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Frustrated (?) pilots and security screening

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Frustrated (?) pilots and security screening

Old 3rd Jul 2007, 09:14
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Angel Frustrated (?) pilots and security screening

Hello, I'm a new contributor. I was just wondering if anyone's heard anything about the Australian Captain who refused to remove his shoes at Darwin Airport last week (June). He'd set off the alarms and wouldn't take off his shoes. He made his way onto the plane apparently, without doing so. I heard another pilot from the same airline did the same thing in Manila, which sparked an internal investigation by his airline.

This was put to me as, pilots think security screening has gone too far and that they are more concerned about security than anyone. The Howard Government is introducing legislation to exempt APEC delegates from the lags rules, for this September's conference in Sydney and pilots want the similar exemptions.

Then there's the concern that the lags rule will soon apply on all domestic routes.

Thank you.
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Old 3rd Jul 2007, 11:52
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The lags rule is?
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Old 3rd Jul 2007, 12:09
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Two of the people detained are Doctors, highly trained and intelligent people just like Pilotís. So why should anyone be above security checks...
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Old 3rd Jul 2007, 12:21
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Unlike anyone else, pilots are going to go into the flight deck. From there, we don't need anything other than our hands to kill everyone on board, so taking our 110ml of water(*) of us isn't going to change anything, nor is getting us to take our shoes etc off.

The world is too PC and has a lack of joined up thinking.

(*) substitute whatever you like here.
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Old 3rd Jul 2007, 12:22
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... 'cause sitting up front I'll just wiggle the stick or control column and we all buy the farm, no need for no weapon of sorts, thanks

We are above security checks by definition



live 2 fly 2 live
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Old 3rd Jul 2007, 12:32
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Easiest way to deal with the problem is to put a bloody smile on your face - I know that some security personnel think that making pilots look small is good sport and yes I know some of the 'frisking' can be a little 'too friendly' but bearing in mind recent events put up with it and get on with the job.
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Old 3rd Jul 2007, 12:38
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Seems they are going to remove the axe and the control column from the cockpits for security reasons...

How can one be so stupid ????????

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Old 3rd Jul 2007, 12:40
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Are you aware of what pilots do for a living PA38?

You can strip a pilot to his birth suit, prod them in every orifice (I know one or two who would enjoy that) and send him to the aircraft and he still has his hands on large metal object packed with jet fuel.

I bite my tongue everytime I pass through security and try and be pleasant to poor sods who do the job because I know it's utterly pointless for pilots. It has nothing to do with being above, below or at the same level as security checks. It's simply pointless. Security needs to be done before pilots get their security pass which it sort of is. ish....
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Old 3rd Jul 2007, 12:44
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But surely the point is that .. yes you can commit suicide and take all your pax with you as Pilot but ..... if you are not screened, you could be carrying something through security to hand on to somebody else .. on another flight ... who is more fanatical and uncaring about his future well being.

It's to stop crew who are sympathisers ... not necessarily suicidal.

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Old 3rd Jul 2007, 12:47
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We are screened! To get the security pass.

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Old 3rd Jul 2007, 13:23
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With respect so were a number of gentlemen who work for or used to work for the NHS who are currently in Paddington Green.
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Old 3rd Jul 2007, 13:27
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Dave Gittins got it Right,once we as pilots are exempt from security checks ,we become the loophole whereby for the right money or threat someone will carry an item to be handed over to someone on the inside.
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Old 3rd Jul 2007, 13:30
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Disagree......
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Old 3rd Jul 2007, 13:39
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Great machines exist where you place your feet one at a time on a machine which somehow scans the shoe. No need to take the shoe off anymore at some places..
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Old 3rd Jul 2007, 13:45
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All these years on, I still cannot understand why shoes need removal for separate x-raying and your pockets don't......
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Old 3rd Jul 2007, 14:39
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Personally speaking, I am sick to death of being treated like a prime security risk everytime I pass through security at a UK airport. All the european airports seem to be more relaxed but the UK is a joke!! What is the point of having an airside pass if we are going to be treated like the pax!!!!! I say, good on the Aussie pilots.................Hopefully, the UK authorities that matter, will smell the coffee and start directing the effort and resources where they are really needed - i.e at PROFILING the pax. Rant over...............
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Old 3rd Jul 2007, 15:25
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Agree with the last post, not the implications of the name though.

We are allowing a security empire to mushroom out of control in the UK and USA. In the interests of political correctness, we have submitted ourselves to the most humiliating and outrageous scrutiny.

We chose to ignore the elephant in the corner which is the fact that the people who pose the threat all come from an easily identifiable ethnic background.
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Old 3rd Jul 2007, 15:56
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Frustrated Pilots etc.

Sshhhhh..............4on4off.
You'll have the Thought Polizei after you. Stick with elephant !
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Old 3rd Jul 2007, 16:17
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Dave Gittins got it Right,once we as pilots are exempt from security checks ,we become the loophole whereby for the right money or threat someone will carry an item to be handed over to someone on the inside.
If you honestly think that the regime of 'security' checks at airports stops everything unwanted getting airside you are deluding yourself - all it takes is for someone to throw something over the fence, for heaven's sake.

Do you really think that a cursory check of a vehicle will stop someone taping a gun/500ml of water/an ingredient of a bomb onto a vehicle chassis etc (what about the roof - never checked AFAIK)?

It is all about a show of presence to deter potential terrorists, to encourage them to try softer targets, rather than to prevent. To absolutely prevent would bring aviation to a standstill. I liken it to having a burglar alarm - if everyone but you in your street has one, who will the burglars hit?

So pilots are screened for their airside passes, then get screened (in the US) to prove who they are (having already flown 7+ hours to get there) and not having killed anyone en-route; who is kidding who here? It is a joke, as I said before, we can down an aircraft with our bare hands, we don't need a 200ml tube of toothpaste ....
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Old 3rd Jul 2007, 16:38
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Fake pilots never manage to get onto planes do they...and before anyone points out that it's very rare...perhaps terrorists don't try to get fake pilots onboard because they know they are subject to the same level of secirity as pax.
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