hello MAS
 

hai guys...its been long time since i posted.
mapa president is doing a wonderful job....congrats capt h.
its about time that mapa considered a fix allowance for the exco....say president 10k,asst,vice,sec get 7k,... exco 5k.works out only about rm 50 ringgit per member.they are dedicating whole life for free,family life, personal committment and personal needs is being sacrificed for the asso.about time the members give back something to this selfless,dedicated people.this works out about rm 50 ringgit only per member.please vote rm 60 increase instead of rm10.heard of the kpi and esos.it totally unacceptable.
noooooo....dont protest or go against the OSA....but leave the place.
TRANSMILE/AIRASIA/KOREA/VIETNAM/SINGAPORE/INDIA/MIDDLE E/EUROPE
is looking for you guys. our earlier mentors have made good name for us....
if you guys r happy with the 0.5 month complimentary money...GOD BLESS THIS MAS PILOTS.
guys .
i have left...having a comfortable life now...many of our guys are...please guys...think and think hard.......ur skills are good,thanks for our extreme training.WHEN A CONSULTANT IS GETTING MORE THAN A JUMBO CAPT. ITSSSSSSSSSSSSS TIME TO GO......

Something about not drinking and posting comes to mind...

Leave MAS when you can
 

I left them a couple of years ago and havent looked backed since.
Only the brave and elite will leave.
For the 3rd rate please stay back, you will get ESOS and good KPI for being just ordinary.

che xindamail,
cant understand ur post...can you further explain.
for the rest mas.....many ex around the world ...nil complain.IJ just made a big mess...so was the last guy munir.among all TR was still okay.he had honour among thiefs.if u guys dont react,nothing will change in this co.
and che xin...if u cant post something nice than please dont waste ur internet money.

Ikan, with due respect to you "braveness" to venture out there are many excellent MAS pilots ( who are certainly NOT THIRD RATE ) who choose to remain for very good reasons of their own...like family commitments and filiel peity which you may find hard to understand. I jumped ship a long time ago but I respect my former colleagues who chose to remain for various reasons. I wished more of the senoir ones would leave which will certainly send a clear message to the management, but alas it was not to be. It is hoped that with the current recruitment drive in the Asian region will spur more to venture forth.

Dear b737400,

What Che Xindamail meant by not drinking and posting is that perhaps you were drunk when you sat at your computer and composed your post. " I must say I do agree with him "

Firstly let me address the MAPA (malay airline pilots association) issue. MAPA is the most useless con-job of any pilots association I have ever come across in the world. They have a MoU with MAS, well an MoU is not legally binding and cannot be upheld in a court of law. At least the ground staff have a collective agreement (legally binding) and are unionised. Thats a darn sight better and smarter than the so called smart pilots in MAS and their crappy association (non unionised). The management take great care to negotiate with the ground staff for reasons explained above but could not give a damn what is written into the MoU for reasons explained above. In fact the MoU is just a gentleman's agreement based on a handshake and written on toilet paper. What a load of CRAP. and now this pay rubbish is just another con-job to give the useless MAPA EXCO buggers money for not doing F%*k all. You guys are more stupid than I thought even considering it rather that voting on it. Have you ever seen the EXCO suck holes behind closed doors. They are like mice, quivering and shaking. They never stand up to the management and JUMP AT ANY OPPORTUNITY TO ADVANCE THEMSELVES. But when they are amongst you they talk the big talk and tell you about the great fight they had on your behalf behind those closed doors. And guess what, you stupid fellows believe them.

Regarding TR. How can you even think he was sane. Look at the bloody damage that fool created and you even consider him as "still ok" Perhaps you have not been drinking but are on happy drugs. What an insane statement. "You must be on the EXCO to have the brains to make that kind statement" Perhaps you are the quality of people representing the pilots of MAS.

MAS has just come out of years of substantial debt. In fact the taxpayers will be paying for the mismanagement monetary costs for decades because the losses of billions were merely set aside in the asset unbundling and set up of PNB as the lessor, in reality the actual losses were absorbed into future governmental budgets.

So now after the company is struggling out of the red into the black and after the pilots have had a pay rise you want more money. Well what about the ground staff. Their pay is total crap the poor baggage loader or the check in staff. WHAT ABOUT THEM !!! Do you give a flying fart about the others in MAS besides the primadona pilots. If you had a team concept you would take a pay cut to enable the other members of your team mainly the ground staff to have a reasonable pay.

