Air Deccan contract ?
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Air Deccan contract ?
Rice and curry !
I am considering a contract with Air Deccan on A320... that is there has been no terms presented yet. Has anyone been on contract or signed a contract recently ? And what are the general conditions and lifestyle working for Air Deccan ?
I am considering a contract with Air Deccan on A320... that is there has been no terms presented yet. Has anyone been on contract or signed a contract recently ? And what are the general conditions and lifestyle working for Air Deccan ?
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Facelac,
Not with a bargepole!
They were playing several agencies off against each other and still wouldn't accept the lowest of the low rates offered.
They wouldn't put a month's money per pilot up front to an agency thus the agency wouldn't be in a position to guarantee the pilot a monthly salary, indeed any salary!
They attempted to steal addresses from agencies to contact the pilots themselves and offer then, reduced salary, direct employment, they have one A320 Captain there on USD4,000 per month.
They have some ex Army chappie there in charge of recruitment, never flown a commercial aeroplane but likes to call himself 'Captain' and the head of Flight Ops is even worse.
And all this going on whilst they have up to 5 A320's grounded due no Captains and 30 more A320's on order. One good thing though, last heard they had 5 A320's, expected to fly early morning until late evening, but only had 5 Captains, where else will you get to write your name on the side of an aeroplane!
What security will you have if you go, if you don't get paid then you complain, if you complain then you get deported I guess!
Not with a bargepole!
They were playing several agencies off against each other and still wouldn't accept the lowest of the low rates offered.
They wouldn't put a month's money per pilot up front to an agency thus the agency wouldn't be in a position to guarantee the pilot a monthly salary, indeed any salary!
They attempted to steal addresses from agencies to contact the pilots themselves and offer then, reduced salary, direct employment, they have one A320 Captain there on USD4,000 per month.
They have some ex Army chappie there in charge of recruitment, never flown a commercial aeroplane but likes to call himself 'Captain' and the head of Flight Ops is even worse.
And all this going on whilst they have up to 5 A320's grounded due no Captains and 30 more A320's on order. One good thing though, last heard they had 5 A320's, expected to fly early morning until late evening, but only had 5 Captains, where else will you get to write your name on the side of an aeroplane!
What security will you have if you go, if you don't get paid then you complain, if you complain then you get deported I guess!
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Beware,
Most of us have been on contract where we were not paid as per contract conditions.
In some cases not even at all.
I dont know anything about this company but I do know that if they ever screwed anyone over before they will do it again.
A good company always pays its employees.
Most of us have been on contract where we were not paid as per contract conditions.
In some cases not even at all.
I dont know anything about this company but I do know that if they ever screwed anyone over before they will do it again.
A good company always pays its employees.
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Thanks for input Phileas Fogg
Sounds quite "exotic" . Hope the Army-guys likes to see the fleet lined up on the apron as they have been used to. Risky to sign individual contract I suppose ... and USD4000$ without housing !! Must improve to get crews I guess ?
Beeing at it let me mention that Windjet (based on Sicily) is a company to stay away from too. Management and ops like Vueling and permanent crews are trying hard to improve agreement now with growing production - ongoing legal action from both parts - while management is trying to get replacements for the permanent guys.
Rgds
Sounds quite "exotic" . Hope the Army-guys likes to see the fleet lined up on the apron as they have been used to. Risky to sign individual contract I suppose ... and USD4000$ without housing !! Must improve to get crews I guess ?
Beeing at it let me mention that Windjet (based on Sicily) is a company to stay away from too. Management and ops like Vueling and permanent crews are trying hard to improve agreement now with growing production - ongoing legal action from both parts - while management is trying to get replacements for the permanent guys.
Rgds
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Poontang,
They are short of Captains, money, work practices and passengers.
Passengers stranded as carrier puts flights on hold
KOLKATA: No-frills carrier Air Deccan, on Wednesday, announced the sudden withdrawal of services to the city. Nearly 120 passengers booked on Thursday's flight are now left in the lurch. This is the second instance of Air Deccan suspending operations for a prolonged period at short notice since starting flights to Kolkata a couple of months ago.
