FlyBE Pilot Exodus!
Joined: Mar 1999
Posts: 423
Likes: 0
From: NZ
Ace Rimmer
Correct (more or less).
Incorrect. Not even close.
No... sorry. That isn't what is happening at all.
That assumption is based on incorrect information, and is wrong.
Well, the difference there is that my reality is based on the facts, and yours is based on assumptions and second-hand info from dubious sources.
Nice try though...
Smokie
What do we provide as "service" that lo-cos don't? Well, for a start they get to select a seat (rather than join the scrum at the gate), they get basic drinks for free (nothing is free on lo-cos), they get access to special passenger handling at no cost (what does Ryanair charge for a wheelchair lift-off..???), they get access to customer service that consists of more than one person reading from their only "service" from a card: "nothing is our fault, you aren't entitled to anything, read the fine print"... etc. We also have lounges for those who want them, the ability to provide free drinks via a voucher, etc.
FlyBE's announcement that it will base it fleet on D8s and 146's (ie bye bye CRJs) and a conversation with a person who is in a position to influence the course of the company.
Tip off that as mentioned earlier big Jim and co are in discussions with Bomb about trading in the CRJs for more Q400s since confirmed through another source BTW
According to the latest data I have BE has 12 D8s and 15 puffs if a deal is done on the CRJs then you could assume they'd be getting more Q4s than CRJs lets be reasonable and say five so that's hmmm 17 D8s and 15 puffs and that's assumeming that more D8s over and above are not aquired by lease or purchase
Net result, it appears reasonable does it not to assume therefore that the airline will have more T/Ps than jets in the future and that further for those flying for the airline there will be more T/P slots than jets?
Dosent seem too big a flight of fancy to me...but there you go my reality might be a little different yours.
Nice try though...
Smokie
What do we provide as "service" that lo-cos don't? Well, for a start they get to select a seat (rather than join the scrum at the gate), they get basic drinks for free (nothing is free on lo-cos), they get access to special passenger handling at no cost (what does Ryanair charge for a wheelchair lift-off..???), they get access to customer service that consists of more than one person reading from their only "service" from a card: "nothing is our fault, you aren't entitled to anything, read the fine print"... etc. We also have lounges for those who want them, the ability to provide free drinks via a voucher, etc.
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 40
Likes: 0
From: SW of BHX
I see Flybe is still being managed in the very same way as ever, -the out of touch,smug down shifters from the far end of the M5 will never make a go of FlyBe and it is time the trustees blew away the whole managment team from cabin services right upto and including the CEO.
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
From: UK
???RD???
RD You seem to have your head buried very deep in a beach on some desrt island!!!
You're saying you'd prefer to get paid 14000 less plus all that sector pay to fly a jurassic jet on short sectors, and get no/very little feedback from management???!!!
Maybe you're just bitter as you "declined an offer of employment from easyJet"???
I may be mad but I'm sure flying a 737 throughout Europe with very few nightstops and much more money is much better for your family and career?
You're saying you'd prefer to get paid 14000 less plus all that sector pay to fly a jurassic jet on short sectors, and get no/very little feedback from management???!!!
Maybe you're just bitter as you "declined an offer of employment from easyJet"???
I may be mad but I'm sure flying a 737 throughout Europe with very few nightstops and much more money is much better for your family and career?
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 48
Likes: 0
From: East Mids, UK
Ohbehave...
What you mean you can't take the puff everywhere..give us 1300m of tarmac,mate.
Makes a hell of alot of noise.............only when the flaps go down !
puddlejumper..
146 rated crews from BMC, one year on about 25 of the 60 odd have jobs so still plenty of ratings to go around...
What you mean you can't take the puff everywhere..give us 1300m of tarmac,mate.
Makes a hell of alot of noise.............only when the flaps go down !
puddlejumper..
146 rated crews from BMC, one year on about 25 of the 60 odd have jobs so still plenty of ratings to go around...
Thread Starter
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
From: UK of course
If me Julie looked like a one four six, I wouldn’t take her to the pub with me!
Which is a bad idea anyway.
Noise? Sorry can’t hear what you’re saying, the flaps just went UP again.
BTW those leaking door seals aren’t helping either. (ask your cabin crew).
Which is a bad idea anyway.
