How do you get to fly Warbirds?
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How do you get to fly Warbirds?
Maybe this should be in Wannabes but….
Eight years ago at the Farnborough Air show, I decided I couldn’t wait any longer to get airborne so, the following week I at last booked that trial lesson I’d been putting off for years, and thus began the slow road of self improvement. I channelled it all into becoming an Airline Pilot as soon as possible (i.e. every penny went on hours building or courses and not doing ‘fun’ things with aeroplanes – just flying was fun enough at that time). Anyway, things went very well and now I drive a regional jet from the LHS.
Yesterday, at Duxford Airshow the sight of 21 Spitfires and 3 Hurricanes in a ‘Big Wing’ (I never thought I’d ever see such a sight) reminded me of the wannabe feeling that first inspired me as a child when visiting airshows with my dad. And I realise that I need a new challenge….
So how do you become one of these lucky guys who get to fly WW2 warbirds and vintage jets. Is it just loads of money, or do you have to be ex-military and know the right people to get invited.
Probably I need to get a share in a Slingsby/Pitts or similar and start having some fun first…
What’s the deal folks?
Eight years ago at the Farnborough Air show, I decided I couldn’t wait any longer to get airborne so, the following week I at last booked that trial lesson I’d been putting off for years, and thus began the slow road of self improvement. I channelled it all into becoming an Airline Pilot as soon as possible (i.e. every penny went on hours building or courses and not doing ‘fun’ things with aeroplanes – just flying was fun enough at that time). Anyway, things went very well and now I drive a regional jet from the LHS.
Yesterday, at Duxford Airshow the sight of 21 Spitfires and 3 Hurricanes in a ‘Big Wing’ (I never thought I’d ever see such a sight) reminded me of the wannabe feeling that first inspired me as a child when visiting airshows with my dad. And I realise that I need a new challenge….
So how do you become one of these lucky guys who get to fly WW2 warbirds and vintage jets. Is it just loads of money, or do you have to be ex-military and know the right people to get invited.
Probably I need to get a share in a Slingsby/Pitts or similar and start having some fun first…
What’s the deal folks?
Guest
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Check out the back of Flyer etc; there is a group flying an ex-RAF Jet Provost that may do pleasure rides.
If you want to fly weird & wonderful ones - head East or West or South
The Russians have the MiG29 flights at Zhukovsky. The Yanks have loads of options including T-38s in Florida. There is also a guy called Mike Beachyhead who has Lightnings, Hunters, Buccaneers etc in South Africa.
In all cases, more important that flying skill (for pleasure rides) is MONEY!! A one hour ride in a Starfighter at Williams Arizona costs $1800!!
Have fun!!
(PS It is worth the effort - I managed to blag a ride in a Hawk at my old job - biggest smile I ever had - adrenalin took 4 days to subside!!)
If you want to fly weird & wonderful ones - head East or West or South
The Russians have the MiG29 flights at Zhukovsky. The Yanks have loads of options including T-38s in Florida. There is also a guy called Mike Beachyhead who has Lightnings, Hunters, Buccaneers etc in South Africa.
In all cases, more important that flying skill (for pleasure rides) is MONEY!! A one hour ride in a Starfighter at Williams Arizona costs $1800!!
Have fun!!
(PS It is worth the effort - I managed to blag a ride in a Hawk at my old job - biggest smile I ever had - adrenalin took 4 days to subside!!)
Guest
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If you're asking how you actually get to fly the warbirds yourself (ie Take part in the Duxford days etc)it's very much a closed shop of being 'in the know' I think.
After all,these machines are worth millions so they don't let you fly just 'cos you can fly - you've got to be good.
Ex-mil fast jets would be a good start or write to Stephen Grey who owns TFC (The Fighter Collection) at Duxford. The Old Flying Machine Co is also there. Buy all the mags and read about these people.
Interesting point is that when you go to one of these old timer airshows, the age of the pilots is quite advanced so OUR DAY WILL COME.
Here's hoping. I'd love to do it too.
If you do get the chance - don't stuff up as someone did recently. Had a 'near incident' in a Hellcat and is out of the 'scene' for ever. Quite rightly I suppose.....
After all,these machines are worth millions so they don't let you fly just 'cos you can fly - you've got to be good.
Ex-mil fast jets would be a good start or write to Stephen Grey who owns TFC (The Fighter Collection) at Duxford. The Old Flying Machine Co is also there. Buy all the mags and read about these people.
