787 DreamLiner
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 144
Likes: 0
From: Planet Earth
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 144
Likes: 0
From: Planet Earth
First flight is going to be pushed back again.
http://fleetbuzz.wordpress.com/2008/...e-pushed-back/
http://fleetbuzz.wordpress.com/2008/...e-pushed-back/
Joined: May 1999
Aviation Qualifications: ATP+Mil
Posts: 27,399
Likes: 857
From: Quite near 'An aerodrome somewhere in England'
Actually I was told by industry insiders when the A380 delays were announced that Airbus were rather more honest about their delays than 'our competitor' as they termed the other compnay.
All the carping about the A380 delays made by some was seen as a pretty risky strategy given that every image of the 7E7 differed substantially from the preious one. No-one knew what it looked like, let alone when it would fly.....
Still, with the true state of the US economy now being revealed and the US dollar falling against the uro, the 7late7 will be available at bargain basement prices.
All the carping about the A380 delays made by some was seen as a pretty risky strategy given that every image of the 7E7 differed substantially from the preious one. No-one knew what it looked like, let alone when it would fly.....
Still, with the true state of the US economy now being revealed and the US dollar falling against the uro, the 7late7 will be available at bargain basement prices.
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 413
Likes: 0
From: down-route
Surely the other way round BEagle.
With about 820 firm B787s orders, Boeing don't need to sell them at "bargain basement prices". The A380 on the other hand is being sold at silly prices - BA's deal on the A380 was almost a case of 'buy one and get one free'.
With about 820 firm B787s orders, Boeing don't need to sell them at "bargain basement prices". The A380 on the other hand is being sold at silly prices - BA's deal on the A380 was almost a case of 'buy one and get one free'.
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 189
Likes: 0
From: Bob Tandy's place boozing with Darryl Hill
I'll not join the band wagon of Boeing vs Airbus willy stretching. But I will say that the recent US credit crunch and the subsequent warnings of recession - the 787 is cheap at the price and becoming cheaper with each closing bell in Wall street.
Does that make Boeing the more attractive aircraft for investment? I would guess not as the forcast is for a very weak US economy for the foreseeable future thanks to this administrations "foreign Policy" (or lack thereof.)
AFL
Does that make Boeing the more attractive aircraft for investment? I would guess not as the forcast is for a very weak US economy for the foreseeable future thanks to this administrations "foreign Policy" (or lack thereof.)
AFL
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 98
Likes: 0
From: Scandinavia
Two things worry me: firstly given the amount of outsourcing and the increasingly worse for wear dollar and that Boeing are throwing more and more people into the project. A rapidly increasing workforce costs money to train, get certified, operate etc and once things have settled down it costs money to "move" these people from the project.
Anyway, how come anytime someone even dares critisise Beoing they are automatically an Airbus disciple and thus "wrong"....
E145 driver
Anyway, how come anytime someone even dares critisise Beoing they are automatically an Airbus disciple and thus "wrong"....
E145 driver
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 492
Likes: 0
From: the edge of madness
Interesting insight into A380 pricing:
Commercial Aviation Online.
Dunno if that's good or bad but I believe list is around $300m.
Airbus Financial Services has sold three A380s on lease to Singapore Airlines to Doric Asset Finance at a base purchase price of $198.6 million each.
Dunno if that's good or bad but I believe list is around $300m.
Joined: Feb 2007
Aviation Qualifications: PPL
Posts: 636
Likes: 792
From: England
Dunno if that's good or bad but I believe list is around $300m.
The purchase price gets you a plane that's yours to do what you like with.
Buying a leased plane gets you income from the operator plus a worn-out plane at the end of the contract.
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 782
Likes: 21
From: netherlands
BA's deal on the A380 was almost a case of 'buy one and get one free'.
2. Do you have any source to back this up?
I hope it is not just another cheap shot at Airbus.
On the delay : I wonder what happened during the last few weeks that caused an additional delay. Reading Carsons comments I sense a little "blame game". He says there are problems on the floor but points at outside factors multiple times.
On the other hand following the press / analists, it seems they are not listening to Boeing anymore but reading Flightblogger, James Wallace, WSJ and maybe forums like these to get a clue on what is really happening..
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 144
Likes: 0
From: Planet Earth
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 1,199
Likes: 3
From: Hunched over a keyboard
Letīs be realistic here - given that most conventional aeroplanes are late entering service, it s atnds to reason that any aeroplane that uses any kind of new technology is going to be even more late into service!!
The only question is "how late?"
Off the top of my head, the A380 is about a year late - the 787 must be about the same by now, if not worse.
The only question is "how late?"
Off the top of my head, the A380 is about a year late - the 787 must be about the same by now, if not worse.
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 266
Likes: 56
From: UK
Off the top of my head, the A380 is about a year late - the 787 must be about the same by now, if not worse.
As for the A380, first flight was only a few months behind schedule in April 2004 with delivery supposed to happen in early 2006, the delays were then drip fed upto ultimately the first delivery (and the only one for the year) being in October 2007 so it's nearer 18 months in that case.
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
From: Edgewood, Wa
I feel that the dream liner was rolled out at least one year early. The execs wanted that date 07-08-07 for roll out and it cost them. The global market is having quite a few glitches, much easier if they were built in house.
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 144
Likes: 0
From: Planet Earth
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 857
Likes: 26
From: Dublin
CNBC: Boeing Faces Customer Ire Over Dreamliner Delays
International Lease Finance Corp (ILFC), the world's top plane leasing firm, said it will seek large compensation from Boeing for the delays, which will push its Dreamliner deliveries back by between 9-12 months to late 2010 or early 2011.
JAS