Though Air Deccan offered no explanation, sources said the Chennai-Kolkata-Chennai sector had been summarily dumped after one of the A-320 aircraft in its fleet was grounded. "On Sunday, a plane hit a boarding ladder while taxiing for take-off in Mumbai. Though it did operate for the day, it was subsequently grounded for inspection and repair. As a result, the Chennai-Kolkata-Chennai sector had to be sacrificed," an official said. There were two reasons behind the decision to drop the Kolkata flight. First, it was less remunerative than other metro sectors.
Second, being the only flight in the eastern sector, removing it made sense. "Plucking out a flight from another sector to service Kolkata would have further jeopardised operations. This decision caused the least disruption," an airline source said.
It may be so for the airline. But for passengers booked on flights the cancellation has wrecked havoc in their schedules. While the carrier will refund the fare, many who need to urgently travel to Chennai could get stranded.
The "now on; now off" operations on the Kolkata-Chennai sector has left passengers as well as the travel/trade industry miffed. While they acknowledge that technical glitches can occur, what they don't agree to is the absence of an exigency plan.
"The carrier must augment its fleet and start operations in the sector when there's a degree of confidence to service it properly. Sudden suspension of operations erodes passenger confidence," a travel agent said. Aviation industry experts, however, pointed out that such risks were part of the low-cost airline business.
"Unlike regular carriers, they cannot afford to keep a buffer aircraft. That would jack up costs," an aviation industry source said.
They are short of Captains, money, work practices and passengers.
Passengers stranded as carrier puts flights on hold
KOLKATA: No-frills carrier Air Deccan, on Wednesday, announced the sudden withdrawal of services to the city. Nearly 120 passengers booked on Thursday's flight are now left in the lurch. This is the second instance of Air Deccan suspending operations for a prolonged period at short notice since starting flights to Kolkata a couple of months ago.
Though Air Deccan offered no explanation, sources said the Chennai-Kolkata-Chennai sector had been summarily dumped after one of the A-320 aircraft in its fleet was grounded. "On Sunday, a plane hit a boarding ladder while taxiing for take-off in Mumbai. Though it did operate for the day, it was subsequently grounded for inspection and repair. As a result, the Chennai-Kolkata-Chennai sector had to be sacrificed," an official said. There were two reasons behind the decision to drop the Kolkata flight. First, it was less remunerative than other metro sectors.
Second, being the only flight in the eastern sector, removing it made sense. "Plucking out a flight from another sector to service Kolkata would have further jeopardised operations. This decision caused the least disruption," an airline source said.
It may be so for the airline. But for passengers booked on flights the cancellation has wrecked havoc in their schedules. While the carrier will refund the fare, many who need to urgently travel to Chennai could get stranded.
The "now on; now off" operations on the Kolkata-Chennai sector has left passengers as well as the travel/trade industry miffed. While they acknowledge that technical glitches can occur, what they don't agree to is the absence of an exigency plan.
"The carrier must augment its fleet and start operations in the sector when there's a degree of confidence to service it properly. Sudden suspension of operations erodes passenger confidence," a travel agent said. Aviation industry experts, however, pointed out that such risks were part of the low-cost airline business.
"Unlike regular carriers, they cannot afford to keep a buffer aircraft. That would jack up costs," an aviation industry source said.
Last edited by Phileas Fogg; 22nd Mar 2005 at 09:56.
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Dear Mr Fogg
Looks like Monsieur Passepartout is upto his old tricks again!
*****
And all this going on whilst they have up to 5 A320's grounded due no Captains
*****
Considering that I am seing one of their aircraft taking off everyday for the past few months - what you mention can't exactly be true is it???
They have five a/c of which the last two are just going to start commercial service from 28th.
Of the other three, yeah one has been out of action for some time this month. But that I understand was more due to the driver of a ground vehicle deciding to check out the structural integrity of a wing tip with predictable results!!!
And as far as lack of passengers - again I think some one's imagination is boiling over! The latest government statistics show that Deccan was almost on par with Jet as far as load factor goes. And most of the time if I try to fly them at short notice, I dont get seats either.
Let us face the facts, they are India's first LCC, started August 2003 with ATR 42s, at a time when every one laughed them off. Now we have every one slashing fares and introducing Etickets here in this part of the world, not to speak of a few more LCCs in various stages of launch (Kingfisher/Spice Jet et all) thanks to Deccan taking off.
