bmi mass exodus
Had it not been for Bishop's and Branson's antipathy towards each other, a codeshare some years ago would have given BA a real run for it's money. A missed opportunity if there ever was one!
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Young Paul, many of BMI's slots are not suitable for the destinations that Virgin wants to serve, so those slots would be surplus to requirements and would be disposed of in time - possibly in exchange for more useful slots from other operators.
Surely a look back to BA's takeovers of Dan Air and British Caledonian give you some idea of what would happen to BMI if it's taken over by another airline not particularly well-disposed towards BMIs (unprofitable) core market. Far better that BMI encourages further investment (and board supervision) by Lufthansa and SAS, or solicits a buyout from an alternative organisation whose motives would be established before any sale as being to improve and expand the current BMI operation - including longhaul (though maybe not to the US for now!).
Looking for help from Virgin is almost as daft as looking for help from BA! But, as I work for Virgin, I'll happily accept those slots if you really want to give them to us.....
Surely a look back to BA's takeovers of Dan Air and British Caledonian give you some idea of what would happen to BMI if it's taken over by another airline not particularly well-disposed towards BMIs (unprofitable) core market. Far better that BMI encourages further investment (and board supervision) by Lufthansa and SAS, or solicits a buyout from an alternative organisation whose motives would be established before any sale as being to improve and expand the current BMI operation - including longhaul (though maybe not to the US for now!).
Looking for help from Virgin is almost as daft as looking for help from BA! But, as I work for Virgin, I'll happily accept those slots if you really want to give them to us.....
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I,AM regional pilot: get me out of here!!
Great news (*AG) jAN 02
We have at last concluded a transfer agrement and
2
Pilots can transfer to baby this year!!!!!!
PS there is no restriction on burger king employees or car wash staff or cabin attendants?
And they wonder why people are looking to leave in droves. what muppets
Vote me out please
We have at last concluded a transfer agrement and
2
Pilots can transfer to baby this year!!!!!!
PS there is no restriction on burger king employees or car wash staff or cabin attendants?
And they wonder why people are looking to leave in droves. what muppets
Vote me out please
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Scroggs,
With all due respect, it's interference from Lufthansa and SAS that is holding back the group.
Several new business routes are on hold, because they want cast-iron assurances on 'numbers'. We all know that any new route introduces an element of risk, but they are extremely unwilling to take it.
Unfortunately bmi is encumbered with individuals who do not like confrontation, hence if SAS or Lufthansa say jump, we reply 'High how?'.
Ironically the only part of the group that is operating at a profit, is regional. They are virtually independent from the rest of us, with their own board of directors and have a lot more flexibility in the way they do things. As much as I hate to say it, maybe the rest of the group could learn lessons from those up in ABZ.
Everyone thinks baby will be the group's saviour, nothing could be further from the truth. Its losing a lot of money and there is no sign of it reaching break even, let alone actually making money. Maybe once the AOC is awarded the board will do the right thing and sell the operation.
As for us in mainline, if this situation continues maybe we'll end up flying Airbuses out of LHR with Lufthansa livery. But you are correct, the Airbuses won't be wearing a Virgin livery, not now and very unlikely in the future.
With all due respect, it's interference from Lufthansa and SAS that is holding back the group.
Several new business routes are on hold, because they want cast-iron assurances on 'numbers'. We all know that any new route introduces an element of risk, but they are extremely unwilling to take it.
Unfortunately bmi is encumbered with individuals who do not like confrontation, hence if SAS or Lufthansa say jump, we reply 'High how?'.
Ironically the only part of the group that is operating at a profit, is regional. They are virtually independent from the rest of us, with their own board of directors and have a lot more flexibility in the way they do things. As much as I hate to say it, maybe the rest of the group could learn lessons from those up in ABZ.
Everyone thinks baby will be the group's saviour, nothing could be further from the truth. Its losing a lot of money and there is no sign of it reaching break even, let alone actually making money. Maybe once the AOC is awarded the board will do the right thing and sell the operation.
