Flybe Ops Director joins list of resignations
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Quote "a typical front line cabbage ready to get shot"
Flying Fiona
Lovely sentiments in the run up to remembrance day!
It's a good job some had the military traits of courage and determination for which we should all be grateful.
May I suggest a donation to cleanse your soul.
http://www.poppy.org.uk/
Flying Fiona
Lovely sentiments in the run up to remembrance day!
It's a good job some had the military traits of courage and determination for which we should all be grateful.
May I suggest a donation to cleanse your soul.
http://www.poppy.org.uk/
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Ngenfire
Sounds like negative fire to me. Not sure if that was your intention but the fact remains joining the military is a choice we all have.
It was my choice not to join because of the risks involved. There was nothing in the statement but you chose to find a meaning. Nothing wrong with that. Your human. However people that sign up with the military tend to be of a certain type and navigators are no exception. I have friends that burnt their hands putting bullets in the guts of Iraqi soldiers so don't ask me to put money into a box that you know nothing about. When was the last time you gave a tenth of your salary to the poppy day appeal? Your moral high ground doesn't wash.
I for one will wear my poppy with pride this year. However it doesn't change my view on a man with a deep down desire to exploit his staff in a way that destructs their familys without even pulling a trigger.
Sounds like negative fire to me. Not sure if that was your intention but the fact remains joining the military is a choice we all have.
It was my choice not to join because of the risks involved. There was nothing in the statement but you chose to find a meaning. Nothing wrong with that. Your human. However people that sign up with the military tend to be of a certain type and navigators are no exception. I have friends that burnt their hands putting bullets in the guts of Iraqi soldiers so don't ask me to put money into a box that you know nothing about. When was the last time you gave a tenth of your salary to the poppy day appeal? Your moral high ground doesn't wash.
I for one will wear my poppy with pride this year. However it doesn't change my view on a man with a deep down desire to exploit his staff in a way that destructs their familys without even pulling a trigger.
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I would like to agree with my Army colleague above: Flying Fiona, you are a cretin. Your opinions are ill founded and wrong and clearly driven by some sense of grievance which has no place in this, or any other, forum. Furthermore, your spelling and grammar are execrable (look it up). May I suggest that you learn: the difference between "your" and "you're"; the plural form of "family" and that there is no verb "to destruct".
If you would care to send me a PM with the appropriate information, I shall be happy to repeat this to your face; a courtesy you have not accorded to MW.
I hope very sincerely that, if you are still (or ever have been) an employee of Flybe, I shall never have the misfortune to be rostered with you. I also hope you will never suffer the pain and misery presently being endured by MW and his family.
GET BACK UNDER YOUR STONE!!
If you would care to send me a PM with the appropriate information, I shall be happy to repeat this to your face; a courtesy you have not accorded to MW.
I hope very sincerely that, if you are still (or ever have been) an employee of Flybe, I shall never have the misfortune to be rostered with you. I also hope you will never suffer the pain and misery presently being endured by MW and his family.
GET BACK UNDER YOUR STONE!!
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FF
Two points:
1) It isn't MW who is "destructing" your family - it is you who does that, by choosing to remain in a job that doesn't suit you;
2) if your family is that fragile, you have bigger problems than MW.
As for "no place for RD in flybe", I wish you could see my inbox. It seems to tell a different story...
However it doesn't change my view on a man with a deep down desire to exploit his staff in a way that destructs their familys without even pulling a trigger.
1) It isn't MW who is "destructing" your family - it is you who does that, by choosing to remain in a job that doesn't suit you;
2) if your family is that fragile, you have bigger problems than MW.
As for "no place for RD in flybe", I wish you could see my inbox. It seems to tell a different story...
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fokker
Your points are noted. Thank you for your quick response. However your point was??
Your desire to take the community of pprune for an English lesson is not wanted. This is a forum in a democratic society that allows freedom of speech.
I am entitled to my opinions and if you do not like them thats tough. Maybe it would be more worth your while debating the point instead of going off on a tangent and advertising your excellence in the English language. After all, the art of communication in whatever form was derived for conveying a message something that the ex Ops director had a problem with and on first impression you struggle with aswell.
I guess I have touched a raw nerve with both ngenfire, fokker and maybe a few more of you. The fact is you probably put a measly pound in the poppy box compared to the £70,000 salary you earn each year. I challenge you all to go and put £100 in next time you walk past the information desk at the airport. The red poppy will be waiting for you but I bet you don't do it.
Your points are noted. Thank you for your quick response. However your point was??
