The state of (the) Philippine(s) aviation
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Like what I said in my previous post, there was never an improvement from ATO to CAAP, they just made things worst.
For me, anybody who audits CAAP and give them flying colors would definitely look very very stupid
For me, anybody who audits CAAP and give them flying colors would definitely look very very stupid
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I'm new here in this forum.
I have been with the outfit before and the sentiments of all those I left behind in CAAP are really bad. We thought then that CAAP was the answer but then again we were wrong. The level of corruption increase with no benefits for the existing employees. The undermining thing about this is that the technical people are the ones greatly affected. If things don't change, time will come when those who will be stay will be overaged guys and newly hired who lacks experince.
Many of ny fellow technical personnel are either contemplating on leaving or are just waiting for their dispatch to go abroad or to another company.
I feel really sorry for the state that CAAP is now. I talked with those people who conceptualized CAAP around the 80's and they are really sad, they said that this is not what we dreamed for before.
Leadership is really doesn't know anything about running the show. They accepted the job with no clear vision on what to do. Then they hired a lot of consultants who when I was still there, was asking us about our job. Come on, you are consultants, you should know a lot more than what we know. I was wondering if they are consultants or just "consulsol". 186 last I heard all receving 18k+ a month and having a bigger allowance that's why all of them kapit toko with their job, Plus tha fact that most of them have bested interest in having a pet project to endorse to the DG.
Almost all areas ng CAAP has consultants, before even the Personnel has a concultant.
I don't know where this band wagon is going to. I hope in the near future things will change.
I salute those who still work there and still provide the service.
Kudos to the Technical Personnel especially the ATC, COMS and the ANS....
Just my honest opinion....
I have been with the outfit before and the sentiments of all those I left behind in CAAP are really bad. We thought then that CAAP was the answer but then again we were wrong. The level of corruption increase with no benefits for the existing employees. The undermining thing about this is that the technical people are the ones greatly affected. If things don't change, time will come when those who will be stay will be overaged guys and newly hired who lacks experince.
Many of ny fellow technical personnel are either contemplating on leaving or are just waiting for their dispatch to go abroad or to another company.
I feel really sorry for the state that CAAP is now. I talked with those people who conceptualized CAAP around the 80's and they are really sad, they said that this is not what we dreamed for before.
Leadership is really doesn't know anything about running the show. They accepted the job with no clear vision on what to do. Then they hired a lot of consultants who when I was still there, was asking us about our job. Come on, you are consultants, you should know a lot more than what we know. I was wondering if they are consultants or just "consulsol". 186 last I heard all receving 18k+ a month and having a bigger allowance that's why all of them kapit toko with their job, Plus tha fact that most of them have bested interest in having a pet project to endorse to the DG.
Almost all areas ng CAAP has consultants, before even the Personnel has a concultant.
I don't know where this band wagon is going to. I hope in the near future things will change.
I salute those who still work there and still provide the service.
Kudos to the Technical Personnel especially the ATC, COMS and the ANS....
Just my honest opinion....
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CAAP.. Still under the shadows of the old ATO..
Oh well..
I can't believe what's continuing to happen in CAAP, it's like ATO part 2.
I have been through the STUPID process of getting licenses there.. And I really hated it..
Some AIRLINE pilots (OLD AGED) would just go inside the office and do the stamping on their own and get the forms they needed from their KAKILALA inside, WHILE SOME ARE WAITING OUTSIDE FOR THEIR TURN.
A friend of mine got his license by giving the SOMEONE there a few hundreds and a lunch meal.
THE CONCLUSION: If everyone wants change in CAAP, REMOVE ALL THE OLD EMPLOYEES! The aviation industry is considered as a very professional field. Too bad, the Philippines does not understand this.
I can't believe what's continuing to happen in CAAP, it's like ATO part 2.
I have been through the STUPID process of getting licenses there.. And I really hated it..
