Airport Incident
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Airport Incident
Taken from my Oldham Chronicle newspaper.
'AN inquiry has been launched after a JMC airlines Boeing 757 collided with a tug which was towing it from the terminal building at Manchester Airport, this morning.
The 234 passengers on board had to leave the aircraft as engineers checked for damage after the 7.30am accident.
A JMC spokesman said the holidaymakers would be delayed for about three-and-a-half hours while a replacement airliner was brought in.'
Does anyone know how this might have happened?
Does anyone know if anybody was injured?
cheers
Dave
'AN inquiry has been launched after a JMC airlines Boeing 757 collided with a tug which was towing it from the terminal building at Manchester Airport, this morning.
The 234 passengers on board had to leave the aircraft as engineers checked for damage after the 7.30am accident.
A JMC spokesman said the holidaymakers would be delayed for about three-and-a-half hours while a replacement airliner was brought in.'
Does anyone know how this might have happened?
Does anyone know if anybody was injured?
cheers
Dave
Ground crew clearance received?
The aircraft collided with the tug after it had been disconnected following push back. The aircraft either rolled forward or commenced taxiing before the ground crew and tug were clear.
This sort of incident has happened in the past at BA and it is drummed into us not to request taxi clearance until both the tug and headset operator are clear and flaps deployed to T/O setting.
It's all on the checklist........
This sort of incident has happened in the past at BA and it is drummed into us not to request taxi clearance until both the tug and headset operator are clear and flaps deployed to T/O setting.
It's all on the checklist........
From what I could see this morning the tug was one of those towbarless ones and the a/c had moved forward and jammed it's nose wheels between the twp outriggers of the tug.
A major operation was in progress with air bags under the fwd & aft fuselage to support the weight whilst a lot of folks stood around scratching their heads and taking photos!!
By all accounts the a/c sustained minor damage but the tug was a mess. Which makes a change considering some of the recent posts concerning ground equipment and damage to a/c.
Now then, where are all those PRUNERS who were demanding that any ground staff that damage an a/c on the ramp should be immediately sacked????
Ahhh, the beautiful sound of silence!!!
A major operation was in progress with air bags under the fwd & aft fuselage to support the weight whilst a lot of folks stood around scratching their heads and taking photos!!
By all accounts the a/c sustained minor damage but the tug was a mess. Which makes a change considering some of the recent posts concerning ground equipment and damage to a/c.
Now then, where are all those PRUNERS who were demanding that any ground staff that damage an a/c on the ramp should be immediately sacked????
Ahhh, the beautiful sound of silence!!!
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ETOPS -
I am surprised that you didn't realize that the problem was total brake failure while the engines were at full idle!!
What ATPL would ever begin their taxi before receiving clearence from the headset operator and "clearing" the tug out of the way??
I am surprised that you didn't realize that the problem was total brake failure while the engines were at full idle!!
What ATPL would ever begin their taxi before receiving clearence from the headset operator and "clearing" the tug out of the way??
Controversial, moi?
while the engines were at full idle!!
What ATPL would ever begin their taxi before receiving clearence from the headset operator and "clearing" the tug out of the way??
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Not saying that the MAN incident was the same cause, but aircraft taxiing before the tug has cleared does happen, even if checklisted. Found an example in November's AAIB bulletin of a BA 744 at LHR taxiing then colliding with the tug after pushback.
http://www.aaib.dtlr.gov.uk/bulletin/nov01/gcivb.htm
http://www.aaib.dtlr.gov.uk/bulletin/nov01/gcivb.htm
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AA SLF
Can't possibly have been an ATPL holders fault they never make mistakes do they!!!!!!!!
B******S
What ATPL would ever begin their taxi before receiving clearence from the headset operator and "clearing" the tug out of the way??