Your desire to take the community of pprune for an English lesson is not wanted. This is a forum in a democratic society that allows freedom of speech.
I am entitled to my opinions and if you do not like them thats tough. Maybe it would be more worth your while debating the point instead of going off on a tangent and advertising your excellence in the English language. After all, the art of communication in whatever form was derived for conveying a message something that the ex Ops director had a problem with and on first impression you struggle with aswell.
I guess I have touched a raw nerve with both ngenfire, fokker and maybe a few more of you. The fact is you probably put a measly pound in the poppy box compared to the £70,000 salary you earn each year. I challenge you all to go and put £100 in next time you walk past the information desk at the airport. The red poppy will be waiting for you but I bet you don't do it.
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Oh, dear.
I rest my case.
No, actually, I think I'll rest it in a moment................
Fiona,
The ill-punctuated, semi-literate drivel that you have just posted makes my point far more eloquently than I ever could. However, I shall attempt to explain in words short enough for you to understand:
MW (as I replied in an earlier post) may or may not have had shortcomings as a manager. FWIW, it is my belief that he is ill-equipped for the role in a company the size that ours now is, whereas he was able to muddle-through when it was smaller. I do not believe that he is basically dishonest, as you have suggested and, yes I do have direct experience on which to base this opinion. HOWEVER, I believe utterly that everyone is entitled to a fair hearing and decent treatment (even one as distorted and bitter as you appear to be) and it ill-behoves anyone to kick a man when he is as comprehensively 'down' as MW is at the moment, whatever the perceived injustice may have been.
You are, indeed, entitled to your opinion. It is, at least partly, to contribute to the preservation of that freedom that I served my Country for 12 years as a military Officer. I stand by your right to hold it even (especially?) when it is as crass, bigoted and poorly-expressed as yours.
I'm not sure where in your corrupted version of discussion the RBL Poppy Appeal crept in but, for the record, I do not earn £70K a year (can't imagine where you got that idea). However, from what I do earn I give to charities a significant three-figure sum annually (the exact amount is between me, my conscience and the tax-man) by Gift Aid - a far more effective form of giving than a counter-top tin, as I am sure you know. Oh, and yes, it does include the Poppy Appeal.
Lastly, I fancy that readers of this thread will form their own opinions as to who struggles with "..conveying a message..".
I repeat: get back under your stone.
OK. NOW I rest my case.
I rest my case.
No, actually, I think I'll rest it in a moment................
Fiona,
The ill-punctuated, semi-literate drivel that you have just posted makes my point far more eloquently than I ever could. However, I shall attempt to explain in words short enough for you to understand:
MW (as I replied in an earlier post) may or may not have had shortcomings as a manager. FWIW, it is my belief that he is ill-equipped for the role in a company the size that ours now is, whereas he was able to muddle-through when it was smaller. I do not believe that he is basically dishonest, as you have suggested and, yes I do have direct experience on which to base this opinion. HOWEVER, I believe utterly that everyone is entitled to a fair hearing and decent treatment (even one as distorted and bitter as you appear to be) and it ill-behoves anyone to kick a man when he is as comprehensively 'down' as MW is at the moment, whatever the perceived injustice may have been.
You are, indeed, entitled to your opinion. It is, at least partly, to contribute to the preservation of that freedom that I served my Country for 12 years as a military Officer. I stand by your right to hold it even (especially?) when it is as crass, bigoted and poorly-expressed as yours.
I'm not sure where in your corrupted version of discussion the RBL Poppy Appeal crept in but, for the record, I do not earn £70K a year (can't imagine where you got that idea). However, from what I do earn I give to charities a significant three-figure sum annually (the exact amount is between me, my conscience and the tax-man) by Gift Aid - a far more effective form of giving than a counter-top tin, as I am sure you know. Oh, and yes, it does include the Poppy Appeal.
Lastly, I fancy that readers of this thread will form their own opinions as to who struggles with "..conveying a message..".
I repeat: get back under your stone.
OK. NOW I rest my case.
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Been following the Flybe posts, but never said anything sofar. But what I am reading now appears to be more about slagging of FF than about MW and Flybe.
I have been out of the company several years now and have still quite a few friends still in on all levels. Can say most are not impressed with the man in question, including myself. Besides having no clue who were on his fabulous Kick Start meetings (you could attend two of these on one day and he would not remember on the second one he saw you on the first) I crossed his "war"path but didn't immediately give in and came to know a different side of him. Not very nice I must say. Had to do with his position as well ofcourse, but it all depends on how you bring it to your people and the way you deal with things.
