Monarch Interview
Join Date: Dec 2004
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Monarch
Blightey,
May i ask, when did you have the intervew? I had an interview recently and want to get an idea of how long they're taking to respond. Fingers crossed. Think they're considering me for 320/231.
Congratulations by the way
Ragga
May i ask, when did you have the intervew? I had an interview recently and want to get an idea of how long they're taking to respond. Fingers crossed. Think they're considering me for 320/231.
Congratulations by the way
Ragga
Join Date: Jun 2001
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Blighty Pilot,
I think these are dreadful terms and conditions. They are far worse than Britannia, Thomas Cook, First Choice and MyTravel.
They are your direct competitors as well as easyJet, and they pay more too.
Desperation has crept into this industry and it is fed by people like you propagating a myth that terms such as these are worth signing up for.
I just cannot believe how anyone can consider these good terms when you look at how much better off your colleagues in Monarch will be.
They will be laughing at you.
I think these are dreadful terms and conditions. They are far worse than Britannia, Thomas Cook, First Choice and MyTravel.
They are your direct competitors as well as easyJet, and they pay more too.
Desperation has crept into this industry and it is fed by people like you propagating a myth that terms such as these are worth signing up for.
I just cannot believe how anyone can consider these good terms when you look at how much better off your colleagues in Monarch will be.
They will be laughing at you.
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Europe
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Wheelbarrow,
Don't expect to make money in this industry - you should know that by now... The industry has changed. True, the scale that Blighty highlighted was not the best, but it could be a lot worse. Flying more sectors per day for Ryanair or Easy for a little bit more would not be viewed as worth it by many pilots.
Should this scale be improved? Of course - hopefully soon. And when it is improved, he will be in a good position on the 757 out of Luton - not bad...
Don't expect to make money in this industry - you should know that by now... The industry has changed. True, the scale that Blighty highlighted was not the best, but it could be a lot worse. Flying more sectors per day for Ryanair or Easy for a little bit more would not be viewed as worth it by many pilots.
Should this scale be improved? Of course - hopefully soon. And when it is improved, he will be in a good position on the 757 out of Luton - not bad...
To those of you accepting Scale C now, and experiencing the thrill of a big jet job - beware. If you see Mon as a long term job, your future prospects are what you have in your contract now. To those of you considering it as a stepping stone, step quickly because other airlines will be noting what out of contract pilots are happy to accept, ie Mon Scale C, and their terms and conditions will soon reflect that standard. You yourself will be signing the contracts that will start the avalanche across the industry, you will only have yourselves to blame in the future!
Join Date: May 2003
Location: UK
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I think the optimisum by some is misinformed, but wish you well none the less. The wool is being pulled over (y)our eyes though when the charter airlines are saying that in order to remain competetive they must match the lower cost base of the LCC.
Consider this. The majority of flights that the charter carriers are flying to are: Greece, Cyprus, Turkey, Egypt and the Canaries. Besides EZY's Athens flights they are not in any way in competition with them. The LCC model doesn't work for such long sector lengths. So, just know that you're being hoodwinked when you go to an airline that offers you inferior conditions on based on the above premis.
It is a difficult conundrum, but be real - it is naive to think things will improve much. Get into the carriers that still have their old terms and conditions while you can!
Consider this. The majority of flights that the charter carriers are flying to are: Greece, Cyprus, Turkey, Egypt and the Canaries. Besides EZY's Athens flights they are not in any way in competition with them. The LCC model doesn't work for such long sector lengths. So, just know that you're being hoodwinked when you go to an airline that offers you inferior conditions on based on the above premis.
It is a difficult conundrum, but be real - it is naive to think things will improve much. Get into the carriers that still have their old terms and conditions while you can!
Join Date: Nov 2004
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That being said, would you prefer to be paid a few thousand quid more for a crap QOL? This industry sux in general - nobody will ever make money - EVER.... I'm not saying wages shouldn't go up in the future, just that expectations of even "reasonable" wages nowadays with an acceptable QOL are not too realistic.
Get paid more at Easy but fly a lot more to really boring destinations (with the exception of some of the holiday spots that you would routinely fly to on the charter carriers)... The industry has changed for the WORSE when considering fair compensation and that must be recognized by those entering the business now...
Get paid more at Easy but fly a lot more to really boring destinations (with the exception of some of the holiday spots that you would routinely fly to on the charter carriers)... The industry has changed for the WORSE when considering fair compensation and that must be recognized by those entering the business now...
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: SE England
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Anyone care to post the salary A & B terms and conditions, so the new joiners can make an accurate comparison?
For many of us Monarch has offered the base of our choice on a decent aircraft. Yes, EZY may pay a little better but to go from RHS to LHS there at the moment (and this includes Ryanair as well) you are likely not just to change base but country as well. Fine, if you are single but with family commitments your QOL takes a nose dive.
Remember, with EZY: no pay until base cx completed, you pay for your type rating, multi sector days with v. fast turn arounds, pay for your unform etc.....
It probably balances out in the end but I'll take a permanent contract and the security of a salary from day one to pay the mortgage.
Although it is not very evident yet, the number of pilots gaining frozen ATPL's is slowly reducing as many young people realise aviation is not the goldmine it used to be. In the next 5-8 years T&C's will probably have to improve again to stop UK pilots being lured to the Middle and Far East.
I understand how the currrent MON pilots feel and hope that they continue to push for comparable contracts but the fact is if you are flying 4-6 sectors per day earning 25k on a t'prop or RJ and an airline offers a £14k pay rise, more flight pay, similar pension, less sectors and a worthwhile type rating then it becomes a bit of a no-brainer. Once more and more pilots leave MON then things will change.
I hope the current pilots don't resent our decision to join. If you were in our shoes you would do exactly the same. Be thankful we are not low hours CTC cadets from overseas on even less money.
