How does your company describe circling approaches?
Joined: Apr 2005
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From: Southeast USA
Originally Posted by Turkish Delight
It'll only be realistic enough once the SIM manufacturers fit a wider arc of visual and a far better weather engine than they do now. FSX has far surpassed anything I've used in real life, providing the add-ons are installed.
Originally Posted by AirRabbit
As everyone knows simulators come in a whole litany of visual capabilities … some have VERY restricted visual systems (from having them only directly in front of each pilot – with no cross-cockpit visual capability) all the way to a continuous 220 degree horizontal (essentially visual capability from wing-tip to wing-tip) by 60 degree vertical field of view (mostly with 25 degrees “up” and 35 degrees “down” – and, of course, there are some variations) all of which is optically correct for both pilots.
Thread Starter
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From: -
Cosmokramer has provided every detail you require and yet you still refuse to tell us how you would fly it. You said you would. Please, in your own time, when you're feeling comfortable, go ahead...
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From: Southeast USA
Screwballs …
I wouldn’t have a clue as to what was posted by Mr. Kramer. He and I have pretty much agreed to disagree, and, as I indicated to him (along with one other participant here), I no longer can see his posts.
A better answer to your request is on the way … but will have to wait until I have the “down” time to do so.
I wouldn’t have a clue as to what was posted by Mr. Kramer. He and I have pretty much agreed to disagree, and, as I indicated to him (along with one other participant here), I no longer can see his posts.
A better answer to your request is on the way … but will have to wait until I have the “down” time to do so.
... you wouldn't be the first to think that ... but ... you'd be just as wrong as those who went before you ... keep yer shirt on ...
Joined: Jun 2000
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From: last time I looked I was still here.
Just a thought: there are some on here who consider a circling to be a visual manoeuvre. Correct, in that you must keep the airfield and/or runway environment in sight at all times. Considering a CAT C a/c with a minimum vis of 2400m, it is not VMC conditions. Below 3000' agl you are clear of cloud in sight of the service, but the vis is too low. I would suggest that if it is not a manoeuvre conducted in VMC conditions, and in an unfamiliar environment at low level, perhaps at night in rain, then a more structured procedure is best adopted rather than a suck it and see let's give it a shot type approach. Mk.1 eyeball may not be sufficient; and it's a bit late to find out as you turn onto finals scratching and searching for that illusive runway.
Just a thought.
Just a thought.
Last edited by RAT 5; 15th December 2013 at 07:49.
Joined: Jul 2001
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From: East of West and North of South
I would suggest that if it is not a manoeuvre conducted in VMC conditions, and in an unfamiliar environment at low level, perhaps at night in rain, then a more structured procedure is best adopted rather than a suck it and see let's give it a shot type approach.
And how convenient for you AirRabbit, one moment you are able to see what I post (and reply) and the next moment your are not. So far all you offered is hot air (and plenty of it too).
Thread Starter
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From: -
My shirt is on. Thanks for the concern. How would you fly the circling approach as provided for by Cosmo Kramer?
Will you, or will you not do as you said you would? Yes or no?
However, given all these issues, if you desire that I describe how a specific circle-to-land should be flown, I can still do that for you, IF the information that is typically available on an approach plate is available for that description.
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From: Ormond Beach
Originally Posted by AirRabbit
... you wouldn't be the first to think that ... but ... you'd be just as wrong as those who went before you ...
Joined: Aug 2013
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From: chicago
our airline only allows circling in basic vfr/vmc conditions...and in this way the FAA doesn't make a big deal about circling on sim rides .
circling approaches and the old contact approach lead to many crashes. so, we dont do em.
circling approaches and the old contact approach lead to many crashes. so, we dont do em.
Joined: Apr 2005
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From: Southeast USA
Geeze! Who died and made you the Sheriff?
Originally Posted by Screwballs
My shirt is on. Thanks for the concern. How would you fly the circling approach as provided for by Cosmo Kramer?
Originally Posted by Screwballs
Will you, or will you not do as you said you would? Yes or no?
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 461
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From: A tropical island.
I just use the TLAR system, in conjunction with the KISS principle, and I'm rather shocked that so many of you have gotten into habits of timing and other such nonsense in a primarily visual maneuver.
Joined: Mar 2008
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From: Western USA
We have 113 posts on how to do a circling approach. How many of you do not have the 1000/3 limitation on your ticket, and how many of you without the limitation work for a company who allows circling approaches, and how many of you have actually made a circling approach within the last year...in the airplane?
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From: On the Beach
Capn Bloggs:
It's a type rating restriction that the FAA started requiring sometime after I took my last rating ride in 1986.
If you don't demonstrate to proficiency CTL during the rating ride then your type rating states (words to this effect) "Circle to land NA on A330" or such.
The carriers that are members of the "1,000 and 3" club don't want to train for something their crews are not going to use.
What's this? You either have an instrument rating or you don't.
It's a type rating restriction that the FAA started requiring sometime after I took my last rating ride in 1986.
If you don't demonstrate to proficiency CTL during the rating ride then your type rating states (words to this effect) "Circle to land NA on A330" or such.
The carriers that are members of the "1,000 and 3" club don't want to train for something their crews are not going to use.
Joined: Apr 2005
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From: Southeast USA
Actually, in the US, the issuance of an ATP conveys the same authorization as an “instrument rating” – but, of course, there can be restrictions issued as well, like "Circle to land NA on A330" (just as aterpster indicated) or “Circle to land limited to VFR” which would be a limitation that is much broader in its application.
... and Desert185 … an excellent point, sir!!
It is apparent that there is a growing concern about what kind of approaches should be able to be flown pretty much whenever, where ever someone wants. With the establishment of “airports” at locations to “better serve” the local residents of a particular area, and wanting to keep the cost to those residents to a minimum, a location is found that is cheap and more easily developed into something on which a landing strip can be constructed. Then someone has to come in and design an approach procedure that can accommodate airplanes … and it doesn’t take long before someone tries to bring in bigger airplanes, which brings more business into that location … and so on and so on. The destiny of such actions is that sometime in the future there is likely to be an attempt to get B747s or A380s into what was originally constructed as a fishing camp in some mountainous valley in central Alaska. 
... and Desert185 … an excellent point, sir!!
We have 113 posts on how to do a circling approach. How many of you do not have the 1000/3 limitation on your ticket, and how many of you without the limitation work for a company who allows circling approaches, and how many of you have actually made a circling approach within the last year...in the airplane?
Last edited by AirRabbit; 16th December 2013 at 15:30.