Flybe to aquire BA Connect. Crew thread. (No Spotters)-(Part 2)
Large, two page, ad in Flight today for Flybe pilots. Lots of bases but, oddly, no base given for the Isle of Man.
Are they trialling the Isle of Man as a commercially viable route?
Curious for two reasons; we need better transport off the Island and I would apply if I could get a local base.
Comments please . . .
Are they trialling the Isle of Man as a commercially viable route?
Curious for two reasons; we need better transport off the Island and I would apply if I could get a local base.
Comments please . . .
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iom routes
flybe are said to be commited to maintain the LGW/MAN & BHX routes and intoduce new routes if viable ......or so they say but there basing plan is 146 & 145 for next year.
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So the desperate advertising campaign for experienced pilots has started.........Two full pages in Flight and all sorts of exagerated representations about "the package".......... Dream on Jimbo!....... Having blown it with experienced employable Rashers you aint going to bottom fish the experience levels you need until you start treating your pilots properly.
Oh, another thing Jimbo. Did you know that Balpa are ballotting their Rasher pilots before adopting one single clause of the various agreements you have been trying to stick down their throats these past three months?? Apparently you werent exactly told that??
Id say youve got yourself a little bit of a problem if you go ahead with this one, because the word is that the boys and girls dont go a bundle on the new "agreements". So what with TUPE etc Id say you are going to be a bit stuck once youve lumbered yourself with this lot......
This has turned into a fiasco of the first water and I am soooooo glad I have my release ticket! ( Apart from your totaly crap terms I just dont fancy working my butt off as an unpaid training Captain with your never ending supply of two hundred hour wunderkids)
Oh, another thing Jimbo. Did you know that Balpa are ballotting their Rasher pilots before adopting one single clause of the various agreements you have been trying to stick down their throats these past three months?? Apparently you werent exactly told that??
Id say youve got yourself a little bit of a problem if you go ahead with this one, because the word is that the boys and girls dont go a bundle on the new "agreements". So what with TUPE etc Id say you are going to be a bit stuck once youve lumbered yourself with this lot......
This has turned into a fiasco of the first water and I am soooooo glad I have my release ticket! ( Apart from your totaly crap terms I just dont fancy working my butt off as an unpaid training Captain with your never ending supply of two hundred hour wunderkids)
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Jeez - don't start. These people are fine when things go to plan, also why should I worry - they know it all....however once it goes off the rails we have big issues. I could tell you about the go around that nearly didn't happen, the level busts that nearly happened, the (multiple) long, fast, deep landings on the runway edge, the missed or mis-read RT...that's all in the last week. I come back from what should be an easy day out and find myself knackered with these kids. Go learn somewhere else....else pay me a heap more as a trainer.
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Stepclimb.A bit off topic..but Ill reply.
Not so long ago very many if not most copilots came to their first commercial job after many hundreds of hours instructing or doing taxi work.
They might not know very much about flying an airliner but basic airmanship and, above all, valuable experience had been gained in the air.
Believe you me, it is far FAR more stressful to fly with a newby who is brilliant at flying a simulator and knowing his SOPs than someone who has had some experience and already has a sound awareness.
fifty percent of FLYBEs pilots have only been there two years or less and that trend is set to accelerate wit Cheesy's latest charm offensives on the training schools.. It is for that reason I made the comment I did.
Glad to be out of it.
Not so long ago very many if not most copilots came to their first commercial job after many hundreds of hours instructing or doing taxi work.
They might not know very much about flying an airliner but basic airmanship and, above all, valuable experience had been gained in the air.
Believe you me, it is far FAR more stressful to fly with a newby who is brilliant at flying a simulator and knowing his SOPs than someone who has had some experience and already has a sound awareness.
fifty percent of FLYBEs pilots have only been there two years or less and that trend is set to accelerate wit Cheesy's latest charm offensives on the training schools.. It is for that reason I made the comment I did.
Glad to be out of it.
