View Poll Results: Was the pilot of this display acting dangerously?
I AM a professional pilot and I believe YES
1,571
46.22%
I AM a professional pilot and I believe NO
360
10.59%
I AM NOT a professional pilot and I believe YES
1,024
30.13%
I Am NOT a professional pilot and I believe NO
311
9.15%
I have no opinion
133
3.91%
Voters: 3399. This poll is closed
Video footage of TAP A310 in extreme low flying turn at airshow
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Airshow
People go to airshows to see some spectacular flying. I remember a show in Germany when the old A300 has been shown for the first time and it looked fantastic (flown by the Airbus test crew) - much more spectacular than this 310.
I don't want to judge anybody but this sure looks scarry to me. It reminds me of some aircrafts departing the old Athens airport to the North.
I don't want to judge anybody but this sure looks scarry to me. It reminds me of some aircrafts departing the old Athens airport to the North.
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I truly believe that displaying of commercial aircraft should only ever be done by approved display/test pilots. These people will be well-versed in all the issues and have no doubt practised the routine in the simulators many times
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IF this was conducted by a line crew (base/training captain notwithstanding) it was, at the very least, cavalier and bordering on the criminally insane.
For non-test/display pilots on the day I believe the adrenalin pumping may cause good sense and caution to be forgotten and margins eroded.
They got away with it here, let's hope they learn from it.
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IF this was conducted by a line crew (base/training captain notwithstanding) it was, at the very least, cavalier and bordering on the criminally insane.
For non-test/display pilots on the day I believe the adrenalin pumping may cause good sense and caution to be forgotten and margins eroded.
They got away with it here, let's hope they learn from it.
Pegase Driver
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This is very similar to what one see at Le Bourget for instance done with the A330/340s by Airbus test pilots.
The video does not show runway slope, so the vision shown is wingtip above horizon, not necessarily above ground. If the guys in front knew their aircraft inside out, no pax and well away from the crowd, for me this is just a normal flying display with a large aircraft.
I will continue to fly TAP ( which has an excellent safety record by the way ) without any problem.
The video does not show runway slope, so the vision shown is wingtip above horizon, not necessarily above ground. If the guys in front knew their aircraft inside out, no pax and well away from the crowd, for me this is just a normal flying display with a large aircraft.
I will continue to fly TAP ( which has an excellent safety record by the way ) without any problem.
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What is, in your mind, the limitations for airshows?
I have done some and let me tell you that the perspective from outside and far away is completely different. If you look carefully as he banks the aircraft , he is climbing slowly always in control. By the way you don't see any jerk inputs on the flight controls demonstrating the control on the maneuver.
If he was there for 30º degrees of bank and 150 kts, i would go to the airport because that's what we do everyday.
And if you choose an airline by it's airshows, well...
Check Six Krueger...
I have done some and let me tell you that the perspective from outside and far away is completely different. If you look carefully as he banks the aircraft , he is climbing slowly always in control. By the way you don't see any jerk inputs on the flight controls demonstrating the control on the maneuver.
If he was there for 30º degrees of bank and 150 kts, i would go to the airport because that's what we do everyday.
And if you choose an airline by it's airshows, well...
Check Six Krueger...
Last edited by Krueger; 17th Sep 2007 at 21:37.
Many moons ago (early 80s), before BA changed it's policy on air show appearances (barring Concorde, of course!) I was peripherally involved in displaying a BAC 1-11 at a couple of shows in the north of England, Blackpool springs to mind.
Not only did we have pax on board but they were charged for the privilege - 20 pounds I believe. - paid for the fuel.
The display had to be approved in advance by the CAA and a ceiling was set on the lowest altitude to be flown, 500 or 1,000 feet I think.
The pax loved it of course, they were all enthusiasts and we carried a third pilot who was continually on the PA briefing them on what was going to happen. The cabin crew were in the cabin for the whole display facing the pax and my abiding memory was of them being on their knees before the pull up which no doubt was no more than 1.5g!
Happy Days.
Not only did we have pax on board but they were charged for the privilege - 20 pounds I believe. - paid for the fuel.
The display had to be approved in advance by the CAA and a ceiling was set on the lowest altitude to be flown, 500 or 1,000 feet I think.
