Aer Lingus - Direct Entry Pilots
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Dublin
Posts: 25
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
alisha - I wouldn't dare comment on your mental aptitude. I'll leave the posts you have previously written in this thread for others to decide themselves.
One thing strikes me (oh excuse me, freudian slip) though, it appears you're already salivating at the thought of getting a job in BFS once Manion has had his dirty way with us. How short sighted.
Lets take away the fact I think you are an imbecile for not understanding why the pilots were/are taking this course of action - when you get your job, and Manion comes next year looking for, say, 5 days annual leave from you - what's your plan going to be?
Do you think we'll care on this forum? Do you IALPA/BALPA/Union will want to know? Do you think your colleagues will help? What if he threats not to pay you for 6 weeks, until you give up the 5 days?
What if he employs some skivvy from "insert non-racial but looked down upon pilot country" to come to Belfast and do your flights while you "consider" his new contracts?
Oh but of course - it would never happen to ME! I mean I'll just do my work, keep the head down, say nothing, maybe look for my command in a couple of years. I mean, it's more than I'm getting paid at McDonalds, screw those other losers already there, they don't know they have it made.
Stupid pension - I'll be dead of radiation before I'll need that. What with my 900 (or more) hrs a year til I'm 65 I'll be glowing brighter than the maglite in my case!
Leave days? When the hell will I have time for that, got to make sure my name doesn't appear at the bottom of any annual flight hours league and draw attention to myself. Actually maybe I'll just ring crew control and see if there's any gaps for tomorrow...can never be too sure.
Pay? Phssst! No idea what my pay freeze is at a at the moment. I'm never at home, haven't seen the outside of an airplane for 3 months. Well, until next Tuesday that is, when I have to go to the hospital for surgery.....to have an A320 professionally removed from my ass.
Where does it stop?
Would you take my grave so quick?
PS. Good luck with the interview.
One thing strikes me (oh excuse me, freudian slip) though, it appears you're already salivating at the thought of getting a job in BFS once Manion has had his dirty way with us. How short sighted.
Lets take away the fact I think you are an imbecile for not understanding why the pilots were/are taking this course of action - when you get your job, and Manion comes next year looking for, say, 5 days annual leave from you - what's your plan going to be?
Do you think we'll care on this forum? Do you IALPA/BALPA/Union will want to know? Do you think your colleagues will help? What if he threats not to pay you for 6 weeks, until you give up the 5 days?
What if he employs some skivvy from "insert non-racial but looked down upon pilot country" to come to Belfast and do your flights while you "consider" his new contracts?
Oh but of course - it would never happen to ME! I mean I'll just do my work, keep the head down, say nothing, maybe look for my command in a couple of years. I mean, it's more than I'm getting paid at McDonalds, screw those other losers already there, they don't know they have it made.
Stupid pension - I'll be dead of radiation before I'll need that. What with my 900 (or more) hrs a year til I'm 65 I'll be glowing brighter than the maglite in my case!
Leave days? When the hell will I have time for that, got to make sure my name doesn't appear at the bottom of any annual flight hours league and draw attention to myself. Actually maybe I'll just ring crew control and see if there's any gaps for tomorrow...can never be too sure.
Pay? Phssst! No idea what my pay freeze is at a at the moment. I'm never at home, haven't seen the outside of an airplane for 3 months. Well, until next Tuesday that is, when I have to go to the hospital for surgery.....to have an A320 professionally removed from my ass.
Where does it stop?
Would you take my grave so quick?
PS. Good luck with the interview.
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: London
Posts: 43
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
1. Is the recruitment ban still in place?
2. How long do you think it will be untill all in AL a happy and stable organistion again?
3. How long is a piece of string? (Quantum Physic answer for this this one please)
2. How long do you think it will be untill all in AL a happy and stable organistion again?
3. How long is a piece of string? (Quantum Physic answer for this this one please)
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Ireland
Posts: 254
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hi FO Jimmie James,
1. Is the recruitment ban still in place?
In reply just heard on RTE news today a statement from Impact Trade Union (IALPA) that Aer Lingus had suspended one pilot for refusing to train Belfast crews.
Willby
1. Is the recruitment ban still in place?
In reply just heard on RTE news today a statement from Impact Trade Union (IALPA) that Aer Lingus had suspended one pilot for refusing to train Belfast crews.
Willby
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Dublin
Posts: 25
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
F/o Jimmie James
1) CHeck out http://www.ialpa.net/main.html
2) When Mannion and co have gone and a proper management team are put in place.