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...They probably aren't offering the IOM as a base yet because unlike virtually all other BACOn bases, nobody has offered their resignation there. The IOM base is nearly all crewed with ex-MANX crew, all happy and determined to remain there if possible. Add to that we also have a number of folk who are marooned in MAN or BHX as a result of the removal of the DH3 that was put there to replace the THREE ATPs we had and it adds up the the fact that there's a queue to get back.
I've been there 9 years, and with 6,000hrs and a long way up the ladder on the seniority list I'm still nowhere near the LHS seat there yet. One up from the bottom actually! If the plans to put a 145 there, then replace it with one or two DH4's comes to fruition, then I reckon they'll need 10-12 F/Os over the next two years for the Island, with possible commands coming for those who join first in about three years when the bulk of the current 146 skippers retire.
If you really want to join Flybe for the Island, either hang on or get a MAN base for now. Best of luck.
I've been there 9 years, and with 6,000hrs and a long way up the ladder on the seniority list I'm still nowhere near the LHS seat there yet. One up from the bottom actually! If the plans to put a 145 there, then replace it with one or two DH4's comes to fruition, then I reckon they'll need 10-12 F/Os over the next two years for the Island, with possible commands coming for those who join first in about three years when the bulk of the current 146 skippers retire.
If you really want to join Flybe for the Island, either hang on or get a MAN base for now. Best of luck.
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Hmmm...
So what exactly are experienced F/Os? A frozen ATPL and recent flying, they say. But with time on the Legacy (ERJ135) gained in GA, I'm hardly going to want to go join the "vast majority" on the Q400, no matter how "jet-like" its performance (but NOT pay), am I!
Where do I fit into this picture?
Where do I fit into this picture?
It's getting off the topic, but I've flown with a fair few 200 hr F/Os at Flybe and don't remember any of them with an "I am wonderful and know it all" attitude. Often the worst offenders for that are those with a bit of GA time who thingk that they are either a) to good to be flying a turbo prop or b) deserving of a command because they have an ATPL and 1600 hrs. I'll fly with the 200 hr guys any time, at least they have enthusiasm.
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Ooh, that's an unfortunate misunderstanding of my post, excrab!
I simply don't think I'm too good for a turboprop and I can't be deserving of command until someone else thinks I am, can I?!
It's only that having jet experience, and Embraer experience at that, the logical step (for me, at least) is to go to the 195, no? That's just the path I'm on right now and it's not clear to me that this recruitment drive will support that.
I was once a 200hr FO and I was very enthusiastic. And I still am! Brilliant!
I guess we are a bit off topic, so you gonna let me have the last word, then?!
I simply don't think I'm too good for a turboprop and I can't be deserving of command until someone else thinks I am, can I?!
It's only that having jet experience, and Embraer experience at that, the logical step (for me, at least) is to go to the 195, no? That's just the path I'm on right now and it's not clear to me that this recruitment drive will support that.
I was once a 200hr FO and I was very enthusiastic. And I still am! Brilliant!
I guess we are a bit off topic, so you gonna let me have the last word, then?!
Last edited by theWings; 19th Feb 2007 at 23:54. Reason: my damn spelling again
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There is no way, on this planet at least, that you are going to end up going to the 195. It has nothing to do with logic, and everything to do with seniority, which of course has it's own logic. Flybe is far more desperate for Q400 crews than 195 crews. Even if it was offered, I suspect a lot of Q400 F/Os would have something to say.
Where do you fit in this picture? Joining the mass exodus to Big Orange, I suspect, if you simply must fly a jet!
Where do you fit in this picture? Joining the mass exodus to Big Orange, I suspect, if you simply must fly a jet!
Anotherflapoperator, Thanks for your post. I note the 'thirty five years behind the times' location' so I understand the lack of resignations! It's the Island I want not Flybe so I will hang on.
Hope all goes well for your family with the takeover.
Regards, S.
Hope all goes well for your family with the takeover.
Regards, S.
Last edited by Spartacan; 20th Feb 2007 at 06:41.
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the level busts that nearly happened, the (multiple) long, fast, deep landings on the runway edge, the missed or mis-read RT
Hang on, that remiinds me of a couple of 10,000hr+ Captains I fly with? Who's training who? With a bit of guidance those low hour F.O.'s can be streaks ahead of some of the old farts.....
