Ryanair-Capt's airside/Armed Forces ID bad-Student ID good (Merged)
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AJ,
You seemto have lost the plot here. The soldier in question did not have access to his passport, for sound military reasons.
You seem to have an unquestioning belief in the inflexibility of rules as in the legendary "...like to help you sir/madam but it's more'n my jobsworth".
Perhaps you might reflect on the other approach, namely that rules are made for the obedience of fools and the guidance of wise men.
For what it's worth, I'm a very experienced airline pilot with a huge respect for Ryanair. I just think they've got it badly wrong this time.
Confundemus
You seemto have lost the plot here. The soldier in question did not have access to his passport, for sound military reasons.
You seem to have an unquestioning belief in the inflexibility of rules as in the legendary "...like to help you sir/madam but it's more'n my jobsworth".
Perhaps you might reflect on the other approach, namely that rules are made for the obedience of fools and the guidance of wise men.
For what it's worth, I'm a very experienced airline pilot with a huge respect for Ryanair. I just think they've got it badly wrong this time.
Confundemus
Shining Example, apparently...
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We're at a cleft stick. If Ryanair's rules are strictly for commercial reasons, exceptions might sometimes be appropriate.
If they're strictly for security reasons, exceptions would be reckless. There can be no shades of grey, otherwise you'd get people sweet-talking their way airside with an al-Quaeda membership card.
If they're strictly for security reasons, exceptions would be reckless. There can be no shades of grey, otherwise you'd get people sweet-talking their way airside with an al-Quaeda membership card.
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Pirate,
I am aware that the soldier's passport was kept by his regiment - perhaps for perfectly sound reasons.
However, I simply do not believe Ryanair have got it wrong at all, whatever proverbs you may choose to throw into this argument.
As I have said, their rules are clear. You can choose to ignore them, or plead mercy - this may work, and if does, good for you. But you cannot blame them if they do decide to play by the book - again, most probably for very sound reasons too (and I doubt those have anything to do with gouging more money from customers...)
I also understand this young man's mother actually phoned Ryanair before he had even reached the airport in order to check whether the airline would accept his military ID. The answer was an unambiguous "no".
You decide.
I remain convinced Ryanair acted appropriately.
I apologise if that sounds unreasonable, but that is my opinion.
Playing along with the spirit of your proverb, I suggest a wise man might have been guided, by his good judgement, to comply with Ryanair's Terms & Conditions, knowing full well their tendency towards inflexibility....
I am aware that the soldier's passport was kept by his regiment - perhaps for perfectly sound reasons.
However, I simply do not believe Ryanair have got it wrong at all, whatever proverbs you may choose to throw into this argument.
As I have said, their rules are clear. You can choose to ignore them, or plead mercy - this may work, and if does, good for you. But you cannot blame them if they do decide to play by the book - again, most probably for very sound reasons too (and I doubt those have anything to do with gouging more money from customers...)
I also understand this young man's mother actually phoned Ryanair before he had even reached the airport in order to check whether the airline would accept his military ID. The answer was an unambiguous "no".
You decide.
I remain convinced Ryanair acted appropriately.
I apologise if that sounds unreasonable, but that is my opinion.
Playing along with the spirit of your proverb, I suggest a wise man might have been guided, by his good judgement, to comply with Ryanair's Terms & Conditions, knowing full well their tendency towards inflexibility....
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R707 said
To show his contempt for security personnel at the entrance of a defence establishment down-under, a scientist colleague pasted a photo of a monkey on his security pass and flashed it to the guard when driving through security.
He got away with it once; the next time he spent four hours in security's lock-up.
I've got through security in a mates car flashin a driving licence, a storecard and a library ticket!!!
He got away with it once; the next time he spent four hours in security's lock-up.
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I find this quite worrying. I think many people know here (not Ryanair people, they don't fly longhaul 
) that an international Student ID card can be purchased in BKK for 2$, 10 minutes to wait. While an airline ID card (which allows you to go around the airport!) is much more of a document.
A friend of mine had a problem in CDG at the beginning of this ID procedure for the same reason. But shortly after (I think after the problem was reported) they started accepting it.
If Ryanair employees are smart enough, they should report the problem, and it should be fixed in a short period. Not fixing it would mean at the best carelessness and incompetence.
) that an international Student ID card can be purchased in BKK for 2$, 10 minutes to wait. While an airline ID card (which allows you to go around the airport!) is much more of a document. A friend of mine had a problem in CDG at the beginning of this ID procedure for the same reason. But shortly after (I think after the problem was reported) they started accepting it.
