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Anyone got some T-cut?

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Anyone got some T-cut?

Old 23rd May 2018, 23:18
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Anyone got some T-cut?

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Old 24th May 2018, 06:18
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Apparently it was being towed to the gate. Given the significant number of wingtip collisions over recent years (towing or taxiing), is it time to consider tech that can detect wingtip obstacles and alert pilots/handlers?
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Old 24th May 2018, 07:42
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San Francisco
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Old 24th May 2018, 08:11
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Tip of Aer Lingus Plane Wing Hits Concrete Wall at SFO; No Injuries Reported

"A commercial jet that landed at San Francisco International Airport on Wednesday afternoon hit a concrete wall while being towed to a gate, according to an airport spokesman".

Towed to a gate? Passengers reportedly stuck on board for an hour.
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Old 24th May 2018, 09:16
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Towed to a gate?
A common event for certain gates at certain airports in the USA.
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Old 24th May 2018, 16:31
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My Ford has efficient proximity sensors! Ok, it will be more complex on an aircraft to tug situation - but surely not impossible. Commercial opportunity for someone!
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Old 24th May 2018, 17:06
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For some reason I looked at the picture and thought 'SFO'.

The tech exists for collision avoidance, it probably wouldn't weigh too much either, but the logistics of getting it installed on everything that needs it would be a massive job (although every successful project has to start somewhere). You've got to retrofit the aircraft, having first determined that it's going to work satisfactorily, then find a way of communicating with the tug, possibly via radio as it's short range, then you have to retrofit the tugs. I guess if it's radio based then retrofitting tugs is easy, a new box on the dash with a big red light on it and a power cord. As it's only intended for low-speed ground operation the certification process may not be too bad.

You still wouldn't catch all of the incidents though, only the wingtip ones. Way harder to stop a wing leading edge from hitting something if the Mk 1 eyeball has failed. Thinking here of the recent incident slicing off a tail fin - that was inboard of the wingtip.
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Old 24th May 2018, 17:11
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Originally Posted by rationalfunctions View Post
is it time to consider tech that can detect wingtip obstacles and alert pilots/handlers?

They have them, they're called the MK 1 eyeballs.
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Old 24th May 2018, 18:25
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One passenger in the terminal got some really close-up pictures of the wingtip, followed by dozens of media requests to use them:


Last edited by bnt; 25th May 2018 at 10:35.
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Old 24th May 2018, 18:55
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I note that Aer Lingus operate both the A330-200 and -300 series. Both types share the same wingspan of 60.3m. However, the 300 is 4.60m longer. I have no idea if it makes any difference to how the tug initiates the turn into the gate but would be interested to know from someone in the know.
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Old 24th May 2018, 20:37
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It's a VERY tight space there. The photo is actually taken from the short-term car park, which is what the wing tip has hit.

Several years ago I was picking up my wife and just as we were about to get in the car, a tug managed to create an entanglement between a plane it was pushing back, and the Qantas 747 that spends all afternoon and evening parked in a corner - in this same place. As far as we could tell nothing had actually hit anything, but they couldn't figure out how to undo the situation without making it worse. I kept an eye on things when I got home and the plane did eventually depart several hours later, presumably after an inspection.
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Old 24th May 2018, 20:56
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If Aer Lingus park round the back of International Terminal A where BA parked when I flew the B744 for them, I can confirm it's pretty tight round there when taxying with a good look out on both sides required (not as tight as taxying onto JFK Terminal 7 stand 3 or 9, but still).

Under tow though? Complacency? Poor training? Who knows...
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Old 24th May 2018, 21:05
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Originally Posted by Hotel Tango View Post
I note that Aer Lingus operate both the A330-200 and -300 series. Both types share the same wingspan of 60.3m. However, the 300 is 4.60m longer. I have no idea if it makes any difference to how the tug initiates the turn into the gate but would be interested to know from someone in the know.
Interesting. This was an A333.
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Old 24th May 2018, 21:12
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Old 25th May 2018, 06:49
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Wonder if they used a tub of Vaseline to ease it out.
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Old 25th May 2018, 06:58
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Originally Posted by rationalfunctions View Post
Apparently it was being towed to the gate. Given the significant number of wingtip collisions over recent years (towing or taxiing), is it time to consider tech that can detect wingtip obstacles and alert pilots/handlers?
You dont need technology, the only requirement is a set of eyes and the common sense to stop if you dont like what you see.
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Old 25th May 2018, 07:21
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Originally Posted by Exit Strategy View Post
You dont need technology, the only requirement is a set of eyes and the common sense to stop if you dont like what you see.
Unfortunately something is going wrong with either the MK 1 eyeballs or 'common sense' if there are ongoing taxiing and towing incidents. Agree with llondell that it would likely have some complexities with retrofitting and interfaces, but if a lightweight solution is available then surely worth it rather than paying out insurance + reputational damage?
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Old 25th May 2018, 08:33
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What about a temporary attachment? You (somehow!?) attach proximity transmitters to the wingtips / tail - simple strapon or clamp - and have the prox receiver in the tug. No need to retrofit at $xx,000,000, just a local kit to get used repeatedly on multiple aircraft.

You’re welcome........

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Old 25th May 2018, 08:34
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The amount of times I've seen those 'wingmen' in the US waving their batons (basically to say 'keep 'er comin'') as we pull onto stand, whilst looking everywhere BUT the wingtip... I expect that's what happened in this scenario.

Towing onto a tight stand is common in the US. EWR is another place where they do this.
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Old 25th May 2018, 09:47
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Originally Posted by TopBunk View Post
If Aer Lingus park round the back of International Terminal A where BA parked when I flew the B744 for them, I can confirm it's pretty tight round there when taxying with a good look out on both sides required (not as tight as taxying onto JFK Terminal 7 stand 3 or 9, but still).
The photos appear to show he was being towed on to G91, which is the innermost stand in the 45° angle between International Pier G and the parking garage/International train station.

GE suggests there is approximately 120 feet between the curved yellow stand lead-in and the station piers at the closest point - half an A333's wingspan is 99 feet ...
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