Singapore Airlines Recruiting Policy?
Guest
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The ad in Flight for 777 pilots based in Perth or Brisbane doesn't mention anything about the right to live and work in Oz. Is it safe to assume that these priviliges are required to be accepted by SQ for these bases, or is there another way that hasn't yet hit me between the eyes?
Guest
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Just heard that we seem to be set for SIA terminating the company Provident Fund provided for ex-pat pilots who joined after CPF was abandoned by SIA for this group some time ago. The reported intention is to pay out the fund to the members and so rid the company of its present monthly obligation to make contributions (yet again saving a slug of money at our expense with zero consultation), as the company is “unable to attain any growth from the fund”. This inability to attain growth seems very strange for an airline that normally never seems to have any difficulty attaining this now elusive property. Maybe it doesn’t mind extending its self on its own behalf but can’t really be bothered on behalf of its ex-pat pilots. Or am I being too simplistic?
If this actually happens (and it did to the last lot of Indians who joined and who were tipped off by their mates so that SIA had to correct the “error” of not including the PF in the package), I personally will take a pay cut of just over S$1000 per month which will probably negate any increase (if indeed there is an increase!) in my monthly salary post the IAC hearing on 11 April and yet again my contract will have been unilaterally altered in a fundamental way (last alteration was the imposed loss of the 6% per annum pay increment on which, amongst other things including the PF, I made a decision to come to SIA). Jeez, it just goes from bad to worse!!!
Any truth in all this???
If this actually happens (and it did to the last lot of Indians who joined and who were tipped off by their mates so that SIA had to correct the “error” of not including the PF in the package), I personally will take a pay cut of just over S$1000 per month which will probably negate any increase (if indeed there is an increase!) in my monthly salary post the IAC hearing on 11 April and yet again my contract will have been unilaterally altered in a fundamental way (last alteration was the imposed loss of the 6% per annum pay increment on which, amongst other things including the PF, I made a decision to come to SIA). Jeez, it just goes from bad to worse!!!
Any truth in all this???
Guest
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cheersnbeers you are entitled to your opinion. Funny how SIA distances itself from the Lear Jets whenever there is a f*** up (oh, it is a seperate entitiy).
That reminds me of your foolish boss that forgot the two dead pilots during a SilkAir speech (SIA has never had a fatality).
My opinion is that sectors gained in a Lear Jet in order to qualify for command is stupid to say the least.
You almost sound like Lenny himself. Is that you Lenny? Strong statement regarding Singapore Airlines vs. Gladiator.
If you have information that is different to mine why not let it out. Come out and let everyone know how much Gladiator cost SIA.
If it is you Lenny, or otherwise he most propably will be reading this anyway, be a man. Let everyone see SIA's financial outcome of Singapore Airlines vs. Gladiator (specially money out vs. money in).
I have some advice for you old man, you spend too much time and effort in the wrong areas. Instead of chasing your former employees for money, or details of laundry bills during CRM courses, spend more time improving safety at SIA.
Also, I want to bring to your attention two more points, first you smoke too much for a pilot, second, consuming alcohol at work place is behavior unbecoming an airline manager. Act your position, that is if you are going to be keeping it.
That reminds me of your foolish boss that forgot the two dead pilots during a SilkAir speech (SIA has never had a fatality).
My opinion is that sectors gained in a Lear Jet in order to qualify for command is stupid to say the least.
You almost sound like Lenny himself. Is that you Lenny? Strong statement regarding Singapore Airlines vs. Gladiator.
If you have information that is different to mine why not let it out. Come out and let everyone know how much Gladiator cost SIA.
If it is you Lenny, or otherwise he most propably will be reading this anyway, be a man. Let everyone see SIA's financial outcome of Singapore Airlines vs. Gladiator (specially money out vs. money in).
I have some advice for you old man, you spend too much time and effort in the wrong areas. Instead of chasing your former employees for money, or details of laundry bills during CRM courses, spend more time improving safety at SIA.
Also, I want to bring to your attention two more points, first you smoke too much for a pilot, second, consuming alcohol at work place is behavior unbecoming an airline manager. Act your position, that is if you are going to be keeping it.
Guest
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Cathay sent one of their captains (Gus) to evaluate the Lear program in Dec 1994. That is over 6.5 years ago.
Yes, smaller aircraft are not new to airline training operations, being a Piper Aztec or HS125. Burning Jet A for the sake of logging a sector is stupid.
