RYANAIR FIRE PILOT UNION CHAIRMAN
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Loc-out,
but I`m sure you would like the pilots up front to be rested when you enjoy the service in the back. Where are you actually coming from? According to your profile you are aircrew, and as such I would have expected a slightly different attitude. It could happen to you too one day.
SBYM,
thank you for your info. If this is the case, I would like to know the Ryanair Pilot Union opinion, and what they are going to do about it. I am sure there will be sufficient backing from the international community of pilots. May be not from Loc-out and some of his friends, but so what. You cannot win them all.
but I`m sure you would like the pilots up front to be rested when you enjoy the service in the back. Where are you actually coming from? According to your profile you are aircrew, and as such I would have expected a slightly different attitude. It could happen to you too one day.
SBYM,
thank you for your info. If this is the case, I would like to know the Ryanair Pilot Union opinion, and what they are going to do about it. I am sure there will be sufficient backing from the international community of pilots. May be not from Loc-out and some of his friends, but so what. You cannot win them all.
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Yes Sby ure man is EXACTLY correct, YES the rules are made up as they go along... u want to know whar i think??
This saga has been ongoing and the problems and in house "fighting" stems from individuals backgrounds prior to FR, i.e. Aer Corps vs Civil.
The capt that was shafted was ex aer corps.
Time Will Tell whats going to result.
its a BIG pity that professional pilots are PAWNS
oh and just remember he was the pilots representative which was an election by the pilots, most of whom did vote.
whos gonna back him now huh? me wonders
[ 15 July 2001: Message edited by: Joe soap ]
This saga has been ongoing and the problems and in house "fighting" stems from individuals backgrounds prior to FR, i.e. Aer Corps vs Civil.
The capt that was shafted was ex aer corps.
Time Will Tell whats going to result.
its a BIG pity that professional pilots are PAWNS
oh and just remember he was the pilots representative which was an election by the pilots, most of whom did vote.
whos gonna back him now huh? me wonders
[ 15 July 2001: Message edited by: Joe soap ]
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Quite simply, he was sacked as an example to all of us. Because he was the union chairman. because he sttood up to O'Leary. Because he didn't play O'Leary's game. OLeary's message is don't organise, don't challenge, don't try to change things, don't fight. Just rollover and do everything I say.
And then, things just get worse and worse. Increased duty times. Pay CUTS for the CRL base. Demotions for those who resisted. Use of standby to roster 3 and 4 six-sector days per week. Whats next?? If they get away with this they can do whatever they like to whoever they like whenever they like. So you resign. Great, he hires an over 60 Captain with a pension already at a knockdown rate. Or a 200 hour SO at £10k pa.
He wins every way. This has to stop. Doesn't it??????????
And then, things just get worse and worse. Increased duty times. Pay CUTS for the CRL base. Demotions for those who resisted. Use of standby to roster 3 and 4 six-sector days per week. Whats next?? If they get away with this they can do whatever they like to whoever they like whenever they like. So you resign. Great, he hires an over 60 Captain with a pension already at a knockdown rate. Or a 200 hour SO at £10k pa.
He wins every way. This has to stop. Doesn't it??????????
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With regard to 'What does the contract say?'
This is Ryanair, none of these finer points are sorted out.
Ryanair is the type of outfit you join with a contract that says Stansted, 2 weeks later they say tough **** you are xxx based, they do not give 2 **** about anybody.
They walk all over people & run the operation on fear.
Most right minded people think 'they can't do this or that'
O' Learys response is I just have, 'what the F*** are you going to do about it.'
& all this is tolerated by a spineless IAA (The Irish (amature??) Aviation Authority.)
This is Ryanair, none of these finer points are sorted out.
Ryanair is the type of outfit you join with a contract that says Stansted, 2 weeks later they say tough **** you are xxx based, they do not give 2 **** about anybody.
They walk all over people & run the operation on fear.
Most right minded people think 'they can't do this or that'
O' Learys response is I just have, 'what the F*** are you going to do about it.'
& all this is tolerated by a spineless IAA (The Irish (amature??) Aviation Authority.)
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If I might add something else to 'skyclear' when he says what exact reason did MOL give for the sacking.
Skyclear, you are guilty of being a rightminded person.
O' Leary is as thick as they come, he doesn't give reasons nor does he feel oblidged to.