Some AIRLINE pilots (OLD AGED) would just go inside the office and do the stamping on their own and get the forms they needed from their KAKILALA inside, WHILE SOME ARE WAITING OUTSIDE FOR THEIR TURN.
A friend of mine got his license by giving the SOMEONE there a few hundreds and a lunch meal.
THE CONCLUSION: If everyone wants change in CAAP, REMOVE ALL THE OLD EMPLOYEES! The aviation industry is considered as a very professional field. Too bad, the Philippines does not understand this.
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THE CONCLUSION: If everyone wants change in CAAP, REMOVE ALL THE OLD EMPLOYEES! The aviation industry is considered as a very professional field. Too bad, the Philippines does not understand this.
The Safety Division comprises approximately 20% of the work force and the rest are technical staff (ATC, ANS, ACOM). They (Safety) maybe rotten and corrupt but not us. We are struggling here and you are adding insult to injury by generalizing.
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I believe ALL pinoys are corrupt more or less, they are well teach by years of the corrupt government
It goes from the taxi driver all the way up to Arroyo,and i feel sorry for the little person that don´t have a single peso to play the corruption game.
One of my best friends are a Philippine General and the story's i hear from him are beyond all fantasia
It goes from the taxi driver all the way up to Arroyo,and i feel sorry for the little person that don´t have a single peso to play the corruption game.
One of my best friends are a Philippine General and the story's i hear from him are beyond all fantasia
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man-up
Thanks for standing up. At least most of us know there are positive things going on at the CAAP. Please keep up the good work as it is always an uphill battle when one department are doing well and the others are not. keep up the good work as this is the only way to slowly progress...we all benefit from people like you who stick it out...
Thank You....
Thank You....
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That's true Amihan. The technical side (ATC, COMS and ANS) are the workhorse of the outfit. And they are not corrupt. I used to belong to this group so I share your sentiments when then generalize all CAAP employees. You guys provide the service and comprise the major part of CAAP that's why you guys are the ones really burdened by the situation.
So in the future be careful guys in generalizing terms.
Hope things work out for the better.
So in the future be careful guys in generalizing terms.
Hope things work out for the better.
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"The technical side (ATC, COMS and ANS) are the workhorse of the outfit."
Is the safety division a non technical department? The way I understand it, without the safety division there can be no ATC controlling the aircraft at all since they the safety division issues the airworthiness certificate, air operator certificate, pilots license, etc. after all. This is the main reason why Philippines was downgraded by the FAA to Category 2 due to the fact that the safety division was not capable of doing its safety oversight to philippine aviation. The FAA audit was mainly focus on the requirements of ICAO Annex 1, 6 and 8 only, which in my opinion are the responsibility of the safety division.
I guess all the people at CAAP should work together to ensure that the leaders they place at CAAP should be those who deserve it. Do employees at CAAP have the courage to voice these matters to the government since they already know what is really going on within CAAP?
Is the safety division a non technical department? The way I understand it, without the safety division there can be no ATC controlling the aircraft at all since they the safety division issues the airworthiness certificate, air operator certificate, pilots license, etc. after all. This is the main reason why Philippines was downgraded by the FAA to Category 2 due to the fact that the safety division was not capable of doing its safety oversight to philippine aviation. The FAA audit was mainly focus on the requirements of ICAO Annex 1, 6 and 8 only, which in my opinion are the responsibility of the safety division.
I guess all the people at CAAP should work together to ensure that the leaders they place at CAAP should be those who deserve it. Do employees at CAAP have the courage to voice these matters to the government since they already know what is really going on within CAAP?
Last edited by win_faa; 16th May 2009 at 07:55.
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hey cn any one let me know the procedure to convert my faa multi cpl to phillipines cpl.. i want to do my recency in phillipines and as well as rt for conversion to indian cpl..
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FAA convertion
new regs for 2009. depending on what privileges you will be using your CPl for. Go to CAAP website under licensing.
in a nutshell..if you want to act as PIC in a commercial operation in the Philippines you will need to show in your log book a minimum of 200 hours flown in a RP registered aircraft.
in a nutshell..if you want to act as PIC in a commercial operation in the Philippines you will need to show in your log book a minimum of 200 hours flown in a RP registered aircraft.