The Bottom line is that you pilots are a greedy lot and have zero negotiation skills or timing. You are willing to kill the goose thats laying the golden eggs just to get one egg quickly. You have absolutely zero foresight and purely live in the moment. Go on, waste fuel, report sick and leave for other airlines and watch MAS open its doors to expats with terms and conditions you wish you had because that is what is going to happen. The lazy, self centred, greedy bumi attitude you have will be your downfall.

Sireh I agree with you. There are many 1st rate pilots who "choose" to remain and can be counted in the digits if the hand . Well and good and the pool of the remaining pilots are just 3rd rate and getting bigger.
The ORDINARY pilot gets the ESOS. I heard that is why the ESOS list is not published. Too ordinary to compare and get benchmark.

Sireh I agree with you. There are many 1st rate pilots who "choose" to remain and can be counted in the digits of both hands . Well and good and the pool of the remaining pilots are just 3rd rate and getting bigger.

The just ORDINARY pilots gets the ESOS. I heard that is why the ESOS list is not published. Too ordinary to compare and get benchmark.
Need to be EXTRA-ORDINARY, to stand above the crowd, then receive ESOS with the applauds of the pilot community. Sadly lacking

dear capt wooblah,fully agree with you.however as u know..pilots cant form a union,as such asso will have do to for know.
what happen behind close doors,i wouldnt know but i do know that the exco works extremely hard...especially the current team.
working condition in mas will never change from day one and so will the management.
my sincere wish for the rest of the pilots in mas is not to fight the system especially the kpi and esos but instead look for a greener zone somewhere else.
i am very annoyed that new consultants gets esos and salary from rm40k to rm 80k but not our pilots.as u know almost all of pilots have been with mas at least 15 yrs and above....
happy flying.

I think what is happening in MAPA is exactly like FOOTBALL in Malaysia.It gets worse trying to improve it.

it's amazing the way they decide to pay ESOS but decided to twitch their ear when i asked about my due salary for flying the twin otters more than a year ago..and it's just a month salary...no big deal....

ssangyongs...get you money first
 

ssangyongs....ever thought of leaving. Go on think about it.
Its fun out here. Great people and good atmosphere in Middle East. Good food.

well i think i'm too young and inexperienced for middle east job..maybe in years time...as for my salary i've been writing to his and her in HR department, calls after calls, but they ask me to wait...maybe something to do with ESOS. i can wait..but there's always a limit..

well ss,cant remember munir's activity except the paintings and the office reno.i do remember the gm hr..mr.yusoff.a white haired gentlement.is he still around and where is the toad now..opps sorry datuk toad.
we can go around till kingdom comes ( sampai kucing bertanduk) about mas management ( or rather mis-management).unfortunetely we cant do anything about it....well as everyone says mapa is powerless,only a asso not a union.
its about time pilots as individuals make the change.......its greener in some places( sometimes its HOTTTTTTT).
clown and cronies will still run the place even in flt ops.....how many IP's and AE's that you know tat doesnt deserve the post.i know a few..but its not their fault..it cronism.
guys...you are the front liners...without you guys there is no t/o.u guys dont deserve this ****s .dont just stand and watch....resign.
even airasia looks better now........at least they got excellent pr management.
ps: how about having a forum/blog/website for all mas/ex-mas/malaysian pilots.

sorry, a little off topic about the FUTURE Generation of MAS's pilot ____________________________________________________________ ____
i don't know about the old generations of MAS pilots. I'm sure there are good ones and bad ones. But for the coming generation,
ok, i've been schooling with them, 60-70% of them, couldn't read METAR, TAF, Synoptics charts, and still PASS CA6 with marvelous marks... how come? they cannot differenciate POLAR MARITIME and Tropical MARITIME but still pass MET THEORY
Some of them couldn't even plot POSITION LINE on Navigation chart, but still pass navigation, how come?
some of them, couldn't do flight planning,Interpolate? >? Performance CHART CAP 385, use of this graph? that graph? yet, all pass...
MAS are training these new breeds of pilots while letting the old and experienced ones leave.