A sector can be obtained on line, only if the Commander is not stingy with the sectors. I take 5, you get 1, or you did not stick to the kiss a** protocal so you do not get any.
So Cathay is going to toy with smaller aircraft, still stupid if it is for the sake of sectors.
Yes, smaller aircraft are not new to airline training operations, being a Piper Aztec or HS125. Burning Jet A for the sake of logging a sector is stupid.
A sector can be obtained on line, only if the Commander is not stingy with the sectors. I take 5, you get 1, or you did not stick to the kiss a** protocal so you do not get any.
So Cathay is going to toy with smaller aircraft, still stupid if it is for the sake of sectors.
Guest
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Well guys I had a nice holidays for 3 weeks. SQ was kid enough to accomodate my request for holidays this time. After 3 weeks I noticed a lot has been discussed about SQ which I am trying to updated myself.
Tosh26 you are right about the PF in SIA. I heard from my friend that SIA had cheated some of the guys on CPF and did not mention in the contract. Later on these pilots were running from pillor to post. Ultimately they were told by the SIA management "we are sorry there was a mistake and you all will be getting your PF from now on." What a cheap tectics on part of the SQ to save few hundred dollers per pilot. I also heard that the new recruits will not be paid the gratuity.
TheComparer I don't know how you are talking about gratuity for SIA MAURITIUS, the pilots recruited by SIA here in Singapore do not get any gratuity these days, atleaset their contract does not say so.
Hey guys any update on the negotions going on between the ALPA-S and SIA as directed by the IAC
Tosh26 you are right about the PF in SIA. I heard from my friend that SIA had cheated some of the guys on CPF and did not mention in the contract. Later on these pilots were running from pillor to post. Ultimately they were told by the SIA management "we are sorry there was a mistake and you all will be getting your PF from now on." What a cheap tectics on part of the SQ to save few hundred dollers per pilot. I also heard that the new recruits will not be paid the gratuity.
TheComparer I don't know how you are talking about gratuity for SIA MAURITIUS, the pilots recruited by SIA here in Singapore do not get any gratuity these days, atleaset their contract does not say so.
Hey guys any update on the negotions going on between the ALPA-S and SIA as directed by the IAC
Guest
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The Lear business .........
When Lenny picked up the first Lear he ran it off the runway in Witchita while lining up for takeoff - really impressive. I flew with Lenny I can assure all that his flying skills are sub standard.
That the four Lear45s seem to be now owned by SIA has no bearing on who actually owned the Lear31s when it all started.
That Lenny doesnt own the present L45s doesn't mean he doesnt get his cut by owning the training school in either Singapore or Australia.
What did Lear offer the "boys" to take the Lear that Beech wouldn't match. Grow up everyone, this is the real world and this is how business aviation is conducted i.e. do you really think Greg Norman bought the BBJ?
The "not for hire or reward" is not for want of trying. Lenny walked over burning coals to try and get Vietnam Airlines to enter his Lear School. VA fortunately had a look at the aircraft's pathetic sub 50% despatch reliability and graciously declined.
The 1300 sector requirement is a fluid ethereal thing that the CAAS changes depending on the whims of SIA. Now is anybody on the take in the CAAS? Worth a thought.
Who owns the $25 million Lear simulator? Why even have it when you can get a B744 for about the same price? Why bother with the real plane when they have fully certified simulators? So many questions and no satisfactory answer until the Lenny factor is added in.
Lenny - Be warned. I am subpoenering you on to the stand and I shall expose you for all to see!!
When Lenny picked up the first Lear he ran it off the runway in Witchita while lining up for takeoff - really impressive. I flew with Lenny I can assure all that his flying skills are sub standard.
That the four Lear45s seem to be now owned by SIA has no bearing on who actually owned the Lear31s when it all started.
That Lenny doesnt own the present L45s doesn't mean he doesnt get his cut by owning the training school in either Singapore or Australia.
What did Lear offer the "boys" to take the Lear that Beech wouldn't match. Grow up everyone, this is the real world and this is how business aviation is conducted i.e. do you really think Greg Norman bought the BBJ?
The "not for hire or reward" is not for want of trying. Lenny walked over burning coals to try and get Vietnam Airlines to enter his Lear School. VA fortunately had a look at the aircraft's pathetic sub 50% despatch reliability and graciously declined.
The 1300 sector requirement is a fluid ethereal thing that the CAAS changes depending on the whims of SIA. Now is anybody on the take in the CAAS? Worth a thought.