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Download the new regulations from here: CAAP - Downloads
The CAR's are 5th down the list.
Actually, what you'll get initially is a Validation Certificate which will be your temporary license 'til you get your 200 hours in a Phil. registered aircraft.
After getting 200 hours, that's when they will convert your FAA CPL to an RP-CPL.
But beware, though. The process might be more painful than what is actually written in the CAR's.
A friend of mine actually suggested at one time to stop reading the CAR's after getting all sorts of requirements and varying interpretation depending on the check pilot he faced on a particular day. Here's a valuable tip, though: NEVER EVER GIVE THEM YOUR LOGBOOK IF THEY ASK THAT YOU LEAVE IT WITH THEM. Photocopy it or what have you. That freakin' office is one big black hole in the center of the known aviation universe.
The CAR's are 5th down the list.
Actually, what you'll get initially is a Validation Certificate which will be your temporary license 'til you get your 200 hours in a Phil. registered aircraft.
After getting 200 hours, that's when they will convert your FAA CPL to an RP-CPL.
But beware, though. The process might be more painful than what is actually written in the CAR's.
A friend of mine actually suggested at one time to stop reading the CAR's after getting all sorts of requirements and varying interpretation depending on the check pilot he faced on a particular day. Here's a valuable tip, though: NEVER EVER GIVE THEM YOUR LOGBOOK IF THEY ASK THAT YOU LEAVE IT WITH THEM. Photocopy it or what have you. That freakin' office is one big black hole in the center of the known aviation universe.
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Toulost said: Here's a valuable tip, though: NEVER EVER GIVE THEM YOUR LOGBOOK IF THEY ASK THAT YOU LEAVE IT WITH THEM. Photocopy it or what have you. That freakin' office is one big black hole in the center of the known aviation universe....
I agree -100%, they ( safety division people) are notorious for it. A friend who was converting his license was asked to leave his logbook and while talking to other pilots, they told him their horror stories with safety div., so he went back the same day, got a photocopy and took his logbook.
However, people in medical have also known to lose X-ray results. WTF ???
as Toulost said: they are a BLACK HOLE.
I agree -100%, they ( safety division people) are notorious for it. A friend who was converting his license was asked to leave his logbook and while talking to other pilots, they told him their horror stories with safety div., so he went back the same day, got a photocopy and took his logbook.
However, people in medical have also known to lose X-ray results. WTF ???
as Toulost said: they are a BLACK HOLE.
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win faa
The safety division is not a technical department but a regulatory department. Much like the PRC (Professional Regulations Commission) for career professionals.
ATCs, like pilots, need to have an ICAO recognized license to operate control towers or man radar sectors. Also annual aviation medical for currency. The Safety Division is the office designated by the Philippine government to regulate this. However, our licensing process is not as much as a pain like yours (pilots) simply because we are already ATO/CAAP "organics" and they cannot get anything from us. We are as pulubi as they are.
CAAP employees do not have the say who becomes the boss of the agency. It is the president's choice, whoever she wants to appoint as leader of CAAP the employees just have to accept that.
The safety division is not a technical department but a regulatory department. Much like the PRC (Professional Regulations Commission) for career professionals.
ATCs, like pilots, need to have an ICAO recognized license to operate control towers or man radar sectors. Also annual aviation medical for currency. The Safety Division is the office designated by the Philippine government to regulate this. However, our licensing process is not as much as a pain like yours (pilots) simply because we are already ATO/CAAP "organics" and they cannot get anything from us. We are as pulubi as they are.
CAAP employees do not have the say who becomes the boss of the agency. It is the president's choice, whoever she wants to appoint as leader of CAAP the employees just have to accept that.