Interesting point is that when you go to one of these old timer airshows, the age of the pilots is quite advanced so OUR DAY WILL COME.
Here's hoping. I'd love to do it too.
If you do get the chance - don't stuff up as someone did recently. Had a 'near incident' in a Hellcat and is out of the 'scene' for ever. Quite rightly I suppose.....
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Beavereager,
I've only had the opportunity to fly in a T-6, However, heres my advice, Get involved as much as you can by volunteering at a museum, or flying club etc that flys warbirds. These groups will aleays accept a volunteer. The ex-mil background helps alot as it gives one instant credibility, especially from the non-mil warbird owners. But either way, your flying an RJ, and that tells alot about your flying skills. If you can befriend a warbird owner or organization,I guarentee you as a minimum you can hop in the back seat for a ride. Its worth it!!! I"m a C-141 pilot in the reserves, 3 years ago I volunteered to do a flyby at a warbird airshow, Now the organizers call me up asking if I can haul some of the equipment they dont have to the show. So by working with them I've been kidding around about getting a B-17 ride, their answer was if you can help us out we;d be happy!!! Looking forward to it. Good Luck
I've only had the opportunity to fly in a T-6, However, heres my advice, Get involved as much as you can by volunteering at a museum, or flying club etc that flys warbirds. These groups will aleays accept a volunteer. The ex-mil background helps alot as it gives one instant credibility, especially from the non-mil warbird owners. But either way, your flying an RJ, and that tells alot about your flying skills. If you can befriend a warbird owner or organization,I guarentee you as a minimum you can hop in the back seat for a ride. Its worth it!!! I"m a C-141 pilot in the reserves, 3 years ago I volunteered to do a flyby at a warbird airshow, Now the organizers call me up asking if I can haul some of the equipment they dont have to the show. So by working with them I've been kidding around about getting a B-17 ride, their answer was if you can help us out we;d be happy!!! Looking forward to it. Good Luck
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Spencer Flack (he of the bright red fighters) bought his Spitfire G-SPIT because he wanted to fly one but found it was a case of "If you havn't flown a Spitfire before, then you're not going to fly mine". It seems to be something of a closed shop.
The way must be to get taildragger experience and work your way up. Depending on where you are, a would be a good starting point - not that many about for hire, but there is one at Wickenby in Lincs.
Best of luck!
The way must be to get taildragger experience and work your way up. Depending on where you are, a would be a good starting point - not that many about for hire, but there is one at Wickenby in Lincs.
Best of luck!
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b e
Call Southern Flight Centre, at Shoreham Airport. (don't know tel no. but should be in book - if not let me know and i'll get it for you)
They operate a warbird and you can book yourself a ride - then maybe do a conversion i don't know but it's a start...
Call Southern Flight Centre, at Shoreham Airport. (don't know tel no. but should be in book - if not let me know and i'll get it for you)
They operate a warbird and you can book yourself a ride - then maybe do a conversion i don't know but it's a start...
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Thanks all,
Unfortunately, as a BALPA rep, giving loads of time to a Museum/Society (although it sounds interesting) would be difficult at the moment. Maybe I need to re-assess where my priorities in life lie.
Perhaps when I've negotiated a huge pay rise I'll be able to afford to do some of this stuff. Still, even my boss (She who must be obeyed) will probably let me spend the cost of a trip in a Harvard at Shoreham, so that seems like a good starting point.
In the meantime I'll keep buying those lottery tickets.
BTW - She didn't mind me spending £35k on the flying training, but now its pay-back time!
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Keep it up!
Unfortunately, as a BALPA rep, giving loads of time to a Museum/Society (although it sounds interesting) would be difficult at the moment. Maybe I need to re-assess where my priorities in life lie.
Perhaps when I've negotiated a huge pay rise I'll be able to afford to do some of this stuff. Still, even my boss (She who must be obeyed) will probably let me spend the cost of a trip in a Harvard at Shoreham, so that seems like a good starting point.
In the meantime I'll keep buying those lottery tickets.
BTW - She didn't mind me spending £35k on the flying training, but now its pay-back time!
------------------
Keep it up!
Guest
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beaver eager, start off with some taildragger time in something cheap like a Cub. Once you're familiar with that try a Stearman (there's one at Swanton Morley for rent, it's a relatively cheap way to get big taildragger time)then try to get some Harvard time in. That way you are pretty much following the path that the wartime pilots did to get into a Spit or similar. Don't know how successful you'll be getting to drive a Spit but it seems like the only way you'll do it short of winning the lottery.