I dont have any idea about the flying conditions et all, but they most certainly are not short of passengers neither are all the 320s grounded!
Looks like Monsieur Passepartout is upto his old tricks again!
*****
And all this going on whilst they have up to 5 A320's grounded due no Captains
*****
Considering that I am seing one of their aircraft taking off everyday for the past few months - what you mention can't exactly be true is it???
They have five a/c of which the last two are just going to start commercial service from 28th.
Of the other three, yeah one has been out of action for some time this month. But that I understand was more due to the driver of a ground vehicle deciding to check out the structural integrity of a wing tip with predictable results!!!
And as far as lack of passengers - again I think some one's imagination is boiling over! The latest government statistics show that Deccan was almost on par with Jet as far as load factor goes. And most of the time if I try to fly them at short notice, I dont get seats either.
Let us face the facts, they are India's first LCC, started August 2003 with ATR 42s, at a time when every one laughed them off. Now we have every one slashing fares and introducing Etickets here in this part of the world, not to speak of a few more LCCs in various stages of launch (Kingfisher/Spice Jet et all) thanks to Deccan taking off.
I dont have any idea about the flying conditions et all, but they most certainly are not short of passengers neither are all the 320s grounded!
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(up to 5 A320's grounded)
neither are all the 320s grounded
Rsoman,
Try reading what I said, I never said that all A320's are grounded. So, if there is no shortage of manpower then why are they advertising on FI website and using every dirty trick in the book to recruit Captains?
I think if you have a look, at the right time during the day, on the ramps at BLR & MAA you will find some of their A320's parked. They are repeatedly accepting applications, oh come to India Captain, we have a job for you but won't enter into dialogue regarding T&C's, salary etc.
neither are all the 320s grounded
Rsoman,
Try reading what I said, I never said that all A320's are grounded. So, if there is no shortage of manpower then why are they advertising on FI website and using every dirty trick in the book to recruit Captains?
I think if you have a look, at the right time during the day, on the ramps at BLR & MAA you will find some of their A320's parked. They are repeatedly accepting applications, oh come to India Captain, we have a job for you but won't enter into dialogue regarding T&C's, salary etc.
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Phileas Fogg
I think I owe you an apology and I have no hesitation in tendering one.
I happened to subsequently interact with airline in question and found that these are the worst sort of penny pinchers. And after having announced with much fanfare about the launch of services of the new A320s ,taking in many (including myself) , for the past many days one aircraft is permanently on the ground (as confirmed by their website (check flight information)
Without doubt these are one bunch of jokers! Not to forget that the parent company who promoted the airline had a helicopter accident which was directly attributed to pilot incomptence (ref : DGCA accident summaries at www.dgca.nic.in). Now they are also crying that another proposed start up is now poaching their pilots! (at the salaries they offer are your surprised???)
I think I owe you an apology and I have no hesitation in tendering one.
I happened to subsequently interact with airline in question and found that these are the worst sort of penny pinchers. And after having announced with much fanfare about the launch of services of the new A320s ,taking in many (including myself) , for the past many days one aircraft is permanently on the ground (as confirmed by their website (check flight information)
Without doubt these are one bunch of jokers! Not to forget that the parent company who promoted the airline had a helicopter accident which was directly attributed to pilot incomptence (ref : DGCA accident summaries at www.dgca.nic.in). Now they are also crying that another proposed start up is now poaching their pilots! (at the salaries they offer are your surprised???)
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RS,
Thanks. Amongst a current fleet of something like 5 A320's they have the crewing for approx 1, if they bust the regulations then perhaps 2 but please note that the aircraft manufacture may be providing some of those pilots on a temporary basis. Air Deccan only have 1 A320 Training Captain of their own and it takes something like 100 sectors of line training to check-out a Captain in India,
If they just had one A320 parked then they could conceal it, if they admit to one being parked then in reality they have a lot more parked, in fact the majority of their fleet.
Yes, A320 & ATR pilots are going to other carriers in India, simply because they're offering a reasonable, even by Indian standards, salary, aren't trying to 'hoodwink' pilots into travelling to India to take up these positions whilst refusing to discuss T & C's and are recruiting via reputable agencies.