3) Twice the length from the middle.
1) CHeck out http://www.ialpa.net/main.html
2) When Mannion and co have gone and a proper management team are put in place.
3) Twice the length from the middle.
Join Date: May 2004
Location: UK
Posts: 114
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
======================================================
Aer Lingus has begun suspending pilots refusing to train new recruits in a dispute over pay and conditions for the airline's planned new hub at Belfast.
Members of the Aer Lingus pilots' union Impact have said they will resign en masse from training duties.
It follows the suspension of four of their colleagues for refusing to train new recruits who will be employed on lower pay and pensions.
Almost 40 senior pilots have begun resigning from training duties.
By doing so they are seeking to avoid the risk of suspension for refusal to train new recruits.
The Irish Airline Pilots' Association (Ialpa) which is part of Impact wants to negotiate over terms and conditions to apply in Belfast.
However, the airline has said negotiations are over and it wants to set up its new hub north of the border employing staff on conditions "with reference to local market conditions".
Four Ialpa members have been suspended so far for refusing to take part in the training of new recruits, in line with union policy to black co-operation with management's Belfast preparations until agreement is reached.
While there was speculation that a suspension might trigger a strike - for which the union already has virtual unanimous approval from its membership - the pilots' move to formally withdraw from training is a surprise one, seeking to outfox management.
An Impact spokesman told the BBC that training was an optional extra duty beyond pilots' core flying duties, which they elected to make themselves available for and for which they received separate pay.
Resignation threat
However, the union claims that an in-house training capability was also a regulatory requirement of Irish aviation authorities, and that loss of this through mass resignations would hit the airline hard as it gears up for its new Belfast operation, while immunising pilots from disciplinary action.
The airline, which refused to comment on Tuesday, however, is expected to be examining if the pilots' withdrawal from training duties could spark any further disciplinary sanction by management.
The union has said it wants to solve the dispute without industrial action, and to negotiate, a path also urged by Taoiseach Bertie Ahern.
"Our line remains the same - we want to discuss it, we want to negotiate, we want to resolve the problem," an Impact spokesman said.
Belfast International Airport
Aer Lingus is setting up a hub at Belfast International
Privately, union members are likely to be very reluctant to strike, conscious that staff shareholdings acquired in last year's privatisation of Ireland's former national airline will be damaged if its overall financial health is affected by a dispute which could weaken the share price.
This may be why Aer Lingus management appears to be playing tough, confronting the pilots last week and also telling other staff it will not honour a pay award supposed to be paid as part of an Irish government-brokered national pay deal, unless staff accept the airline's cost reduction proposals.
A showdown may be part of Chief Executive Dermot Mannion's plans to streamline the airline, and develop a new post-privatisation culture in the face of stiff competition from bitter rival and substantial shareholder Ryanair.
The airline also faces stiff competition from rivals including Ryanair on almost all its UK and European routes, and British Midland on its routes across the Irish Sea.
With the new Belfast hub due to open in early December, the latest surprise move by pilots places more pressure on management to resolve the increasingly bitter dispute, and meet its deadline for take-off from Belfast.
Any uncertainty or postponement of the start of services from Belfast would represent a public relations disaster for the airline, already taking bookings for its advertised services to London Heathrow and European destinations from Aldergrove.
The stakes for the pilots are high too however, fearful that staff on lower pay and pensions at a base only 110 miles just up the road from Dublin could eventually reduce their own conditions, which are considerably better than those enjoyed by staff in rival Ryanair.
Aer Lingus has begun suspending pilots refusing to train new recruits in a dispute over pay and conditions for the airline's planned new hub at Belfast.
Members of the Aer Lingus pilots' union Impact have said they will resign en masse from training duties.
It follows the suspension of four of their colleagues for refusing to train new recruits who will be employed on lower pay and pensions.
Almost 40 senior pilots have begun resigning from training duties.
By doing so they are seeking to avoid the risk of suspension for refusal to train new recruits.
The Irish Airline Pilots' Association (Ialpa) which is part of Impact wants to negotiate over terms and conditions to apply in Belfast.
However, the airline has said negotiations are over and it wants to set up its new hub north of the border employing staff on conditions "with reference to local market conditions".
Four Ialpa members have been suspended so far for refusing to take part in the training of new recruits, in line with union policy to black co-operation with management's Belfast preparations until agreement is reached.
While there was speculation that a suspension might trigger a strike - for which the union already has virtual unanimous approval from its membership - the pilots' move to formally withdraw from training is a surprise one, seeking to outfox management.