Who owns the $25 million Lear simulator? Why even have it when you can get a B744 for about the same price? Why bother with the real plane when they have fully certified simulators? So many questions and no satisfactory answer until the Lenny factor is added in.
Lenny - Be warned. I am subpoenering you on to the stand and I shall expose you for all to see!!
Guest
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Twitchy, the latest news on the CA is not good. When Alpa-S and SIA Management met, SIA decided to change a few things for the worst. You'd normally expect a slightly better offer or the original offer better packaged, but SIA is not normal and it seems their strategy is " everytime you reject my offer I will return with less." I suppose it comes as no real surprise but everyone was hoping that a little common sense or integrity may prevail. I would have thought the Airline would have done all possible to resolve the CA quickly to ease the present severe crew shortage and attempt to crew the new aircraft arrivals, but they are playing the same tune, yes we may make close to $2 billion profit this year but we have to be frugal because of a possible downturn in the economy next year. I agree be economically sensible but we all took a pay cut over 2 years ago and are yet to return to our 1998 pay and that after declaring billion dollar profits both years on. Before anyone says then leave well there is the major problem of a bond.
I never thought people could be so unethical, untrustworthy, arrogant, and distasteful but SIA has confidently proved otherwise.
I never thought people could be so unethical, untrustworthy, arrogant, and distasteful but SIA has confidently proved otherwise.
Guest
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If anything goes wrong SIA always distance themselves from the occurence. When their Learjet was lost in Thailand it was not SIA's but one that was owned by a "wholly independant subsidary of SIA", that is, it was owned by Singapore Flying College.
Guest
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Just to quote some self explanatory lines from the latest newsletter.
"The principal changes, as compared to the package that was voted out, are:
1. The exclusion of Second Officers and Pilots on Expatriate terms
2. The sole discretion of the Company to pay First Officers and Captains a salary other than at the starting of a salary range
3. That the Company has the right to optimise COPs to the limit of AOC
4. There is no mention of wage adjustments for incumbents
5. There is no mention of back pay.
EXPATRIATION ALLOWANCE - to be deleted from CA
CHILD EDUCATION ASSISTANCE - to be deleted from CA
HOUSE RENTAL ASSISTANCE - to be deleted from CA"
Food for thought!
[This message has been edited by runer (edited 29 March 2001).]
"The principal changes, as compared to the package that was voted out, are:
1. The exclusion of Second Officers and Pilots on Expatriate terms
2. The sole discretion of the Company to pay First Officers and Captains a salary other than at the starting of a salary range
3. That the Company has the right to optimise COPs to the limit of AOC
4. There is no mention of wage adjustments for incumbents
5. There is no mention of back pay.
EXPATRIATION ALLOWANCE - to be deleted from CA
CHILD EDUCATION ASSISTANCE - to be deleted from CA
HOUSE RENTAL ASSISTANCE - to be deleted from CA"
Food for thought!
[This message has been edited by runer (edited 29 March 2001).]
Guest
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SIA in fact tried to sell other programs to Cathay. In late 1994 Cathay sent half a dozen cadets to SIA for B747-400 training. Captain Gus Lullard of Cathay was evaluating the Lear program. Those cadets left after a short period of time.
It was obvious that the program was bull pucky. Was Lenny the loser having a few beers with the Cathay management boys, (hey, look what I have done, you can do it too).
Sorry you are getting shafted at SIA boys. It is only going to get worst. Get out while you can. Remember, in the Leepublic if they can not exploit you, they do not want you.
It was obvious that the program was bull pucky. Was Lenny the loser having a few beers with the Cathay management boys, (hey, look what I have done, you can do it too).
Sorry you are getting shafted at SIA boys. It is only going to get worst. Get out while you can. Remember, in the Leepublic if they can not exploit you, they do not want you.
Guest
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EasyGo-Lucky?
Re: your post of 29 March. I’ve heard the same stuff. Can anyone explain to me in really simple terms how SIA will be able to crew the 14 x 777’s that I understand will be arriving in the next 9 months, if they show the world pilot pool their true mentality in their approach to pay and conditions negotiation as demonstrated by the latest convolutions in the present CA wrangle?
Re: your post of 29 March. I’ve heard the same stuff. Can anyone explain to me in really simple terms how SIA will be able to crew the 14 x 777’s that I understand will be arriving in the next 9 months, if they show the world pilot pool their true mentality in their approach to pay and conditions negotiation as demonstrated by the latest convolutions in the present CA wrangle?
