Lufthansa Italia recruitment
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- never experienced on-time flights with such a service with Alitalia...
, service what service???
Anyway, if this is the salary, well then it is very very low, I think AirDolomiti Crews get more.
If LHITA wants to pay the lowest salary in italy....well they are on a good way.
This is even below AirBerlin or Niki salary.
even Windjet pays more.
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Keep in mind that per diems are very high in Italy! Its easily another 500 Euros a month and you now have the chance of becoming a captain very fast. With LH mainline you will also have a net income of about 3.000 to 3.500 Euros the first year, so it is not much of a difference in the beginning. And as I recall it, one of Alitalias problems was the high costs of its pilots...
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Keep in mind that per diems are very high in Italy!
And as I recall it, one of Alitalias problems was the high costs of its pilots...
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So net would be around 40-50% less
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hi sorry to be a little of topic, but you guys keep talking about this DLR test, is it anything like the JAA ATPL exams? is there any kind of prep book or something? thanks
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Yes there is a bond for the TR, and i do confirm all the datas given by greenpilots concerning the upgrading to the CPT position.
Just to underline it, as greenpilots already mentioned, LH, in the 99% of the times, makes a relationship with the worker which lasts a lifetime.
So if you are basically looking for a TR and/or a cpt upgrade to go somewhere else in the near future (without criticising it, everybody has his own targets) i would say that it's not the correct company for you.
The biggest part, if not the 100%, of the LH pilots would refuse a 30% increase in salary and a faster cpt upgrade, for example in Emirates, because it's different to have a fast and rich career somewhere in a X company, and to be part of a huge group to which you FEEL to belong.
This is what LH has been able to do in the last decades. To give the feeling to the employee to be PART of something. And this is more important than earning some $$$$ more and being just a number around.
Behind the success of LH, i think, this is a key point. And they will go on with this philosophy in the future in every plan they will make, in Germany, in Italy or in Uganda.
To everybody all the best.
bio161
Just to underline it, as greenpilots already mentioned, LH, in the 99% of the times, makes a relationship with the worker which lasts a lifetime.
So if you are basically looking for a TR and/or a cpt upgrade to go somewhere else in the near future (without criticising it, everybody has his own targets) i would say that it's not the correct company for you.
The biggest part, if not the 100%, of the LH pilots would refuse a 30% increase in salary and a faster cpt upgrade, for example in Emirates, because it's different to have a fast and rich career somewhere in a X company, and to be part of a huge group to which you FEEL to belong.
This is what LH has been able to do in the last decades. To give the feeling to the employee to be PART of something. And this is more important than earning some $$$$ more and being just a number around.
Behind the success of LH, i think, this is a key point. And they will go on with this philosophy in the future in every plan they will make, in Germany, in Italy or in Uganda.
To everybody all the best.
bio161
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bio161,
what a load of bullsh.it!
LHI has screened and failed tens of pilots last year in the name of their own internal union dispute, had these pilots passed the selection there would have been no jobs for them anyways in those days and if they wanted to re-apply now they can't.
Not really the kind of situation you describe:
On top of that if you consider the bond and the sub-standard T&C's then the picture if far from being the safe heaven you seem to dream of.
what a load of bullsh.it!
LHI has screened and failed tens of pilots last year in the name of their own internal union dispute, had these pilots passed the selection there would have been no jobs for them anyways in those days and if they wanted to re-apply now they can't.
Not really the kind of situation you describe:
The biggest part, if not the 100%, of the LH pilots would refuse a 30% increase in salary and a faster cpt upgrade, for example in Emirates, because it's different to have a fast and rich career somewhere in a X company, and to be part of a huge group to which you FEEL to belong.
This is what LH has been able to do in the last decades. To give the feeling to the employee to be PART of something. And this is more important than earning some $$$$ more and being just a number around.
This is what LH has been able to do in the last decades. To give the feeling to the employee to be PART of something. And this is more important than earning some $$$$ more and being just a number around.
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"what a load of bullsh.it"
"what a load of bullsh.it!"
Sorry that you think so..But first of all i was not speaking about the selection, everyone has his own story, we all know it!
Beside this if you think that what i wrote about the idea of being part of LH is false, then it shows you don't know the kind of enviroment they are working in. I'm not speaking about heaven on earth, i'm speaking about an airline, one of the few ones, which establishes a fixed relationship with the employee to ensure a growth in professionalism and quality. If you feel to be more and more part of something then you will work in a better way.
