Singapore Airlines Recruiting Policy?
Guest
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Boeingfly
The bond you would have to sign would be for S$350,000 decreasing over a five year period. To join, you would have to pay over a sum of S$45,000 (USD26,500)to a Singapore bank who would then provide the five year guarantee to SIA - an expensive business that more and more pilots are (rightly) shying away from.
Best regards
The bond you would have to sign would be for S$350,000 decreasing over a five year period. To join, you would have to pay over a sum of S$45,000 (USD26,500)to a Singapore bank who would then provide the five year guarantee to SIA - an expensive business that more and more pilots are (rightly) shying away from.
Best regards
Guest
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Hi boeingfly....
Here in Singapore also per child it will cost you about SGD 20,000 per year. As other friends have mentioned you need to give a bank gaurantee for SGD 45,000. The Singaporean bank will ask you to deposit around SGD 50,000/- in fixed deposit for 5 year and 5 months (which you can't touch) and your money will be earning interest
@ 2.33% per year, against this money the bank will give the gauranee to SQ. On top of this , if you are not type rated (which you are not) you have sign the bond I an not sure about the right amount but it should be couple of hundred thousand dollors. Then please bring another SGD 10,000 to be given to the house owner for 2 year as interest free deposit for renting you the house. This money you may not get back as the landlord try to adjust at the end of lease period against any damage to the house walls or bath-room walls etc. If you have to put 2 kids in a school here then you will require another about SGD 16,000 to be deposted with the school till your kids study there.(this is ofcourse with out any interest) The cars here are ridiculously expensive say like a honda civic will cost you about USD 55,000/-
You say that you are making about USD 7,750/- in Korea, let me tell you here also you will not be able to make more than USD 8,250 on the 777 fleet, this also if you are posted here in Singapore. We have seen the flight international, what kind of aweful salary SQ have advertised. Don't ever believe, that you will be paid what is mentined in the Flight International as salary per month. Suppose you are getting any subsidised food in Singapore, SQ will include the amount of subsidy in your salary and advertise that you will be getting this as a salary per month. Factually it will be different. This company has lot of glitter so be careful. And if you come here, then these guys are expert in locking you up here for atleast 5 yr and 5 months. We have some of the Captains who are looking forward to go on leave for close to one year and there is no hope they will be given leave. The staff travel is one of the worst in the industry. The so called previlaged travel by confirm "F" class once a year, you will have to pay income tax on the cost of the free ticket. Nothing is free here, its how they sugar coat it and make you swollow the pill. So choice is yours. If you are coming then be prepared to say that Korean was a better company to work for, I am yet to see one pilot, who has not said that his earlier company was better than SQ in all respect. So make the right choice, don't say later that people did not warn you. Yes you can forget about the 16 to 17 night home with the family if you are coming here. SQ does not employ any body, even the locals to sleep with their wives at home. You have to earn for them so that they can sleep well with their wives.
As for recruitment is concerned, its an eyewash, if you are called for an interview that means you are selected, but you have to come here and complete the formalities. First question asked will be whether you can furnish the bank gaurantee or not, if not then you can go home.
" Your application was not successful" email is generally sent to theose qualified pilots whom the company knows earlier or who know the company. Any fresh meat will never get this kind of reply, ultimately he has to be butchered, while he is smiling.
Here in Singapore also per child it will cost you about SGD 20,000 per year. As other friends have mentioned you need to give a bank gaurantee for SGD 45,000. The Singaporean bank will ask you to deposit around SGD 50,000/- in fixed deposit for 5 year and 5 months (which you can't touch) and your money will be earning interest
@ 2.33% per year, against this money the bank will give the gauranee to SQ. On top of this , if you are not type rated (which you are not) you have sign the bond I an not sure about the right amount but it should be couple of hundred thousand dollors. Then please bring another SGD 10,000 to be given to the house owner for 2 year as interest free deposit for renting you the house. This money you may not get back as the landlord try to adjust at the end of lease period against any damage to the house walls or bath-room walls etc. If you have to put 2 kids in a school here then you will require another about SGD 16,000 to be deposted with the school till your kids study there.(this is ofcourse with out any interest) The cars here are ridiculously expensive say like a honda civic will cost you about USD 55,000/-
You say that you are making about USD 7,750/- in Korea, let me tell you here also you will not be able to make more than USD 8,250 on the 777 fleet, this also if you are posted here in Singapore. We have seen the flight international, what kind of aweful salary SQ have advertised. Don't ever believe, that you will be paid what is mentined in the Flight International as salary per month. Suppose you are getting any subsidised food in Singapore, SQ will include the amount of subsidy in your salary and advertise that you will be getting this as a salary per month. Factually it will be different. This company has lot of glitter so be careful. And if you come here, then these guys are expert in locking you up here for atleast 5 yr and 5 months. We have some of the Captains who are looking forward to go on leave for close to one year and there is no hope they will be given leave. The staff travel is one of the worst in the industry. The so called previlaged travel by confirm "F" class once a year, you will have to pay income tax on the cost of the free ticket. Nothing is free here, its how they sugar coat it and make you swollow the pill. So choice is yours. If you are coming then be prepared to say that Korean was a better company to work for, I am yet to see one pilot, who has not said that his earlier company was better than SQ in all respect. So make the right choice, don't say later that people did not warn you. Yes you can forget about the 16 to 17 night home with the family if you are coming here. SQ does not employ any body, even the locals to sleep with their wives at home. You have to earn for them so that they can sleep well with their wives.