MC thanks for the info.
This is how Jala going to flood the market with cadet pilots and SO so that MAS will not have a shortage of pilots.There are 300 cadets in the various flying schools and how do you let them pass the CPL ground school?How do you maintain standards?Maybe jala thinks that it's like employing a bus driver,teach a monkey with time monkeywill learn.
The 737 is flooded with SOs doing line training.The IPs there are overworked,and i think they are not maintaining the standards looking at what new FOs or how they are performing.
Good indicator here.They recently scrapped the english test cos many were performing below the score line.What did they blame on?They blame the equipment that was used for the test.Now shouldn't you blame the candidate's english?Most of the new FO english is hardly passable,listen to their PA when you fly in one.When you brief them you better use Malay or else they ll never fully understand you(doesn't matter if FO is malay or non malay-english equally bad).
So guess what MC says if correct will filter down to operations in MAS.
And thank god i'm no longer there

a little bit off topic, how does MAS Kargo recruit their flight crew? apart from greener pastures abroad does anybody know why JJ ong left? he kept the cargo ops profitable when mas was bleeding (bocor) millions of mullah..does their operation is separated from the mainline mas?

gremlins at work again? my replied has been shortened but nevermind...

Ikan,
good for you but if the once mighty greenback plunges further you may have to do much rethinking. There certainly many honorable and proficient MAS pilots who remain loyal and happy to keep flying with the national flag carrier with no great grand plans to chase the almighty$.

Pendekar, agree with you 100%. As for b737400 don't get your hopes too high. Do know the current mob in Mapa; just biding time to spring a coup ala toady. Years of association and flying with these guys allow me to form this opinion and I am sure many in the know agree with me. Having said that, your suggestion that the EXCO's expenses should be covered and an allowance be made for those days spent on association business is a good one albeit mooted a long time ago already. The quetion is how to manage it. We all know the time when the bhai guru and cohoots pocketted funds meant for the annual dinner etc; day light robbery but nobody took charge to order a scrutiny and so dedicated Mapa members came away fools.

Hello bungacengkeh,
Tanah melayu no longer exists...it's ala kaput. Only Malaysia hidup, and Malaysia would have reached great heights if not for bigots with sentiments like you bringing us all down to the pits. The same story with MAS; are you guys all blind, deaf and heart/brain dead? The malaise that Malaysia has come to be is all out there for all to see notwithsatanding the short memories of most of our fellow citizens.:ugh:

Well said Jaguh; after 37 years of NEP and seeing how our own Bumis run the country and all its institutions to the ground, it's time we Melayus embrace our non-Bumi brothers and sisters back to the mainstream so that they can contribute effectively and permanently to the wellbeing of our beloved nation.:{:D:)

bungacengkeh,if only meritocracy prevails over affirmative action and we are all Malaysians instead of categorizing each and everyone of us based on our skin colour,this country will be way better off,look at the tiny island down south and see what they have archieved with their way of doing things..:D

The replies here have been truthful and of an outstanding nature. This is the mindset and culture that will make Malaysia a great nation with a sense of pride and most importantly nationhood. To hear the words I am a Malaysian rather than I am a Chinese, Indian etc from Malaysia.

For my part I know I am direct and to the point and as I have said before I just call it the way it is.

For those at MAS, all is not lost. You need to work within the new system which in my opinion is better than no reward system. Define the KPI indices as related to FLT OPS as a division on a whole and be paid as a group when you achieve the PI and define individual KPI indices by fleet and down to the individual. If you guys think performance based ideas the CEO will buy it as a win win situation. What you need is the sales team that can talk the talk and walk the walk, have the brains and intellect to negotiate and close the deal. I really believe there has not been a better time to fix a performance based monetary reward system for the pilots in stone than now.

Wooblah.

Wooby, great but don't get your hopes up too high. Nice sentiments but we need action. The above posts are from enlightened Bumis who have shaken off the eons of indoctrination, brainwash and utter tosh imprinted in them. Bless them for their awakening but they are but the few shiny grains in big sandpit. Anyway it is my sincere hope that this awakening bloom to full glory. Best wishes to all.

