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Easyjet Recruitment

Old 24th Aug 2012, 11:56
  #181 (permalink)  
 
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I was more referring to your misplaced satisfaction with your current position. Whilst I agree that if you have the regrets of yesterday and worries of tomorrow on your shoulders you won't enjoy today, let's consider who we're dealing with here - he is on a one man crusade to destroy the career worldwide.
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Old 24th Aug 2012, 12:17
  #182 (permalink)  
Robert G Mugabe
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Are you referring to POD " The Prince of Darkness " alias WB?
 
Old 24th Aug 2012, 12:20
  #183 (permalink)  
 
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OK, on a totally different note:

There's a rumour going around the place with turboprops, at the moment that come next year, easy are going to be keenly sniffing around the experienced FOs/SFOs and looking to take quite a few along.

My point is though that surely nobody from this place would consider leaving in order to be put on a Flexicrew deal? The guys I've spoken to all agree - we would not consider leaving a permanent contract in order to put up with a flexicrew deal - without being brutal about it, most comments concern the fact that this flexicrew deal is really only aimed at low houred guys and girls, and that experienced pilots wouldn't need to lower themselves to it.

It's just a rumour of course, and if you listen to every rumour, we'd all be spaceship Captains for now... But, it is just food for thought at the moment... If they want us (and it's a big IF!), then they've got to make it worth our while.
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Old 24th Aug 2012, 12:32
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I'm not even mentioning initials. Based on your experience you join the dots.

As for them taking people from turbo props, it would be on a flexicrew deal, there will be people stupid enough to do it, I don't recommend it and I strongly doubt it will happen. There isn't a shortage of people with upgradable hours in the company. Genuinely, if you want a career flying airliners in the uk, BA is the only option.
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Old 24th Aug 2012, 12:59
  #185 (permalink)  
 
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Of course - I equally doubt it strongly... I wouldn't bet against some people hopping from the frying pan and into the fire though. Morale in the dark proppy world has fallen so much that there's a good chance that it will be rats out of a sinking ship - and that those who hate MayBE with a passion might consider it.

Of course, in my eyes (and the majority of the others!) it would be a retrograde step - but there always will be someone who will do it.

Career airlines?? BA?? Try telling that to the non-t/r guys who made the BA hold pool last time it opened, only to be let go (some for the second time!!) Sad fact of the matter: turboprop time is largely useless - thanks a lot CTC. The only airline who could offer any hope to our workforce, wears a spotty M!
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Old 24th Aug 2012, 21:15
  #186 (permalink)  
 
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Career = down hill and out of control.

Don't just blame CTC. The CAA were involved with CTC at the outset. Money talks! Arguably the organisation responsible for regulating this industry have been partly culpable in destroying it as a 'career'. Funny old world.

Now...back to the bitching and bickering
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Old 2nd Sep 2012, 11:30
  #187 (permalink)  
 
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Dear all,

I have just seen that also CTC is accepting applications for Easy. Does anyone know which recruiting agency is best/least worse between CTC and Parc?

I know about the terrible T&Cs that anyway are present in the contract, but I am really looking to get close again to my family, and Easyjet is the only Company that allows this at present.

Last edited by Drugo; 2nd Sep 2012 at 12:54.
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Old 2nd Sep 2012, 12:42
  #188 (permalink)  
 
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Well easy is getting new guys via ctc/parc purely because they realise that after 6 months out of 46 people that are being laid off now, very few will come back if any. So the new ones are ready for the next summer period, and I guess the same will happen over the next year's winter period to new guys.So much for job security at easy. Probably the only secure place within easy group is easy swiss, with strong financial performance etc.
As for the rest of the group you have to look at the business model they run ie selling the new aircraft ,they are getting from toulouse at a very discounted price ,to leasing companies and leasing them back , generating a lot of cash in the process. That sweet deal of discounted busses is now either finish or nearly fulfilled, therefore the cash flow is narrowing as well. This business model only works together with expansion, now however we have contraction, Madrid closing and LPL losing 3 aircraft. Management knows it and they come up with short term so called solutions like flexi crew on mcdonalds wages etc, another is to buy some falling airline ( easy was an udisclosed bidder for bmi baby but the price was not right)
Now for a long term strategy, well there isn't any because our top management is only here for a few years at the time to
  • hit their targets
  • collect the associated bonus
  • move onto a better paying position elsware having added target performance to their cv's
They have no interest in the long term performance of the airline because they work for their targets only and nothing else, then move on to better paying jobs.

Talking about time to command here, well I flew with a few guys recently who made me lough by saing " I really look forward to my command soon" having done under 2000h. The airline is maturing and I estimate time to command for someone with under 2000h will be at least 5 years if not more. look at the average age of our worforce plus 0 expansion and you get the picture.
Easy despite what anyone says is now on par with ryanair, and it was a great airline only a few years back.

