Ryanair AGAIN!!!
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Payrise in the first year for most co-pilots about 8%
Capts will be about average 13%
Over 4 years Co-pilots 8 + 3 + 2 + 2 = @15% not compounded
Capts 13 + 3 + 2 + 2 = @20% not compounded
These figures will be disputed. I got my calculator out unlike some.
Am happy to stand corrected if someone can show otherwise. I can show my calculations.
The problem is that for the co-pilots they are taking a cut in sector pay and that clouds most thinking on this subject but they have a net gain due to big increases as a % of their salary in other areas.
Standing by for the INCOMING!! from GR
Capts will be about average 13%
Over 4 years Co-pilots 8 + 3 + 2 + 2 = @15% not compounded
Capts 13 + 3 + 2 + 2 = @20% not compounded
These figures will be disputed. I got my calculator out unlike some.
Am happy to stand corrected if someone can show otherwise. I can show my calculations.
The problem is that for the co-pilots they are taking a cut in sector pay and that clouds most thinking on this subject but they have a net gain due to big increases as a % of their salary in other areas.
Standing by for the INCOMING!! from GR
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we will agree to disagree.3 or 4 erc meetings in over two years(i say 4).2 meetings with management since may.top class representation.look at the history and that is all you need in this company.you going down buddy.just that the pilots below will soften your landing by absorbing the ****ty end of the deal.if that is good with you,well you probably have signed half a dozen of us up already.
hope the erc/management typist gave you a few choccy bics with your cuppa to sweeten the taste of the **** you were swallowing.you will be used to it soon.
well good to see that you are as fantastical with your figures as you were when working on the management letter produced today.
lunacy,lunacy,lunacy.lets see your calculations,here and now.not holding my breath.
15% and 20%,you have lost the plot cochise.
the co-pilots take a cut in sector pay,that would cloud ones judgement.why don't the captains take a sector pay cut.sorry you are one and the erc are all captains and it is the least that the company will accept.how silly of me thought you guys were representing all the pilots.
hope the erc/management typist gave you a few choccy bics with your cuppa to sweeten the taste of the **** you were swallowing.you will be used to it soon.
well good to see that you are as fantastical with your figures as you were when working on the management letter produced today.
lunacy,lunacy,lunacy.lets see your calculations,here and now.not holding my breath.
15% and 20%,you have lost the plot cochise.
the co-pilots take a cut in sector pay,that would cloud ones judgement.why don't the captains take a sector pay cut.sorry you are one and the erc are all captains and it is the least that the company will accept.how silly of me thought you guys were representing all the pilots.
Last edited by the grim repa; 13th Dec 2007 at 19:54.
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I still say get in the Union - strange your thinking. I am in BALPA have been for 12 years and have no intention of leaving BALPA and I will be there voting for them if it ever gets that far. But I do not see how the acceptance of this deal prevents the BALPA thing happening. If anything it puts the Union in a position of strength for two reasons.
1. If the Company f**k with this deal that will def be the final straw and the pilots will pour into BALPA.
2. And if BALPA are in and the Company f**k with the deal at least we will have right to 'withdraw our labour' and putting more pressure on the Company.
Am waiting for it to happen but hopefully waiting for it on a 5 on 4 off roster and a few extra quid.
1. If the Company f**k with this deal that will def be the final straw and the pilots will pour into BALPA.
2. And if BALPA are in and the Company f**k with the deal at least we will have right to 'withdraw our labour' and putting more pressure on the Company.
Am waiting for it to happen but hopefully waiting for it on a 5 on 4 off roster and a few extra quid.
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yes,but when will they renege on the deal and what will they do in the interim.what will the market for pilots be like when they renege on the deal,as they will.pilots have an out now and are in a buoyant stage of the cycle.i tell you,when their is nowhere to go and no association to turn to,woe betide the pilot in ryanair,under the current regime.
****ting on our colleagues continually for small short term gain is wrong,wrong,wrong!and until this kind of behaviour stops.unity cannot be achieved.i would rather be sitting in the **** together than disparate and accepting scraps from a bunch of bullies and cowards.
When BALPA appears with our mandate and they will,the company has promised to revert the proposed deal to a level below the drivel we are accepting now.i think that will enlighten those who cannot see the error of their actions now.
let us not sell ourselves short once again.
don't wait for it to happen.lead and make it happen!!!
****ting on our colleagues continually for small short term gain is wrong,wrong,wrong!and until this kind of behaviour stops.unity cannot be achieved.i would rather be sitting in the **** together than disparate and accepting scraps from a bunch of bullies and cowards.
When BALPA appears with our mandate and they will,the company has promised to revert the proposed deal to a level below the drivel we are accepting now.i think that will enlighten those who cannot see the error of their actions now.
let us not sell ourselves short once again.
don't wait for it to happen.lead and make it happen!!!