His only explanation for anything is 'this is my F****** airline, I do what I f****** like.
(and yes that includes the bad language).
Skyclear, you are guilty of being a rightminded person.
O' Leary is as thick as they come, he doesn't give reasons nor does he feel oblidged to.
His only explanation for anything is 'this is my F****** airline, I do what I f****** like.
(and yes that includes the bad language).
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Hopefully the dub based pilots will have some kind of response to this. I'd like to see us lose the 100 grand share options that are tied to no industrial action. this might galvinise some of the money orientated fence sitters into seeing the light.
Lets face it capt x was sacked because he was organising the place. All he ever wanted to do was make ryanair a better place to work for us all. But mol's pyscotic dislike of pilots should land him in therapy....pity he doesn't look at southwest and take a leaf out of their employee relations book.
Lets face it capt x was sacked because he was organising the place. All he ever wanted to do was make ryanair a better place to work for us all. But mol's pyscotic dislike of pilots should land him in therapy....pity he doesn't look at southwest and take a leaf out of their employee relations book.
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It is a wonder that M O'L wasn't on Monday's RTE Morning Ireland radio show boasting about what he did in sacking Captain X - he has such a mania for any kind of publicity, be it good or bad. Whatever, if anything, is stated in a contract of employment am I right in believing that normal Department of Labour work regulations and IAA rules, such as they are, apply as well?
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The options are straight forward, either stand up and be counted or take what they give you for the rest of your career.
There is a motion to be balloted on in the IALPA office. Every FR pilot should vote, irrespective of which way (s)he votes, so that the result has creedence.
There is a motion to be balloted on in the IALPA office. Every FR pilot should vote, irrespective of which way (s)he votes, so that the result has creedence.
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In the airline that I work for they have a rule that you can be dismissed for bringing the Airline into disrepute.
If FR have the same rules M O'L could find himself required to resign. I bet Capt.X is still working for FR long after M O'L and by all accounts it will be a "expletive deleted" better airline to work for without the "expletive deleted"!!
[ 17 July 2001: Message edited by: sky9 ]
If FR have the same rules M O'L could find himself required to resign. I bet Capt.X is still working for FR long after M O'L and by all accounts it will be a "expletive deleted" better airline to work for without the "expletive deleted"!!
[ 17 July 2001: Message edited by: sky9 ]
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full monkey
Heard this too. Heard she had a row with a management pilot and O'leary fired her on the spot. Power gone mad if true two pilots in a week. Who's next? What are IALPA doing? What are the IAA doing?
Heard this too. Heard she had a row with a management pilot and O'leary fired her on the spot. Power gone mad if true two pilots in a week. Who's next? What are IALPA doing? What are the IAA doing?
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Crossfeedclosed;
Get the background on this second incident and then decide if its time to voice such strong concerns..!!, If you did the same you could not expect less..!!!
Remember guys..ALWAYS SAFETY FIRST..!!!!
Get the background on this second incident and then decide if its time to voice such strong concerns..!!, If you did the same you could not expect less..!!!
Remember guys..ALWAYS SAFETY FIRST..!!!!
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From today's Irish Independent 18 July..
...
sackings
A ROW is growing over the sacking of two pilots by Ryanair chief Michael O'Leary.
One of them, Martin Duffy, is a trade union activist. The other, junior co-pilot Cliona Duggan, is a daughter of the airline's chief pilot.
Mr Duffy was dismissed because he refused to sit in a cockpit "jump seat" for a flight on which he was off duty. Ms Duggan was sacked on Monday following a claim of "insubordination".
Mr O'Leary, the airline's chief executive, personally terminated Captain Duffy's position following the dispute over jump seats - extra seats in the cockpit, sometimes allocated to off-duty staff.
Captain Duffy was not working on the flight in question but intended to travel to Stansted to pilot a flight from there.
He wanted a normal seat in the main cabin and refused the jump seat in the cockpit. Ryanair says this could only have been managed by turning away fare-paying passengers.
Last April Mr Duffy, an opponent of the controversial pay deal concluded last November, was elected chairman of the Ryanair section of the Irish Airline Pilots Association (IALPA) branch of the IMPACT union.
The airline yesterday issued a notice claiming the pilot had "disrupted and delayed departure of Flight FR 226" when he insisted that he and his crew would not fly to Stansted on jump seats and "would only position in the cabin thereby forcing our ramp staff to try to off-load some of our checked-in, fare-paying passengers.