An Impact spokesman told the BBC that training was an optional extra duty beyond pilots' core flying duties, which they elected to make themselves available for and for which they received separate pay.
Resignation threat
However, the union claims that an in-house training capability was also a regulatory requirement of Irish aviation authorities, and that loss of this through mass resignations would hit the airline hard as it gears up for its new Belfast operation, while immunising pilots from disciplinary action.
The airline, which refused to comment on Tuesday, however, is expected to be examining if the pilots' withdrawal from training duties could spark any further disciplinary sanction by management.
The union has said it wants to solve the dispute without industrial action, and to negotiate, a path also urged by Taoiseach Bertie Ahern.
"Our line remains the same - we want to discuss it, we want to negotiate, we want to resolve the problem," an Impact spokesman said.
Belfast International Airport
Aer Lingus is setting up a hub at Belfast International
Privately, union members are likely to be very reluctant to strike, conscious that staff shareholdings acquired in last year's privatisation of Ireland's former national airline will be damaged if its overall financial health is affected by a dispute which could weaken the share price.
This may be why Aer Lingus management appears to be playing tough, confronting the pilots last week and also telling other staff it will not honour a pay award supposed to be paid as part of an Irish government-brokered national pay deal, unless staff accept the airline's cost reduction proposals.
A showdown may be part of Chief Executive Dermot Mannion's plans to streamline the airline, and develop a new post-privatisation culture in the face of stiff competition from bitter rival and substantial shareholder Ryanair.
The airline also faces stiff competition from rivals including Ryanair on almost all its UK and European routes, and British Midland on its routes across the Irish Sea.
With the new Belfast hub due to open in early December, the latest surprise move by pilots places more pressure on management to resolve the increasingly bitter dispute, and meet its deadline for take-off from Belfast.
Any uncertainty or postponement of the start of services from Belfast would represent a public relations disaster for the airline, already taking bookings for its advertised services to London Heathrow and European destinations from Aldergrove.
The stakes for the pilots are high too however, fearful that staff on lower pay and pensions at a base only 110 miles just up the road from Dublin could eventually reduce their own conditions, which are considerably better than those enjoyed by staff in rival Ryanair.
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: London
Posts: 43
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Thanks Papa2 and Charlie and Wilby.
No one can tell me that this will be a boring Airline to work for!
Viva better conditions for all Pilots. All the best to the suspended pilots . . . True honour displayed!
No one can tell me that this will be a boring Airline to work for!
Viva better conditions for all Pilots. All the best to the suspended pilots . . . True honour displayed!
Join Date: Jun 1997
Location: 5530N
Posts: 845
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
the load factor are are so low on the AMS sector it's a joke. LHR - SNN dropped this weekend with good loads. BFS on LHR will be interesting. I think they made a dogs arse of it...time will tell.
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Cologne
Age: 52
Posts: 36
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hi!
Is there still the recruitment ban? I could not find any information about it.
Or did they sort it out in the meantime? Are the fired trainers re-employed??
Would there be any RE F/O for the A330fleet?
Is there still the recruitment ban? I could not find any information about it.
Or did they sort it out in the meantime? Are the fired trainers re-employed??
Would there be any RE F/O for the A330fleet?
It will be interesting how much money per day! EI will be loosing at the moment out of BFS? Will the shareholders allow this to continue particularily with a global slowdown to contend with?
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Europe
Posts: 64
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Some news is creeping out now about BFS. First, all current DE pilots have signed up to a contract without having all the information about their future situation. I know that at least two pilots have declined to sign up because there was no clarity available about important questions. These two were not prepared to accept promises that things would be sorted out later (one was told that the answer to a question he asked was "confidential" and he could only be told once he checked out and after arrived in BFS to start work). Also there are strong rumours that existing EI pilots have all declined BFS contracts due to the lack of clarity about conditions. Apparently EI have announced to at least one pilot that there will be no formal working conditions at the begining.
Some of the new DE pilots also seem to have picked up the idea that they will receive the same allowances, productivity pay, etc. as existing EI pilots, only to discover afterwards that this is not correct. Others refer to things they were told at interview which are different from the agreement for the BFS base. I suspect that all of this means is that there is going to be fun and games at BFS for months to come.
Some of the new DE pilots also seem to have picked up the idea that they will receive the same allowances, productivity pay, etc. as existing EI pilots, only to discover afterwards that this is not correct. Others refer to things they were told at interview which are different from the agreement for the BFS base. I suspect that all of this means is that there is going to be fun and games at BFS for months to come.