B******S
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HotDog -
All I know is what I read from the posts above mine. That's why I said it must have been brake failure - probably with a severly sloping ramp. I would never say that an ATPL holder ("although others might say it") would EVER begin to taxi without clearing the right-of-way. However - M.Mouse, I believe, implies that that might have happened more than once in the past. Hard to imagine though, the ATPL profession being so "professional" and all. Could it have been the BIG WATCH obscuring the PIC's view??
Checklists, checklists - what checklist? What - me worry? Nah.
Yea though I ride through the Valley of Death, I shall fear naught, for I am the meanest rooten-tooten sun-of-a-gun on this planet. (paraphrasing the well known quote).
It had to be brake failure!!
All I know is what I read from the posts above mine. That's why I said it must have been brake failure - probably with a severly sloping ramp.
I would never say that an ATPL holder ("although others might say it") would EVER begin to taxi without clearing the right-of-way. However - M.Mouse, I believe, implies that that might have happened more than once in the past. Hard to imagine though, the ATPL profession being so "professional" and all. Could it have been the BIG WATCH obscuring the PIC's view?? Checklists, checklists - what checklist? What - me worry? Nah.
Yea though I ride through the Valley of Death, I shall fear naught, for I am the meanest rooten-tooten sun-of-a-gun on this planet. (paraphrasing the well known quote).
It had to be brake failure!!
Delay? What delay?
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Not wanting to cast aspersions on the diligence of my colleagues in the flight deck, I have first hand experience of taxi-ing before ground staff are clear of the aircraft. A large airliner with three engines once rolled right over the top of me after I had done the headset. I was obviously quite surprised at the time as I was just walking to the side to show him my pretty red ribbon with the pin on the end. I wont say who or when but it happened. In this instanceat MAN, whilst the incident might not have threatened the lives of the passengers or crew I bet the poor guy in the tug was a tad concerned! Accidents happen, its our job to try and mitigate the chances of them happening.
Jumping to conclusions?
It must have been brake failure
You're not a CNN journalist by any chance are you?
Wait for the AAIB report - it might take a while but the real reason will be there for all to see.........
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ETOPS and all others -
My posting was in "jest", or possible sarcasm. Just being a bit of a "wisea**" and trying to see if the Big Watches would rise to the bait. I normally hangout in JB, where fun in postings is a regular occurance. I should have known that trying some "fun" in R&N just wouldn't go over at all!!
NO - I am not a CNN person, nor a journalist of any kind. Look how poorly I put my words togather in my postings. Embarassment is the operative word.
Just a humble software person who flies his butt off every week on AA all over the globe (Oneworld mostly overseas - I like Nigel but they are expensive; the BIG RAT also expensive).
ps - I think you have one of the better "signature" lines. I really like it as it is in a "fun" type of statement. FUN, did say that?
In any case ATPLs, hang in there if you can, airtravel will return to normal someday - and GOOD LUCK to y'all in any event.
See - that's my serious side.
My posting was in "jest", or possible sarcasm. Just being a bit of a "wisea**" and trying to see if the Big Watches would rise to the bait. I normally hangout in JB, where fun in postings is a regular occurance. I should have known that trying some "fun" in R&N just wouldn't go over at all!!
NO - I am not a CNN person, nor a journalist of any kind. Look how poorly I put my words togather in my postings. Embarassment is the operative word.
Just a humble software person who flies his butt off every week on AA all over the globe (Oneworld mostly overseas - I like Nigel but they are expensive; the BIG RAT also expensive).
ps - I think you have one of the better "signature" lines. I really like it as it is in a "fun" type of statement. FUN, did say that?
In any case ATPLs, hang in there if you can, airtravel will return to normal someday - and GOOD LUCK to y'all in any event.
See - that's my serious side.
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Recently had 737 crew forget to set brakes.....started to roll forward as Despatcher was in the nose-wheel bay removing the bypass pin.
Result....one very shaken Despatcher but could definitely have been worse!
Result....one very shaken Despatcher but could definitely have been worse!