Hang on, that remiinds me of a couple of 10,000hr+ Captains I fly with? Who's training who? With a bit of guidance those low hour F.O.'s can be streaks ahead of some of the old farts.....
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Anybody else noticed the apparent contradiction in attitudes here?
Along the lines of 'the Q400 is absolutely fantastic, easily as good as any jet. Why do you want to fly jets'
on the one hand, and...
'Don't think you're getting anywhere near one of our TTJs (Toy Town Jets) they're reserved exclusively for those that have done our time!'
One way or another, this is going to be a mess!
Along the lines of 'the Q400 is absolutely fantastic, easily as good as any jet. Why do you want to fly jets'
on the one hand, and...
'Don't think you're getting anywhere near one of our TTJs (Toy Town Jets) they're reserved exclusively for those that have done our time!'
One way or another, this is going to be a mess!
The wings - sorry, I hadn't seen your post when I typed that. It wasn't meant as a dig at anyone in particular.
4468 - No contadiction at all. The sad thing is that a jet F/O or Captain at Flybe still earns considerably more than their counterpart on the Q400. That is the main reason for the attitude you are seeing. At the moment there are plenty of jobs out there even for Q400 pilots if they want to move on. Most of those trying to change fleet are possibly planning to stay because of being happy based where they are, but would like to earn more. If you take into consideration that it takes between 6 - 8 years of seniority to get a LHS on a jet at Flybe you'll see why they are not happy about the idea of direct entry pilots going straight into the embraer.
4468 - No contadiction at all. The sad thing is that a jet F/O or Captain at Flybe still earns considerably more than their counterpart on the Q400. That is the main reason for the attitude you are seeing. At the moment there are plenty of jobs out there even for Q400 pilots if they want to move on. Most of those trying to change fleet are possibly planning to stay because of being happy based where they are, but would like to earn more. If you take into consideration that it takes between 6 - 8 years of seniority to get a LHS on a jet at Flybe you'll see why they are not happy about the idea of direct entry pilots going straight into the embraer.
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DEC Jet
They are desperate for pilots, hence the two page ad in Flight, so if I say I'll only join if you give me DEC jet then with my experience that's what I'll get or I won't join. Simple as that.
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BMB
You won't get a DEC Jet. Period! The courses are booked up till the end of the year and there are dozens of very senior Captains waiting for next years allocation.
Q400 - yes. And they'll ask you if you can bring a friend too.
You won't get a DEC Jet. Period! The courses are booked up till the end of the year and there are dozens of very senior Captains waiting for next years allocation.
Q400 - yes. And they'll ask you if you can bring a friend too.
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British Airways regional subsidiary BA Connect have advised the flights shown below to/from Birmingham have been cancelled due to operational reasons.
15 February 2007
BA4171/4170 - To and from Aberdeen - cancelled
BA1754/5 - To and from Hanover- cancelled
BA1810/1 - To and from Paris(CDG) - cancelled
16 February 2007
BA1741/2 - To and from Stuttgart - cancelled
BA4153/4 - To and from Geneva - cancelled
BA1735/1764 - To and from Glasgow - cancelled
17 February 2007
BA7711/2 - To and from Lyon - cancelled
BA4193/4 - To and from Berlin (Tegel) - cancelled
19 February 2007
BA7715 - From Birmingham to Lyon-passengers re-accommodated onto BA7711
BA7716 - From Lyon to Birmingham -cancelled with no alternative.