Guest
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Gladiator, are you a failed training or management pilot? With the approach and temperment I seriously wonder if you should any where near a cockpit. I know free speach is allowed and merited but 'free' to talk fact, not fiction.
Try dealing in fact and stop behaving like a UK tabloid paper - short on fact and embelishing fanasy, feeding on your own insecurity.
The lear 31 were part of SQ all along - check if you wish. Now the Thais are 'going jet' and have leased a Beech 400A which you migh see in BKK from time to time. Iits owned/leased by the HuaHin school I am told. TG were not directly involved in the choice but the former DFO is now Chairman of the school.
With CX(Lear 45) and TG(B400) your short sighted lame snipping 'form the sidelines' makes SQ's pioneering move ten yrs ago seem what it was - trend setting. Their possible fault being first or early. Watch out there will be more going this way.
You also need top know that the lears are not merely for sectors. If you want to find out find out. I knwo but lets see how much fact you can find on your own.
As for the sim. You dont know what sims cost either nor a 744 either come to that. The sim costs about 12-14m. A 744 well try again to find out if your management skills are so good and you have the inside track.
Selling the idea of jet training is not new. LH have been doing it for years with the Piper Cheyanne. If SQ or infuture CX try to sell their skills then it makes financial sense to the airline. So did North Carolina University seeling jet courses to CI.
FYI CX did a more recnt evaluation than 6 years ago. Again you are short of fact.
Reality Check time Gladiator.... No Oscars for you in this lifetime!
Starbucks time again my friend.....
Try dealing in fact and stop behaving like a UK tabloid paper - short on fact and embelishing fanasy, feeding on your own insecurity.
The lear 31 were part of SQ all along - check if you wish. Now the Thais are 'going jet' and have leased a Beech 400A which you migh see in BKK from time to time. Iits owned/leased by the HuaHin school I am told. TG were not directly involved in the choice but the former DFO is now Chairman of the school.
With CX(Lear 45) and TG(B400) your short sighted lame snipping 'form the sidelines' makes SQ's pioneering move ten yrs ago seem what it was - trend setting. Their possible fault being first or early. Watch out there will be more going this way.
You also need top know that the lears are not merely for sectors. If you want to find out find out. I knwo but lets see how much fact you can find on your own.
As for the sim. You dont know what sims cost either nor a 744 either come to that. The sim costs about 12-14m. A 744 well try again to find out if your management skills are so good and you have the inside track.
Selling the idea of jet training is not new. LH have been doing it for years with the Piper Cheyanne. If SQ or infuture CX try to sell their skills then it makes financial sense to the airline. So did North Carolina University seeling jet courses to CI.
FYI CX did a more recnt evaluation than 6 years ago. Again you are short of fact.
Reality Check time Gladiator.... No Oscars for you in this lifetime!
Starbucks time again my friend.....
Guest
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Landing lights!!!! obviously not on when you posted the above.
The L-31s and now the L-45 are NOT operated by SIA. They are operated by Singapore Flying College, for SIA on a very big contract. They are crewed by employees of the College who are absolutely NOT employed by SIA. Their contracts are with SFC, terms are poles different in all areas, including staff ID Nos.
They are operated on SQ flt numbers, the pilots wear SIA uniforms which is necessary to facilitated CIQ at all the first landings ex SIN. The original intention was to wear the College blazer, but the difficulties of that were realised in time.
As to what was the first accident to an SIA aircraft, as the Lear was on an SQ flt number you can all make your own judgement, as was the Silk Air Accident also not SEEN as part of SIA in the same sense.
It's a little bit like the post mix at Big Mac, you can have many flavours of drink, all delivered by the same truck, paid for by the same cheque, but seen to be all different.
The Smoke and Mirrors are on show again.
You should not knock the Gladiators/Titans of this world, be they from a particular point of view, as it is only by being in SIA and "Walking the Walk" can you stand with them. You are a long way from that.
Sui Generis.
The L-31s and now the L-45 are NOT operated by SIA. They are operated by Singapore Flying College, for SIA on a very big contract. They are crewed by employees of the College who are absolutely NOT employed by SIA. Their contracts are with SFC, terms are poles different in all areas, including staff ID Nos.
They are operated on SQ flt numbers, the pilots wear SIA uniforms which is necessary to facilitated CIQ at all the first landings ex SIN. The original intention was to wear the College blazer, but the difficulties of that were realised in time.
As to what was the first accident to an SIA aircraft, as the Lear was on an SQ flt number you can all make your own judgement, as was the Silk Air Accident also not SEEN as part of SIA in the same sense.