I recommend a very good book

"What they teach you at harward business school
Beware a CEO coming to a perfectly good business near you"

Can't remember the author
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Old 2nd Sep 2012, 16:39
  #189 (permalink)  
 
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Drugo - I'd say CTC mildly win here, mainly due to the way in which some Parc guys have essentially been sacked in the UK and in the same breath re hired onto a worse contract in Berlin.
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Old 2nd Sep 2012, 18:08
  #190 (permalink)  
 
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RM: Nail, Head.
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Old 4th Sep 2012, 15:17
  #191 (permalink)  
 
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Good morning ROBMEDIUM, welcome to the real world! This is what I've been saying for years!

The permanent introduction of more and more "McJobs" based upon ever degrading substandard contracts was clearly visible a few years ago, but unfortunately 'responsible adults' flying jets worth millions prefer to believe in fairy tales posted by management proxies...
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Old 5th Sep 2012, 13:03
  #192 (permalink)  
 
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My 2 cents

...but the question is, what is the option?
Well, treat it like any technical problem in the aircraft!

1) The first and most important thing to do is to correctly identify the problem! It never seizes to amaze me of how people that are trained and selected for things like situational awareness, problem solving and forward planning can have their collective heads stuck so deep into the sand or believe in fairy tales that somehow and magically 'it will alright and the problem will go away by itself.' Well, it won't be alright, just like an engine fire will most probably not extinguish itself either.

T&C's in the aviation industry have been declining since the 1990's and people just don't want to see it. Everybody readily accepts that the '5 days party layover at great exotic destinations' is a thing of the past, but nobody wants to project that trend vector of the last 10-20 years forward! The newly proposed EASA FTL's, quicker and quicker turn arounds, more block hours, longer duty days etc etc. Sooner or later the edges of that envelope will be reached and then the next logical step to maintain profitability is to decrease wages and T&C's. Especially in the low cost arena you already see both things happen simultaneously.

The real problem IMHO is the permanent oversupply of pilots, this is the giant fulcrum that management is using to continuously lower T&C's. Tons of naive kids get suckered into the industry every year by all kinds of rosy stories about a massive amount of retiring pilots or massive expansion in the Far East, when the truth is far less dramatic. Yes, pilots retire, and the Far East expands, but far less than flight schools are cranking out pilots. The excess and unemployed pilots are with their backs against the wall making them a probe weapon in the quest for higher management bonuses and lower T&C's for the employees.

Just like any supply/demand situation, an oversupply means that the price of pilots (i.e. wages, T&C's) go down. The oversupply MUST stop, simple!

2) Low cost CRM. Just like the lack of situational awareness when it comes to T&C's amazes me, I'm equally amazed by the total lack of CRM when it comes to defending those very same T&C's. Everybody is brainwashed in how to challenge a colleague that shows up for duty smelling like alcohol or a colleague that is not stable at 500', but nobody is challenging colleagues that are advocating the destruction of T&C's. People need to stop sheepishly accepting all the fairy tales that some agents of misinformation are posting here, and they need to actively start challenging them more and more about the failed promises and nonsense that these management proxies post!

There are too many "senior (training) captains" in the low cost industry that don't seem to give a damn about what happens to the young entrants into the industry in the naive illusion that those very same new entrants will not be used as a fulcrum against them. So long as they themselves can continue fat dumb and happy on their exclusive contract with share options for just a few more years until retirement, they simply won't care. Obviously to them CRM is only applicable in the sim, or between on and off duty, because when it comes to T&C's they'll happily stick a knife in the backs of the B, C, D, E, Z scale colleagues and even give it a nice little twist..

IMHO there's quite a big distinction between low cost airlines and the more established carriers, where in the later, unions are stronger, people stick much more together and as such, contracts are better and equal for everybody. This of course is a double whammy because this makes it even harder for main line carriers to compete with low cost airlines, dragging the overall industry even lower because eventually these airlines will have to renegotiate lower contracts.

So there you have my opinion for what it's worth: 1) look at the big picture and try to control the enormous oversupply of pilots and 2) grow a spine, be assertive and stick together to solve any problem!

Last edited by Doug the Head; 5th Sep 2012 at 13:12.
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Old 5th Sep 2012, 14:37
  #193 (permalink)  
 
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Finally... common sense...
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Old 5th Sep 2012, 15:35
  #194 (permalink)  
Robert G Mugabe
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1) look at the big picture and try to control the enormous oversupply of pilots
2) grow a spine, be assertive and stick together to solve any problem!
All very well to pontificate here but what are your solutions to the conundrum.
 