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From AA SLF's post on page 1:
The most memorable such incident I ever saw in person was in YSCB in the very early 70’s when HM was out touring the colonies and was doing so in Ron Raff’s VIP BAC111. Come her departure from YSCB, (with the whole nine yards of pomp and circumstance, including the GG, the PM and camera crews from all four Australian television networks along with a relatively large crowd of onlookers), it was very, very windy.
Let’s set the scene in detail so it’s quite clear in everyone’s mind. YSCB’s VIP apron is to the south of the 34 Squadron hangar, with the area for the guard of honour and the seats for VIPs immediately in front of it. The VIP aircraft always line up facing east so the VIPs can turn for one last photo op and give their adoring subjects one last wave before they step through the aircraft door and have their first (doubtlessly long awaited) gin and tonic.
In Canberra, there’s frequently a westerly wind, more often than not a strong westerly wind (which is fortuitous, since it means the hats of the guard of honour end up strewn among the parked helicopters rather than out on the active runway, which is immediately to the west of the apron).
And as I’ve said already, this day it was very, very windy. So much so, that the captain of the VIP BAC111, (for the sake of anonymity, we’ll call him “Flight Lieutenant Smith”), decided it was too strong to start the engines with his tail into wind.
Now logic would dictate a reeeeeaaaaaly simple answer to a problem as straightforward as that ….wouldn’t it? Park the aircraft into wind for engine start.
Ahhh, no, dear reader. You are not allowing for the (senior) military mind.
The PowersThatBe decided that it would be completely beneath HM’s dignity to have to board the aircraft through the smaller catering door on the right side of the aircraft if the -111 was facing west. And they couldn’t have her walking all the way around to the far side of the aircraft to ascend the steps out of sight of the cameras and the adoring crowd. She would have to board as usual and the aircraft would have to be parked as usual and “Flt Lt Smith” would have to deal with it.
So, dutiful young officer that he was, “Flt Lt Smith” followed orders. HM arrived, inspected the (mostly hatless) guard of honour, said goodbye to the GG and the PM, ascended the steps, turned for her last wave to the crowd, allowing the cameramen to get their all-important one last photo op, and the doors were closed and the steps pulled away. Now “Flt Lt Smith” wasn’t particularly happy with his orders, so he decided that he’d start only one engine while his tail was facing into wind and turn the aircraft into wind before he started his second engine. Doubtlessly, he informed the groundcrew of this and thoroughly briefed them on this non-SOP procedure. And everyone understood exactly what the other would be doing. …right? Right.
“Flt Lt Smith” proceeded to start the first engine, doubtlessly watching the EGT gauge very closely to ensure the strong tailwind didn’t cause an overtemp. He then obtained taxi clearance…
…and with every dignitary in the land and four television network camera crews filming his every move, proceeded to taxi (not very smoothly) over the chocks, which were still in place. Now considerable power is required to get the aircraft over the chocks even with both engines operating. With only one, it must be somewhere near takeoff thrust. (It sounded like it to the assembly.)
I’m not sure what was the more arresting sight – the way the aircraft lurched drunkenly as it flopped back to earth having finally scaled the chocks with power rapidly returning towards idle, or the hapless engineer, who was still attached to the left side of aircraft by his headset lead. On the outside of the turn, he was running at full tilt as the -111 turned away from the crowd, blasting them with not inconsiderable jet efflux. What he was saying to “Flt Lt Smith” I don’t know, but I don’t think it was quite within the bounds of normal enlisted man-to-officer military protocol.
I’ve always wondered at the scene inside the aircraft cabin, with the Royal party quite possibly on their Royal derrieres on the floor, and I’ve often wondered at the PA “Flt Lt Smith” might have made after departure.
If anyone believes this unlikely tale might be untrue, I’m sure there is quite memorable footage of the incident in the film archives of all four Australian television networks.