As for recruitment is concerned, its an eyewash, if you are called for an interview that means you are selected, but you have to come here and complete the formalities. First question asked will be whether you can furnish the bank gaurantee or not, if not then you can go home.
" Your application was not successful" email is generally sent to theose qualified pilots whom the company knows earlier or who know the company. Any fresh meat will never get this kind of reply, ultimately he has to be butchered, while he is smiling.
Guest
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Twitchy,
Thank you so much!
What a prision, eh?
Does Human Rights and Haya Convention are aware of this? It is an unbearable abuse, on 21st century.
Even so,
1.- is there a 777 base in LA, and in positive case, how is the money?
2.- could you forward me a typical month roster for the 777?
3.- Does SIA consider expat for 747? What they mean "national terms" on their website, in case of 747 captains?
As for the recruitment, a friend of mine, a driver with impeccable professional records, 11,000 TT, 7,000 plus PIC, mostly Efis, also 767 current received after 3 months he applied an invitation email for the interview. He acknowledge, exchanged several emails and phone calls on the details, went after a lot of paperwork, asked his airline schedule the necessary days off to go to Singapore and, 2 weeks before the appointment, emailed SIA to confirm the tickets pick up.
Guess what? He got: "We regret to inform you that we reviewed your application and considered your interview canceled.
Thanks for your interest in SIA..."
This after 4 months they have this professional applications in his hands, made him lose a lot of time and effort. The guy has never anything with SIA or any airline whatsoever. Just an excellent professional looking for an opportunity. How could this happen?
If they have such an example of professional respect, we can easily imagine how things go when you are already caught...
Nice flights
Thank you so much!
What a prision, eh?
Does Human Rights and Haya Convention are aware of this? It is an unbearable abuse, on 21st century.
Even so,
1.- is there a 777 base in LA, and in positive case, how is the money?
2.- could you forward me a typical month roster for the 777?
3.- Does SIA consider expat for 747? What they mean "national terms" on their website, in case of 747 captains?
As for the recruitment, a friend of mine, a driver with impeccable professional records, 11,000 TT, 7,000 plus PIC, mostly Efis, also 767 current received after 3 months he applied an invitation email for the interview. He acknowledge, exchanged several emails and phone calls on the details, went after a lot of paperwork, asked his airline schedule the necessary days off to go to Singapore and, 2 weeks before the appointment, emailed SIA to confirm the tickets pick up.
Guess what? He got: "We regret to inform you that we reviewed your application and considered your interview canceled.
Thanks for your interest in SIA..."
This after 4 months they have this professional applications in his hands, made him lose a lot of time and effort. The guy has never anything with SIA or any airline whatsoever. Just an excellent professional looking for an opportunity. How could this happen?
If they have such an example of professional respect, we can easily imagine how things go when you are already caught...
Nice flights
Guest
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Boeingfly,
Here in SQ the national term means that the SQ will save lot of money, every penny count here buddy in this Lee-public of Stingapore.
If you accept appointment on national term than the company will not pay you the housing subsidy(SGD 3450), they don't pay you children education(SGD 1500 for 2 kids)and ofcourse you are not entitled for the expat allowance(SGD 1025)so net gain per national term pilot to the company is SGD 5975/- only and on national term you will need to spend all the money earned here in the island only. you will save may be SGD 1000/- per month.
yes about your friend, may be SQ though that he asks too many questions even before joining. Here asking questions is only SQ's BIRTH RIGHT, pilots only have right to answer. Can you imagine your telephone conversation with Chief pilot, his deputy or the crew scheduler is always recorded. Here they don't trust anybody.
Does SIA consider expat for 747? What they mean "national terms" on their website, in case of 747 captains?
Here in SQ the national term means that the SQ will save lot of money, every penny count here buddy in this Lee-public of Stingapore.
If you accept appointment on national term than the company will not pay you the housing subsidy(SGD 3450), they don't pay you children education(SGD 1500 for 2 kids)and ofcourse you are not entitled for the expat allowance(SGD 1025)so net gain per national term pilot to the company is SGD 5975/- only and on national term you will need to spend all the money earned here in the island only. you will save may be SGD 1000/- per month.
yes about your friend, may be SQ though that he asks too many questions even before joining. Here asking questions is only SQ's BIRTH RIGHT, pilots only have right to answer. Can you imagine your telephone conversation with Chief pilot, his deputy or the crew scheduler is always recorded. Here they don't trust anybody.
Does SIA consider expat for 747? What they mean "national terms" on their website, in case of 747 captains?
Guest
Posts: n/a
Twitchy, thanks,
Like a friend of mine say, it's too bad to be true! Unfortunately, we have to admit that here at Pprune most of the information are trustworthy...