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Old Farts From Pal
AMIHAN,
i have not read all of the past forums but these things i know
firefox...this idiot wats his name...AHHH....TINGLE CONTRACEPCION on airbus 340 ex pal is there
bembol julie annO.....feeling tom cruz with his 1000cc motorcycle(too old for his age,...DOM>>)
MANG LAPUS...ilongo piece of sh....t
bully of newbies, good for nothing captain who does not know techinicalities of his aircraft, relies on his seniority and fat ass and big beer belly, owns a 45 caliber pistol but can't shoot straight in the gun club,,,,
WHY IS IT THAT THESE IDIOTS WHO ARE ABOVE 65, AND YET HOLD RATINGS ON THEIR LICENSES, ARE LEGAL TO CHECK PILOTS, GET PAID MORE THAN THE ORGANICS(WHO ARE LOUSY FLIERS AND HAVE FAILED THEIR SIM COURSES EXCEPT ONE....OR TWO??, )
BUT ARE FUC...KNG OLD!!! AND BEYOND THE LEGAL AGE TO FLY!!
i have not read all of the past forums but these things i know
firefox...this idiot wats his name...AHHH....TINGLE CONTRACEPCION on airbus 340 ex pal is there
bembol julie annO.....feeling tom cruz with his 1000cc motorcycle(too old for his age,...DOM>>)
MANG LAPUS...ilongo piece of sh....t
bully of newbies, good for nothing captain who does not know techinicalities of his aircraft, relies on his seniority and fat ass and big beer belly, owns a 45 caliber pistol but can't shoot straight in the gun club,,,,WHY IS IT THAT THESE IDIOTS WHO ARE ABOVE 65, AND YET HOLD RATINGS ON THEIR LICENSES, ARE LEGAL TO CHECK PILOTS, GET PAID MORE THAN THE ORGANICS(WHO ARE LOUSY FLIERS AND HAVE FAILED THEIR SIM COURSES EXCEPT ONE....OR TWO??, )
BUT ARE FUC...KNG OLD!!! AND BEYOND THE LEGAL AGE TO FLY!!
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To pare,
So you mean CAAP employees would just shut their mouth even if the President appoint an idiot at the agency? It seems that "safety culture" is non-existent within the agency. I remember when ATCs at ATO have taken a forceful stand and did a strike to remove Villaruel at the helm of office. Nobody likes these things to happen again, but what is CAAP doing knowing that the people being appointed are incompetent?
So you mean CAAP employees would just shut their mouth even if the President appoint an idiot at the agency? It seems that "safety culture" is non-existent within the agency. I remember when ATCs at ATO have taken a forceful stand and did a strike to remove Villaruel at the helm of office. Nobody likes these things to happen again, but what is CAAP doing knowing that the people being appointed are incompetent?
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Yeah he is right, i have a controller friend @ ATO/CAAP, the people just shut up when they have a new 'boss', its because they are threatened & coerced(forced) by the people who are supposed to be their seniors in the office.
thats probably why most controllers are grumpy on the frequency.
Yep thats the culture there.
i came across this article in the net.
Homesick in West Central Africa - INQUIRER.net, Philippine News for Filipinos
it is very typical of that office.
i tried to get my ratings signed & checked in AVsafety, the old farts there blatantly asked for money, i couldnt say no, i wanted it done badly so i gave the last money i had, its was good a had fuel in my car to go home.
what if i didnt bring my car? what of those young guyss who dont have connections & enuf money to go home?
ho humm...
thats probably why most controllers are grumpy on the frequency.
Yep thats the culture there.
i came across this article in the net.
Homesick in West Central Africa - INQUIRER.net, Philippine News for Filipinos
it is very typical of that office.
i tried to get my ratings signed & checked in AVsafety, the old farts there blatantly asked for money, i couldnt say no, i wanted it done badly so i gave the last money i had, its was good a had fuel in my car to go home.
what if i didnt bring my car? what of those young guyss who dont have connections & enuf money to go home?
ho humm...