I would like to make you read a post of streetcardriving, in the thread about LH and the union:
http://www.pprune.org/rumours-news/4...ml#post5790663
"...If you want to become a Lufthansa captain, there is another requirement: You are only allowed to take part in the training to become a commander, if you have an experience of at least 3,000h with an airline operating in accordance with all Lufthansa standards.
That does not mean that you are not able to become a commander if you have some thousands hours of experience with another airline. Nevertheless, research has shown, that a common culture among pilots is one of many important items to establish a safe operation. A culture is something which cannot be learned from a book, especially if you are used to fly in a different environment. A culture has to be established. This can be done, if new pilots have to spend some thousand hours with experienced captains who already live that kind of culture in the cockpit. That's why Lufthansa will use captains from its mainline until the LHI first officers have a "Lufthansa - experience" of at least 3,000h and are ready to become captains.
Once again, I'd like to emphasize, that there are a lot of experienced Italian pilots who are excellent captains. All have their individual way how to do the job - and I do not talk about any procedure violations. There are just hundred ways to operate an aircraft according to the book. If you like to have a certain degree of homogeneity among pilots, it is much easier to teach and form relatively young and inexperienced pilots than it is to make experienced captains change their way of making decisions.
Me and most of my colleagues treat foreign colleagues with respect and we all believe in their skills (unfortunately there are a handful of exceptions, who I personally consider to be arrogant idiots), nevertheless the concept I've just tried to describe has worked well for Lufthansa in the past and we pilots do not want to see it changed. Personally, I like the idea of having a common seniority list, which gives all Lufthansa pilots (LHI, LCAG & DLH) the chance to apply for all positions the company has to offer. Unfortunately, this proposal was rejected by our managers.
I know that there are other professional airlines like Emirates, who have hired pilots with various backgrounds and these airlines also conduct safe flights. There are hundred ways how to run an airline and Lufthansa Italia will apply the standards, Lufthansa has used for decades.
I hope that there will be a regular exchange between DLH and LHI pilots. It's just the beginning of something new within a well established legacy carrier. Maybe we will be united in the future.
Auguro a tutti Voi tanto successo!
Streetcar driver"
This is what i was trying to explain before.
I hope now you have it a little bit more clear.
Sorry that you think so..But first of all i was not speaking about the selection, everyone has his own story, we all know it!
Beside this if you think that what i wrote about the idea of being part of LH is false, then it shows you don't know the kind of enviroment they are working in. I'm not speaking about heaven on earth, i'm speaking about an airline, one of the few ones, which establishes a fixed relationship with the employee to ensure a growth in professionalism and quality. If you feel to be more and more part of something then you will work in a better way.
I would like to make you read a post of streetcardriving, in the thread about LH and the union:
http://www.pprune.org/rumours-news/4...ml#post5790663
"...If you want to become a Lufthansa captain, there is another requirement: You are only allowed to take part in the training to become a commander, if you have an experience of at least 3,000h with an airline operating in accordance with all Lufthansa standards.
That does not mean that you are not able to become a commander if you have some thousands hours of experience with another airline. Nevertheless, research has shown, that a common culture among pilots is one of many important items to establish a safe operation. A culture is something which cannot be learned from a book, especially if you are used to fly in a different environment. A culture has to be established. This can be done, if new pilots have to spend some thousand hours with experienced captains who already live that kind of culture in the cockpit. That's why Lufthansa will use captains from its mainline until the LHI first officers have a "Lufthansa - experience" of at least 3,000h and are ready to become captains.
Once again, I'd like to emphasize, that there are a lot of experienced Italian pilots who are excellent captains. All have their individual way how to do the job - and I do not talk about any procedure violations. There are just hundred ways to operate an aircraft according to the book. If you like to have a certain degree of homogeneity among pilots, it is much easier to teach and form relatively young and inexperienced pilots than it is to make experienced captains change their way of making decisions.
