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How does your company describe circling approaches?

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How does your company describe circling approaches?

Old 13th Dec 2013, 16:35
  #101 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Turkish Delight
It'll only be realistic enough once the SIM manufacturers fit a wider arc of visual and a far better weather engine than they do now. FSX has far surpassed anything I've used in real life, providing the add-ons are installed.
As I indicated in an earlier post … the simulator manufacturers have developed and are building visual systems just as you suggest:

Originally Posted by AirRabbit
As everyone knows simulators come in a whole litany of visual capabilities … some have VERY restricted visual systems (from having them only directly in front of each pilot – with no cross-cockpit visual capability) all the way to a continuous 220 degree horizontal (essentially visual capability from wing-tip to wing-tip) by 60 degree vertical field of view (mostly with 25 degrees “up” and 35 degrees “down” – and, of course, there are some variations) all of which is optically correct for both pilots.
Additionally, VERY realistic programming for weather conditions are also available - winds, gusting winds, turbulence, rain on the windscreen, lightning flashes, wet runways, standing water on runways, the whole package is available.
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Old 13th Dec 2013, 18:34
  #102 (permalink)  
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Cosmokramer has provided every detail you require and yet you still refuse to tell us how you would fly it. You said you would. Please, in your own time, when you're feeling comfortable, go ahead...
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Old 13th Dec 2013, 21:31
  #103 (permalink)  
 
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I get the feeling that AirRabbit has never actually flown anything, let alone flown a circling approach.
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Old 14th Dec 2013, 00:08
  #104 (permalink)  
 
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Screwballs …

I wouldn’t have a clue as to what was posted by Mr. Kramer. He and I have pretty much agreed to disagree, and, as I indicated to him (along with one other participant here), I no longer can see his posts.

A better answer to your request is on the way … but will have to wait until I have the “down” time to do so.
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Old 14th Dec 2013, 04:33
  #105 (permalink)  
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In fact I'll edit my post to be more specific; AirRabbit, I don't think you are who you claim to be.

Last edited by Screwballs; 14th Dec 2013 at 12:35. Reason: Rewording.
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Old 14th Dec 2013, 15:50
  #106 (permalink)  
 
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... you wouldn't be the first to think that ... but ... you'd be just as wrong as those who went before you ... keep yer shirt on ...
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Old 14th Dec 2013, 19:42
  #107 (permalink)  
 
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Just a thought: there are some on here who consider a circling to be a visual manoeuvre. Correct, in that you must keep the airfield and/or runway environment in sight at all times. Considering a CAT C a/c with a minimum vis of 2400m, it is not VMC conditions. Below 3000' agl you are clear of cloud in sight of the service, but the vis is too low. I would suggest that if it is not a manoeuvre conducted in VMC conditions, and in an unfamiliar environment at low level, perhaps at night in rain, then a more structured procedure is best adopted rather than a suck it and see let's give it a shot type approach. Mk.1 eyeball may not be sufficient; and it's a bit late to find out as you turn onto finals scratching and searching for that illusive runway.
Just a thought.

Last edited by RAT 5; 15th Dec 2013 at 07:49.
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Old 14th Dec 2013, 21:58
  #108 (permalink)  
 
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I would suggest that if it is not a manoeuvre conducted in VMC conditions, and in an unfamiliar environment at low level, perhaps at night in rain, then a more structured procedure is best adopted rather than a suck it and see let's give it a shot type approach.
Spot on.

And how convenient for you AirRabbit, one moment you are able to see what I post (and reply) and the next moment your are not. So far all you offered is hot air (and plenty of it too).
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Old 14th Dec 2013, 23:04
  #109 (permalink)  
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My shirt is on. Thanks for the concern. How would you fly the circling approach as provided for by Cosmo Kramer?

However, given all these issues, if you desire that I describe how a specific circle-to-land should be flown, I can still do that for you, IF the information that is typically available on an approach plate is available for that description.
Will you, or will you not do as you said you would? Yes or no?
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Old 14th Dec 2013, 23:20
  #110 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by AirRabbit
... you wouldn't be the first to think that ... but ... you'd be just as wrong as those who went before you ...
That's interesting...so, why is it that so many people have historically thought you were a faker?
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Old 15th Dec 2013, 01:23
  #111 (permalink)  
 
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our airline only allows circling in basic vfr/vmc conditions...and in this way the FAA doesn't make a big deal about circling on sim rides .

circling approaches and the old contact approach lead to many crashes. so, we dont do em.
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Old 15th Dec 2013, 18:55
  #112 (permalink)  
 
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Geeze! Who died and made you the Sheriff?