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Prob wasting my time but but for you GR
Take middle rank FO eg J F/O and Line Cpt all figures Gross
Now ---- New deal
J F/O --- Capt
Basic 24,384 - 25,115, 54,888 - 56,535
Hol pay 2,154 - 2,154 , 2,847 - 2,847
Sector pay 28,929 - 24,866 , 34,322 - 36,610
Pension 0 - 2,500, 0 - 5,000
Benefits in Kind 0 - 5,000 , 0 - 5,000
Total 55,466 - 59,455, 92,057 - 105,993
Inc in pay 3,988 -% inc 7.19% , inc 13,935 - inc 15.14%
Sector pay / Hol pay grossed up at appropriated level of tax and NI
Take middle rank FO eg J F/O and Line Cpt all figures Gross
Now ---- New deal
J F/O --- Capt
Basic 24,384 - 25,115, 54,888 - 56,535
Hol pay 2,154 - 2,154 , 2,847 - 2,847
Sector pay 28,929 - 24,866 , 34,322 - 36,610
Pension 0 - 2,500, 0 - 5,000
Benefits in Kind 0 - 5,000 , 0 - 5,000
Total 55,466 - 59,455, 92,057 - 105,993
Inc in pay 3,988 -% inc 7.19% , inc 13,935 - inc 15.14%
Sector pay / Hol pay grossed up at appropriated level of tax and NI
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If you think they are wrongly will happily stand corrected. Which ones and by how much. Calculations arent difficult they are adjusted for which bracket of tax and NI you are in thats why hols and sector pay gross differ from Capt to Fo and was careful to apply to correct % of pay at the appropriate level as per Inland Revenue web site to get as accurate as poss.
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look buddy,i have done the figures over and over and they are nowhere near these.grossing up/grossing down - potatoes/tomatoes!anyone who has read the document knows that it is pathetic pay wise and so riddled with clauses and penalties,that one could sidewind a bus through it!
for example - failure to reply to a base captain query within 2 days will lead to loss of benefits for that month.
look i could go on forever.it is a **** deal which stinks to the high heavens and will be ripped apart whenever mol decides that the pilots are getting uppity or he hasn't got his leg over the missus for a few days.the same pilots he expects to sign up to his wonder deal.
why as a matter of interest do we have to give you/erc the authorisation to negotiate on our behalf if as we suspect the result is pre ordained,the document we are supposed to propose came from the company and if as previously stated by your good self the erc were "democratically" elected and have our mandate.surely it is not for the company to use as proof of erc legitimacy in the company,for januarys upcoming pilots versus company intimidation case in ireland.
if fr management gave me a gold bar,i would chuck it in the bin.no question,without even looking at it.because sure as nuts is nuts.these scumbags will try to screw us over.
how do you know that a ryanair manager is lying?his lips are moving!
what will a newly promoted captain earn,90% of an existing captains salary.why is that say mach number.is it the least the company will accept or is it market forces at work.**** sorry you are already a capt tre,so you have most to gain from this deal.what's it like to pick the co-pilots pocket,while not even having to face him.
when will we have the meeting to consult with the pilot body.shucks,the deal has been pre approved by management.
does any of this make sense to you,my democratic friend?i can ping pong figures with you all month long but the company needs the deal approved by year end,why is that?oh yeah that court case in january.
i should call micheal moore,he could make a movie out of ryanair?he could call it - GIPPO!
for example - failure to reply to a base captain query within 2 days will lead to loss of benefits for that month.
look i could go on forever.it is a **** deal which stinks to the high heavens and will be ripped apart whenever mol decides that the pilots are getting uppity or he hasn't got his leg over the missus for a few days.the same pilots he expects to sign up to his wonder deal.
why as a matter of interest do we have to give you/erc the authorisation to negotiate on our behalf if as we suspect the result is pre ordained,the document we are supposed to propose came from the company and if as previously stated by your good self the erc were "democratically" elected and have our mandate.surely it is not for the company to use as proof of erc legitimacy in the company,for januarys upcoming pilots versus company intimidation case in ireland.
if fr management gave me a gold bar,i would chuck it in the bin.no question,without even looking at it.because sure as nuts is nuts.these scumbags will try to screw us over.
how do you know that a ryanair manager is lying?his lips are moving!
what will a newly promoted captain earn,90% of an existing captains salary.why is that say mach number.is it the least the company will accept or is it market forces at work.**** sorry you are already a capt tre,so you have most to gain from this deal.what's it like to pick the co-pilots pocket,while not even having to face him.
when will we have the meeting to consult with the pilot body.shucks,the deal has been pre approved by management.
does any of this make sense to you,my democratic friend?i can ping pong figures with you all month long but the company needs the deal approved by year end,why is that?oh yeah that court case in january.
i should call micheal moore,he could make a movie out of ryanair?he could call it - GIPPO!
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Good night GR. I know we have a difference of opinion but at least we engage and have an opinion. If only more were prepared to engage in the process there may be hope.
UP THE WORKERS
UP THE WORKERS
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If you have the time read the Fragrant Harbour Forum for a direct comparison between Ryanair and Cathay Pacific, unfortunately you will see many similarities, for the ERC read the AOA. 