Well, it seems pretty hard to find out something that offsets what living in Seoul means!
Does 777 have base in LA? What is the money and typical roster?
Like a friend of mine say, it's too bad to be true! Unfortunately, we have to admit that here at Pprune most of the information are trustworthy...
Well, it seems pretty hard to find out something that offsets what living in Seoul means!
Does 777 have base in LA? What is the money and typical roster?
Guest
Posts: n/a
Tosh
Thank you.
If somebody could send me a typical roster for 777 (be careful in erasing all signs that could possibly indentify it!...) it would be very nice.
What is the standard of the apartments (or houses) expats use? And as for food, school and typical monthly bills, how much a family of four would spend monthly (average standard living)?Is it possible to save something?
Best regards
Thank you.
If somebody could send me a typical roster for 777 (be careful in erasing all signs that could possibly indentify it!...) it would be very nice.
What is the standard of the apartments (or houses) expats use? And as for food, school and typical monthly bills, how much a family of four would spend monthly (average standard living)?Is it possible to save something?
Best regards
Guest
Posts: n/a
As the pressure mounts to crew the ever increasing number of 777’s backing up for delivery to SQ, experience standards for desperately needed ex-pat captains inexorably plummet. These formerly high entry standards, in terms of total/command hours to date, routes flown and types operated in major airline service have all dropped by the wayside and anyone with a modest amount of jet command time, gained in whatever circumstances will be considered as meat for the grinder. The lady on the recruiting battlefront, Jokillah Anthony, has her instructions to this effect, of course, though naturally not in writing, so if one of her protégés ever involves the airline in another SQ006, she will be firmly in the firing line along with the flight ops interviewer who endorsed the fateful choice.
All utterly ridiculous, totally unnecessary and to be laid at the door of the corrupt de Vaz flight ops regime of the last twenty years, which, to achieve personal wealth at the expense of the pilot body, has sought to turn what could be the best airline job in the world, attracting the industry’s highest calibre and best experienced captains, into the present poorly paid backwater, seething with discontent and loathing, held together, for a limited time more, by the time honoured amalgam of fear and the infamous, onerous and hated bonding/bank guarantee system. So limited has been the outlook and experience of these dummies that it has never crossed their minds that there could be an alternative, enlightened management methodology, which, even if they did not start out with, they could have evolved with a little intelligence and foresight – qualities which recent events and the present manning crisis have clearly demonstrated to have been lacking!
My point on this posting is prompted by some of the contributions that I’ve read on the current GF-072 thread and which seem to indicate (very simply put) that a young, very inexperienced captain of a given personality profile was not prevented by his first officer from flying his airplane into the sea in circumstances that were largely self induced. I do not wish to enter debate on the merits or otherwise of this crew’s actions but merely to indicate that SQ will shortly find itself in the position of fielding similar crew compositions, of equally young and inexperienced captains, brought in from outside and, hence, possessed of unknown personality profiles, with similarly very young but well trained and indoctrinated ex-cadets, bereft however, of the inclination or CRM training to say “captain, this is not working, I have control”.
Before treading this dangerous path further, SQ in turn needs to say, “this is not working”. The man currently entering the role of flight ops supremo, Lt General LG Bey must now take control from de Vaz, dump him and his baggage and get to grips with captain recruiting before further disaster strikes. He has already taken the first step by very creditably breaking the two-year de Vaz generated pay negotiation impasse and, following the initial snub by the younger members of ALPAS, continued to deal with the ALPAS President and reach an amicable settlement with the pilot force. I do believe we need to congratulate him on this salvage effort.
The General now needs to take stock and figure that to turn SQ into what I indicated could be the world’s best airline job, with a waiting list to get in and people only leaving at retirement, he perhaps requires some outside assistance from, as a start, Professor Helmreich, of the University of Texas who, after making this newly suggested input in addition to the presently contracted safety survey contribution, will in turn be able to recommend further assistance from suitable international recruiting consultants. The point of this exercise is that (sorry to say this first bit General) not only does the money need to quickly go higher to bring in the needed captains but the whole substance and perception of terms and conditions of employment amongst incumbent and targeted pilots must be brought into the twenty first century and moved away from the present feeling that pilots are worthless commodities to be bilked and dumped at will. Existing pilots need proper inducements to stay – not bonds/bank guarantees – but solid feelings of respect and value by an enlightened and forward looking leadership which pays more than lip service to the ideas of employee welfare, career development and the legitimate aspirations of the individual.
It is worth mentioning that Senior Minister Lee’s sentiment, as reported on the front page, by the Straits Time’s Finance Correspondent, in the May 23 2001 edition, is “pay top dollar if you want top talent”. SM Lee is further quoted as saying “Singapore will have to opt out of being a serious player in the internationally competitive game of attracting top talent if it refuses to abide by this principle”. Whilst he was in fact referring to the attraction and retention of supremely talented international fund managers and bankers with desirable employment packages, the principle holds good for the attraction and retention of similarly talented international pilots – on whose services the airline has publicly stated its dependence.
