ajv contract in tokyo
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I don't mind a stern tongue-lashing for failure to perform something in the sim that I should be able to do. I'm my own worst critic sometimes and I absolutely DETEST when I miss something (like missing a step in the FMS programming) then totally pooch-screw the approach because of it, and would expect to be chastised for it. I've worked at 2 carriers now where there was no "warm fuzzy" from the instructor - you either cut it or you got chewed out.
I will not, however, put up with someone touching me. You hit or smack me and I'm going to beat the holy hell out of you. Period. Kicking my chair is about as bad as it's ever gotten in the sim and I turned around and calmly told him we'd be stepping outside if he didn't learn how to be a professional.
There's limits to acceptable behavior. Heck, you can even raise your voice or yell at me (without resorting to insults or profanity), and I'll take it because I screwed up. However, physical violence in ANY form is simply unacceptable in the professional aviation world, and I'd like to know if that's the kind of behavior I could expect from their training department (although I somewhat doubt it).
You can go throw a tantrum with someone else...
I will not, however, put up with someone touching me. You hit or smack me and I'm going to beat the holy hell out of you. Period. Kicking my chair is about as bad as it's ever gotten in the sim and I turned around and calmly told him we'd be stepping outside if he didn't learn how to be a professional.
There's limits to acceptable behavior. Heck, you can even raise your voice or yell at me (without resorting to insults or profanity), and I'll take it because I screwed up. However, physical violence in ANY form is simply unacceptable in the professional aviation world, and I'd like to know if that's the kind of behavior I could expect from their training department (although I somewhat doubt it).
You can go throw a tantrum with someone else...
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Sorry guys, but I have yet to come across any physical abuse from a Japanese instructor. The verbal abuse has been minimal, remember Japanese males speak very forcibly because that's the culutre, so what would appear to be a stern tone may well be just a very determined input. Remember, as the pilots online say, it's their train set!!
Yes, there is a higher attrition rate latelt, but that appears to be, no insult to anyone, because the package being offered is being ignored by the better experienced pilots who prefer to work elsewhere.
Yes, there is a higher attrition rate latelt, but that appears to be, no insult to anyone, because the package being offered is being ignored by the better experienced pilots who prefer to work elsewhere.
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My personnal experience has been like Ishi described. I had Japanese instructors in the SIM and have being flying with Japanese line instructors and I have to say that they have been very professional. Are they demanding and pretty inflexible about procedures and company callouts and the likes? The answer to that is without a doubt, YES! but from there to grabby? Don't know about that? remember that the stories you hear from these training events are always the tip of the iceberg. What is under the waterline, you never hear about
Don't know about that? remember that the stories you hear from these training events are always the tip of the iceberg. What is under the waterline, you never hear about
Last edited by The Dominican; 20th Oct 2007 at 07:07.
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"Capt" Lear 70... I'll be as diplomatic as i can.......we don't want the likes of you here. There are a lot of very qualified FO's waiting for upgrades at AJV and AJX who are sitting in RHS, only because they applied at a stage where they weren't offering DEC's. It sounds to me like you have an attitude that would not be appreciated by most , if not all , expats ( Capts and F/Os ) here, so I would suggest not wasting your time. Y'all have a nice day
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"Capt" Lear 70... I'll be as diplomatic as i can.......we don't want the likes of you here. There are a lot of very qualified FO's waiting for upgrades at AJV and AJX who are sitting in RHS, only because they applied at a stage where they weren't offering DEC's. It sounds to me like you have an attitude that would not be appreciated by most , if not all , expats ( Capts and F/Os ) here, so I would suggest not wasting your time. Y'all have a nice day
You, sir, are more than welcome to your opinion,,, However, there's about 4 other DECA's and one FO there who I've flown with before (or know from other places) who are looking forward to flying with me, and vice-versa, so...
Thanks for your input,,,
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I am with Ishi, I have only had normal experiences with the ANA instructional staff, in fact I think that they have put in more effort than a western counter part.
We currently do long tours through north America, so the team has to be reasonably friendly to each other.
It does seem that there is a high failure rate right now, a whole course of AJX was wiped out a week or two ago. Hang in there Lear and remember the ANA insructor is busting his gut to get you through, a loss of a candidate is also a loss of face for an ANA instructor.