Try talking to the ex-army chappie at Deccan via email or phone, he's downright rude and thinks he's the first one to ever try to 'hoodwink' a pilot or agency. Perhaps Deccan will learn one day, probably be the same day that the lessors start to repossess their A320's & ATR's!
RS, but what salaries are Deccan offering, they won't discuss these with the pilots, are they actually offering a salary, where can this information be sourced and of course, if they employ the pilots directly then they will need to pay (a lot of) Indian tax.
Thanks. Amongst a current fleet of something like 5 A320's they have the crewing for approx 1, if they bust the regulations then perhaps 2 but please note that the aircraft manufacture may be providing some of those pilots on a temporary basis. Air Deccan only have 1 A320 Training Captain of their own and it takes something like 100 sectors of line training to check-out a Captain in India,
If they just had one A320 parked then they could conceal it, if they admit to one being parked then in reality they have a lot more parked, in fact the majority of their fleet.
Yes, A320 & ATR pilots are going to other carriers in India, simply because they're offering a reasonable, even by Indian standards, salary, aren't trying to 'hoodwink' pilots into travelling to India to take up these positions whilst refusing to discuss T & C's and are recruiting via reputable agencies.
Try talking to the ex-army chappie at Deccan via email or phone, he's downright rude and thinks he's the first one to ever try to 'hoodwink' a pilot or agency. Perhaps Deccan will learn one day, probably be the same day that the lessors start to repossess their A320's & ATR's!
RS, but what salaries are Deccan offering, they won't discuss these with the pilots, are they actually offering a salary, where can this information be sourced and of course, if they employ the pilots directly then they will need to pay (a lot of) Indian tax.
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A320:
1 training captain? only? strange.... and saw a 320 parked in Bangalore the other day.
Atr 42 :
Look like they fly a lot and no airplane grounded
Am I wrong?
My indian colleagues not interrested to go there due to very low salary and very bad working conditions
30 a320 to come
the show must go on
1 training captain? only? strange.... and saw a 320 parked in Bangalore the other day.
Atr 42 :
Look like they fly a lot and no airplane grounded
Am I wrong?My indian colleagues not interrested to go there due to very low salary and very bad working conditions
30 a320 to come
the show must go on
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I had a chance to talk to both Jet and Air Deccan recently, both for ground based jobs. Never made it to Jet at the end, but frankly I was impressed. The interview was professional (after a thorough screening test one month prior) and the interviewers went in depth, and systematically on the subject trying to draw out the depth of your knowledge. You walked out feeling good (although a little disappointed naturally that you finally did not make it).
Deccan was a different cup of tea altogether. First they make come all the way to BLR from HYD (at my own expense - after all they are a LCC, arent they?) only to tell me that they dont have vacancies at entry level (now why they couldnt understand this from from my CV before calling me all the way is something I couldnt understand) . While I am on the way back they call me again that another of their honchos now want to talk . So I make my way back a few days later (again at my own expense) goes through an interview basically consisting of nothing but why I want to leave my current job and how much I want for the job with them and then am asked to call after a few days. I call back and the feedback is that beig a LCC they cannot "afford" to employ me!
I did ask how much they could "afford"- The answer was 175 Pounds a month! Not surprisingly I said NO when I would have to spend half of that on housing alone (BLR is one of most expensive cities in India) not to forget the fact that I spend 15 Grand (Pounds) on my qualifications!!!! Ah! Before I forget , there was another valauable feedback from the interview (and I am not joking) - YOUR PARTING HANDSHAKE WAS NOT STRONG ENOUGH (after all your are speaking of colonels and captains here!)
Now that there is feedback in the thread from both the flying and ground based areas, I can only join Phileas Fogg in requesting everyone to please think twice about going ahead in investing time and effort to interview with this set up. I took a big risk taking two days of unauthorised absence from my curent job not to speak of expenses from my own pocket amounting to something like 20 % of my monthly pay check and finally all this came to nothoing.
And if you do decide to go for it, please dont forget to PRACTICE YOUR HANDSHAKES!!!
Good Luck!!!
Deccan was a different cup of tea altogether. First they make come all the way to BLR from HYD (at my own expense - after all they are a LCC, arent they?) only to tell me that they dont have vacancies at entry level (now why they couldnt understand this from from my CV before calling me all the way is something I couldnt understand) . While I am on the way back they call me again that another of their honchos now want to talk . So I make my way back a few days later (again at my own expense) goes through an interview basically consisting of nothing but why I want to leave my current job and how much I want for the job with them and then am asked to call after a few days. I call back and the feedback is that beig a LCC they cannot "afford" to employ me!