Originally Posted by Screwballs
My shirt is on. Thanks for the concern. How would you fly the circling approach as provided for by Cosmo Kramer?
Originally Posted by Screwballs
Will you, or will you not do as you said you would? Yes or no?
I've told you - a couple of times now - that I have no clue what that guy you keep referencing has or has not posted. I can't see posts from anyone with that name. I don't know what I need to do to convince you of that ... but, be that as it may, I'll ask you to keep your temperature down below the price of gold and I’ll do what I told you I’d do … but the fact is that some of us actually have a paying job to do. Besides, you’re beginning to sound like this issue is THE most important thing in your life … but, then again, maybe it is … and, how was it you decided on the moniker you’ve chosen to use?
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Old 16th Dec 2013, 09:50
  #113 (permalink)  
 
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I just use the TLAR system, in conjunction with the KISS principle, and I'm rather shocked that so many of you have gotten into habits of timing and other such nonsense in a primarily visual maneuver.
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Old 16th Dec 2013, 13:25
  #114 (permalink)  
 
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We have 113 posts on how to do a circling approach. How many of you do not have the 1000/3 limitation on your ticket, and how many of you without the limitation work for a company who allows circling approaches, and how many of you have actually made a circling approach within the last year...in the airplane?
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Old 16th Dec 2013, 13:30
  #115 (permalink)  
 
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How many of you do not have the 1000/3 limitation on your ticket
What's this? You either have an instrument rating or you don't.
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Old 16th Dec 2013, 13:54
  #116 (permalink)  
 
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Capn Bloggs:


What's this? You either have an instrument rating or you don't.

It's a type rating restriction that the FAA started requiring sometime after I took my last rating ride in 1986.


If you don't demonstrate to proficiency CTL during the rating ride then your type rating states (words to this effect) "Circle to land NA on A330" or such.


The carriers that are members of the "1,000 and 3" club don't want to train for something their crews are not going to use.
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Old 16th Dec 2013, 14:00
  #117 (permalink)  
 
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Rojer. Bit like an "automatic only" driver's licence.
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Old 16th Dec 2013, 15:15
  #118 (permalink)  
 
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Actually, in the US, the issuance of an ATP conveys the same authorization as an “instrument rating” – but, of course, there can be restrictions issued as well, like "Circle to land NA on A330" (just as aterpster indicated) or “Circle to land limited to VFR” which would be a limitation that is much broader in its application.

... and Desert185 … an excellent point, sir!!
We have 113 posts on how to do a circling approach. How many of you do not have the 1000/3 limitation on your ticket, and how many of you without the limitation work for a company who allows circling approaches, and how many of you have actually made a circling approach within the last year...in the airplane?
It is apparent that there is a growing concern about what kind of approaches should be able to be flown pretty much whenever, where ever someone wants. With the establishment of “airports” at locations to “better serve” the local residents of a particular area, and wanting to keep the cost to those residents to a minimum, a location is found that is cheap and more easily developed into something on which a landing strip can be constructed. Then someone has to come in and design an approach procedure that can accommodate airplanes … and it doesn’t take long before someone tries to bring in bigger airplanes, which brings more business into that location … and so on and so on. The destiny of such actions is that sometime in the future there is likely to be an attempt to get B747s or A380s into what was originally constructed as a fishing camp in some mountainous valley in central Alaska.

Last edited by AirRabbit; 16th Dec 2013 at 15:30.
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Old 16th Dec 2013, 19:35
  #119 (permalink)  
 
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Rabbit, you've driven way wayward. Nobody is talking about shoving A380s into Dutch Harbor. Stay on topic, will ya?
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Old 16th Dec 2013, 20:29
  #120 (permalink)  
 
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How does your company describe circling approaches?

Actually, sensible post from AirRabbit. I do see the trend in my outfit (no widebodies though).

Edit: or did I miss the sarcasm?
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