SIA jobs
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Insider107...thank you for your comments. Upon reflection, it appears it was not appropriate for me to have mentioned Titan or Gladiator in this specific thread, since they had said nothing previous to my post. In response to your post though, I must add that in following prune since it's inception during the days of email notifications, i have watched Titan and Gladiator hijack many threads relevant to SIA, and turned it into a crusade for democracy in Singapore. I have no desire to argue the merits or demerits of their case. As i mentioned in my first post, i'm sure they have their reasons. My point once again is...we are pilots, and when other pilots in this forum ask for information regarding working conditions, those of us able to, should give an unbiased opinion. If the same pilots asked me to comment on the social/political situation here, to me as a pilot, my comments would be my personal opinion, and may be far removed from the general perception of locals or expats, and as a pilot, not relevent to this forum (unless of course SIA whips it's pilots for carryig excess fuel 
under the express orders of LKY). On that note, i must emphasise that SIA does play dirty tricks with contracts/collective agreements/bonds etc., but that is a whole new topic, and covered extensively in other threads in this forum, and i might add, largely due contributions from Titan and Gladiator, and many others. With this, my references to these two gentlemen in this thread is closed.
Whalecapt...it is conceivable that other airlines have a worse staff travel than ours, and my condolences, but the fact remains, SIA staff fares are at least 20-30% more than what sould be, for an airline of this standing, and with our mega profits, not to mention the absence of STAR Alliance travel benefits. The latter however, might change in the near future.
Morse Code...1 free ticket, 4 ID90 tickets, and unlimited ID75 tickets until year 5 followed by unlimited ID85 tickets until year 10, and unlimited ID90 tickets beyond year 10, per year, for self, spouse, and eligible dependents. No CPF or SIA PF paid to newcomers. Yes, there has been a salary increase...incumbents have a basic salary increase of S$1000, MAA increase of S$100, IFA increase of S$10 per hour; newcomers are on a new basic starting salary of S$10,000, S$9000, S$9000, and S$8200 for 744/340/777/310 as compared to the old starting salary of S$8500, S$8125, S$????, and S$7100.
under the express orders of LKY). On that note, i must emphasise that SIA does play dirty tricks with contracts/collective agreements/bonds etc., but that is a whole new topic, and covered extensively in other threads in this forum, and i might add, largely due contributions from Titan and Gladiator, and many others. With this, my references to these two gentlemen in this thread is closed.Whalecapt...it is conceivable that other airlines have a worse staff travel than ours, and my condolences, but the fact remains, SIA staff fares are at least 20-30% more than what sould be, for an airline of this standing, and with our mega profits, not to mention the absence of STAR Alliance travel benefits. The latter however, might change in the near future.
Morse Code...1 free ticket, 4 ID90 tickets, and unlimited ID75 tickets until year 5 followed by unlimited ID85 tickets until year 10, and unlimited ID90 tickets beyond year 10, per year, for self, spouse, and eligible dependents. No CPF or SIA PF paid to newcomers. Yes, there has been a salary increase...incumbents have a basic salary increase of S$1000, MAA increase of S$100, IFA increase of S$10 per hour; newcomers are on a new basic starting salary of S$10,000, S$9000, S$9000, and S$8200 for 744/340/777/310 as compared to the old starting salary of S$8500, S$8125, S$????, and S$7100.
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locgreen
Thank you for the reply.
I confirm that I am not being pedantic but merely emphasising a very important feature of the pprune bulletin board, when I again draw your attention to your writing of 17 June 2001:
"I suppose they have their reasons, but my point is that their views are not truly representative of what goes on here".
Well if I may say so, your statement is not fact but is merely you own view on a particular subject, which, of course, you are at perfect liberty to air. Do you have data to process into factual information supporting your view that Titan and Gladiators' views are not truly representative?
It is a slippery slope we tread when, even unconciously, view (opinion) is stated as fact, ie:
"I'm told (the SIA Mauritius pilots) lead a fairly cushy life".
Who says so and on what processed data basis, especially as they, to use your words, "work to AOC limits"?
And as a variant, using a fact to support an implicit view:
"S$4500 will fetch you a decent 3 bedroom condo at a nice locality (eg. Tg Rhu) facing the sea, or with city views"
Your implied view being that the SIA housing allowance is adequate and that this style should be OK for everyone in SIA, unmindful of unsuitability for young children accustomed to a less constrained life style, or parents wishing to spare their progeny long periods of school bussing from the east to the west of the island. I think another contributor's assessment of house with garden rentals of S$7-8000 pm in a style suitable for young children is probably close to the mark. The rental is fact, the style is my view.
Far be it from me to imply criticism - I fall into the above trap myself but manage to extricate myself by careful re-reading and critical edits.
Finally, yes I think you are absolutely correct about MAA - this will be the prefered tool to up the ante.