I did ask how much they could "afford"- The answer was 175 Pounds a month! Not surprisingly I said NO when I would have to spend half of that on housing alone (BLR is one of most expensive cities in India) not to forget the fact that I spend 15 Grand (Pounds) on my qualifications!!!! Ah! Before I forget , there was another valauable feedback from the interview (and I am not joking) - YOUR PARTING HANDSHAKE WAS NOT STRONG ENOUGH (after all your are speaking of colonels and captains here!)
Now that there is feedback in the thread from both the flying and ground based areas, I can only join Phileas Fogg in requesting everyone to please think twice about going ahead in investing time and effort to interview with this set up. I took a big risk taking two days of unauthorised absence from my curent job not to speak of expenses from my own pocket amounting to something like 20 % of my monthly pay check and finally all this came to nothoing.
And if you do decide to go for it, please dont forget to PRACTICE YOUR HANDSHAKES!!!
Good Luck!!!
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yyzdub,
Foreign pilots are not changing airlines, they've never started with Deccan because of the appalling recruitment tactics thus they are free to go wherever they like.
And it is 30ish A320's and 30ish ATR's, just wanting to set the facts straight of course. No pilots, no capacity to train pilots but 60ish aircraft on order ..... Cool
Foreign pilots are not changing airlines, they've never started with Deccan because of the appalling recruitment tactics thus they are free to go wherever they like.
And it is 30ish A320's and 30ish ATR's, just wanting to set the facts straight of course. No pilots, no capacity to train pilots but 60ish aircraft on order ..... Cool
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But of the 12 how many are provided by ATR/Airbus as an interim arrangement? By the way finally they got all five 320s on the air (if their website is to be believed) yesterday after a long time.
And Jet Airways is merrily dumping surplus capacity in many of the Air Deccan's routes at fares comparable to them . Remids me of the Peoples Express saga.....
Also reg pilots changing airlines, this is about Indian pilots switching over.
And Jet Airways is merrily dumping surplus capacity in many of the Air Deccan's routes at fares comparable to them . Remids me of the Peoples Express saga.....
Also reg pilots changing airlines, this is about Indian pilots switching over.
Last edited by rsoman; 16th Apr 2005 at 05:49.
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There is a solitary Colombian A320 Captain there earning USD4,000.00 per month.
There are 2 Airbus Industries TRI's, Deccan have their own solitary A320 Training Captain & Postholder but, and no joke, he has been in hospital from overwork.
I stand to be corrected but there are no agency pilots with Deccan because Deccan refuse to guarantee a contract or indeed a salary, Rishworth's were to provide pilots but the cheque(s) didn't arrive in the post etc. etc. etc.
A few pilots, as stated, ain't going to operate a fleet of 70ish aircraft and where will the training capacity come from to provide initial and recurrent training?
There are 2 Airbus Industries TRI's, Deccan have their own solitary A320 Training Captain & Postholder but, and no joke, he has been in hospital from overwork.
I stand to be corrected but there are no agency pilots with Deccan because Deccan refuse to guarantee a contract or indeed a salary, Rishworth's were to provide pilots but the cheque(s) didn't arrive in the post etc. etc. etc.
A few pilots, as stated, ain't going to operate a fleet of 70ish aircraft and where will the training capacity come from to provide initial and recurrent training?
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Bangalore is a great place to be, provided you have the salaries to enjoy it! It is the IT capital of India but that also means that since the average per capita income of the salaried class is high (compared to other Indian cities) , the cost of living is also proportionately higher.
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All the Middle East, European airlines are looking for A320 Capts etc etc, how the hell does the "Capt" of Deccan, really plan to attract pilots for contract jobs, whilethe jobs in Gulf are permanent and offer a better deal.
Big Brother if you are REALLY watching, learn some thing from Jet Airways and hire airline professionals to run your co not, X army, air force chaps to run a LCC.
Big Brother if you are REALLY watching, learn some thing from Jet Airways and hire airline professionals to run your co not, X army, air force chaps to run a LCC.