For many of us Monarch has offered the base of our choice on a decent aircraft. Yes, EZY may pay a little better but to go from RHS to LHS there at the moment (and this includes Ryanair as well) you are likely not just to change base but country as well. Fine, if you are single but with family commitments your QOL takes a nose dive.
Remember, with EZY: no pay until base cx completed, you pay for your type rating, multi sector days with v. fast turn arounds, pay for your unform etc.....
It probably balances out in the end but I'll take a permanent contract and the security of a salary from day one to pay the mortgage.
Although it is not very evident yet, the number of pilots gaining frozen ATPL's is slowly reducing as many young people realise aviation is not the goldmine it used to be. In the next 5-8 years T&C's will probably have to improve again to stop UK pilots being lured to the Middle and Far East.
I understand how the currrent MON pilots feel and hope that they continue to push for comparable contracts but the fact is if you are flying 4-6 sectors per day earning 25k on a t'prop or RJ and an airline offers a £14k pay rise, more flight pay, similar pension, less sectors and a worthwhile type rating then it becomes a bit of a no-brainer. Once more and more pilots leave MON then things will change.
I hope the current pilots don't resent our decision to join. If you were in our shoes you would do exactly the same. Be thankful we are not low hours CTC cadets from overseas on even less money.
Join Date: Apr 2002
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If an improved quality of life is your reason for joining, make sure that you don't ask to go to Manchester on the A320.
3 Canaries flights in a row, followed by 2 more days work, 5 earlies, and numerous roster changes are the order of the day.
3 Canaries flights in a row, followed by 2 more days work, 5 earlies, and numerous roster changes are the order of the day.
stilljustanothernumber
Join Date: Apr 2002
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QOL? LOL!
Forty flying hours in a week, 55+ duty hours in a week & 850 hours per year are all realities in the New Monarch. Do you like taxis and dead-heading? 24 hours + on duty can and does happen. Night flights finishing in one UK airport followed by a wait of some hours and then airline back are common practice. Operating UK ti India and then staying on the aircraft to dead-head back is a real treat for some. We do not have a scheduling agreement, as you will gather from the above. Join and I'll give you six months before you start moaning!
Join Date: May 2001
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matzpenetration
anything wrong with CTC cadets from overseas ? Dont think they are happy to fly for less.
Let me remind you that there are quit a lot of ex-CTC cadets within Monarch, some up for command.
Or do you want to say : pay peanuts,get monkeys ?
All the best,
Rogi
anything wrong with CTC cadets from overseas ? Dont think they are happy to fly for less.
Let me remind you that there are quit a lot of ex-CTC cadets within Monarch, some up for command.
Or do you want to say : pay peanuts,get monkeys ?
All the best,
Rogi
Join Date: Dec 2004
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matzpenetration
I think you and the pilot community have got to accept that the whole of the aviation community are on the slippery slope....
The days of glamorous stopovers, high class hotels and jobs for life are coming to an end at the big (flag) carriers and ARE over, if they ever existed, at the remaining.
Face it, with automation and increased reliabiltiy, safety and the 2 man flight deck , flying aint what it used to be and the airlines powers that be know it.
People are always going to want to fly for a living and will take whatevers offered, as they do now. However if they are still happy after 10 years in the job is a different matter.
If you are not happy , you know what the answer is.....
The days of glamorous stopovers, high class hotels and jobs for life are coming to an end at the big (flag) carriers and ARE over, if they ever existed, at the remaining.
Face it, with automation and increased reliabiltiy, safety and the 2 man flight deck , flying aint what it used to be and the airlines powers that be know it.
People are always going to want to fly for a living and will take whatevers offered, as they do now. However if they are still happy after 10 years in the job is a different matter.
If you are not happy , you know what the answer is.....
Join Date: Jul 2002
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Don't expect that the union will be able to change your terms and conditions after you sign on the dotted line.
They won't.
Monarch's main competitors are Brits, Excel, thomson and air 2 bob , they are hiring and offer better t's and c's.
If you join, you will not fly the 767, you will be at the bottom of a very long list.
They won't.
Monarch's main competitors are Brits, Excel, thomson and air 2 bob , they are hiring and offer better t's and c's.
If you join, you will not fly the 767, you will be at the bottom of a very long list.
Join Date: Aug 1999
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Put simply, the more people who join on C Scale, the harder it is for BALPA to help change C Scale and the more pressure is put on the A & B Scale Terms and Conditions. In years to come if you join on C Scale do not be deluded into thinking you will move up to A & B Scale terms and Conditions, at present this just will not happen as there is NO link. A & B Scales will be eroded towards C, not vice err versa.
Join Date: Nov 2004
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Rogi,
I have no issue with CTC cadets. Some are no doubt much better and some much worse than me as an operator. In my opinion schemes such as those at CTC, Ryanair, Bond aviation, EZY etc... do more to de-value this industry than people like myself entering on scale C as I understand that the starting salary is just above 30k for the cadets.
I am pleased that MON has chosen to have a mix of age, experience and background with its recruitment as some airlines place so much emphasis on these organisations that you sometimes wonder if you are a second class citizen by not choosing to pay for the course.
We have former CTC cadets in our airline who are in the LHS.
I have no issue with CTC cadets. Some are no doubt much better and some much worse than me as an operator. In my opinion schemes such as those at CTC, Ryanair, Bond aviation, EZY etc... do more to de-value this industry than people like myself entering on scale C as I understand that the starting salary is just above 30k for the cadets.
I am pleased that MON has chosen to have a mix of age, experience and background with its recruitment as some airlines place so much emphasis on these organisations that you sometimes wonder if you are a second class citizen by not choosing to pay for the course.
We have former CTC cadets in our airline who are in the LHS.