If Ryanair employees are smart enough, they should report the problem, and it should be fixed in a short period. Not fixing it would mean at the best carelessness and incompetence.
What about Mum?
Looks like my dear old Mum will never have the pleasure of a cheap flight with Ryanair. The reason is she has neither a passport or a driving licence. The only photo ID she has is a local authority bus pass........
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Understand the military guarding our airports have been instructed not to accept Ryanair IDs unless accompanied by a student photo ID showing that the subject is enrolled in a full time course on how to be reasonable to their customers.
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Unfortunately the course for Ryanair on PR and how to be nice to your customers was cancelled due to lack of interest
There seems to be some confusion in the posts as to the reasons for the photo ID requirement - if it really is just to say you are who it says on your ticket, then whats the big deal - other than Ryanair might lose out on their £1.99 fare somewhere.
If on the otherhand, as has been suggested that it is an absolute security requirement then I have two questions:-
a) Why do the "mainline" domestic carriers not currently require photo ID
b) If it really is for security then Ryanair would appear to have a rather misplaced sense of security about what an ISIC card proves (or not)
Finally perhaps Ryanair should remember who is really protecting the UK airspace and airports - certainly not the Irish Air Corps with two helicopters and a Cessna 172!
TZ
There seems to be some confusion in the posts as to the reasons for the photo ID requirement - if it really is just to say you are who it says on your ticket, then whats the big deal - other than Ryanair might lose out on their £1.99 fare somewhere.
If on the otherhand, as has been suggested that it is an absolute security requirement then I have two questions:-
a) Why do the "mainline" domestic carriers not currently require photo ID
b) If it really is for security then Ryanair would appear to have a rather misplaced sense of security about what an ISIC card proves (or not)
Finally perhaps Ryanair should remember who is really protecting the UK airspace and airports - certainly not the Irish Air Corps with two helicopters and a Cessna 172!
TZ
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...and the two which stand out most are...
valid photographic forces identity card
valid police warrant card / badge
...both of which are difficult to obtain and are not accepted by the Ryans. Good for Easy here.
From Crepello
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We're at a cleft stick. If Ryanair's rules are strictly for commercial reasons, exceptions might sometimes be appropriate.
If they're strictly for security reasons, exceptions would be reckless. There can be no shades of grey, otherwise you'd get people sweet-talking their way airside with an al-Quaeda membership card.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
How can this be for security when Student Cards are valid forms or ID. This is blatently commercial....remember most students go for the cheapest form of transport...hence Ryan air when flying.
You may need to produce documentation to get an ISIC card but to get hold of an NUS card was a joke when I was studying. Anyone could get hold of an NUS card ...the required documentation to get an ISIC card.
Getting an exception, well if you have Cabinet Ministers requesting that forces ID's be accepted then I think they should consider it.
valid photographic forces identity card
valid police warrant card / badge
...both of which are difficult to obtain and are not accepted by the Ryans. Good for Easy here.
From Crepello
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
We're at a cleft stick. If Ryanair's rules are strictly for commercial reasons, exceptions might sometimes be appropriate.
If they're strictly for security reasons, exceptions would be reckless. There can be no shades of grey, otherwise you'd get people sweet-talking their way airside with an al-Quaeda membership card.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
How can this be for security when Student Cards are valid forms or ID. This is blatently commercial....remember most students go for the cheapest form of transport...hence Ryan air when flying.
You may need to produce documentation to get an ISIC card but to get hold of an NUS card was a joke when I was studying. Anyone could get hold of an NUS card ...the required documentation to get an ISIC card.
Getting an exception, well if you have Cabinet Ministers requesting that forces ID's be accepted then I think they should consider it.
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ahh, found this thread at last. I think most of the arguements have been made but you've missed one corker 
Ryan Air operate in/out of RAF St Mawgan Sure, it sounds nice as "Newquay", but it's an RAF base through and through.
Ryan Air operate in/out of RAF St Mawgan
Sure, it sounds nice as "Newquay", but it's an RAF base through and through.
More of the same thread
Santro,
I did not realise that this particular airline used RAF St Mawgan, but by calling it Newquay.
The problem is therefore solved..,
Station Commander at St Mawgan greets the very next airline arrival and has the entire crew arrested, the charge being that, they are all on MOD / Military premesis without a valid MILITARY ID card. Tough I agree on the lads and lassies, but if the airline management are going to play by these rules, so should the other side. Aircraft itself is impounded of course and not released, as it poses a security threat, it's non UK registered.