As for us in mainline, if this situation continues maybe we'll end up flying Airbuses out of LHR with Lufthansa livery. But you are correct, the Airbuses won't be wearing a Virgin livery, not now and very unlikely in the future.
Uncle Pete
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When it's all going well you'll see them out and about on a mutual congratulation trip around the empire.
When it's not:-
Now you see 'em, now you don't.
It's very sad to read this thread and see what has happened to something that was great and could still be great.
Management:-
Buck up your ideas and sort it. You have a very loyal workforce but unfortunately loyalty won't pay the mortgage.
MP
When it's not:-
Now you see 'em, now you don't.
It's very sad to read this thread and see what has happened to something that was great and could still be great.
Management:-
Buck up your ideas and sort it. You have a very loyal workforce but unfortunately loyalty won't pay the mortgage.
MP
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Hi Scroggs,
You seem to be inferring in your comments about BAs' take-over of BCAL and Dan-air that it was all a bad thing.
As an ex-BCAL pilot it was the best thing to happen to most of us. Apart from the first few months of aggro, it soon became very clear that the grass is so much greener in BA. We ended up with the most secure job in UK aviation, a reasonable salary, the best working conditions, a good pension and, best of all, no stress worrying about whether we were going to be paid every month.
Just for the security of lifestyle I believe that most Virgin pilots would grab the opportunity of a BA life.
I can only hope that BMI gets taken over by BA. It is the best option. If BMI went to the wall BA would probably get permission to 'save'it and give them a ready-made pool of quality pilots...just what it is looking for...and got from BCAL and Dan-air...for next to nothing.
After years in independent aviation, I can now sit back in my First Class seat and ponder how it might have been!
Good luck
You seem to be inferring in your comments about BAs' take-over of BCAL and Dan-air that it was all a bad thing.
As an ex-BCAL pilot it was the best thing to happen to most of us. Apart from the first few months of aggro, it soon became very clear that the grass is so much greener in BA. We ended up with the most secure job in UK aviation, a reasonable salary, the best working conditions, a good pension and, best of all, no stress worrying about whether we were going to be paid every month.
Just for the security of lifestyle I believe that most Virgin pilots would grab the opportunity of a BA life.
I can only hope that BMI gets taken over by BA. It is the best option. If BMI went to the wall BA would probably get permission to 'save'it and give them a ready-made pool of quality pilots...just what it is looking for...and got from BCAL and Dan-air...for next to nothing.
After years in independent aviation, I can now sit back in my First Class seat and ponder how it might have been!
Good luck
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Sad thread this. I flew a lot between London and Scotland in the late nineties on BM when I was still in the military. Good product, smilling staff, and punctual. Sadly the cost went up and we found it cheaper to go with BA and you got a hot meal on the Glasgow shuttle as BMi went to a rather cheap looking sandwhich.....
Well I have a plan....
My CPL and IR should be done in about 3-4 months (in between a mass BMi exodus...??). Get job with BMi, work had for a couple of years and take the s&*t but get up to a couple of thousands hours. BMi then either goes bust or is sold out. Leave and go to Ryanair or Easyjet, command a year or so after perhaps. Cynical maybe?
Having read Barbara Cassani's book recently, I think it is very unlikely that anyone will buy BMi. Airline mergers have a habit of causing all sorts of problems, which is probably well recognised by BA and Virgin.
If someone does buy BMi it will be for one thing - slots, just like the Ryanair / Buzz take over. Mass redundancies as BMi will follow and as suggested above a handful of aircraft will be kept to feed into the routes of the buyer.
Well I have a plan....
My CPL and IR should be done in about 3-4 months (in between a mass BMi exodus...??). Get job with BMi, work had for a couple of years and take the s&*t but get up to a couple of thousands hours. BMi then either goes bust or is sold out. Leave and go to Ryanair or Easyjet, command a year or so after perhaps. Cynical maybe?