The question for SQ is, do you really want the quality of pilots you say you do and are now prepared to provide a modern, attractive benefit package and employment conditions to get them, or do you continue to pay lip service and quietly trawl for the cheapest and most easily subjugated disposable commodity that the world market can provide? Your choice - but be prepared to live with the consequences.
All utterly ridiculous, totally unnecessary and to be laid at the door of the corrupt de Vaz flight ops regime of the last twenty years, which, to achieve personal wealth at the expense of the pilot body, has sought to turn what could be the best airline job in the world, attracting the industry’s highest calibre and best experienced captains, into the present poorly paid backwater, seething with discontent and loathing, held together, for a limited time more, by the time honoured amalgam of fear and the infamous, onerous and hated bonding/bank guarantee system. So limited has been the outlook and experience of these dummies that it has never crossed their minds that there could be an alternative, enlightened management methodology, which, even if they did not start out with, they could have evolved with a little intelligence and foresight – qualities which recent events and the present manning crisis have clearly demonstrated to have been lacking!
My point on this posting is prompted by some of the contributions that I’ve read on the current GF-072 thread and which seem to indicate (very simply put) that a young, very inexperienced captain of a given personality profile was not prevented by his first officer from flying his airplane into the sea in circumstances that were largely self induced. I do not wish to enter debate on the merits or otherwise of this crew’s actions but merely to indicate that SQ will shortly find itself in the position of fielding similar crew compositions, of equally young and inexperienced captains, brought in from outside and, hence, possessed of unknown personality profiles, with similarly very young but well trained and indoctrinated ex-cadets, bereft however, of the inclination or CRM training to say “captain, this is not working, I have control”.
Before treading this dangerous path further, SQ in turn needs to say, “this is not working”. The man currently entering the role of flight ops supremo, Lt General LG Bey must now take control from de Vaz, dump him and his baggage and get to grips with captain recruiting before further disaster strikes. He has already taken the first step by very creditably breaking the two-year de Vaz generated pay negotiation impasse and, following the initial snub by the younger members of ALPAS, continued to deal with the ALPAS President and reach an amicable settlement with the pilot force. I do believe we need to congratulate him on this salvage effort.
The General now needs to take stock and figure that to turn SQ into what I indicated could be the world’s best airline job, with a waiting list to get in and people only leaving at retirement, he perhaps requires some outside assistance from, as a start, Professor Helmreich, of the University of Texas who, after making this newly suggested input in addition to the presently contracted safety survey contribution, will in turn be able to recommend further assistance from suitable international recruiting consultants. The point of this exercise is that (sorry to say this first bit General) not only does the money need to quickly go higher to bring in the needed captains but the whole substance and perception of terms and conditions of employment amongst incumbent and targeted pilots must be brought into the twenty first century and moved away from the present feeling that pilots are worthless commodities to be bilked and dumped at will. Existing pilots need proper inducements to stay – not bonds/bank guarantees – but solid feelings of respect and value by an enlightened and forward looking leadership which pays more than lip service to the ideas of employee welfare, career development and the legitimate aspirations of the individual.
It is worth mentioning that Senior Minister Lee’s sentiment, as reported on the front page, by the Straits Time’s Finance Correspondent, in the May 23 2001 edition, is “pay top dollar if you want top talent”. SM Lee is further quoted as saying “Singapore will have to opt out of being a serious player in the internationally competitive game of attracting top talent if it refuses to abide by this principle”. Whilst he was in fact referring to the attraction and retention of supremely talented international fund managers and bankers with desirable employment packages, the principle holds good for the attraction and retention of similarly talented international pilots – on whose services the airline has publicly stated its dependence.
The question for SQ is, do you really want the quality of pilots you say you do and are now prepared to provide a modern, attractive benefit package and employment conditions to get them, or do you continue to pay lip service and quietly trawl for the cheapest and most easily subjugated disposable commodity that the world market can provide? Your choice - but be prepared to live with the consequences.
Guest
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... was interested very much by all the info ! question/ what are the min requirements to join Singapore Airlines as a first officer or second officer ... I hold a Irish CPL multi IR + MCC 800 hours total time ... and I keep receiving the answer that I must be a local to apply for cadet sponsoring despite that I apply for direct entry position ! ... 3 identical letters !
Thanks in advance !
Thanks in advance !
Guest
Posts: n/a
Thanks for the interesting topic, question/ what are the requirement for a F/O or S/O with SIA, holding Irish CPL IR multi 800 total time, and despite I am asking for a direct entry pos they keep answering that I need to be a local to apply for a cadet sponsorship ... thanks in advance !
Guest
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... looking for info regarding min requirements for S/O or F/O with SIA, holding Irish CPL IR multi 800 total time ... keep receiving answer saying I can't apply for cadet sponsorship despite I apply for direct entry ... thanks in advance !
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Guest
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Insider 107
I do not pretend to talk about the labor problems that you have with SIA, I honestly ignore them and I assume that you are right about all the grievances you may have against your company. As I neither work nor pretend to work for SIA I will only talk about the attack that without realizing it, you are doing against your colleagues around the world.