Noise? Sorry can’t hear what you’re saying, the flaps just went UP again.
BTW those leaking door seals aren’t helping either. (ask your cabin crew).
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 50
Likes: 0
RD,
You may thing that FlyBe is a much better place than easyJet. I have been in both(146), and I make £1000 more every month, for 40 sectors/70hrs, 2 nightstop. We're not using any Cat C airport at the moment but ABZ, INV and even LTN are sort of shortfield for the the 737. Nice (NCE) is always an exciting approach to fly. Please, the easy network is not fantastic but don't tell me that the FlyBe network is much better.
I don't want to criticize a former employer here, but I think you're not in position to criticize the working condition of an airline you never fly with. There is lot of details (roster, training, maintenance, 737NG, people, ...) about easyJet you are missing.
In my opinion, FlyBe was not a bad place, but easyjet is better.
Regards
You may thing that FlyBe is a much better place than easyJet. I have been in both(146), and I make £1000 more every month, for 40 sectors/70hrs, 2 nightstop. We're not using any Cat C airport at the moment but ABZ, INV and even LTN are sort of shortfield for the the 737. Nice (NCE) is always an exciting approach to fly. Please, the easy network is not fantastic but don't tell me that the FlyBe network is much better.
I don't want to criticize a former employer here, but I think you're not in position to criticize the working condition of an airline you never fly with. There is lot of details (roster, training, maintenance, 737NG, people, ...) about easyJet you are missing.
In my opinion, FlyBe was not a bad place, but easyjet is better.
Regards
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 713
Likes: 0
From: 52N 20E
RD,
Looks like you're gettin longdicked here matey, surely you can't be the only one that's right ?
Oh ! and by the way, we have another one on early release to the big "O" starts end of Jan, handed in their notice a couple of days ago aswell ! Not to mention the Birmingham 7 !!!
( Now where have I heard that before)
Just a thought , I notice none of our newly painted have
"Be.Special " on them yet, can't think why !
Whisperbrick,
You mean to say that you've not had the 1199 privilege yet ?
Jacksman,
Like your style mate.
So off 't Pub fur last orders to reflect on all the carnage .....
YES, THERE'S GOING TO BE CARNAGE MATEY !!
Looks like you're gettin longdicked here matey, surely you can't be the only one that's right ?
Oh ! and by the way, we have another one on early release to the big "O" starts end of Jan, handed in their notice a couple of days ago aswell ! Not to mention the Birmingham 7 !!!
( Now where have I heard that before)
Just a thought , I notice none of our newly painted have
"Be.Special " on them yet, can't think why !
Whisperbrick,
You mean to say that you've not had the 1199 privilege yet ?
Jacksman,
Like your style mate.
So off 't Pub fur last orders to reflect on all the carnage .....
YES, THERE'S GOING TO BE CARNAGE MATEY !!
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 57
Likes: 0
From: UK
Lay off me 146!!!!
Oh Behave!
Hey up lad! Lay off me beloved 146. It's a reet good first jet, and as I said on t'previous forum that were scrubbed, it's not about what you fly, it's all about where you fly into. By eck, yon moderator chap needs to lighten up a bit and let folks express themselves. Only time I went to a kickstart meeting, when I was there, the chief pilots size nine imprint was on me backside for weeks afterwards!
Before anyone says anything, I think 0-5 away to Villa was quite acceptable!
Hey up lad! Lay off me beloved 146. It's a reet good first jet, and as I said on t'previous forum that were scrubbed, it's not about what you fly, it's all about where you fly into. By eck, yon moderator chap needs to lighten up a bit and let folks express themselves. Only time I went to a kickstart meeting, when I was there, the chief pilots size nine imprint was on me backside for weeks afterwards!
Before anyone says anything, I think 0-5 away to Villa was quite acceptable!
Last edited by perseus; 5th December 2002 at 23:59.
Joined: Mar 1999
Posts: 423
Likes: 0
From: NZ
Jacksman
Well, you may think that going from deep in the crapper to break-even, in a year when many other carriers have either gone to the wall, or at the very least shed a bunch of pilots and aircraft, is bad management. I disagree. The fact is, that if our management were anything less than very good indeed, we would all be unemployed by now. I think you need to get out more.
carlos vandango
Somebody emailed me anonymously and objected to your statement. I have no idea why. Anyway, they claim that "BA CitiExpress pilots don't get any thing like 56k 'for drivin 146's & pencils' without 10 years of service at any rate. Try base jet pay of £49905 + £1 hr flt pay."