Yes dirty tricks are a way of life in SQ flight ops division, which is why no one trusts them and automatically assume they are lying - great management triumph hey?
Yes, SQ staff travel is pathetic.
Kind regards
Thank you for the reply.
I confirm that I am not being pedantic but merely emphasising a very important feature of the pprune bulletin board, when I again draw your attention to your writing of 17 June 2001:
"I suppose they have their reasons, but my point is that their views are not truly representative of what goes on here".
Well if I may say so, your statement is not fact but is merely you own view on a particular subject, which, of course, you are at perfect liberty to air. Do you have data to process into factual information supporting your view that Titan and Gladiators' views are not truly representative?
It is a slippery slope we tread when, even unconciously, view (opinion) is stated as fact, ie:
"I'm told (the SIA Mauritius pilots) lead a fairly cushy life".
Who says so and on what processed data basis, especially as they, to use your words, "work to AOC limits"?
And as a variant, using a fact to support an implicit view:
"S$4500 will fetch you a decent 3 bedroom condo at a nice locality (eg. Tg Rhu) facing the sea, or with city views"
Your implied view being that the SIA housing allowance is adequate and that this style should be OK for everyone in SIA, unmindful of unsuitability for young children accustomed to a less constrained life style, or parents wishing to spare their progeny long periods of school bussing from the east to the west of the island. I think another contributor's assessment of house with garden rentals of S$7-8000 pm in a style suitable for young children is probably close to the mark. The rental is fact, the style is my view.
Far be it from me to imply criticism - I fall into the above trap myself but manage to extricate myself by careful re-reading and critical edits.
Finally, yes I think you are absolutely correct about MAA - this will be the prefered tool to up the ante.
Yes dirty tricks are a way of life in SQ flight ops division, which is why no one trusts them and automatically assume they are lying - great management triumph hey?
Yes, SQ staff travel is pathetic.
Kind regards
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Gentlemen
I have been reading the information provided by all of you. Thank you all.
I too have an interest in SIA. Does anyone know if an endorsement "expires"
I have the A340 both on my ticket but haven't flown it for 2 years. I am currently flying the A320.
How would SIA view this situation if I did show up with a current PPC on the A340?
Thanks in advance
I have been reading the information provided by all of you. Thank you all.
I too have an interest in SIA. Does anyone know if an endorsement "expires"
I have the A340 both on my ticket but haven't flown it for 2 years. I am currently flying the A320.
How would SIA view this situation if I did show up with a current PPC on the A340?
Thanks in advance
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Loc green.......thanks a heap for that very useful information. One more question. During initial training is one paid the whole salary minus of course the flying bounty?
Also can you tell me a little about the interview process...Thanks in advance.
My email [email protected]
Also can you tell me a little about the interview process...Thanks in advance.
My email [email protected]
Guest
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Just referencing my earlier query.
Does anyone know if Singapore Airlines considers you rated or non-rated if you haven't flown the aircraft for 2 years. I have 1200hrs in command on the aircraft but have not flown it in 2 years.
My concern is the bond in particular
Cheers!
Does anyone know if Singapore Airlines considers you rated or non-rated if you haven't flown the aircraft for 2 years. I have 1200hrs in command on the aircraft but have not flown it in 2 years.
My concern is the bond in particular
Cheers!
Guest
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Chaos..... See www.singaporeair.com and go to recruitment. It'll take a little trying to locate recruitment, but there is all the information you need. best of luck
Morse Code
Morse Code
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Morse thanks for the website, however I've looked at that not too long ago and it mentioned nothing about A340. Just B777 and B747, in fact I believe they were asking 500 or 1000 on type. Anyway I'll give it a try again. Does anyone know telephone numbers for recruiting and if they actually accept phone call enquiries?
A4o007 Thanks for your kind interest but I am very much worried about the future. In all honesty our Airline could be the best in world if only it was run commercially. I want to avoid going in details on this forum but I'm sure you know what I mean.
A4o007 Thanks for your kind interest but I am very much worried about the future. In all honesty our Airline could be the best in world if only it was run commercially. I want to avoid going in details on this forum but I'm sure you know what I mean.
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a4o007
I haven't worked with you before actually. I am pretty much on the other side of thed world. You sound as if you are a management type, so in defference to the fellow you are thinking of it is not he to whom you speak. My career takes place on the other side of the world. I did have an inaw who flew the VC10 for you once a long time ago though.
Cheers, Hope all workds out.
I haven't worked with you before actually. I am pretty much on the other side of thed world. You sound as if you are a management type, so in defference to the fellow you are thinking of it is not he to whom you speak. My career takes place on the other side of the world. I did have an inaw who flew the VC10 for you once a long time ago though.
Cheers, Hope all workds out.