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Now PAL is re-thinking their B777-300ER purchase
You guys in the PI will never get your act together again as long as you have ATO/CAAP ppl who cant run the Civil Aviation properly.
Upgrading to FAA Cat. 1 is far, far away and now PAL re-thinks their B777-300ER purchase
PAL rethinks Boeing purchase
The birds in Manila are whispering that one of the issues is that Zest Airways was able to get the MA60 certified in the Philippines through the influence of "guns and gold".
Just wondering who are the ATO/CAAP officials who lined their pockets with that deal? Amb. Alfred Yao claims that he and his boys very to the "gods" in ATO/CAAP and they can get wonders done by putting the necessary "oil into the engine" of ATO/CAAP!
When will the ppl in the islands learn to do thing right and right at the first time?
Upgrading to FAA Cat. 1 is far, far away and now PAL re-thinks their B777-300ER purchase
PAL rethinks Boeing purchase
PAL rethinks Boeing purchase
FLAG carrier Philippine Airlines (PAL) is reported to be shelving its planned purchase of about six units of the long-range Boeing 777-300ER because the Philippines remains in Category 2 status since its downgrading by the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) in the last quarter of 2007.
The Faa will not allow any Philippine air carrier to mount new destinations in the United States unless Category 1 status has been reaquired through sweeping reforms in the local aviation industry.
Although the former Air Transportation Office has been abolished and replaced by the Civil Aviation Authority of the Philippines (Caap), its director general, Ruben F. Ciron, is finding that getting back to Category 1 is a long and difficult process.
Ciron, who took over the Caap in June 2008, has discovered that the reported “autonomy” granted by the Caap for him to put in place sweeping reforms is not easily enforceable.
For one, the Caap remains under the Department of Transportation and Communications (DOTC), which means reforms must have the approval of Secretary Leandro Mendoza.
Pressing more technical men into service means going through the requirements imposed by the Civil Service Commission (CSC), and having his funds scrutinized by the Budget Department.
The Caap has trouble recruiting highly technical men because of the low salary structure. But when the Caap submitted a salary scale that appears to overtake the levels of those from the DOTC, the latter’s executives balked, demanding to know what technical know-how these men have that they don’t.
When Ciron suspended an assistant for committing eight counts of alleged illegal transactions, the executive refused to submit himself to an accounting before his peers and brought the case before the Pasay City Regional Trial Court (RTC).
The Pasay RTC junked the case, although the Caap said that may not be the end of it.
Caap in limbo; PAL cautious
These difficulties are preventing the Caap from focusing on its main objectives of addressing the problems that the FAA wants solved before the authority is allowed to regain its Category 1 status.
So long as the Caap remains in limbo, PAL has to reconsider its expansion plans, according to sources in the aviation industry.
On December 6, 2006, PAL signed an agreement with Boeing for two Boeing 777-300ER aircraft, with a purchase agreement for two more aircraft. A separate agreement to lease two additional 777-300ERs from General Electric Capital Aviation Services was signed as well.
Delivery of the four 777-300ERs will commence in 2009. In May 2007, PAL exercised its rights to purchase an additional two 777-300ERs for delivery in 2011.
However, Jaime Bautista, PAL president, is reported to be wary about ending up with airplanes that have no routes to fly, as they are not prepared to enter Europe at this stage when American doors are closed for them to expand.
The effect of the downgrading is that PAL and other Philippine air carriers would not be able to apply for new routes in the United States until the Category 1 rank is reinstalled.
Bautista said that having two new planes is manageable, as they can find routes easily for them, but the third one will be more difficult at this stage of their finances.
The airline intends to fly the triple seven to Canada, Japan and Australia for the time being and will transfer the A340 to Los Angeles by November.
Same caution everywhere
An aviation source said that most international airlines in the world are either deferring or canceling (then buying a cheaper aircraft type) their orders because of the global financial crisis.
The Boeing 777 is a long-range, wide-body twin-engine airliner, now considered the world’s largest twinjet and commonly referred to as the “Triple Seven.”