Me and most of my colleagues treat foreign colleagues with respect and we all believe in their skills (unfortunately there are a handful of exceptions, who I personally consider to be arrogant idiots), nevertheless the concept I've just tried to describe has worked well for Lufthansa in the past and we pilots do not want to see it changed. Personally, I like the idea of having a common seniority list, which gives all Lufthansa pilots (LHI, LCAG & DLH) the chance to apply for all positions the company has to offer. Unfortunately, this proposal was rejected by our managers.
I know that there are other professional airlines like Emirates, who have hired pilots with various backgrounds and these airlines also conduct safe flights. There are hundred ways how to run an airline and Lufthansa Italia will apply the standards, Lufthansa has used for decades.
I hope that there will be a regular exchange between DLH and LHI pilots. It's just the beginning of something new within a well established legacy carrier. Maybe we will be united in the future.
Auguro a tutti Voi tanto successo!
Streetcar driver"
This is what i was trying to explain before.
I hope now you have it a little bit more clear.
Last edited by bio161; 21st Aug 2010 at 08:38.
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What streetcardriver says isn't carved in stone, what you then said is actually even offensive to some.
LH is one of the last legacy carriers in Europe that still has some kind of decent corporate culture and that treats its pilots fairly but don't forget the second class citizens of Cityline for example.
LHI ,after failing hundreds of pilots last year, has now re started hiring pilots with different requirements leaving the italian language out for instance.
Probably lots of non-italian pilots will apply and the perspective of having lots of underpaid foreign pilots (because the LHI pay is substandard) living in a foreign country and having to deal with an extremely inefficient environment like the cassa marittima,the fondo volo,the lack of decent international schools,the lack of opportunities for non italian speaking wives and so on (seen it before in expats living near MXP) is a situation that clashes with your view of:
The reason is very simple: LH has managed to create what you say in Germany amongst german pilots who are based and living at home.
Re-creating a "german sense of belonging" in a bunch of foreign pilots living in a foreign country will be a tough job, especially if the T&C's are already on the low side before even starting.
LH is one of the last legacy carriers in Europe that still has some kind of decent corporate culture and that treats its pilots fairly but don't forget the second class citizens of Cityline for example.
LHI ,after failing hundreds of pilots last year, has now re started hiring pilots with different requirements leaving the italian language out for instance.
Probably lots of non-italian pilots will apply and the perspective of having lots of underpaid foreign pilots (because the LHI pay is substandard) living in a foreign country and having to deal with an extremely inefficient environment like the cassa marittima,the fondo volo,the lack of decent international schools,the lack of opportunities for non italian speaking wives and so on (seen it before in expats living near MXP) is a situation that clashes with your view of:
The biggest part, if not the 100%, of the LH pilots would refuse a 30% increase in salary and a faster cpt upgrade, for example in Emirates, because it's different to have a fast and rich career somewhere in a X company, and to be part of a huge group to which you FEEL to belong.
Re-creating a "german sense of belonging" in a bunch of foreign pilots living in a foreign country will be a tough job, especially if the T&C's are already on the low side before even starting.
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Mmh..I can understand your personal point of view and i respect it..but can you just say what did i write of "offensive"? Just being sincerly curious because i didn't have the intention of..
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Offensive to the hundreds of pilots who wanted to "belong" to the big LH family and who got screwed on the basis of internal industrial disputes, who applied without even knowing how sub-standard the conditions would have been,who were not told they would join as F/O's, who see people applying one year later with changed requirements....to these hundreds of pilots don't mention the fairy-tale about the "sense of belonging" because they might be offended.
Clear?
Clear?
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Hey Bio161,
Do you maybe have more specific information about the trainingbond? I mean is it 50.000 if you leave within a year and 25.000 after one year and after 2 years only 12.500?
Because what you described before about making a relationship for a lifetime would be true if you're part of a legacy carier. But since LH Italia and LH Mainline are two different company's that doesn't count. So if the legacy cariers are going to hire in 1,2 maybe 3 years and you still have an expensive bond to pay it would make a transfer difficult.
thanks in advance!!
Do you maybe have more specific information about the trainingbond? I mean is it 50.000 if you leave within a year and 25.000 after one year and after 2 years only 12.500?
Because what you described before about making a relationship for a lifetime would be true if you're part of a legacy carier. But since LH Italia and LH Mainline are two different company's that doesn't count. So if the legacy cariers are going to hire in 1,2 maybe 3 years and you still have an expensive bond to pay it would make a transfer difficult.
thanks in advance!!