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Morse Code
During initial training on type I was paid the princely sum of S$5850 basic salary plus S$1025 expatriation allowance – total S$6875 or USD3800 per month. This payment was made over a four-month training period, following which, from the fifth month onwards, I was paid the basic “checked out” salary of S$8125 plus the allowances associated with line flying. I also received a salary adjustment of S$3020.71 in this fifth month, to reflect a slightly higher salary than basic during my brief line training
In “recognition” of this extremely modest start, SIA makes an interest free loan of S$6000 payable over the first year, to tide individuals over this very lean time – rather than pay a liveable salary from the begining.
It has taken me well over two and a half years to recover from this start plus the bank guarantee/accommodation rental/school fee/power supply/telephone deposits etc, which you have been hearing of.
I have very often wondered why I even bothered.
Good luck!
During initial training on type I was paid the princely sum of S$5850 basic salary plus S$1025 expatriation allowance – total S$6875 or USD3800 per month. This payment was made over a four-month training period, following which, from the fifth month onwards, I was paid the basic “checked out” salary of S$8125 plus the allowances associated with line flying. I also received a salary adjustment of S$3020.71 in this fifth month, to reflect a slightly higher salary than basic during my brief line training
In “recognition” of this extremely modest start, SIA makes an interest free loan of S$6000 payable over the first year, to tide individuals over this very lean time – rather than pay a liveable salary from the begining.
It has taken me well over two and a half years to recover from this start plus the bank guarantee/accommodation rental/school fee/power supply/telephone deposits etc, which you have been hearing of.
I have very often wondered why I even bothered.
Good luck!
Guest
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Tosh, in comparison, a 5-year Air Mauritius A340 captain gets the 3800US you mentioned. Except he gets it as a fully-qualified captain after 5 years!!! He also gets a housing allowance of less than 500US, thus totalling less than 4300US.
Have fun!
nmnf
Have fun!
nmnf
Guest
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The problem with the salary structure in SQ is that the starting salaries are still too low. However if you have had around ten years in the company with one or two aircraft changes and the yearly 6% increase which was up till 2 years ago the policy you look at a total different package. Some of the "older" expats here have nothing to complain about, other then that they work there bollocks off. Just ask a few of them what their taxable income was last year and you might be in for a little surprise!!!
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Tosh, no problems at all in recruiting!!! Just witness the 1000+ applications in reply to the last Air M advert in Flight! The advert did neglect to specify any minimum requirements (presumably even a PPL would qualify you for an A340 captain position!) and also did not divulge the salary. (To be fair, the company had not figured that one out yet!)
So loads of people came and enjoyed a free 3 or 4-day tropical holiday in a beach hotel courtesy of Air M.
Somewhat like timeshare selling, all they had to do was sit through a pesky 30min presentation in a dingy flight ops building. 
The problem came when all the successful applicants were notified of their achievement; suddenly no-one was interested...
So anybody tired of the rat race and yearning for a break? Interviews (again) tomorrow!!!
Have fun!
nmnf
So loads of people came and enjoyed a free 3 or 4-day tropical holiday in a beach hotel courtesy of Air M.
Somewhat like timeshare selling, all they had to do was sit through a pesky 30min presentation in a dingy flight ops building. The problem came when all the successful applicants were notified of their achievement; suddenly no-one was interested...
So anybody tired of the rat race and yearning for a break? Interviews (again) tomorrow!!!
Have fun!
nmnf
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locgreen
Re: your posting of 21 June 2001 in which you mention with remarkable prescience “I must emphasise that SIA does play dirty tricks with contracts/collective agreements/bonds etc”.
Despite us being in the middle of a “healing process” (see OSIG minutes) with the flt ops management, following years (literally) of bruising negotiation over the last, finally settled, Collective Agreement (CA), despite the imminent Safety Attitude Survey Briefing Session to take place on 11 July 2001, to be presented by Professor R. Helmreich of University of Texas and despite a new Crew Resource Management Programme being developed (not before time) by contracted consultants, Dédale, all of which moves are designed to greatly strengthen the Flight Safety stance of the airline, we are about to, yet again, lock horns with an obdurate management, this time over bonus payments.
Does this management not understand that the very bedrock of Flight Safety is harmonious relations between itself and the flight crews that it absolutely relies upon to get the job done properly plus the engineers who guarantee the aircraft integrity and that the permanent friction of “constant revolution” is injurious to such Flight Safety aspirations? And does it further not understand the negative effect such new friction will have on its recruiting drive for desperately needed pilots?
From the latest ALPA-S Newsflash:
Quote: “This is to inform you that the Company has unilaterally decided that the bonus due to employees based for FY 00/01 amounts to 4.45 months and as such will make payment of 3.54 months on 7 July 2001. The remaining 1 month will be payable on 7 December 2001.