It's a little bit like the post mix at Big Mac, you can have many flavours of drink, all delivered by the same truck, paid for by the same cheque, but seen to be all different.
The Smoke and Mirrors are on show again.
You should not knock the Gladiators/Titans of this world, be they from a particular point of view, as it is only by being in SIA and "Walking the Walk" can you stand with them. You are a long way from that.
Sui Generis.
Guest
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Landing Lights:
- post number 2 yet obviously a well posted writer
- "SQ's pioneering move ten yrs ago seem what it was - trend setting"
- "If you want to find out find out"
I mean really, KaptinM, you should try being a bit more original. Now be a good little boy and go off and do your homework. If I catch you cheating, plagiarising, and not doing any study again then I will have to stop giving you little stars and elephant stamps.
Teacher Titan
- post number 2 yet obviously a well posted writer
- "SQ's pioneering move ten yrs ago seem what it was - trend setting"
- "If you want to find out find out"
I mean really, KaptinM, you should try being a bit more original. Now be a good little boy and go off and do your homework. If I catch you cheating, plagiarising, and not doing any study again then I will have to stop giving you little stars and elephant stamps.
Teacher Titan
Guest
Posts: n/a
EasygoLucky and Runer thanks a lot for the latest info on the negotiations between ALPA-S and the MdeV. What do you think SIA is heading for. It seems the company is totally blind to the happenings in the world about the "human resource". I don't think this place has any proper labour laws at all. If so least the ALPA-s can do is to sue the company for "bad faith bargaining". So let us keep our fingers crossed and wait for the 11th April. I think we should get what ever money we get out of it and then quit. Actually we only are to be blamed 'cos we should have thought about this a long ago. Don't be afraid my local friends, the world is quite a big place with many more good Airlines and better job with better work culture. There are many places which are far superior to live than this "Lee-public of Singapore". I can understand the initial hesitation but try out you won't be a loser at all. Wish you all the good tailwinds always........
Guest
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Again lacking accurate information is often the reason you get all of a tizz! For a profession that uses check lists, why not check the facts!
Fact - the Lears (31 and now the 45's)are 'owned' by SQ while the crews or instructors employed by the College. Gladiator suggested that there was some kind of 'monkey business' in the ownership/contract. Never said or queried who 'employed' the instructors/crews.
Check the plaque near the door, of any aircraft when you next board again so before you think this is something strange, get the facts right.
What should actually be under scrutiny is the whole subject of airline training. The SQ Lears & those associated to them are the object of your hate or dislike of Singapore so dont get the two mixed up & keep emotions out of it. Snipping is only a sign of immaturity and a failed argument. If your gripe is with Singapore then get out go back to where you were whether it was flying Sheds out of GLA or 340's (Saab's kinda 340) out of DBO! Oh sorry I forgot there are no Maids and the wife may have to work!Better stay in SIN!
It is training that needs a radical overhaul throughout the industry and the supply chain is not producing the numbers in the keeping with the orders for aoircraft. This is a problem in Asia, ME and now Europe and the US have woken up to the fact.
Debate the issue, not the emotion.
Landing Lights 'on' and burning bright, showing the way not looking back at 'old mind sets'. Save the Gripe water for something else!
Salute.....
Fact - the Lears (31 and now the 45's)are 'owned' by SQ while the crews or instructors employed by the College. Gladiator suggested that there was some kind of 'monkey business' in the ownership/contract. Never said or queried who 'employed' the instructors/crews.
Check the plaque near the door, of any aircraft when you next board again so before you think this is something strange, get the facts right.
What should actually be under scrutiny is the whole subject of airline training. The SQ Lears & those associated to them are the object of your hate or dislike of Singapore so dont get the two mixed up & keep emotions out of it. Snipping is only a sign of immaturity and a failed argument. If your gripe is with Singapore then get out go back to where you were whether it was flying Sheds out of GLA or 340's (Saab's kinda 340) out of DBO! Oh sorry I forgot there are no Maids and the wife may have to work!Better stay in SIN!
It is training that needs a radical overhaul throughout the industry and the supply chain is not producing the numbers in the keeping with the orders for aoircraft. This is a problem in Asia, ME and now Europe and the US have woken up to the fact.
Debate the issue, not the emotion.
Landing Lights 'on' and burning bright, showing the way not looking back at 'old mind sets'. Save the Gripe water for something else!
Salute.....