Funny enough I now work with quite a few people that knew him from before his Flybe time and they are all (without any exception) not too positive about him. I think it might be good for flybe that he leaves and am sure the company will do fine without him.
And BTW RD, don't know you very well but if you have a family or would have I am sure your kids would sleep in B'ham City shirts and on days off you take the family to the airport to see Flybe airplanes land and take off.
Ofcourse the flybe roster upsets family life! Maybe not on your idyllic base, but many guys are fed up with changing rosters and unscheduled overnights. And to give the answer before the question comes, yes, these guys are busy with leaving.
But please don't let me hold all of you from slaggin' of FF a bit more.
Cheers,
Ptt
I have been out of the company several years now and have still quite a few friends still in on all levels. Can say most are not impressed with the man in question, including myself. Besides having no clue who were on his fabulous Kick Start meetings (you could attend two of these on one day and he would not remember on the second one he saw you on the first) I crossed his "war"path but didn't immediately give in and came to know a different side of him. Not very nice I must say. Had to do with his position as well ofcourse, but it all depends on how you bring it to your people and the way you deal with things.
Funny enough I now work with quite a few people that knew him from before his Flybe time and they are all (without any exception) not too positive about him. I think it might be good for flybe that he leaves and am sure the company will do fine without him.
And BTW RD, don't know you very well but if you have a family or would have I am sure your kids would sleep in B'ham City shirts and on days off you take the family to the airport to see Flybe airplanes land and take off.
Ofcourse the flybe roster upsets family life! Maybe not on your idyllic base, but many guys are fed up with changing rosters and unscheduled overnights. And to give the answer before the question comes, yes, these guys are busy with leaving.
But please don't let me hold all of you from slaggin' of FF a bit more.
Cheers,
Ptt
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PTT
In my time at flybe, I spent most of it at EDI on the 146. We were, after the initial year of LCY, probably the most dislocated and dicked-about base in the company. Daily commutes to NCL, early morning dashes to GLA, weeks spent in the SOU Hilton - I was away from home a hell of a lot. I complained about it at the time to MW, and he went out of his way to "ease our pain". I have a young family, and I was conscious of the effect on them. In the end, I decided that my family was more important, and that is the reason - the only reason - I no longer work for flybe. If I was to lay blame anywhere, it would be at JF's door, as he signs off on all those decisions that result in us being messed about. However, that would hardly be fair as many of those decisions had to be made to ensure the future of the company.
My point is, I always had the choice. If I didn't like it, I could leave; if I felt my family was at risk, I could stay anyway and let them suffer. It was always my choice.
The difference between me and FF is that he blames MW for ruining his life, and I take responsibility for mine. He doesn't understand that his destiny is in his own hands, or that operational decisions regarding bases or resulting in roster turbulence are only rarely the fault of the Ops Director. In my experience, those decisions are made by Commercial and are often argued against, on behalf of the crews, by MW!
People who have a run-in with any manager are likely to be less than objective in their views, and it shows in some of the comments here. Of course it is never their fault, always the manager...
FF has led us to believe that he is a person of exceptionally little character. Assuming that is true - half the time, stuff on here is a wind-up- he deserves all he gets.
In my time at flybe, I spent most of it at EDI on the 146. We were, after the initial year of LCY, probably the most dislocated and dicked-about base in the company. Daily commutes to NCL, early morning dashes to GLA, weeks spent in the SOU Hilton - I was away from home a hell of a lot. I complained about it at the time to MW, and he went out of his way to "ease our pain". I have a young family, and I was conscious of the effect on them. In the end, I decided that my family was more important, and that is the reason - the only reason - I no longer work for flybe. If I was to lay blame anywhere, it would be at JF's door, as he signs off on all those decisions that result in us being messed about. However, that would hardly be fair as many of those decisions had to be made to ensure the future of the company.
My point is, I always had the choice. If I didn't like it, I could leave; if I felt my family was at risk, I could stay anyway and let them suffer. It was always my choice.
The difference between me and FF is that he blames MW for ruining his life, and I take responsibility for mine. He doesn't understand that his destiny is in his own hands, or that operational decisions regarding bases or resulting in roster turbulence are only rarely the fault of the Ops Director. In my experience, those decisions are made by Commercial and are often argued against, on behalf of the crews, by MW!
People who have a run-in with any manager are likely to be less than objective in their views, and it shows in some of the comments here. Of course it is never their fault, always the manager...
