A/C flies with tape covered alt static ports?
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Well having seen first-hand some of the "handling" carried out by SA, I can only concur that it occasionally veers into unsafe practice.
Assuming the aircraft departed without the tape on the ports,Irish Steve did all he could, nobody got hurt, case closed.
Maybe he could have pursued it, but the outcome of that is highly doubtful.
Also, any pressure on his job for highlighting safety concerns is clearly illegal under EU law, and would more likely have resulted in problems for his manager - but then who wants to put the family income on the line, unless lives are directly threatened. Quite understandable.
The real problem here is an obviously unsafe maintenance procedure, but then there is little he could do to affect that.
If he is on a mission against SA - which isn't apparent to me - then fine. He certainly isn't the first here to rail against his (ex) employer, and he has just cause.
Assuming the aircraft departed without the tape on the ports,Irish Steve did all he could, nobody got hurt, case closed.
Maybe he could have pursued it, but the outcome of that is highly doubtful.
Also, any pressure on his job for highlighting safety concerns is clearly illegal under EU law, and would more likely have resulted in problems for his manager - but then who wants to put the family income on the line, unless lives are directly threatened. Quite understandable.
The real problem here is an obviously unsafe maintenance procedure, but then there is little he could do to affect that.
If he is on a mission against SA - which isn't apparent to me - then fine. He certainly isn't the first here to rail against his (ex) employer, and he has just cause.
The Reverend
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I was watching our aircraft docking at the gate in Seoul one afternoon, waiting to board to operate it home. From the departure lounge window, I saw the tape over the alternate static vent. I pointed it out to the incoming crew and I was in a position to have the flight engineer severely reprimanded for not noticing this serious discrepancy. I had a private talk to him and brought the matter up at a subsequent check and training meeting without mentioning names. An appropriate notice to crew was distributed and the F/E concerned was never caught out again with this oversight. Maintenace, who were originally at fault were also severely criticised but eventually, we suffered another similar incident some years later. So, there you go Irish Steve, get over it, we are all human and make mistakes. Cheers, HD.
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"get over it, we are all human and make mistakes"
Yes I agree, but these mistakes cost LIVES. Procedures must be in place to ensure that mistakes are rectified. It is not to bo**ock humans but to ensure human error is reduced to nothing. Hard to do in this day and age but safety is paramount in my view and when I fly everything is triplechecked. I do not want to die with 250 pax with it being my fault. Unfortunately companies do not see the safety element as paramount, money is first. The old saying "if you think safety is expensive, then wait till you have an accident" comes into mind.
Finally I agree with the poster of this thread that something had to be done. Unremoved Pitot Head covers do and have caused fatal aircraft crashes and if nobody stands up and says something then flying becomes unsafe.
Yes I agree, but these mistakes cost LIVES. Procedures must be in place to ensure that mistakes are rectified. It is not to bo**ock humans but to ensure human error is reduced to nothing. Hard to do in this day and age but safety is paramount in my view and when I fly everything is triplechecked. I do not want to die with 250 pax with it being my fault. Unfortunately companies do not see the safety element as paramount, money is first. The old saying "if you think safety is expensive, then wait till you have an accident" comes into mind.
Finally I agree with the poster of this thread that something had to be done. Unremoved Pitot Head covers do and have caused fatal aircraft crashes and if nobody stands up and says something then flying becomes unsafe.
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Unremoved Pitot Head covers
The problem with the aircraft was that the Alternate static ports had been covered with speed tape to prevent ingress of water during a deep wash at the aircraft's home base, and it had not been removed prior to return to service. As it was alternate ports, it would not have been immediately apparent there was a problem, so the aircraft flew for 2 days with the speed tape on the ports. As the port is polished aluminium, with no paint, and speed tape is metallic colour, it wasn't easy to see.
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Well having seen first-hand some of the "handling" carried out by SA, I can only concur that it occasionally veers into unsafe practice
Yes, Irish Steve was working for them, but the problem mentioned here would appear to be a MAINTENANCE issue, originating at the aircraft's home base, before being picked up by....... oh, a SA staff member.
What I can't understand is why SA management wouldn't want it highlighted. As I said, it wasn't a SA attributable problem, so what were they worried about?
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slight embarassment was that the LM engineer that had done the checks overnight was SA LM.
I suspect, based on other experience, that the ramp manager was scared sh
tless at the mountain of paperwork that this would have generated, as he was unfortunately less than capable in that area.
The other ( more likely ) possibility, is that he may not have been very happy at the thought of regulators and investigators looking too closely at the operation. Others have commented on the "handling". I concur. Most of the time, it is not the guys on the ramp that are the problem, they do the best they can with inadequate numbers, poorly maintained equipment, and attitudes from management that belong to the stone age. An external inspection of records and operational practise by someone who knows what is supposed to happen would be very uncomfortable in some cases.
I suspect, based on other experience, that the ramp manager was scared sh
tless at the mountain of paperwork that this would have generated, as he was unfortunately less than capable in that area. The other ( more likely ) possibility, is that he may not have been very happy at the thought of regulators and investigators looking too closely at the operation. Others have commented on the "handling". I concur. Most of the time, it is not the guys on the ramp that are the problem, they do the best they can with inadequate numbers, poorly maintained equipment, and attitudes from management that belong to the stone age. An external inspection of records and operational practise by someone who knows what is supposed to happen would be very uncomfortable in some cases.