The aircraft can carry between 283 and 368 passengers in a three-class configuration and has a range from 5,235 to 9, 380 nautical miles. It is designed to bridge the capacity difference between the B767 and the B747.
FLAG carrier Philippine Airlines (PAL) is reported to be shelving its planned purchase of about six units of the long-range Boeing 777-300ER because the Philippines remains in Category 2 status since its downgrading by the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) in the last quarter of 2007.
The Faa will not allow any Philippine air carrier to mount new destinations in the United States unless Category 1 status has been reaquired through sweeping reforms in the local aviation industry.
Although the former Air Transportation Office has been abolished and replaced by the Civil Aviation Authority of the Philippines (Caap), its director general, Ruben F. Ciron, is finding that getting back to Category 1 is a long and difficult process.
Ciron, who took over the Caap in June 2008, has discovered that the reported “autonomy” granted by the Caap for him to put in place sweeping reforms is not easily enforceable.
For one, the Caap remains under the Department of Transportation and Communications (DOTC), which means reforms must have the approval of Secretary Leandro Mendoza.
Pressing more technical men into service means going through the requirements imposed by the Civil Service Commission (CSC), and having his funds scrutinized by the Budget Department.
The Caap has trouble recruiting highly technical men because of the low salary structure. But when the Caap submitted a salary scale that appears to overtake the levels of those from the DOTC, the latter’s executives balked, demanding to know what technical know-how these men have that they don’t.
When Ciron suspended an assistant for committing eight counts of alleged illegal transactions, the executive refused to submit himself to an accounting before his peers and brought the case before the Pasay City Regional Trial Court (RTC).
The Pasay RTC junked the case, although the Caap said that may not be the end of it.
Caap in limbo; PAL cautious
These difficulties are preventing the Caap from focusing on its main objectives of addressing the problems that the FAA wants solved before the authority is allowed to regain its Category 1 status.
So long as the Caap remains in limbo, PAL has to reconsider its expansion plans, according to sources in the aviation industry.
On December 6, 2006, PAL signed an agreement with Boeing for two Boeing 777-300ER aircraft, with a purchase agreement for two more aircraft. A separate agreement to lease two additional 777-300ERs from General Electric Capital Aviation Services was signed as well.
Delivery of the four 777-300ERs will commence in 2009. In May 2007, PAL exercised its rights to purchase an additional two 777-300ERs for delivery in 2011.
However, Jaime Bautista, PAL president, is reported to be wary about ending up with airplanes that have no routes to fly, as they are not prepared to enter Europe at this stage when American doors are closed for them to expand.
The effect of the downgrading is that PAL and other Philippine air carriers would not be able to apply for new routes in the United States until the Category 1 rank is reinstalled.
Bautista said that having two new planes is manageable, as they can find routes easily for them, but the third one will be more difficult at this stage of their finances.
The airline intends to fly the triple seven to Canada, Japan and Australia for the time being and will transfer the A340 to Los Angeles by November.
Same caution everywhere
An aviation source said that most international airlines in the world are either deferring or canceling (then buying a cheaper aircraft type) their orders because of the global financial crisis.
The Boeing 777 is a long-range, wide-body twin-engine airliner, now considered the world’s largest twinjet and commonly referred to as the “Triple Seven.”
The aircraft can carry between 283 and 368 passengers in a three-class configuration and has a range from 5,235 to 9, 380 nautical miles. It is designed to bridge the capacity difference between the B767 and the B747.
Just wondering who are the ATO/CAAP officials who lined their pockets with that deal? Amb. Alfred Yao claims that he and his boys very to the "gods" in ATO/CAAP and they can get wonders done by putting the necessary "oil into the engine" of ATO/CAAP!
When will the ppl in the islands learn to do thing right and right at the first time?
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Its only a matter of time before the Philippines joins the EU Blacklist. If that happen's the next President will be flying to Europe for an official trip on a foreign airline What a shame!
What a shame!