We currently do long tours through north America, so the team has to be reasonably friendly to each other.
It does seem that there is a high failure rate right now, a whole course of AJX was wiped out a week or two ago. Hang in there Lear and remember the ANA insructor is busting his gut to get you through, a loss of a candidate is also a loss of face for an ANA instructor.
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One question for yu Lear.... why wouldn't you accept an FO slot for a couple of years to gain a command? You may just get the respect you so richly deserve. Don't want to get into a slanging match with you but there are more than 4 DEC and 1 FO here. 
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Thanks, Meguro, I hear it's a very learning-intensive course and I know I'll have my work cut out for me. I appreciate your view on the instructors; nice to know that they aren't trying to fail anyone, but simply demanding very high standards, although it's distressing to hear of the recent failures.
Was there a specific reason that so many failed?
OldHasBeen, I wasn't implying that I would not care if I didn't get along with others than I know, I was simply stating that, as a matter of logic, if I get along with several people already there, it goes to follow that I just *might* get along just fine with others as well...?
I'm sorry you took my earlier comments out of context, but I feel pretty strongly about a certain level of professionalism required for this job and, if it's not present, in either student or instructor, then that person doesn't need to be there and I'm too old to put up with physical assault as a training method.
As for why I wouldn't be an F/O... why should I if they're going to hire DECA's *ANYWAY*...?
The demand for Captains with the delivery schedule these carriers have for the next decade simply cannot be met by internal pilots alone, so SOMEONE is going to have to staff them. Why then, should a pilot, who is qualified for a DECA slot, take an F/O slot when the next pilot in the interview is going to take one of the CA slots anyway and the company will continue to interview and hire DECA's?
I have been a DECA at 2 other companies, both of which are in the U.S. and are STILL looking for DECA 5 - 7 years later. There are DECA slots available at half a dozen carriers in Asia alone. What makes AJX/AJV unique is its lack of requirement for the applicant to be typed for DECA slots and its renumeration package which, arguably, could be higher, but for gaining initial heavy time, it's still better than pay in the U.S., and is a nice base for the beginnings of an international career.
DECA opportunities are here to stay in this industry, and one would be a fool not to take one simply because it might "rub another pilot the wrong way". No personal injury to other pilots is intended, just a course of life.
Regards,
Was there a specific reason that so many failed?
OldHasBeen, I wasn't implying that I would not care if I didn't get along with others than I know, I was simply stating that, as a matter of logic, if I get along with several people already there, it goes to follow that I just *might* get along just fine with others as well...?
I'm sorry you took my earlier comments out of context, but I feel pretty strongly about a certain level of professionalism required for this job and, if it's not present, in either student or instructor, then that person doesn't need to be there and I'm too old to put up with physical assault as a training method.
As for why I wouldn't be an F/O... why should I if they're going to hire DECA's *ANYWAY*...?
The demand for Captains with the delivery schedule these carriers have for the next decade simply cannot be met by internal pilots alone, so SOMEONE is going to have to staff them. Why then, should a pilot, who is qualified for a DECA slot, take an F/O slot when the next pilot in the interview is going to take one of the CA slots anyway and the company will continue to interview and hire DECA's?
I have been a DECA at 2 other companies, both of which are in the U.S. and are STILL looking for DECA 5 - 7 years later. There are DECA slots available at half a dozen carriers in Asia alone. What makes AJX/AJV unique is its lack of requirement for the applicant to be typed for DECA slots and its renumeration package which, arguably, could be higher, but for gaining initial heavy time, it's still better than pay in the U.S., and is a nice base for the beginnings of an international career.
DECA opportunities are here to stay in this industry, and one would be a fool not to take one simply because it might "rub another pilot the wrong way". No personal injury to other pilots is intended, just a course of life.
Regards,
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Lear guy,
The failure rate cannot be simply explained by one single reason in the courses. The decision to cut a pilot is made after carefull consideration and is not one bad Sim. There have been pilots fail the JCAB check and be kept on and retrained as well as guys that won the free trip home, it's often about the attitude of the candidate. At the end of the day if the ANA instructors don't think that you will pass the JCAB check, you will be cut and that's it.