Correct me if I am wrong as I am referring to the ads that SIA placed in FI requesting B 777 and A 340. According to them for the A 340 and 777 the minimum experienced required is 7000 Hrs. TT including 3000 Hrs. on command in jets equipped with FMC and EFIS,.
Seems to me that you think that only somebody that has climb the ladder in SIA or that has 3000 Hrs. of experience in widebody aircraft is capable of performing the job in Singapore Airlines. As you express that the levels of experience of the pilots being recruited are very low let me ask you some questions:
1. Why is more difficult to fly a B 777 that is probably the most advanced airplane in the world than flying a Boeing 737-300? Every single pilot that I know and has experience in both wide body and narrow body tells me that it is easier to fly the wide body airplanes as they are more stable. Actually in the company I fly there are more problems moving to the narrow body fleet than going to the wide body fleet. Do you have any experience in narrow body jets?
2. How many wide body airplanes have crashed because the captain was in his first command in a widebody aircraft? I do not recall any accident on the B 747 Classic, L 1011 or DC 10 when they were first introduced in the early 70’s due to the lack of experience of the pilots in wide body airplanes, do you?
3. Why the requisites that were enough to fly the 310 in SIA until 2 years ago are not enough to fly the A 340 or the B 777? Is it more difficult to fly a B 777 than an A-310, if your answer is yes then the people in Boeing may feel terrible knowing that their newest baby is worst than the old A 310.
4. Why is more difficult to fly long haul in a B-777 with all it’s back up and navigation systems than to fly ETOPS in a B-737-300? (However I agree with those that say that those that are pushing the B-777ETOPS (180 or 207) to the limits, like flying over the poles with really substandard suitable airports, sooner or later will burn their hands)
5. I will assume that most airports that SIA operates are equipped with ILS as usually they are major international airports. When was the last time that you had to made an NDB approach to an airport situated in very narrow valleys, like most of the 737 or Md-80 pilots operating in East Asia or South America? When was the last time that you operated in an Airport with an elevation above 7000 ft? What do you think is easier to land an A 340 in Changi or to land a B 727 in La Paz at more than 13 000 ft, What do you think is more difficult to navigate a B 777 over South East Asia or a TU 154 over Siberia during the winter? Do you think you can do it? The difference between long haul and short haul pilots is that long haul pilots mainly operate to the primary airports in the world while the pilots in the narrow body, short haul operation operate into the first, second and third level fields around the world.
6. On average how many sectors do you need to get 3000 Hrs. on a B 777 compared to a B 737, don’t you think that measuring experience only in flight time is a very narrow way of thinking?
7. Why do you talk about the GF-072 level of experience of the captain, when we both know that his level of experience was far less than the 3000 Hrs. required by SIA, this is misleading to say the least. On the same token do you think that any pilot around the world gets his first command with 3000 Hrs. PIC already? Everybody starts from ZERO, Do you have any idea of the levels of experience of the colleagues upgrading at this time in the majors in the USA, believe me is far less than the experienced required in SIA.
8. Why is so difficult to adapt for a Professional Pilot to SIA procedures? Don’t forget that many of the pilots joining SIA have been in several airlines in different countries around the world, just because it may be difficult for you, it doesn’t mean that it is difficult for every body.
9. Why do you say in your post: in another SQ006, she will be firmly in the firing line along with the flight ops interviewer who endorsed the fateful choice. I have read the preliminary report of SQ 006 and I do not think that the level of experience of the pilots had anything to do with the accident, again this is misleading. I think that most serious pilots in this forum agreed that it was a very unfortunate accident that may happen to any of us, please show respect for the pilots of that airplane, How do you expect to get support from colleagues if you attack the pilots that are in the same ship as you are. I f there is another accident it will be another accident not another SQ 006. I think that SQ 006 may happen either in a B 747 or a CRJ.
10. For you what is the right level of experience of a pilot to take a command in a B 777 or A-340 in any airline of the world? If you say 3000 Hrs. widebody time then I will say that there are plenty of inexperienced pilots flying for many airlines over the skies around the world.
Insider as I said before do not assume that just because some thing are difficult for you to do are difficult for everybody, I certainly think that any professional pilot with 7000 Hrs. TT and 3000 Hrs. on command in Jet with FMC and EFIS time, with the right amount of dedication and professionalism may succeed in SIA.
Insider in order to solve those problems you have in SIA you will have to look at a much wider picture, I honestly think that that you are leaving in the SIA micro world and have no idea what is going around the world, things will never change for you just because you attack your fellow pilots, The only thing these pilots did was to apply and accept a job that was offered to them, remember there is no industrial action in SIA, I think that instead of attacking them you should work together to change whatever you don’t like in your company, look at the examples of Delta and Lufthansa pilots that is the only way.
Thank you
I do not pretend to talk about the labor problems that you have with SIA, I honestly ignore them and I assume that you are right about all the grievances you may have against your company. As I neither work nor pretend to work for SIA I will only talk about the attack that without realizing it, you are doing against your colleagues around the world.