Having read Barbara Cassani's book recently, I think it is very unlikely that anyone will buy BMi. Airline mergers have a habit of causing all sorts of problems, which is probably well recognised by BA and Virgin.
If someone does buy BMi it will be for one thing - slots, just like the Ryanair / Buzz take over. Mass redundancies as BMi will follow and as suggested above a handful of aircraft will be kept to feed into the routes of the buyer.
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When I joined British Midland, it was with the intention of helping to make it the best airline in the business (amongst other reasons of course). So it really saddens me to see so many people feeling this way about bmi.
The problem has long been; a bunch of managers that have deluded themselves about their capabilities and their effect on the company. Generally, by only promoting only like-minded individuals has allowed them to perpetuate their pathetic delusions.
When something good happens, its because of their great management, when something bad happens, they have been let down by their staff.
They know how to pay lip service to all the right things like safety, proffessionalism, service standards, devotion to duty and any other cliche that comes upon their lonely brain cells, but in truth, they completely fail to live up to the demands they place on their staff.
Without respect for the leadership, the company only runs on the integrity of the workforce, which it does DESPITE management and thier ego-masaging petty exploits.
Why are we all worried about a buyer selling off bmi's assets when bmi has been doing this for years.
And BTW gmidc;
Without LH and SK covering the huge losses that bmi incur each year, 'the group' would have folded a long time ago. I would worry if they try to wriggle out of their arrangement if I were you. The fact that they have been bailing bmi out has given them leverage to "interfere", but this is only becaquse of bmi's weak performance.
The slots are not just assets, they are licenses to make money if only someone could get rid of the ignorant and nasty parasites that are running the show. When you have a situation where 1 check-in agent has more qualifications than her 3 duty controllers, 2 line managers and station manager put together, you know something is less than not right.
The problem has long been; a bunch of managers that have deluded themselves about their capabilities and their effect on the company. Generally, by only promoting only like-minded individuals has allowed them to perpetuate their pathetic delusions.
When something good happens, its because of their great management, when something bad happens, they have been let down by their staff.
They know how to pay lip service to all the right things like safety, proffessionalism, service standards, devotion to duty and any other cliche that comes upon their lonely brain cells, but in truth, they completely fail to live up to the demands they place on their staff.
Without respect for the leadership, the company only runs on the integrity of the workforce, which it does DESPITE management and thier ego-masaging petty exploits.
Why are we all worried about a buyer selling off bmi's assets when bmi has been doing this for years.
And BTW gmidc;
With all due respect, it's interference from Lufthansa and SAS that is holding back the group.
The slots are not just assets, they are licenses to make money if only someone could get rid of the ignorant and nasty parasites that are running the show. When you have a situation where 1 check-in agent has more qualifications than her 3 duty controllers, 2 line managers and station manager put together, you know something is less than not right.
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Airline mergers and management.
Sorry in advance. I'm not trying to hijack the thread, it's just that the descriptions of morale and regard for management are so similar to BACX. At one time, we used to be part of the BM group, before being sold. BM was always the ambition, but for some reason, a flow of pilots was never formally established.
I wonder if it's something about Airlines and their management, it's clearly not just our lot being led by tossers.
Substitue BACX for BMi in the first six paras of the last post, and it would totally apply to us too.
Good luck to us all guys.
I wonder if it's something about Airlines and their management, it's clearly not just our lot being led by tossers.
Substitue BACX for BMi in the first six paras of the last post, and it would totally apply to us too.
Good luck to us all guys.
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I was until recently a regular BMA passenger. I then started to notice an advertisement about British Midland trying to match the lowcost carriers for fares and it certainly shows as I noticed that it also tried to match them in the customer service area as well, with indifferent customer service as well as the hassles of LHR. I wrote to Michael Bishop and did not receive a reply, obviously matching the low cost airlines customer service. I am very sorry that BMI has reached this sorry state as once it was one of the best airlines in the world and I was prepared to pay Business class fares to fly with them. I do not fly with BMI any more.