I do tend to support the FOs' here to be upgraded as opposed to DECs' but as you point out there is a demand. In my experience with ANA the DEC window is not open for very long. It was available at the initial set up and now after the division of AJX/AJV and the rapid demand for expansion. It is great to get experienced guys, but ANA are finding it difficult to get well qualified DECs' although we have a lot of very experienced FOs' and it is a bit of rub for them to have to hold the hand of an inexperienced guy especially for this type of flying.
Finally, as I understand it the demand for pilots is mostly in AJX right now, the passenger side.
Gambate ne
The failure rate cannot be simply explained by one single reason in the courses. The decision to cut a pilot is made after carefull consideration and is not one bad Sim. There have been pilots fail the JCAB check and be kept on and retrained as well as guys that won the free trip home, it's often about the attitude of the candidate. At the end of the day if the ANA instructors don't think that you will pass the JCAB check, you will be cut and that's it.
I do tend to support the FOs' here to be upgraded as opposed to DECs' but as you point out there is a demand. In my experience with ANA the DEC window is not open for very long. It was available at the initial set up and now after the division of AJX/AJV and the rapid demand for expansion. It is great to get experienced guys, but ANA are finding it difficult to get well qualified DECs' although we have a lot of very experienced FOs' and it is a bit of rub for them to have to hold the hand of an inexperienced guy especially for this type of flying.
Finally, as I understand it the demand for pilots is mostly in AJX right now, the passenger side.
Gambate ne
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Meguro, thanks for the reply.
I can certainly understand the aggravation of the F/O's who want to upgrade but may not otherwise meet the time requirements.
At Pinnacle several years ago, we had the same thing. Many F/O's who were only 500 or so hours short of the "required" time, yet the company kept hiring DECA's rather than giving the F/O the opportunity to attempt the upgrade. Whether it was for insurance or other reasons, we never knew.
It's always better to upgrade from within, whenever possible, but I'm grateful for the opportunity to interview and, if successful, to get in at the beginning of what I believe will be a long-term expansion in demand for experienced crews worldwide leading to better terms for all of us.
Thanks again, and I look forward to seeing all of you on the line!
p.s. I prefer AJX, so that's not a problem.
I can certainly understand the aggravation of the F/O's who want to upgrade but may not otherwise meet the time requirements.
At Pinnacle several years ago, we had the same thing. Many F/O's who were only 500 or so hours short of the "required" time, yet the company kept hiring DECA's rather than giving the F/O the opportunity to attempt the upgrade. Whether it was for insurance or other reasons, we never knew.
It's always better to upgrade from within, whenever possible, but I'm grateful for the opportunity to interview and, if successful, to get in at the beginning of what I believe will be a long-term expansion in demand for experienced crews worldwide leading to better terms for all of us.
Thanks again, and I look forward to seeing all of you on the line!
p.s. I prefer AJX, so that's not a problem.
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I think the reason for the unhappiness here is that the FOs do meet the time requirements. In fact, there are some FOs here that have over 15,000 hours with significant 767 time who are sitting right seat to guys with a lot less time. Just an observation.
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Lear 70,
The reasons is "timing".
There was a period where AJX/AJV stopped hiring Direct Captains about 2 years ago. So some guys who well and truly qualified to be DEC's under todays hiring criteria and the initial criteria were only offered FO positons. Unfortunately for them, and it must really hurt, 6 months or so after they signed as FO's the companies started hiring Capts again because they can't get enough FO's wanting to come here under the current conditions.
The question was aked if they could now become Captains as they meet all the criteria. The stern reply is always "NO". Far too many Capts in this outfit and not enough FO's. Timing!!
The reasons is "timing".
There was a period where AJX/AJV stopped hiring Direct Captains about 2 years ago. So some guys who well and truly qualified to be DEC's under todays hiring criteria and the initial criteria were only offered FO positons. Unfortunately for them, and it must really hurt, 6 months or so after they signed as FO's the companies started hiring Capts again because they can't get enough FO's wanting to come here under the current conditions.
The question was aked if they could now become Captains as they meet all the criteria. The stern reply is always "NO". Far too many Capts in this outfit and not enough FO's. Timing!!
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JCAB
...How is the structure of the JCAB course and why is that after reading some comments here the whole thing sounds scary and stressful? Besides that one has to study of course for 6 months for it... that is always ugly anywhere in the world!