I understand Wooby's optimism but I also share bakutteh's misgivings. The rot that had set in Malaysian society pervades through all sectors. Look at the pit that Malaysian soccer and hockey had sunked into. Badminton sank but enjoy a rollercoaster revival but a non too hopeful future remains. The corporate sector would have tanked if not for the EPF and Petrodollars pumped in.
The non Bumis have given up as they know that their hard work and expertise that put Malaysian sports on the world map had gone to nought as the Bumi politicians, royalty and upstarts took over the management of the sports body and run them to the ground with their pettiness and penchant for self aggrandisement. So sports like soccer, hockey ( field hockey ), athletics, badminton which are the premier sports which garner huge sponsorships and support were made into political vote gettters and pocket money generators. So the non Bumis gave up and headed for the less glamorous sports which the Bumis deem to be " chepek ' and not cool. So we have squash, karate, wushu etc where again the non Bumis brought great honour ( like Nicol David ) to the nation and placing Malaysia on the world map. However it remains to be seen how long this will be allowed to last.
The saddest thing about his NEP and Bumi preferrence thing is that how much the damage done to both Bumi and non Bumis alike. The Bumis consigned themselves to a self destructive make believe world of grandness, and the poor non Bumi kids contaminated by the atrocious education and social value system grew up mentally and psychologically damaged. Just see the prevalence of crime and misdemeanour amongst non Bumi kids nowadays make me cringe with hopelessness. Watch how the young non Bumi badminton players 5 to 10 years ago and see their pathetic attempts at heroics; they were 100% like Bumi kids! Their role models were the scums of Malaysian society, con men datuks, conmen businessmen and filthy politicians, yikes!
The more sensible non Bumis decided that enough is enough and not wanting this contamination of their families to continue anymore, a lot of good people emigrated. Even some enlightened Bumis jumped ship.
So Wooby, you will appreciate our misgivings.

We have (2) champions in our times.
1. MAWI the jagoh kampong felda
2. NICOL DAVID world champion

Mawi is the local champ, and adored for his just average singing by the masses.
Nicol David is a world squash champion and the masses don't even know the her.

Life is like that in MALAYSIA BOLEH LAND

showbiz is different from sporting culture. What more, squash. Well i'm not a fan of Mawi but it's like that everywhere.

jala being trounced by senators
 

Been on the RPK website and read the amount of **** being hurled at MAS due to its incompetencies, roti jala included. The profit shown, to my understanding, was by the sale of assets ( http://www.malaysia-today.net/blog20...unt=0&blogid=1).
So what did the 10% do to get the ESOS...
What is more striking is long service pilots got nothing and a 2 year Bernard Francis got plenty. Just exactly what did he do is my question.

ssangyongs
agreed showbiz and squash is different....
What are Malaysians proud of ? A world champion or local Mawi who cant sing for nuts but hyped by the media.

The culture of the country (mas included) reflects this anomaly.

Well, in MAS the non Bumis are given some table scraps and occasionally given some big sounding posts with little influence or authority; a sort of tokenism to reflect the hip sounding " Malaysia Truly Asia ". More often or not these pitiful non Bumis in MAS become lap dogs consigned to doing the dirty work of screwing their own professionals in the management's quest to put pilots in their place. The highly principled and sensible non Bumis will never accept a management post when they know the management will use them to screw others. That leaves the scums who will lick ass and boots to get some position so that they can boast to all that they are the top class, not knowing their very craving for such positions belie their low life nature. The smart non Bumi knows that whatever great work they do will amount to nothing; wasted efforts which will probably be used by the actual powers to be who either ignore the good work or twist and turn claiming that it is their own work! Worser still, in the whole time one become sucked into a highly nefarious scheme undermining or screwing their own bethren.
The malaise that pervades the whole architecture of Malaysian society is mirrored at a micro level in MAS. Saving face, grandiose schemes to score points, ego boosting stuff etc which all amount to great waste besides undermining and drowning the morale of dedicated aviators.:ugh:

Hello all,

During my years in MAS I have always wondered whether the flight ops management know what they were doing. Many highly competent and and proficient pilots were bypassed by their juniors at the whims and fancies of the top brass for their own expediency. Some of the said juniors were known ass lickers and sucked up to their patrons, weaseling their ways to get promoted to the premier B744 fleet at the expense of those who help launch the great revenue generating B777 with their ETOPS expertise gained during their tenure on the A330. Some of these ass lickers are now helming MAPA! These miscreants with their slick and sly ways conned the flight ops management with their computer generated forecast of savings and cost effectiveness of their bypass plans, and the dim wits at the helm of flight ops swallowed the whole dubious scheme line, hook and sinker. So the optimists, I guess you need to water down your expectations a wee bit lest the coming doom and gloom will surely leave you doing this:ugh::ugh::ugh:

Ali, selamat pagi Pak. Not forgetting the bizzare decision to promote guys with accident records over more proficient and competent seniors!! If you were around during the mid 90's when one guy ( they called him lew wing tip, I think ) who smashed his A330 wing tip into the aerobridge in SIN and another chap who similarly swung another A330 wing tip into an SQ plane in Male. Both were given a slap on the wrist and a year later THEY WERE PROMOTED TO THE B744 over their seniors who were left languishing on the B777. What charity!! No wonder many of the seniors packed and left, and what have we, the wing tip smashers remain in MAS as shining example of competency and proficiency by the very fact they were deemed " BETTER' than the seniors, thus earning their promotion ahead of the flabergasted seniors. These people go around boasting to all and sundry that they were the best and that's why they were promoted ahead of their seniors. Ha, is there still hope in MAS?:*

Interesting observation. But....