The pax loved it of course, they were all enthusiasts and we carried a third pilot who was continually on the PA briefing them on what was going to happen. The cabin crew were in the cabin for the whole display facing the pax and my abiding memory was of them being on their knees before the pull up which no doubt was no more than 1.5g!
Happy Days.
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Babelfish? Well kinda ... www.tranexp.com:2000/Translate/result.shtml ... I was lost for my own words ... did the ones I found aptly describe or not aptly describe the event in question? 
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What a joke some people are...
This is not your average B52 doing tight turns, nor 707 doing rolls ...this plane is as exciting as a washing machine with wings; so to make it interesting enough for the crowd they have shown what this plane does when provoked, but only enough to make the crowd go wow. No big deal.
One thing's for sure, that A310 has better maintenance than most top notch flag carriers, and without a doubt, a crew that could teach you all experts in airmanship a thing or two. Oh and they can afford the fuel for that too. And what about their outstanding safety record?
btw, they still have free meals on board, for pax and crew
This is not your average B52 doing tight turns, nor 707 doing rolls ...this plane is as exciting as a washing machine with wings; so to make it interesting enough for the crowd they have shown what this plane does when provoked, but only enough to make the crowd go wow. No big deal.
One thing's for sure, that A310 has better maintenance than most top notch flag carriers, and without a doubt, a crew that could teach you all experts in airmanship a thing or two. Oh and they can afford the fuel for that too. And what about their outstanding safety record?
btw, they still have free meals on board, for pax and crew
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I was just gob-smacked seeing this footage. I don't care about camera angles and sloping ground - he was very low and I'm surprised so many posters are justifying it. Whenever I've seen civilian airliners do low slow fly pasts at Farnborough they have been considerably higher than this.
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One thing's for sure, that A310 has better maintenance than most top notch flag carriers, and without a doubt, a crew that could teach you all experts in airmanship a thing or two. Oh and they can afford the fuel for that too. And what about their outstanding safety record?
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Babelfish? Well kinda ... www.tranexp.com:2000/Translate/result.shtml ... I was lost for my own words ... did the ones I found aptly describe or not aptly describe the event in question?
And to clarify some ignorant minds, this flight had no pax and was fully trained in the sim.
Check Six Krueger...
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Is that the same TAP that landed an A340 on the taxiway at GRU recently?
By the way, the topic was...?
Check Six Krueger...
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Yes, it is. And did a perfect landing after crossing the Atlantic with four engines running at the destination airport, not with three and not getting to the destination. By the way, the topic was...?
Oh yeah, forgot to mention that I wouldn't classify any landing on a taxiway as 'perfect'.
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Never mind the airline or the aircraft, the pilot flying is a complete and utter prat of the first order. He should be stripped of his license and shown the door with a large boot up his fundament. Dick Wit doesn't describe him or her.
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TAP Air Portugal was the topic.
Would you care to enlighten us at to what relevance your comments have to the debate?
I hardly think a manufacturer and certifying authority approved (and since unchanged) procedure ranks alongside landing a heavy jet on a taxiway.
Oh Yeah, I forgot to mention that your posts were very enlightening and relevant to this topic.
There are two sorts of pilots
In the world of flying there are two sorts of pilots: those who fly by the book and pursue a set of defined numbers to get the job done, and those for whom flying becomes an extension of their own selves and actually 'fly'. I'd be willing to wager my next month's pay that the pilot who was flying this manoeuvre was of the latter type. Bob Hoover is probably the best known example of the true 'flyer' but throughout the world there are many thousands more who instinctively 'feel' the aircraft and what it's doing, even if it is a large twin engined airliner.
The wowsers who villify real pilots are generally button pushers and number chasers who have never experienced the sheer joy of allowing an aircraft to become part of their extended selves. To them an aircraft is just a machine. I personally know three or four pilots with whom I would gladly get into that plane and perform that exact same manoeuvre, and several dozen RTP bus drivers who I trust to fly down an ILS but not a real 'flying' manoeuvre such as this.
The wowsers who villify real pilots are generally button pushers and number chasers who have never experienced the sheer joy of allowing an aircraft to become part of their extended selves. To them an aircraft is just a machine. I personally know three or four pilots with whom I would gladly get into that plane and perform that exact same manoeuvre, and several dozen RTP bus drivers who I trust to fly down an ILS but not a real 'flying' manoeuvre such as this.