The Company has also unilaterally decided and announced by the CEO, that an ex-gratia payment of 1.5 months will be paid in respect of profits received from the IPO of SATS and SIAEC, subject to the agreement of the Unions.
ALPA-S is of the view that the computation for bonus is only based on the declared “Group Profit After Tax less Minority Interest” as provided for in the SIPS Agreement”. Unquote.
For all SIA pilots and outsiders who do not realise the implication of this move, in a period of, to quote locgreen again, “mega profits”, it is that in time honoured form, following a standard and tired old formula straight from the Boys’ Own Book of Harvard Business School Management circa 1950, the management has formed the opinion that the employees are “getting too much” (some would argue achieving a living salary), despite the agreements governing bonus payments being long-standing, percentage based and to mutual satisfaction. It has now set itself the task of “entering the real world”, lopping bonus payments by stealth and precedent, hoping that the pilots in particular will be split as usual. The mechanism is:
Bonus Payment Calculation using SIPS Agreement – 6.04 months basic salary.
New Proposal – 4.54 months basic salary + 1.5 months “ex-gratia” (and very much one off for this FY only) = 6.04 months basic salary.
Hence next year, the “new improved” formula will be used on a precedence basis and so, if the pilots accept this present nonsense, future bonus payment will be subject to a significant southward movement!
To quote ALPA-S further:
Quote: “As there is a dispute with regards to the ex-gratia payment, such payment is being withheld until further notice. Meanwhile, conciliation efforts with the Ministry of Manpower have begun and are ongoing between the Company, the Minister and all the Unions”. Unquote.
Will SIA pilots, just for once, give ALPA-S their unanimous support in its efforts on their behalves?
[This message has been edited by Tosh26 (edited 29 June 2001).]
Re: your posting of 21 June 2001 in which you mention with remarkable prescience “I must emphasise that SIA does play dirty tricks with contracts/collective agreements/bonds etc”.
Despite us being in the middle of a “healing process” (see OSIG minutes) with the flt ops management, following years (literally) of bruising negotiation over the last, finally settled, Collective Agreement (CA), despite the imminent Safety Attitude Survey Briefing Session to take place on 11 July 2001, to be presented by Professor R. Helmreich of University of Texas and despite a new Crew Resource Management Programme being developed (not before time) by contracted consultants, Dédale, all of which moves are designed to greatly strengthen the Flight Safety stance of the airline, we are about to, yet again, lock horns with an obdurate management, this time over bonus payments.
Does this management not understand that the very bedrock of Flight Safety is harmonious relations between itself and the flight crews that it absolutely relies upon to get the job done properly plus the engineers who guarantee the aircraft integrity and that the permanent friction of “constant revolution” is injurious to such Flight Safety aspirations? And does it further not understand the negative effect such new friction will have on its recruiting drive for desperately needed pilots?
From the latest ALPA-S Newsflash:
Quote: “This is to inform you that the Company has unilaterally decided that the bonus due to employees based for FY 00/01 amounts to 4.45 months and as such will make payment of 3.54 months on 7 July 2001. The remaining 1 month will be payable on 7 December 2001.
The Company has also unilaterally decided and announced by the CEO, that an ex-gratia payment of 1.5 months will be paid in respect of profits received from the IPO of SATS and SIAEC, subject to the agreement of the Unions.
ALPA-S is of the view that the computation for bonus is only based on the declared “Group Profit After Tax less Minority Interest” as provided for in the SIPS Agreement”. Unquote.
For all SIA pilots and outsiders who do not realise the implication of this move, in a period of, to quote locgreen again, “mega profits”, it is that in time honoured form, following a standard and tired old formula straight from the Boys’ Own Book of Harvard Business School Management circa 1950, the management has formed the opinion that the employees are “getting too much” (some would argue achieving a living salary), despite the agreements governing bonus payments being long-standing, percentage based and to mutual satisfaction. It has now set itself the task of “entering the real world”, lopping bonus payments by stealth and precedent, hoping that the pilots in particular will be split as usual. The mechanism is:
Bonus Payment Calculation using SIPS Agreement – 6.04 months basic salary.
New Proposal – 4.54 months basic salary + 1.5 months “ex-gratia” (and very much one off for this FY only) = 6.04 months basic salary.
Hence next year, the “new improved” formula will be used on a precedence basis and so, if the pilots accept this present nonsense, future bonus payment will be subject to a significant southward movement!
To quote ALPA-S further:
Quote: “As there is a dispute with regards to the ex-gratia payment, such payment is being withheld until further notice. Meanwhile, conciliation efforts with the Ministry of Manpower have begun and are ongoing between the Company, the Minister and all the Unions”. Unquote.
Will SIA pilots, just for once, give ALPA-S their unanimous support in its efforts on their behalves?
[This message has been edited by Tosh26 (edited 29 June 2001).]