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Originally Posted by haejangkuk
(Post 10106513)
Not specific to China Southern. It happened at Korean Air too. Local crew. Captain in the toilet. F/o heard clearance to climb to 9800m but was actually only cleared 8900m. F/O read back 9800m but ATC controller did not catch that mistake. Climb was initiated to 9800m set on the MCP. Passing 9300m, alert controller caught the level bust and ordered flight back to the correct flight level 8900m which the F/O hurriedly complied with. The crew apologized to the controller. As there was no conflict with any other traffic in the vicinity, the Chinese ATC controller decided to let the mistake slide and declared " no problem, no report to CAAC "
The Captain taught that it was the end of the matter and did nothing. The F/O decided to be super honest and went to verbally report to the chief pilot as some kind of precaution to other pilots of Chinese ATC not hearing or monitoring readbacks. Some kind of sharing unfortunate incident with lessons to be learnt. The ambitious chief pilot took it upon himself to investigate, even communicating with the Chinese ATC to verify that the incident took place. The Chinese ATC confirm the incident but as no conflict with any other traffic took place they would not take it any further. However the chief pilot blew it up, initiated a safety violation enquiry insisting the Safety Department take punitive measures. End result, both pilots were grounded for 2 months with requirement to attend numerous technical and disciplinary inquiries, with the punitive measures of having to undergo several long winded safety classes. So such sh:ugh:it happens in Korea, China and I believe in Jan and Taiwan too! |
I certainly think everyone working at CSA should have a plan B ready to activate. Ride the barrel for as long as you can but pull out before the wave closes out.
That’s what I’m doing��*♂️. |
Originally Posted by Manuel Reversion
(Post 10111678)
I certainly think everyone working at CSA should have a plan B ready to activate. Ride the barrel for as long as you can but pull out before the wave closes out.
That’s what I’m doing��*♂️. Absolutely right!!! Whats scary is how against the contract they have gone with this one. Contract CLEARLY states your punishment for every ‘class of error.’ The worst being loss of full safety bonus...........but thats it!!!! Absolutely nowhere is it written that if you make a small mistake you will be grounded with ZERO pay for 6 months, made to stay in the office in CAN for those 6 months and get home to your family 1 week a month if you are lucky. This poor fella will lose about 130K$ in pay for this and NOWHERE is that written in the contract so of course you never ‘factor this in’ to what might happen in your life. As such what about mortgages, schools, debts etc etc. It’s just totally not on. Medical failures are clearly written in the contract how much you will be paid if you fail and they seem to stick to that one most of the time. If this is how they are going to punish then it needs to be clearly written in the contract so guys know what they are letting themselves in for and can make decisions accordingly. You need to know that you could easily lose 130K$ for a small mistake as this information will be an important part of your decision making whether to take the job or not. If they punished according to the contract then thats one thing but this is just not on........ Cheers. |
Hi, thinking about joining either Bejing Capital Airlines or China Southern Airlines. Is it that bad at CSA? |
Yes. Only go there if you can afford to be out on your arse 6 months later for a myriad of reasons. I just completed a tour of duty at CSA and the human carnage I saw there was horrendous. I strongly suspect all Chinese carriers are similar. I would advise to only go there if you don’t need the cash. But if you don’t need the cash...why would you go there? You simply must have a plan B if you’re considering it. |
Hi, Any updates on MOMO ? Is it operational ? Thanks in advance |
Originally Posted by Pilot_GDN
(Post 10158192)
Hi, Any updates on MOMO ? Is it operational ? Thanks in advance Apparently it is also being removed from the official contract as a roster option’. Now might not be true but he was pretty sure about it. Cheers, |
Any Happy Pilots at CSA
I know the money is good and I know there is fine system and I know there is some reverse rostering. Is anyone there actually happy?
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Originally Posted by mach85
(Post 10160402)
I was recently told by an agent that the MOMO roster is no longer being offered to anyone. Apparently it is also being removed from the official contract as a roster option’. Now might not be true but he was pretty sure about it. Cheers, |
Originally Posted by jrwhitehat
(Post 10161167)
I know the money is good and I know there is fine system and I know there is some reverse rostering. Is anyone there actually happy?
What you like and what you want. |
Apparently CSA was expecting around 150 foreign Captains to join in 2018, but since January looks like only 10 joined the ranks...that's the rumor I heard.
RSP bases are full so CAN base might not be very attractive for some. |
The CAN basing is but a small deterrent.
The manner in which they treat the foreign pilots is the biggest deterrent to CSA ever expanding the foreign pilot group. Whilst not an employee of theirs personally, I can safely say their poor reputation for management of the foreigners is known worldwide. Extra salary is not the answer. Until they take an objective look at their strategy, expansion of the foreign pilot group will elude them. |
Is it true that we now have a case of a foreign pilot being paid zero after getting Medical back?! |
I don't think so
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Originally Posted by blueonblue
(Post 10183298)
Is it true that we now have a case of a foreign pilot being paid zero after getting Medical back?! Anybody considering leaving an even remotely secure and/or likeable job to come here to CSN needs to be beaten senseless with their own logbook. If you are unemployed, by all means you have nothing to lose. This place has descended into absolute lunacy and foreign pilot recruitment has halted as a result, a negative balance attrition rate is just about upon us. |
In case there was any doubt, CSA DO NOT WANT YOU, except as cannon fodder. The crap that is going on there is out of control. Safety meetings completely in Chinese that do nothing for safety. A constant flow of new rules that nobody follows. Institutionalised incompetence. Lies and cover ups. Ridiculous and expensive punishments that only ever seem to be inflicted on expat pilots for the smallest errors that would not even raise an eyebrow anywhere else in the world. A culture of double standards that will take your breath away. The only people not looking elsewhere for a job are the misfits that would never get a job anywhere else, such as the universally hated self promoting BM who would throw his own mother under a bus if he thought it would win favour with someone in management. Wherever you are, stay there.
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And all that never ending paperwork... The process is way too long, too complicated and too testing with all the stamps in different colours, visas, Black get pens only etc... It could be an awesome airline but I do believe that their attitude towards foreign pilots is wrong, well from training management at least. I think HR knows they need pilots, but the workers on deck doesn’t want foreigners to take the locals jobs. Still some foreign pilots being fired every month, for different reasons. Maybe it will change? |
Anyone considering working for any Chinese airline should read Flying upside down, a book written by a yank contract pilot with Tianjin, entertaining and 100% accurate, the Chinese will challenge your will to live
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China Southern RSP Basing
Hi All,
I have seen both positive and negative comments regarding China Southern and their RSP basing but most are quite dated. I am interested in the Auckland basing (non-type rated) and would would really appreciate feedback from anyone currently on an RSP basing with China Southern. Thanks in advance... |
Auckland basing has just been closed again for, let me see....the 3rd time. If you think you are coming here for an AKL RSP forget it. The clowns are running the circus. The company seems to think there are a million foreigners who want to work here so if we all left tomorrow it wouldn't be a problem. The reality is that they are experiencing negative net growth in the foreign ranks. If you come here you run the risk of ultimately being here alone.
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