So there you go...
DIAMOND2000
Actually I get a lot of feedback from management. I guess I have become adept at using a telephone keypad.
I think the point you need to take on board, is that I did the declining. And for good reason- at the time, Easy crews were doing a lot of night-stopping and generally working their butts off. No thanks.
How do I know this? I know 7 pilots who work for them. It gives me a good picture.
Actually the money is virtually the same, as I have three "extra" jobs with Flybe (ie training and some other stuff). If I went in as an F/O (which apparently you have to now if you have been tainted by the evil 146), I would take a major pay cut. No thanks.
dik dastardly
Gee, you must think you are really clever, however the very fact that it is there should tell you it isn't a secret... doh!
Nice of you to try though, I only hope I can do the same for you one day.
acm
Actually, no, I don't think that at all. I went through the process with them and was offered a job. I declined. It is perfect for some, not for others. I prefer the stability of knowing my base is secure, flying into the fun airports I mentioned, and being involved in training and other "extra-curricular" activities with flybe that I wouldn't have the opportunity to do in Easyjet.
Not really. As mentioned above, I know a few people in Easy and got a pretty clear picture about how the airline works in practice. It's not for me- if you enjoy it, well, great.
Fine. My roster has about 50 hours on it this month. Money similar if you factor the duty pay for less hours. Whatever.
Well, you may think that going from deep in the crapper to break-even, in a year when many other carriers have either gone to the wall, or at the very least shed a bunch of pilots and aircraft, is bad management. I disagree. The fact is, that if our management were anything less than very good indeed, we would all be unemployed by now. I think you need to get out more.
carlos vandango
Somebody emailed me anonymously and objected to your statement. I have no idea why. Anyway, they claim that "BA CitiExpress pilots don't get any thing like 56k 'for drivin 146's & pencils' without 10 years of service at any rate. Try base jet pay of £49905 + £1 hr flt pay."
So there you go...
DIAMOND2000
You're saying you'd prefer to get paid 14000 less plus all that sector pay to fly a jurassic jet on short sectors, and get no/very little feedback from management???!!!
Maybe you're just bitter as you "declined an offer of employment from easyJet"???
How do I know this? I know 7 pilots who work for them. It gives me a good picture.
I may be mad but I'm sure flying a 737 throughout Europe with very few nightstops and much more money is much better for your family and career?
dik dastardly
Gee, you must think you are really clever, however the very fact that it is there should tell you it isn't a secret... doh!
Nice of you to try though, I only hope I can do the same for you one day.acm
You may thing that FlyBe is a much better place than easyJet
I think you're not in position to criticize the working condition of an airline you never fly with. There is lot of details (roster, training, maintenance, 737NG, people, ...) about easyJet you are missing.
I make £1000 more every month, for 40 sectors/70hrs
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 713
Likes: 0
From: 52N 20E
Ah Carlos ! and I thought the complaint would have been about EZYs New "Large Flight Deck" sim !..... Never mind .
As for drawing straws, well apparently if you can pull off a negatively, vertically, parallel track towards a nav aid of the examiners choice, then you also get another free go at the ILS !
The mind really does boggle though considering the very,very, high quality of candidates that were Royaly Shafted last summer in the "Orange Box" that supposedly represented a "SIM" down at CTC.
I wonder if the EZY management will be sent Xmas prezzies this year ?
Yep ! there's going to be Carnage Matey, and not just at FlyBe.xxxxxx. !!
As for drawing straws, well apparently if you can pull off a negatively, vertically, parallel track towards a nav aid of the examiners choice, then you also get another free go at the ILS !
The mind really does boggle though considering the very,very, high quality of candidates that were Royaly Shafted last summer in the "Orange Box" that supposedly represented a "SIM" down at CTC.
I wonder if the EZY management will be sent Xmas prezzies this year ?
Yep ! there's going to be Carnage Matey, and not just at FlyBe.xxxxxx. !!
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 366
Likes: 0
From: Horsham UK
Raw Data:
As a good journo I can't of course reveal my sources
But (and here's the thing) If you are, as your profile suggests a line pilot, then I suspect that my source is better placed to know what's going on in the minds of Fly BE management's than you are.