FF has led us to believe that he is a person of exceptionally little character. Assuming that is true - half the time, stuff on here is a wind-up- he deserves all he gets.
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RD,
Only meant that I rather see more about flybe than about who and what with FF. That's all.
Thanx for your brief lifestory in flybe. I already knew, cause I actually know you better than I said. Had EDI as base as well for a while and was also always away from home.
On topic; good that MW did his best for you. Wish he would have done the same. Always laid low in the company and worked when asked, but didn't matter to him. Despite asking for a bit of sympathy he pretty much let me crash and burn, with JC in his wake. Hard to forget if it happens to you, I tell you. Maybe he helped you because you were LHS and I was then still RHS, therefore probably dispensable. I don't know. Anyway, I didn't burn the bridge, but I can say the bridge was pretty soaked with fuel and it was hard to not drop the match. If you hear me
All the best.
Rgds,
Ptt
Only meant that I rather see more about flybe than about who and what with FF. That's all.
Thanx for your brief lifestory in flybe. I already knew, cause I actually know you better than I said. Had EDI as base as well for a while and was also always away from home.
On topic; good that MW did his best for you. Wish he would have done the same. Always laid low in the company and worked when asked, but didn't matter to him. Despite asking for a bit of sympathy he pretty much let me crash and burn, with JC in his wake. Hard to forget if it happens to you, I tell you. Maybe he helped you because you were LHS and I was then still RHS, therefore probably dispensable. I don't know. Anyway, I didn't burn the bridge, but I can say the bridge was pretty soaked with fuel and it was hard to not drop the match. If you hear me
All the best.
Rgds,
Ptt
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Of all my dealings with management either at flybe or wherever, one thing thats strikes me is that it is a two way relationship. As advocates have already implied here.
So far, I have never had a bad moment with any management implied here. Maybe because when I have had issues, I have also seen it from the employers point of view. There is no such thing as a free lunch chaps and we can't have it all our own personal way.
If it ain't going your way, try and fix it, if that won't work, leave. Flybe like any business trying to stay afloat, has to remember its goal, that being don't sink. I would rather have been in the dinghy with air in its tubes than get it all my way to see the air pissing out over board. This is how it seemed back a few years ago. Hard decisions were made, and here we are now.......
There are of course, two sides to every coin.
So far, I have never had a bad moment with any management implied here. Maybe because when I have had issues, I have also seen it from the employers point of view. There is no such thing as a free lunch chaps and we can't have it all our own personal way.
If it ain't going your way, try and fix it, if that won't work, leave. Flybe like any business trying to stay afloat, has to remember its goal, that being don't sink. I would rather have been in the dinghy with air in its tubes than get it all my way to see the air pissing out over board. This is how it seemed back a few years ago. Hard decisions were made, and here we are now.......
There are of course, two sides to every coin.
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RD, i take it you now know that FF did not as you stated "have a fit and leave" !!, although as you rightly said we are all in control of our own decissions, and FF should leave or shut up whinging about how much his life is being made hard.
The guys he leaves in the s**t every time he calls in on his sick days, now they can moan about one man making life hard for everyone !!!!!
The guys he leaves in the s**t every time he calls in on his sick days, now they can moan about one man making life hard for everyone !!!!!
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Nope he has either left the company or is telling porkies. Easy enough to figure out if you read carefully... in fact I think you will find he left some time ago (just in time to avoid being pushed, as it happens).
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FlyBe sounds no different to the regional turboprop airline I work for - we are losing loads of crew at the moment to Globespan/easyJet/Thomsonfly/First Choice/Thomas Cook...it is not a mystery at this level of the industry....
FF - your an idiot!
FF - your an idiot!
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The whole FF persona is an attempt at misdirection - that should be obvious. The individual doesn't work for flybe any more, as you can see from his/her/its thread on Jet Blast. That thread also seems to confirm what Raw Data said - this person seems to have left under a cloud (flybe wouldn't give him/her/it a reference, so there must have been some problem).
The only purpose of this persona seems to be to inflict damage on flybe, which is a particularly cowardly act to perform from under the cloak of anonymity.
It makes you wonder how people of such low moral substance ever become professional pilots. Well, perhaps we should not use the word "professional" to describe this person...
The only purpose of this persona seems to be to inflict damage on flybe, which is a particularly cowardly act to perform from under the cloak of anonymity.
It makes you wonder how people of such low moral substance ever become professional pilots. Well, perhaps we should not use the word "professional" to describe this person...