Correct me if I am wrong as I am referring to the ads that SIA placed in FI requesting B 777 and A 340. According to them for the A 340 and 777 the minimum experienced required is 7000 Hrs. TT including 3000 Hrs. on command in jets equipped with FMC and EFIS,.
Seems to me that you think that only somebody that has climb the ladder in SIA or that has 3000 Hrs. of experience in widebody aircraft is capable of performing the job in Singapore Airlines. As you express that the levels of experience of the pilots being recruited are very low let me ask you some questions:
1. Why is more difficult to fly a B 777 that is probably the most advanced airplane in the world than flying a Boeing 737-300? Every single pilot that I know and has experience in both wide body and narrow body tells me that it is easier to fly the wide body airplanes as they are more stable. Actually in the company I fly there are more problems moving to the narrow body fleet than going to the wide body fleet. Do you have any experience in narrow body jets?
2. How many wide body airplanes have crashed because the captain was in his first command in a widebody aircraft? I do not recall any accident on the B 747 Classic, L 1011 or DC 10 when they were first introduced in the early 70’s due to the lack of experience of the pilots in wide body airplanes, do you?
3. Why the requisites that were enough to fly the 310 in SIA until 2 years ago are not enough to fly the A 340 or the B 777? Is it more difficult to fly a B 777 than an A-310, if your answer is yes then the people in Boeing may feel terrible knowing that their newest baby is worst than the old A 310.
4. Why is more difficult to fly long haul in a B-777 with all it’s back up and navigation systems than to fly ETOPS in a B-737-300? (However I agree with those that say that those that are pushing the B-777ETOPS (180 or 207) to the limits, like flying over the poles with really substandard suitable airports, sooner or later will burn their hands)
5. I will assume that most airports that SIA operates are equipped with ILS as usually they are major international airports. When was the last time that you had to made an NDB approach to an airport situated in very narrow valleys, like most of the 737 or Md-80 pilots operating in East Asia or South America? When was the last time that you operated in an Airport with an elevation above 7000 ft? What do you think is easier to land an A 340 in Changi or to land a B 727 in La Paz at more than 13 000 ft, What do you think is more difficult to navigate a B 777 over South East Asia or a TU 154 over Siberia during the winter? Do you think you can do it? The difference between long haul and short haul pilots is that long haul pilots mainly operate to the primary airports in the world while the pilots in the narrow body, short haul operation operate into the first, second and third level fields around the world.
6. On average how many sectors do you need to get 3000 Hrs. on a B 777 compared to a B 737, don’t you think that measuring experience only in flight time is a very narrow way of thinking?
7. Why do you talk about the GF-072 level of experience of the captain, when we both know that his level of experience was far less than the 3000 Hrs. required by SIA, this is misleading to say the least. On the same token do you think that any pilot around the world gets his first command with 3000 Hrs. PIC already? Everybody starts from ZERO, Do you have any idea of the levels of experience of the colleagues upgrading at this time in the majors in the USA, believe me is far less than the experienced required in SIA.
8. Why is so difficult to adapt for a Professional Pilot to SIA procedures? Don’t forget that many of the pilots joining SIA have been in several airlines in different countries around the world, just because it may be difficult for you, it doesn’t mean that it is difficult for every body.
9. Why do you say in your post: in another SQ006, she will be firmly in the firing line along with the flight ops interviewer who endorsed the fateful choice. I have read the preliminary report of SQ 006 and I do not think that the level of experience of the pilots had anything to do with the accident, again this is misleading. I think that most serious pilots in this forum agreed that it was a very unfortunate accident that may happen to any of us, please show respect for the pilots of that airplane, How do you expect to get support from colleagues if you attack the pilots that are in the same ship as you are. I f there is another accident it will be another accident not another SQ 006. I think that SQ 006 may happen either in a B 747 or a CRJ.
10. For you what is the right level of experience of a pilot to take a command in a B 777 or A-340 in any airline of the world? If you say 3000 Hrs. widebody time then I will say that there are plenty of inexperienced pilots flying for many airlines over the skies around the world.
Insider as I said before do not assume that just because some thing are difficult for you to do are difficult for everybody, I certainly think that any professional pilot with 7000 Hrs. TT and 3000 Hrs. on command in Jet with FMC and EFIS time, with the right amount of dedication and professionalism may succeed in SIA.
Insider in order to solve those problems you have in SIA you will have to look at a much wider picture, I honestly think that that you are leaving in the SIA micro world and have no idea what is going around the world, things will never change for you just because you attack your fellow pilots, The only thing these pilots did was to apply and accept a job that was offered to them, remember there is no industrial action in SIA, I think that instead of attacking them you should work together to change whatever you don’t like in your company, look at the examples of Delta and Lufthansa pilots that is the only way.