Well, the difference there is that my reality is based on the facts, and yours is based on assumptions and second-hand info from dubious sources.
But (and here's the thing) If you are, as your profile suggests a line pilot, then I suspect that my source is better placed to know what's going on in the minds of Fly BE management's than you are.
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 457
Likes: 2
From: Down a Tin mine......
For Info
Just to add my twopenny's worth,
From what i've heard the plan is to dispose of the CRJ's to a foreign operator, in return for this we will get the last 8 Dash8-400's from the production line at Bombardier and from next year the Dash8-300's and 200's will be diposed off leaving us with a fleet off Dash8-400's (12 in total) and 146's. Yes some of the 146's are being disposed of - but these are all the lightweight a/c and we possible might be gaining a additional 146 to to replace one of the one's that are being disposed off.
Personally i enjoy working at flybe i know off several of my collegues from a previous airline that i worked for who now work for the orange mob and they are regretting it and can't wait to move on from there - So perhap's the grass is not greener on the other side - every airline has it's faults and we are NO different.
From what i've heard the plan is to dispose of the CRJ's to a foreign operator, in return for this we will get the last 8 Dash8-400's from the production line at Bombardier and from next year the Dash8-300's and 200's will be diposed off leaving us with a fleet off Dash8-400's (12 in total) and 146's. Yes some of the 146's are being disposed of - but these are all the lightweight a/c and we possible might be gaining a additional 146 to to replace one of the one's that are being disposed off.
Personally i enjoy working at flybe i know off several of my collegues from a previous airline that i worked for who now work for the orange mob and they are regretting it and can't wait to move on from there - So perhap's the grass is not greener on the other side - every airline has it's faults and we are NO different.
Joined: Mar 1999
Posts: 423
Likes: 0
From: NZ
dik dastardly
I guess you could say I have no time for dik-heads.
Ace Rimmer
Apart from the fact that I actually talk to said management, and you don't, of course...
Whispering Giant
Well, that's a bit closer to the truth. Except you have under-estimated the final 146 count...
I guess you could say I have no time for dik-heads.
Ace Rimmer
then I suspect that my source is better placed to know what's going on in the minds of Fly BE management's than you are
Whispering Giant
Well, that's a bit closer to the truth. Except you have under-estimated the final 146 count...
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 457
Likes: 2
From: Down a Tin mine......
146 Fleet.
From the information i've seen - i believe the company are looking at a fleet of between 10-12 146's but this is to be confirmed - so that we would have a equal fleet of 146's and Dash8-400's. But i agree that the company for it's long term development should look at comanly produced a/c type instead of what is being re-ported in one of the magazine's that we are considering the Embraer190-195, nice that these a/c maybe on paper but they will in the long run be more expensive and not as cost effetive as a Boeing or Airbus product...
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 64
Likes: 0
From: Operate from Somerset International.
Whispering Giant & Raw Data!
.....I can offer you a couple of Boeing 737-800 (189 config) CAT3a LVP, A Boeing 767-200 (290 Config) CAT1a.
Oh I'm sorry we're a charter company, I totally forgot FlyBE don't do those do they........?! - CMF/SZG etc, etc.
Hey take your pick Guys!
What ever the company does as it's main bread & butter, you'll ALWAYS get someone who isn't happy. If it's not roster stability, it's who's sitting next to them!
I would have thought that RD would have a more information than most as he is on the Employee Forum (aren't you?). FlyBE would be great if there weren't so many Empire builders and if EVERYONE sang from the same hymn sheet!
"You can please some of the people some of the time, but never all the people all of the time!"
.....Mind you I left over two years ago!
Oh I'm sorry we're a charter company, I totally forgot FlyBE don't do those do they........?! - CMF/SZG etc, etc.
Hey take your pick Guys!
What ever the company does as it's main bread & butter, you'll ALWAYS get someone who isn't happy. If it's not roster stability, it's who's sitting next to them!
I would have thought that RD would have a more information than most as he is on the Employee Forum (aren't you?). FlyBE would be great if there weren't so many Empire builders and if EVERYONE sang from the same hymn sheet!
"You can please some of the people some of the time, but never all the people all of the time!"
.....Mind you I left over two years ago!