I somehow do not think this would happen of course, but just think how good the feeling would be if it did.
Come on Group Captain XXXXXX at St Mawgan, show us what you are made of.
I did not realise that this particular airline used RAF St Mawgan, but by calling it Newquay.
The problem is therefore solved..,
Station Commander at St Mawgan greets the very next airline arrival and has the entire crew arrested, the charge being that, they are all on MOD / Military premesis without a valid MILITARY ID card. Tough I agree on the lads and lassies, but if the airline management are going to play by these rules, so should the other side. Aircraft itself is impounded of course and not released, as it poses a security threat, it's non UK registered.
I somehow do not think this would happen of course, but just think how good the feeling would be if it did.
Come on Group Captain XXXXXX at St Mawgan, show us what you are made of.
MJ.
But perhaps OC Plod could send a couple of his lads over to do a 'routine security check'.
"what's this sir, no international students ID card, then I'm afraid I'll have to ask you to accompany me to the nick"
That would sort 'em out, or maybe MOD could just cancel permission to operate into St. Mawgan 'due to on going operational reasons'
..
But perhaps OC Plod could send a couple of his lads over to do a 'routine security check'.
"what's this sir, no international students ID card, then I'm afraid I'll have to ask you to accompany me to the nick"
That would sort 'em out, or maybe MOD could just cancel permission to operate into St. Mawgan 'due to on going operational reasons'
..
Mmmmm PPruuune!
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As AJ puts so well - It is Ryan Air's right to determine and enforce policy. If that goes against common sense then so be it. One would hope that their policy might be amended but.....
The point that I take out of all of this is their arrogant don't give a s***t attitude. You can be firm and polite but the customer relations attitude they employ seems to beggar belief and is the single most important point in my personal resolve not to ever use them as my carrier of choice.
The point that I take out of all of this is their arrogant don't give a s***t attitude. You can be firm and polite but the customer relations attitude they employ seems to beggar belief and is the single most important point in my personal resolve not to ever use them as my carrier of choice.
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I don't think a security issue like this, which I believe Student ID's really are, has anything to do with cost. Airlines should be doing everything in their power to make sure that the people that board their aircraft are who they say they are. Intelligence Agencies can probe passenger lists looking for suspects, but people that can change a name, grab an easily obtainable student ID and board an aircraft are a real danger.
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There would appear to be a bit of debate here surrounding FR's acceptance of Student ID cards or International Student Identity Cards (ISIC).
I would like to clarify that a Student card issued by a university is NOT acceptable for carriage, but an ISIC card is. This is the situation, for better or worse, but it is an attempt to introduce an element of standardisation for check in staff to allow them to identify acceptable ID (after all, university cards in the Far East, South America, etc will each look different for each uni).
Personally my life would be much easier if forces ID was accepted, but the ISIC situation is actually almost irrelevant - I have maybe only seen 5 pax check in with ISIC cards since the regulations were introduced.
We also need to remember that, rather like pubs or shops, an airline can deny access to their aircraft without giving any reason. FR may have 7 pages of terms and conditions, but unlike EZY (with whom I have recently booked) they do form part of the printout when booking, and you do not need to click on various links on various parts of the website in order to access them.
Read the details when booking with any airline and prevent any disappointment when checking in - simple.
I would like to clarify that a Student card issued by a university is NOT acceptable for carriage, but an ISIC card is. This is the situation, for better or worse, but it is an attempt to introduce an element of standardisation for check in staff to allow them to identify acceptable ID (after all, university cards in the Far East, South America, etc will each look different for each uni).
Personally my life would be much easier if forces ID was accepted, but the ISIC situation is actually almost irrelevant - I have maybe only seen 5 pax check in with ISIC cards since the regulations were introduced.
We also need to remember that, rather like pubs or shops, an airline can deny access to their aircraft without giving any reason. FR may have 7 pages of terms and conditions, but unlike EZY (with whom I have recently booked) they do form part of the printout when booking, and you do not need to click on various links on various parts of the website in order to access them.
Read the details when booking with any airline and prevent any disappointment when checking in - simple.
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You'd think "international students" would also carry passports tbh. Correct me if I'm wrong, but weren't half the terrorists involved in 9/11 "international students"? I'm still waiting for that unruly drunken passenger to create a problem onboard one of FR's flights, which then diverts somewhere and ask the police to remove him and charge him. The same police who's Warrant Cards don't permit them access to the aircraft! Hmm.