except cadets? 6000 in Avion is gross, check the tax rules where you are tax resident to estimate your net income.
Sure, cadets only. First pay rise with 1500h (factorized), which means ~2 years of **** salary. Especially when based in some strange place so minus additional costs of hotels, apartments, car, you name it. Hotac in avion is pretty tempting.
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Old 25th Jan 2024, 10:15
  #193 (permalink)  
 
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to be fair the average gross is just above 5000 per month in avion express for a FO (if you count 500 BH and including the loyalty bonus).
When I looked at the last commercial from wizzair on linkedin it looks a bit the same (for example in Italy gross salary for FO varies from 4100 to 6100).
I'd say it boils down to which kind of life you prefer as command upgrade is also 3000BH and two OPC in Avion Express
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Old 27th Jan 2024, 10:55
  #194 (permalink)  
 
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Hello I have been invited to do type rating with baa training por Avion express with Cade program, I have read lot of bad stuffs here. Is it sure after passing all the exam to start flying with Avion express? Itís 35.000 too much money to lose. Thanks
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Old 27th Jan 2024, 23:40
  #195 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Ragneir
If you're so annoyed at this why are you still here? Because I know anything I say won't be anough for whatever gatekeeping standards you have.
People are here happy, some come and some go. Some want to leave and others want to stay. The airline has lots of things working almost flawlessly, and other things working less well.

I'm just sharing my experience, which so far has been pretty good. If you don't like this type of flying, just go somewhere and talk there? Aren't there any threads for BA or Lufthansa or something?
I think you need to chill out a bit.
I was amused by your comment not critical of it.
The take away point I was making was that the effects of poor hotels (and other niggling T&C's) tend to de-motivate flight crews and if you have a choice, work for someone who doesn't skimp on crew welfare.
Thankfully, this is all behind me now, so enjoy your Best Western, I will be waking in my own bed tomorrow.
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Old 4th Feb 2024, 15:11
  #196 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by macdo
I think you need to chill out a bit.
I was amused by your comment not critical of it.
The take away point I was making was that the effects of poor hotels (and other niggling T&C's) tend to de-motivate flight crews and if you have a choice, work for someone who doesn't skimp on crew welfare.
Thankfully, this is all behind me now, so enjoy your Best Western, I will be waking in my own bed tomorrow.
I was also thinking you were another commenter. So I was already "attacking" because I was getting fed up of constant bashing for absolutely no reason.

As I said, the type of contract is pretty good if you value money over being 100% comfortable.
The hotels are nice since as I said, it's the clients that pay for them. When we complain about something missing, new hotels are made available and crews are moved there.
Sure, I wouldn't mind sleeping at home, being with my dog, my fiancee and such. However, this also allows me to being in full vacation mode whenever I come back home.
I actually like this type of work. As with everything, it comes with pros and cons. I'll eventually change, but before that maybe I try to get my fiancee to join me. Would make it much more enjoyable.
The money is too good to pass on, and right now I haven't seen any offer come remotely close to what Avion offers.
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Old 4th Feb 2024, 22:49
  #197 (permalink)  
 
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As long as you dont care about taxes, social security and any form of protection given by a regular work contract
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Old 5th Feb 2024, 01:46
  #198 (permalink)  
 
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Old 5th Feb 2024, 14:49
  #199 (permalink)  
 
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Pay2Fly at its finest, with lithuanian incompetent PIC at controls...good luck in having this bottom-feeder on your CV guys.
Social junk someone said few years ago.
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Old 5th Feb 2024, 16:12
  #200 (permalink)  
 
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My guess. A training flight with a cadet on board. That's a 15kt crosswind landing, so my guess is cadet didn't follow through with enough rudder post rollout, applied late or worse pressed the wrong pedal. This same attitude you hear on the frequency is what resulted in a SmartWings 737 flying single engine for almost 90 minutes over Europe. Men of steel out there. Nothing can be done to break their steely resolve.
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