"Captain Duffy was instructed by operations to position on the jump seat, he refused and was therefore off-loaded from the flight," said the statement.
The company added that,"in these circumstances we had no alternative but to terminate Captain Duffy's contract of employment with immediate effect."
The airline did not give any verbal or written warnings according to the pilots' union. IMPACT aviation secretary, Michael Landers last night said: "In my experience the only procedures within Ryanair are whatever Mr O'Leary decides at any given time."
The action taken against Ms Duggan has shocked airline staff, and her fellow pilots will be attending a union meeting later this week to decide on their response.
Mr Duffy told IMPACT that Mr O'Leary had advised him, as he was being sacked, that he could take his case to the Employment Appeals Tribunal, the High Court, or organise a strike.
The airline stated that Captain Duffy's request for an ordinary passenger seat "was the very antitheses of the concern for our customers that we expect from all our staff.
In many airlines non-working cockpit crews are accommodated in the best available cabin seats, usually business class.
Jump seats are primarily for supervisory pilots overseeing the two-person flight deck crew. Pilots contend that when seated in a temporary jump seat they are effectively working and cannot relax as they are psychologically involved in flight operations.
General practice in most airlines is to reserve adequate seating to accommodate outbound or returning crew members.
Ryanair said that "under no circumstances will we ever tolerate a situation whereby passengers are either expected to, or be off-loaded, to accommodate a staff member insisting on travelling in the cabin of our aircraft instead on an available jump seat."
...
sackings
A ROW is growing over the sacking of two pilots by Ryanair chief Michael O'Leary.
One of them, Martin Duffy, is a trade union activist. The other, junior co-pilot Cliona Duggan, is a daughter of the airline's chief pilot.
Mr Duffy was dismissed because he refused to sit in a cockpit "jump seat" for a flight on which he was off duty. Ms Duggan was sacked on Monday following a claim of "insubordination".
Mr O'Leary, the airline's chief executive, personally terminated Captain Duffy's position following the dispute over jump seats - extra seats in the cockpit, sometimes allocated to off-duty staff.
Captain Duffy was not working on the flight in question but intended to travel to Stansted to pilot a flight from there.
He wanted a normal seat in the main cabin and refused the jump seat in the cockpit. Ryanair says this could only have been managed by turning away fare-paying passengers.
Last April Mr Duffy, an opponent of the controversial pay deal concluded last November, was elected chairman of the Ryanair section of the Irish Airline Pilots Association (IALPA) branch of the IMPACT union.
The airline yesterday issued a notice claiming the pilot had "disrupted and delayed departure of Flight FR 226" when he insisted that he and his crew would not fly to Stansted on jump seats and "would only position in the cabin thereby forcing our ramp staff to try to off-load some of our checked-in, fare-paying passengers.
"Captain Duffy was instructed by operations to position on the jump seat, he refused and was therefore off-loaded from the flight," said the statement.
The company added that,"in these circumstances we had no alternative but to terminate Captain Duffy's contract of employment with immediate effect."
The airline did not give any verbal or written warnings according to the pilots' union. IMPACT aviation secretary, Michael Landers last night said: "In my experience the only procedures within Ryanair are whatever Mr O'Leary decides at any given time."
The action taken against Ms Duggan has shocked airline staff, and her fellow pilots will be attending a union meeting later this week to decide on their response.
Mr Duffy told IMPACT that Mr O'Leary had advised him, as he was being sacked, that he could take his case to the Employment Appeals Tribunal, the High Court, or organise a strike.
The airline stated that Captain Duffy's request for an ordinary passenger seat "was the very antitheses of the concern for our customers that we expect from all our staff.
In many airlines non-working cockpit crews are accommodated in the best available cabin seats, usually business class.
Jump seats are primarily for supervisory pilots overseeing the two-person flight deck crew. Pilots contend that when seated in a temporary jump seat they are effectively working and cannot relax as they are psychologically involved in flight operations.
General practice in most airlines is to reserve adequate seating to accommodate outbound or returning crew members.
Ryanair said that "under no circumstances will we ever tolerate a situation whereby passengers are either expected to, or be off-loaded, to accommodate a staff member insisting on travelling in the cabin of our aircraft instead on an available jump seat."