What ATPL would ever begin their taxi before receiving clearence from the headset operator and "clearing" the tug out of the way??
The most memorable such incident I ever saw in person was in YSCB in the very early 70’s when HM was out touring the colonies and was doing so in Ron Raff’s VIP BAC111. Come her departure from YSCB, (with the whole nine yards of pomp and circumstance, including the GG, the PM and camera crews from all four Australian television networks along with a relatively large crowd of onlookers), it was very, very windy.
Let’s set the scene in detail so it’s quite clear in everyone’s mind. YSCB’s VIP apron is to the south of the 34 Squadron hangar, with the area for the guard of honour and the seats for VIPs immediately in front of it. The VIP aircraft always line up facing east so the VIPs can turn for one last photo op and give their adoring subjects one last wave before they step through the aircraft door and have their first (doubtlessly long awaited) gin and tonic.
In Canberra, there’s frequently a westerly wind, more often than not a strong westerly wind (which is fortuitous, since it means the hats of the guard of honour end up strewn among the parked helicopters rather than out on the active runway, which is immediately to the west of the apron).
And as I’ve said already, this day it was very, very windy. So much so, that the captain of the VIP BAC111, (for the sake of anonymity, we’ll call him “Flight Lieutenant Smith”), decided it was too strong to start the engines with his tail into wind.
Now logic would dictate a reeeeeaaaaaly simple answer to a problem as straightforward as that ….wouldn’t it? Park the aircraft into wind for engine start.
Ahhh, no, dear reader. You are not allowing for the (senior) military mind.
The PowersThatBe decided that it would be completely beneath HM’s dignity to have to board the aircraft through the smaller catering door on the right side of the aircraft if the -111 was facing west. And they couldn’t have her walking all the way around to the far side of the aircraft to ascend the steps out of sight of the cameras and the adoring crowd. She would have to board as usual and the aircraft would have to be parked as usual and “Flt Lt Smith” would have to deal with it.
So, dutiful young officer that he was, “Flt Lt Smith” followed orders. HM arrived, inspected the (mostly hatless) guard of honour, said goodbye to the GG and the PM, ascended the steps, turned for her last wave to the crowd, allowing the cameramen to get their all-important one last photo op, and the doors were closed and the steps pulled away. Now “Flt Lt Smith” wasn’t particularly happy with his orders, so he decided that he’d start only one engine while his tail was facing into wind and turn the aircraft into wind before he started his second engine. Doubtlessly, he informed the groundcrew of this and thoroughly briefed them on this non-SOP procedure. And everyone understood exactly what the other would be doing. …right? Right.
“Flt Lt Smith” proceeded to start the first engine, doubtlessly watching the EGT gauge very closely to ensure the strong tailwind didn’t cause an overtemp. He then obtained taxi clearance…
…and with every dignitary in the land and four television network camera crews filming his every move, proceeded to taxi (not very smoothly) over the chocks, which were still in place. Now considerable power is required to get the aircraft over the chocks even with both engines operating. With only one, it must be somewhere near takeoff thrust. (It sounded like it to the assembly.)
I’m not sure what was the more arresting sight – the way the aircraft lurched drunkenly as it flopped back to earth having finally scaled the chocks with power rapidly returning towards idle, or the hapless engineer, who was still attached to the left side of aircraft by his headset lead. On the outside of the turn, he was running at full tilt as the -111 turned away from the crowd, blasting them with not inconsiderable jet efflux. What he was saying to “Flt Lt Smith” I don’t know, but I don’t think it was quite within the bounds of normal enlisted man-to-officer military protocol.
I’ve always wondered at the scene inside the aircraft cabin, with the Royal party quite possibly on their Royal derrieres on the floor, and I’ve often wondered at the PA “Flt Lt Smith” might have made after departure.
If anyone believes this unlikely tale might be untrue, I’m sure there is quite memorable footage of the incident in the film archives of all four Australian television networks.