Thank you
Guest
Posts: n/a
Well I would like to express my opinion regarding Latin American pilots. From what I have read in this thread it appears that some of you have elected to put down some my fellow colleagues. Being a pilot who has worked with VASP, I can attest that the majority of the pilots there are safe to fly with. Of course we can't expect all of them to be fluent in english because obviously they don't come from an english speaking countries. They can though, understand basic Enlgish ATC orders and follow them precisely. I'm on the verge of joining another S.American carrier, VARIG. Now with this company, I can assure you that the standards are as high as any carrier out there. Please lets not generalize when we talk about S.America please.
I'm defending the interests of Brazilian pilots and urge other fellow S.American pilots to do the same.
I'm defending the interests of Brazilian pilots and urge other fellow S.American pilots to do the same.
Guest
Posts: n/a
Mad Dog,
You've made a point!
I've been with Varig for almost 20 years, and all I can say is that, during all this time, I enjoyed professional respect, support, good management and strong technical backgrounds. Never suffered schedule or "go" pressures. All my decisions as captain were respected and supported everytime.
The weak side is, of course, salary. But this is not Varig's fault, it is Brazilian macroeconomics instead.
Because of this I am experiencing how is life outside the nest. Presently I am on an Asian temporary contract. And it is being good to give more value on what we have.
You are definitely right, they don't do ANY BETTER than we do. They just grab on own standard procedures like a life buoys because of their lack of good "seat of the pants" and "readiness for the unexpected" behavior.
Prejudice and basic ignorance sometimes make it difficult for some "first worlders" see Brazil produces as many excellent professionals as any place else.
You've made a point!
I've been with Varig for almost 20 years, and all I can say is that, during all this time, I enjoyed professional respect, support, good management and strong technical backgrounds. Never suffered schedule or "go" pressures. All my decisions as captain were respected and supported everytime.
The weak side is, of course, salary. But this is not Varig's fault, it is Brazilian macroeconomics instead.
Because of this I am experiencing how is life outside the nest. Presently I am on an Asian temporary contract. And it is being good to give more value on what we have.
You are definitely right, they don't do ANY BETTER than we do. They just grab on own standard procedures like a life buoys because of their lack of good "seat of the pants" and "readiness for the unexpected" behavior.
Prejudice and basic ignorance sometimes make it difficult for some "first worlders" see Brazil produces as many excellent professionals as any place else.
Guest
Posts: n/a
Singapore is an absulute DUMP unless you are stopping off as an SIA trapped tourist that see's only the down town tourist area's.
How should I know .... well I worked and lived there for two years. I know the local Air Force way of doing things and I believe I realise the way it carries over to SIA.
Anyone thinking of "helping out" SIA and advancing their career at the same time are fools to themselves and their families. It's going to be a one way street where you give and in return will be the abused for the privilege.
Asia (I've lived here over 14 years) is the most RACIST area on this planet..... if you aren't Singapore born Chinese (in Singapore) you are a second class person. It makes you wonder who did all the fighting in WW2. Not the collaborating Chinese traders that now rule the roost, I suspect.
However I digress. If you go to SIA you are little more than a maid in Hong Kong...... thanks for helping us out, but no rights and don't expect to be treated like a local.
Just my thought's and hated no doubt by brainwashed Singaporian's. I've lived the truth and agree with all that is suggested that is wrong with SIA.
By the way, I am an airline pilot, and I do fly within Asia on occasions. I hear what the SIA expat say's around the traps.
Be recruited at your peril.
Roll on the "you are a racist" bu11****.
How should I know .... well I worked and lived there for two years. I know the local Air Force way of doing things and I believe I realise the way it carries over to SIA.
Anyone thinking of "helping out" SIA and advancing their career at the same time are fools to themselves and their families. It's going to be a one way street where you give and in return will be the abused for the privilege.
Asia (I've lived here over 14 years) is the most RACIST area on this planet..... if you aren't Singapore born Chinese (in Singapore) you are a second class person. It makes you wonder who did all the fighting in WW2. Not the collaborating Chinese traders that now rule the roost, I suspect.
However I digress. If you go to SIA you are little more than a maid in Hong Kong...... thanks for helping us out, but no rights and don't expect to be treated like a local.
Just my thought's and hated no doubt by brainwashed Singaporian's. I've lived the truth and agree with all that is suggested that is wrong with SIA.
By the way, I am an airline pilot, and I do fly within Asia on occasions. I hear what the SIA expat say's around the traps.
Be recruited at your peril.
Roll on the "you are a racist" bu11****.
Guest
Posts: n/a
weightandbalance
What a well-reasoned and very sensible piece you took the trouble to compose and post on 27 May - please be assured that I agree with your views 100%.
However, you do not understand the complex currents that flow beneath the Singapore Airlines surface and nor should you be expected to. The fact remains that
Pilots are now being recruited with no experience at all of FMC and EFIS.
Similarly, the very reasonably stated experience requirements of the FI ads are being waived, as few pilots at this stage of their careers are bothering to respond to the SQ ads.
Of the pilots who meet the qualification requirements and do respond, a number have asked very reasonable but very direct questions of the deal on offer and so have subsequently been deemed “unsuitable”.
Again, of the qualified pilots who do apply, a number are deemed to have experience inappropriate to SQ’s requirements (don’t ask me why – it’s still a mystery to me in a number of cases!).