Good luck and keep us posted on any leads you get.
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When the wheels stop turning you're high enuff. CubTrek. To slowly go...
Good luck and keep us posted on any leads you get.
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When the wheels stop turning you're high enuff. CubTrek. To slowly go...
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Apart from those who buy their own, warbird pilots are either ex fighter pilots, or pilots with extensive aerobatics/display experience.
Knowing somebody involved in the warbird scene who can introduce and vouch for you obviously helps but, even then, only if you have military/aerobatics experience.
There's no shortage of pilots offering to fly warbirds but owners are understandably cautious given the safety considerations, the value of the aircraft and insurance considerations.
Realistically, working as a volunteer is unlikely to lead to flying anything more powerful than a Harvard - unless you fall into one of the categories listed. That said, volunteers who prove themselves genuinely committed over a period of time do get rides on positioning flights, with a few aeros en route!
For most of us, the Harvard was our introduction to warbirds but, even if you go no further, it's a great aircraft.
If you are serious about learning the fly a Harvard, learn to fly a tail-dragger properly first- a Chipmunk is ideal. I also got a few hours Stearman time which certainly helped with the feel of a big radial engine, but is not essential.
I'm sorry if this is discouraging, but owners' caution is sensible. My close friend, Mark Hanna, was killed in an Me109 a year ago. He genuinely was a natural, one of the best and most experienced warbird pilots in the world. Little did I think when we were building experience in a Pilatus P2, and then a Harvard, years ago that it would ultimately lead to such a tragic loss.
On a lighter note, if you get the chance to fly a Harvard for an hour - go for it. It will give you an exciting insight into warbird flying.
Knowing somebody involved in the warbird scene who can introduce and vouch for you obviously helps but, even then, only if you have military/aerobatics experience.
There's no shortage of pilots offering to fly warbirds but owners are understandably cautious given the safety considerations, the value of the aircraft and insurance considerations.
Realistically, working as a volunteer is unlikely to lead to flying anything more powerful than a Harvard - unless you fall into one of the categories listed. That said, volunteers who prove themselves genuinely committed over a period of time do get rides on positioning flights, with a few aeros en route!
For most of us, the Harvard was our introduction to warbirds but, even if you go no further, it's a great aircraft.
If you are serious about learning the fly a Harvard, learn to fly a tail-dragger properly first- a Chipmunk is ideal. I also got a few hours Stearman time which certainly helped with the feel of a big radial engine, but is not essential.
I'm sorry if this is discouraging, but owners' caution is sensible. My close friend, Mark Hanna, was killed in an Me109 a year ago. He genuinely was a natural, one of the best and most experienced warbird pilots in the world. Little did I think when we were building experience in a Pilatus P2, and then a Harvard, years ago that it would ultimately lead to such a tragic loss.
On a lighter note, if you get the chance to fly a Harvard for an hour - go for it. It will give you an exciting insight into warbird flying.
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A little while ago I noticed my co-pilot glancing at one of those "Pilots Notes" publications. I asked what type it was for and he replied "Spifire MkIX". I said I thought some of those old books were really interesting but he stunned me by saying it wasn't out of idle interest he was reading it. He had his first solo that coming weekend and he wanted to learn the numbers!!
There again he was ex Red Arrows.....
There again he was ex Red Arrows.....
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Beaver Eager. Good luck. It is not just the tail dragging thing, though.
When you are sitting behind a Merlin or Griffon, you are sitting behind a nose that stretches up into eternity and occupies a large part of your horizon; and you are not sitting behind Gypsy Major at 143 H.P.
A Merlin or Griffon delivers +/- 2,000 H.P. coupled to a three-bladed or more propeller. Those engines give instant response and those blades can hit the air like a brick wall. I believe jets spool up faster today than they used to, but even so, I suspect nothing like as fast as a big piston. Deliver that power in fine pitch at low speed, as has been done (though rarely twice at low altitude on approach by the same pilot)and you may find yourself in an airframe that is rotating round the propeller. This probably is not what you had in mind.
The torque is fierce. The first time I flew a Firefly T.2 the instructor (Knocker White, are you out there?)took it to the extreme right hand edge of the runway, nose pointing down the line, stopped, and said: "Watch this!".
He rammed the throttle open in fine pitch and then as rapidly closed it. In that split second we surged 90 degrees left and were at the grass at the left hand side, facing off the runway.