Old 5th Sep 2012, 21:08
  #195 (permalink)  
 
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Sorry guys - I simply do not buy this. ROBMEDIUM, your views might go down well at a political rally of the disenfranchised, but do not really stand up to examination. A cursory glance at our share price today (which, incidentally has risen 60% in one year) will tell you that on the basis of the news that we are about to start allocated seating, has risen 14p. Love us or hate us, we are doing very well indeed - and long may that continue. Your tales of doom and disaster are frankly misplaced. People working on permanent contracts for easyJet are some of the most privileged people in the airline industry and if we were to open the doors to recruitment tomorrow, we would be swamped with applicants. As I have said many times, there are few better places to be other than a legacy carrier right now. We have job security and work for a company with a bright future and which has never failed to make a profit. We are about to announce the biggest ever profit in our history - dare I say we seem to be doing ok? The real glitch lies in the fact that we have many pilots on the shameful flexicrew contracts - and that is where tomorrow's battle lies.

Doug the Head - a very interesting argument, but I have to say somewhat vacuous. You are someone who loathes and despises every aspect of easyJet but cannot seem to name a single airline who would be better to work for, other than a legacy carrier. What your argument of declining condition fails to consider is that there are countless more jet jobs available today than existed 20 years ago - that is a direct result of the inroads made by the low cost carriers like ourselves. Furthermore, to say that the root of the problem lies in the over-supply of pilots is simply to pass the blame - what on earth can anyone do about the fact that many more people want to fly commercial aircraft than there are jobs to give them? That is not easyJet's fault, or indeed anyone other than the people who want to pursue a career in flying (as we all once did). What I have consistently observed is a total unwillingness by you and others like you to actually do anything to sort the problem out other than wring your hands like Private Fraser and announce, 'We're all doomed'. Your references to senior training captains would presumably include people like myself - you have no idea the efforts being made behind the scenes to try and sort out the mess we currently have. I have said all along that all BALPA have to do over flexicrew is send me the strike ballot and I will be there - that is yet to happen, although I dare to believe it will do very shortly. There are countless senior pilots at easyJet who have argued consistently with every single member of senior management they meet over the flexicrew issue, and the time has now come for action. Will you actually put your head above the parapet to do something when the time comes? That is the question Doug, so before you criticise everyone else, make sure you are willing to be there when push comes to shove. I can promise you I will be there alongside you if you are willing to step up to the plate beyond this forum.
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Old 5th Sep 2012, 23:51
  #196 (permalink)  
 
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When is prune gonna give me a "Like" button!! That is the most encouraging news I have heard for a long time Alexander. Thank you for fighting. I sincerely hope you get the support you need.
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Old 6th Sep 2012, 04:09
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A very encouraging post AlexanderDeMeerkat, even if only a gesture. The real question would be as to whether this would result in the possibility of opportunities for non rated TP operators such as myself other than just a more stable situation for flexi cadets. Still welcome news to know that flexi is being actively discussed as an issue by the senior guys.
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Old 6th Sep 2012, 07:58
  #198 (permalink)  
 
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Oh, how I love to hear promises from anonymous "senior" pilots.
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Old 6th Sep 2012, 13:11
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Couldn't agree more Rex. This is the arguement we hear every day at EZY. Having come from turboprops myself 13 years ago, I actually feel quite sorry for the flexis we have here today. They will never experience this area of flying. I would relish flying with guys from FLYBE, Eastern, etc. ones with a bit more experience than at present. Quite possibly they may have a slightly smaller chip their shoulder than some of the flexi guys have.
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Old 7th Sep 2012, 09:28
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RexBanner - I am one of those who utterly reject our current recruitment policy and see the lack of a 'broad church' approach as a real failing. There is no doubt that we are missing a trick in only recruiting cadets - we need a broader recruitment base including turboprops, instructors, military, helicopters and other non-Airbus rated jets. I came from a mixture of the first 3 and have unquestionably benefitted from exposure to the wider world. However, it would not be fair to characterise our operation as being 'ILS to ILS'. In the last year or so at easyJet I have done day and night VORs, NDBs, PRNAVs, visual and circling approaches. In addition we operate to what is widely recognised as some of the more challenging Cat C airports in Europe with narrow runways, high terrain etc. Arguably, our Gatwick operation offers the widest variety of flying and destinations of any airline around. Sure, we cannot offer Kathmandu, but we can provide just about everything else! By the time an easyJet FO gets a command he is a fairly polished individual who has a wide exposure to a substantial number of difficult destinations. Virtually all our new Captains come through Gatwick, thereby increasing their exposure to the hard end of the scale. We are far from perfect and I agree we should have more widely experienced pilots as a matter of policy, but we also have a lot right in terms of what we put our aspiring Captains through.
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