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A tad harsh methinks. SA staff do their best but they are working most of the time with one hand tied behind their backs. Besides which, what the hell does any of this have to do with SA?
In my time I have seen them wipe out hatches with GPU's that weren't chocked and got blown into the aircraft by high winds, I have seen one baggage loader lock another in the hold by mistake, I have seen ramp guys very nearly sliced and diced by props, one guy who was doing our pushback with his clipboard in his hand, and as he was disconnecting lost the clipboard, which promptly disappeared into No 2 engine... that one cost a bit... then there was the one that placed some steps against an aircraft which weren't secured, and moved away from the aircraft when the pax started de-planing... shall I go on...
Of course these things aren't confined to SA, but by the same token they aren't immune to error. Saying they do their best with "one hand tied behind their backs" merely highlights the problem - nobody is singling out the ramp guys - we are talking about the whole organisation.
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static ports covered
Howdy Steve!
Look, you found an oops. A very serious, potentially deadly oops, but you found it. I'll quote you here:
"Over 18 months ago, when I was still a lowly ramp lead agent, during a walkround inspection, I found both alternate static ports on a 737 covered with speed tape. The aircraft had night stopped. I called the line maintenance engineer back, in case he'd dropped a bk and forgotten to take it off."
I would imagine that the Engineer at that point removed the tape. Guess what?
You're done!
As a ramp agent, I have no idea why you are doing walkarounds, but whatever, you discovered something wrong and that's a good thing. You have no need to beat yourself up, nobody died and you did the right thing notifying the appropriate person who is supposed to be doing walkarounds of the defect you found. Did the Engineer raise an issue regarding the defect? Not your problem. Will it happen again? Well, that's what you are worried about, isn't it?
Unfortunately, the way things are going in the industry today, there are people out there who don't think there is anything wrong with covering static ports with speed tape. As has been mentioned previously, silver tape on a silver area of the fuselage is rather hard to spot. That's why you are not supposed to do that, nevermind the sticky stuff left behind that picks up all manner of stuff, making the static ports not so static.
So, if you really believe there is an issue, drop a dime anonymously and let the local yokels know that there may be a serious problem with the organization in question. You will be "anonymous", but they are going to want to know your background, so if you are not a Certifying Engineer or Pilot, you better have your ducks in a row or they will not take you very seriously.
A note to those that leave the ground for a living: the airplane allegedly flew for two days in this condition. How many of you out there really REALLY pay attention to your standby instruments?
Keep the Faith!
PB
Look, you found an oops. A very serious, potentially deadly oops, but you found it. I'll quote you here:
"Over 18 months ago, when I was still a lowly ramp lead agent, during a walkround inspection, I found both alternate static ports on a 737 covered with speed tape. The aircraft had night stopped. I called the line maintenance engineer back, in case he'd dropped a bk and forgotten to take it off."
I would imagine that the Engineer at that point removed the tape. Guess what?
You're done!
As a ramp agent, I have no idea why you are doing walkarounds, but whatever, you discovered something wrong and that's a good thing. You have no need to beat yourself up, nobody died and you did the right thing notifying the appropriate person who is supposed to be doing walkarounds of the defect you found. Did the Engineer raise an issue regarding the defect? Not your problem. Will it happen again? Well, that's what you are worried about, isn't it?
Unfortunately, the way things are going in the industry today, there are people out there who don't think there is anything wrong with covering static ports with speed tape. As has been mentioned previously, silver tape on a silver area of the fuselage is rather hard to spot. That's why you are not supposed to do that, nevermind the sticky stuff left behind that picks up all manner of stuff, making the static ports not so static.
So, if you really believe there is an issue, drop a dime anonymously and let the local yokels know that there may be a serious problem with the organization in question. You will be "anonymous", but they are going to want to know your background, so if you are not a Certifying Engineer or Pilot, you better have your ducks in a row or they will not take you very seriously.
A note to those that leave the ground for a living: the airplane allegedly flew for two days in this condition. How many of you out there really REALLY pay attention to your standby instruments?
Keep the Faith!
PB
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For plastic bug,
This a/c type has an alternate system which is switchable. In normal configuration the Stby intsruments are fed from static ports integrated within the pitot heads. The alternate is switched if the normal and aux static systems go down.
This a/c type has an alternate system which is switchable. In normal configuration the Stby intsruments are fed from static ports integrated within the pitot heads. The alternate is switched if the normal and aux static systems go down.
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Hey Mono,
Thanks for that. There WAS something rattling around in the back of the vacant space between my ears last night when I posted, that must be what it was.
Ya know, the "only used when the regular sources fail" deal kinda makes the scenario worse, doesn't it? You'll only find out the alt stuff doesn't work when you really, REALLY need it. Wonder how often the alt stuff gets checked? Preflight, weekly, when someone says: "hmm, wonder what this switch does?".
OK, the last was a bit silly...well, maybe not.
PB
Thanks for that. There WAS something rattling around in the back of the vacant space between my ears last night when I posted, that must be what it was.
Ya know, the "only used when the regular sources fail" deal kinda makes the scenario worse, doesn't it? You'll only find out the alt stuff doesn't work when you really, REALLY need it. Wonder how often the alt stuff gets checked? Preflight, weekly, when someone says: "hmm, wonder what this switch does?".
OK, the last was a bit silly...well, maybe not.
PB