I think you will not do a torque stall in a Chipmunk or a Tiger Moth, but a big piston is something else again. If I had a Spitfire, I would not lend it out much. Nothing personal, you understand. I just would not want to risk my toy and someone else's broken neck. Especially my toy.
I have to tell you though, Beaver, if you have the money to do it, you are on the right track. There is nothing -- short of the other, of course -- like a curved approach (to see round the nose)in a heavy in-line single, in rain, straighten out at the last second, chop the throttle, Ah! the crackle from the stub exhausts, stick back, and touch down on three points. Outasight! Mind you, some do wheelers, but those are not for you nor me.
If you do get the money together and want someone to show you how, give me a call. It is only 43 years since I flew one, and I remember very well. Same thing with a bicycle.
[This message has been edited by Davaar (edited 13 September 2000).]
When you are sitting behind a Merlin or Griffon, you are sitting behind a nose that stretches up into eternity and occupies a large part of your horizon; and you are not sitting behind Gypsy Major at 143 H.P.
A Merlin or Griffon delivers +/- 2,000 H.P. coupled to a three-bladed or more propeller. Those engines give instant response and those blades can hit the air like a brick wall. I believe jets spool up faster today than they used to, but even so, I suspect nothing like as fast as a big piston. Deliver that power in fine pitch at low speed, as has been done (though rarely twice at low altitude on approach by the same pilot)and you may find yourself in an airframe that is rotating round the propeller. This probably is not what you had in mind.
The torque is fierce. The first time I flew a Firefly T.2 the instructor (Knocker White, are you out there?)took it to the extreme right hand edge of the runway, nose pointing down the line, stopped, and said: "Watch this!".
He rammed the throttle open in fine pitch and then as rapidly closed it. In that split second we surged 90 degrees left and were at the grass at the left hand side, facing off the runway.
I think you will not do a torque stall in a Chipmunk or a Tiger Moth, but a big piston is something else again. If I had a Spitfire, I would not lend it out much. Nothing personal, you understand. I just would not want to risk my toy and someone else's broken neck. Especially my toy.
I have to tell you though, Beaver, if you have the money to do it, you are on the right track. There is nothing -- short of the other, of course -- like a curved approach (to see round the nose)in a heavy in-line single, in rain, straighten out at the last second, chop the throttle, Ah! the crackle from the stub exhausts, stick back, and touch down on three points. Outasight! Mind you, some do wheelers, but those are not for you nor me.
If you do get the money together and want someone to show you how, give me a call. It is only 43 years since I flew one, and I remember very well. Same thing with a bicycle.
[This message has been edited by Davaar (edited 13 September 2000).]
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Good advise from Davaar, the voice of experience! I recall reading somewhere that the BP Balliol (short lived 50s advanced trainer) which had a Merlin in the pointy end had a notorious torque stall effect that did for quite a few.
Someone mentioned Cubs - if you are in the South of England try Cubair at Redhill who fly, strangely enough, Cubs and will rent out at very reasonable rates to PPL after a swift check ride. And at least one is a *real* warbird - ex USAAF!
Someone mentioned Cubs - if you are in the South of England try Cubair at Redhill who fly, strangely enough, Cubs and will rent out at very reasonable rates to PPL after a swift check ride. And at least one is a *real* warbird - ex USAAF!
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The nearest thing to a warbird at light plane prices has to be the Yak52. Big radial, handling far sharper than a Chippy, out flies a Harvard any day at a fraction the cost. It's not a taildragger and consequently is easier to handle on the ground than a Chippy - but in the air it's the biz!
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I'd like to agree with Shaggy Sheep Driver about the Yak 52. I flew the Raspberry Ripple Yak 52 from Little Gransden yesterday afternoon - and I've still got a big grin on my face. £150 an hour wet, good availability and near to uncontrolled airspace so you can quickly pile on a few thousand feet to practice your aeros. If you're interested phone Skyline on 01767 651950 - they're very friendly and it really is a warbird you can afford to fly!
Guest
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Gotta agree about Yaks - they are the biz.
If you get a chance to fly a Yak50 you'll love it - I did and it's probably as close to a true warbird as I'll ever get.
Incidently Beaver - where are you based?
I know of a nice Pitts S1 share in Gloucestershire.
If you get a chance to fly a Yak50 you'll love it - I did and it's probably as close to a true warbird as I'll ever get.
Incidently Beaver - where are you based?
I know of a nice Pitts S1 share in Gloucestershire.