20 February 2007
BA1741 - From Birmingham to Stuttgart- passengers re-accommodated onto BA1743
BA1742 - From Stuttgart to Birmingham - passengers re-accommodated onto BA1740
22 February 2007
BA1772 - From Birmingham to Hamburg- passengers re-accommodated onto BA1774
BA1773 - From Hamburg to Birmingham - passengers re-accommodated onto BA1775
BA4153 - From Birmingham to Geneva- cancelled with no alternative
BA4154 - From Geneva to Birmingham - cancelled with no alternative
BA1762 - From Birmingham to Frankfurt- passengers re-accommodated onto BA1766
BA1763 - From Frankfurt to Birmingham - passengers re-accommodated onto BA1767
24 February 2007
BA1754 - Birmingham to Hanover- cancelled with no alternative
BA1755 - Hanover to Birmingham- cancelled with no alternative
BA1833 - Birmingham to Glasgow- passengers re-accommodated onto BA1757
BA1738 - Glasgow to Birmingham- passengers re-accommodated onto BA1736
15 February 2007
BA4171/4170 - To and from Aberdeen - cancelled
BA1754/5 - To and from Hanover- cancelled
BA1810/1 - To and from Paris(CDG) - cancelled
16 February 2007
BA1741/2 - To and from Stuttgart - cancelled
BA4153/4 - To and from Geneva - cancelled
BA1735/1764 - To and from Glasgow - cancelled
17 February 2007
BA7711/2 - To and from Lyon - cancelled
BA4193/4 - To and from Berlin (Tegel) - cancelled
19 February 2007
BA7715 - From Birmingham to Lyon-passengers re-accommodated onto BA7711
BA7716 - From Lyon to Birmingham -cancelled with no alternative.
20 February 2007
BA1741 - From Birmingham to Stuttgart- passengers re-accommodated onto BA1743
BA1742 - From Stuttgart to Birmingham - passengers re-accommodated onto BA1740
22 February 2007
BA1772 - From Birmingham to Hamburg- passengers re-accommodated onto BA1774
BA1773 - From Hamburg to Birmingham - passengers re-accommodated onto BA1775
BA4153 - From Birmingham to Geneva- cancelled with no alternative
BA4154 - From Geneva to Birmingham - cancelled with no alternative
BA1762 - From Birmingham to Frankfurt- passengers re-accommodated onto BA1766
BA1763 - From Frankfurt to Birmingham - passengers re-accommodated onto BA1767
24 February 2007
BA1754 - Birmingham to Hanover- cancelled with no alternative
BA1755 - Hanover to Birmingham- cancelled with no alternative
BA1833 - Birmingham to Glasgow- passengers re-accommodated onto BA1757
BA1738 - Glasgow to Birmingham- passengers re-accommodated onto BA1736
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this sort of stuff should be made illegal :
http://www.flybe.com/vacancies/pilots_benefits.htm
Point 2 - Published 6 weeks in advance, don't believe it - you'll be lucky to get it by the 20th of the month for the following month, and in any case it won't work out that way. Multiple changes along the way - just to help you "plan your Life".
stable roster and flybe are 2 words that just don't go together.
Do the management of flybe not realise, that with the exception of newbees, most pilots talk to each another and know what it's really like to work for them. Maybe they should put all this effort into making it a better company to work for and they wouldn't be having the pilot retention problems that they've got.
http://www.flybe.com/vacancies/pilots_benefits.htm
Point 2 - Published 6 weeks in advance, don't believe it - you'll be lucky to get it by the 20th of the month for the following month, and in any case it won't work out that way. Multiple changes along the way - just to help you "plan your Life".
stable roster and flybe are 2 words that just don't go together.
Do the management of flybe not realise, that with the exception of newbees, most pilots talk to each another and know what it's really like to work for them. Maybe they should put all this effort into making it a better company to work for and they wouldn't be having the pilot retention problems that they've got.
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The recent ads on the website and in Flight contain 'spin' in the extreme. Whilst I admit that £50k for a Direct Entry Captain (DHC8 of course) is not bad, £82k is an absolute lie. Looking at the pay scales that figure would be achievable only by a 146/195 Captain with 17 years seniority!
I agree with 40hm, that sort of advertising shouldn't be allowed. However, we're an intelligent bunch, and it only takes a couple of clicks on the mouse to uncover the real Flybe package.
I agree with 40hm, that sort of advertising shouldn't be allowed. However, we're an intelligent bunch, and it only takes a couple of clicks on the mouse to uncover the real Flybe package.