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I say vote with your feet. Get out and give someone a chance who will be an asset to the company, help it grow and improve the prospects for all who work there.
You are at the front end and many other less well off people rely on you.
Work with your managment to improve you situation and stop bitching about it.
Have a spell of being out of work and you will realise that in this climate you should be greatful for the opportunites you have been given.
You are at the front end and many other less well off people rely on you.
Work with your managment to improve you situation and stop bitching about it.
Have a spell of being out of work and you will realise that in this climate you should be greatful for the opportunites you have been given.
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If BMI management have posted, it would seem that they can't write decent English, and they feel that you are lucky to have jobs at all!
Well, it seems that unless they buck their ideas up, they won't have any jobs either!
Well, it seems that unless they buck their ideas up, they won't have any jobs either!
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captjimbo
You seem to make many assumptions. I had 5 years out of work.
You talk about "in this climate you should be more grateful" There are more flying jobs going now than for many years. I can meet the requirements for 8 major companies (some as DE captain).
That is what this whole thread is about, there are so many jobs available there will be a mass exodus unless the management do something soon.
You seem to make many assumptions. I had 5 years out of work.
You talk about "in this climate you should be more grateful" There are more flying jobs going now than for many years. I can meet the requirements for 8 major companies (some as DE captain).
That is what this whole thread is about, there are so many jobs available there will be a mass exodus unless the management do something soon.
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If nothing else, this should speed up that 'exodus'
(BBC News Quote)
Jobs boost as Virgin ups flights
Virgin Atlantic is to create hundreds of new jobs with the launch of extra summer flights to the US.
The UK airline plans to recruit around 700 cabin crew, along with pilots and support staff, for its operations from Gatwick and Heathrow airports.
Virgin will fly additional planes to Boston, Washington DC and Newark, in New Jersey, from June to October.
The airline said the move would enable more Britons to take advantage of the favourable pound/dollar exchange rate.
'Growing confidence'
Sterling is currently at its strongest position against the American dollar since 1992, something that has prompted a big increase in UK visitors to the US.
Virgin Atlantic chief executive Steve Ridgway said: "These new services reflect the airline's growing confidence in the North American market and increasing passenger demand for long-haul travel."
He said: "British tourists are taking advantage of not only the good fares available to the US, but also the favourable exchange rate."
Mr Ridgway said the new US transatlantic services would bring in "around 15,000 additional US passengers, mainly tourists, into the UK over the summer".
Story from BBC NEWS:
(BBC News Quote)
Jobs boost as Virgin ups flights
Virgin Atlantic is to create hundreds of new jobs with the launch of extra summer flights to the US.
The UK airline plans to recruit around 700 cabin crew, along with pilots and support staff, for its operations from Gatwick and Heathrow airports.
Virgin will fly additional planes to Boston, Washington DC and Newark, in New Jersey, from June to October.
The airline said the move would enable more Britons to take advantage of the favourable pound/dollar exchange rate.
'Growing confidence'
Sterling is currently at its strongest position against the American dollar since 1992, something that has prompted a big increase in UK visitors to the US.
Virgin Atlantic chief executive Steve Ridgway said: "These new services reflect the airline's growing confidence in the North American market and increasing passenger demand for long-haul travel."
He said: "British tourists are taking advantage of not only the good fares available to the US, but also the favourable exchange rate."
Mr Ridgway said the new US transatlantic services would bring in "around 15,000 additional US passengers, mainly tourists, into the UK over the summer".
Story from BBC NEWS:
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Richterscale 10
The "in private" roadshows are for the management of regional, to give a brief on the business and other things, and to field a question and answer session with the staff.all of the bases are going to be covered starting next week.
The "in private" roadshows are for the management of regional, to give a brief on the business and other things, and to field a question and answer session with the staff.all of the bases are going to be covered starting next week.