Of the pilots finally offered positions, a number are having second thoughts and turning SQ down.
Moving on, I apologise unreservedly to my colleagues around the world if it has seemed to them that I have attacked them, unconsciously or otherwise. I have in fact stated on this thread my belief in the legitimate aspirations of the individual – a stance inconsistent with any form of aggression towards my fellow professionals.
In respect of types/roles/hours, the bulk of my flying has been mainstream jet transport and I have spent very many years flying non FMC/EFIS/Basic Nav fit jet airliners into some very funny parts of the world. Yes you are perfectly correct in saying that this type of flying is far more demanding than driving an A340/B777/B747 around the sky. However, SQ is not so much looking for handling skills/instrument procedure skills – they take it for granted that they come with the package – they are looking for maturity, long experience and a personality profile that can integrate within a multi-cultural working environment, coupled with extensive experience on the same or similar types operated by the airline, in similar roles – not unreasonable qualifications where the main requirements of the job are to ensure absolutely crystal clear communication between crew members and to calmly assess some very difficult situations that arise, as they do anywhere, but which are exacerbated by company pressures seemingly unique to SQ.
Of the command qualities most likely to prevent the future equivalent of the SQ006 disaster, I would humbly suggest that the ability to “calmly assess” is the one that will save the day. I may be different but when I was a lot younger and much less experienced, this quality seemed to get a back seat on most occasions.
On the point of my living in “the SIA micro world”, again please be reassured that I am not. I have a wide spread of experience around the world, with a number of world-class airlines, with whom I retain very amicable links. I am, therefore, in a very good position to understand what is happening at the cutting edge of the international air transport industry and in an equally good position to understand where SQ is going wrong.
Finally, you may have noticed that I sharply differentiate between the shortly to leave flight operations regime which has blighted the airline for so long and the new regime, which I have great hopes of and will most certainly be willing to support and work with.
Regards Insider107
Mad Dog 11
As far as I am aware, all the Latin American pilots in SQ are very well regarded by all of their peers. I think one or two of the postings, which I have noticed on this thread, have been more to do with rudimentary English skills, rather than nationality/professional ability.
What a well-reasoned and very sensible piece you took the trouble to compose and post on 27 May - please be assured that I agree with your views 100%.
However, you do not understand the complex currents that flow beneath the Singapore Airlines surface and nor should you be expected to. The fact remains that
Pilots are now being recruited with no experience at all of FMC and EFIS.
Similarly, the very reasonably stated experience requirements of the FI ads are being waived, as few pilots at this stage of their careers are bothering to respond to the SQ ads.
Of the pilots who meet the qualification requirements and do respond, a number have asked very reasonable but very direct questions of the deal on offer and so have subsequently been deemed “unsuitable”.
Again, of the qualified pilots who do apply, a number are deemed to have experience inappropriate to SQ’s requirements (don’t ask me why – it’s still a mystery to me in a number of cases!).
Of the pilots finally offered positions, a number are having second thoughts and turning SQ down.
Moving on, I apologise unreservedly to my colleagues around the world if it has seemed to them that I have attacked them, unconsciously or otherwise. I have in fact stated on this thread my belief in the legitimate aspirations of the individual – a stance inconsistent with any form of aggression towards my fellow professionals.
In respect of types/roles/hours, the bulk of my flying has been mainstream jet transport and I have spent very many years flying non FMC/EFIS/Basic Nav fit jet airliners into some very funny parts of the world. Yes you are perfectly correct in saying that this type of flying is far more demanding than driving an A340/B777/B747 around the sky. However, SQ is not so much looking for handling skills/instrument procedure skills – they take it for granted that they come with the package – they are looking for maturity, long experience and a personality profile that can integrate within a multi-cultural working environment, coupled with extensive experience on the same or similar types operated by the airline, in similar roles – not unreasonable qualifications where the main requirements of the job are to ensure absolutely crystal clear communication between crew members and to calmly assess some very difficult situations that arise, as they do anywhere, but which are exacerbated by company pressures seemingly unique to SQ.
Of the command qualities most likely to prevent the future equivalent of the SQ006 disaster, I would humbly suggest that the ability to “calmly assess” is the one that will save the day. I may be different but when I was a lot younger and much less experienced, this quality seemed to get a back seat on most occasions.
On the point of my living in “the SIA micro world”, again please be reassured that I am not. I have a wide spread of experience around the world, with a number of world-class airlines, with whom I retain very amicable links. I am, therefore, in a very good position to understand what is happening at the cutting edge of the international air transport industry and in an equally good position to understand where SQ is going wrong.
Finally, you may have noticed that I sharply differentiate between the shortly to leave flight operations regime which has blighted the airline for so long and the new regime, which I have great hopes of and will most certainly be willing to support and work with.
Regards Insider107
Mad Dog 11
As far as I am aware, all the Latin American pilots in SQ are very well regarded by all of their peers. I think one or two of the postings, which I have noticed on this thread, have been more to do with rudimentary English skills, rather than nationality/professional ability.