1. There is the bidding system.
2. Now no increase in salary for WB to WB promotion.
3. B744 are slowly being phased out (except the F version)
4. Lots more GOM on the B744 fleet than any other fleet.


So, LANGUISHING???? Probably by choice.

Mat Tongkang ..to add to your list
Wasn't the FO IDI(ot) with Liew Wing TiP also promoted as a MANAGEMENT PILOT of some sort. Wasn't Saf Avian an IP after scraping the tail of the B747 in London. Wasn't he also invloved in a DC-10 taxi excursion into grass way back in the 70's. Wasn't his FO Nikki Boy also an AE or IP on the B737 and later got demoted to FO for violent behaviour.
MAS Flt OPS promotes :ugh: .....what else can I deduce! :D:D:D

Lesenterbang, I believe Mat refered to the 1996-2000 period, not the present. During that period there is a substantial type pay difference between the B777 and B744, so I can understand the grievance of those who were bypassed. I was made to understand the scums who were promoted sucked up to Jun and fixed up the promotion schedule with the dumb che pek Man who had no clue how to manage fleet progression. Same malaise.

The bypass of the seniors was a company decision to avoid excessive costs I think though I had no part in the decision. Nasiblah, hard luck. You win some, you lose some.The non Bumis must learn to give back to the nation for stability and harmony lah.

Langka & lesen, I was indeed referring to the 1996 to 2000 period when the abovementioned incidents occurred much to our embarassment as both incidents had the kiasus sneering and rolling their eyes. After these two "ace" pilots were promoted bypassing their seniors, most of the seniors upped and left for kimchi land. MAS lost a number of good men. Sigh.:confused:

As alluded by malaysiancadet and ikan terbang, it looks like the dross that we now get together with the dregs that remaim makes for some interesting times in the near future. The multiple choice type of questions in the Malaysian CPL and ATPL exams makes it very easy for people with superficial grasp of aviation subjects to pass or even score high. Going through the databank of questions and through rote learning of past questions makes passing a breeze. You wonder how many Malaysian skippers would still be F/Os had the CAA and DCA not switch to the present format. After the switch in the late 80's we suddenly have so may people pass; it sure was a Malaysia boleh miracle!

Ha, malaysiacadet, haven't you heard of " patok "? With the multiple choice format, a patok makes life so easy. So passing is no sweat, passing with high marks is fairly easy. There is a big disconnect between " mugging " aviation questionaires to pass the exam and making sense of it all to sucessfully apply to daily flight operations.:(

What is 'Patok"? Nowadays Sireh, you can get all sorts of nonsense in Local flying schools. During exam, some fellow MAS cadets decided that "mugging up" was a difficult task and resorted to copying. and somebody had an eye closed. half-way through, papers were flying, phones were ringing, language of the hand were everywhere.and Yet, they were very proud that they had passed all! with no remorse! right after the exam when there is a discussion, a lot of them had no SINGLE IDEA on what question they ANSWERED, not 1, not 2, but all of the questions!!! They just don't know.
-and then come the problem of drug-abuse. This is probably happening in all the flying schools in malaysia. most of the Involved? you probably guessed it right. Selected one from MAS who had gone through Psychomotor, MISPA, Interview , Medical. apparently, they are the GENIUS breed of people who were carefully selected for this job - PILOT.
-As an aviator in Malaysia, well, not yet. I hope MAS will open up their eyes and reconsider their logic in "Flooding schools in malaysia with 200 cadets a year", I'd say, try to keep the ELITES, I will have many things to learn from them in the years to come when it is my turn to sit at the right seat
-I agree with you that Aviation Questionaires had little similarities or rather irrelevant to Daily Operations(if that is what you meant in your last sentence). But by doing these nonsense, you can judge them,PILOT,as a person & their character, and how will "THEY-The ELITES" contribute to the COMPANY and Aviation in future.
-It just doesn't stop at the school level, i'm sure everyone agrees.
Back into the COMPANY, doing type-rating, another round of nonsense, how did they do so well.

After all that i've said, I am not so Clean either. I did "Mug-Up" to make sure that my efforts at the textbook had paid off.