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-   -   G-LAWX S92 Incident AAIB (https://www.pprune.org/rotorheads/627996-g-lawx-s92-incident-aaib.html)

JulieAndrews 13th Dec 2019 16:55

G-LAWX S92 Incident AAIB
 
14 Oct 2019G-LAWXSIKORSKY S-92A High rate of decent on landing,Under Investigation
Anyone able to share anymore info?

"High Rate of Decent on Landing" - would that not just be a "heavy landing" or is there more to this if we read between the lines?
As this is simply a rumour network:
Was this a case of failing to "practice what you preach"?
Or a lack of recency and credible experience 'on-type'?
Was it another 'Paul McCartney-esque' incident?
Cant wait years for the official report so need to speculate now ...........
On a more serious note - just thankful that everyone got away this time
​​​​​​​

helicrazi 13th Dec 2019 17:17

High RoD n landing and heavy landing are 2 very different things

jeepys 13th Dec 2019 17:45


Originally Posted by JulieAndrews (Post 10639102)
14 Oct 2019G-LAWXSIKORSKY S-92A High rate of decent on landing,Under Investigation
Anyone able to share anymore info?

"High Rate of Decent on Landing" - would that not just be a "heavy landing" or is there more to this if we read between the lines?
As this is simply a rumour network:
Was this a case of failing to "practice what you preach"?
Or a lack of recency and credible experience 'on-type'?
Was it another 'Paul McCartney-esque' incident?
Cant wait years for the official report so need to speculate now ...........
On a more serious note - just thankful that everyone got away this time

Yes the 92 is a jolly decent machine. I wonder if descent auto corrected to decent!
​​​​​​​

helisniper 13th Dec 2019 17:53

QUOTE=helicrazi;10639116]High RoD n landing and heavy landing are 2 very different th
 
Helicrazi,

Would you mind sharing your wisdom on this matter with us then?

HS


Jimmy. 13th Dec 2019 20:18

Wasn't this the one that lost too much height on the approach to an oli rig, had an overtorque and heading deviation upon recovering?
I couldn't find the thread here nor the link, sorry.

heli14 13th Dec 2019 20:31


Originally Posted by Jimmy. (Post 10639241)
Wasn't this the one that lost too much height on the approach to an oli rig, had an overtorque and heading deviation upon recovering?
I couldn't find the thread here nor the link, sorry.

don’t think so. G-LAWX is a vip/corporate-configured s92, Starspeed AOC

industry insider 14th Dec 2019 00:23


Wasn't this the one that lost too much height on the approach to an oli rig, had an overtorque and heading deviation upon recovering?
I couldn't find the thread here nor the link, sorry.
No, that one was in Canada. Regardless of the circumstances the parameters were approximately:

1700fpm ROD, 10 KTS, 30’ off the water and pulled 145% torque drooping to 78% NR, both ACs off line and that S-92 still flew home.

It’s one tough aircraft.

Jimmy. 14th Dec 2019 01:45


Originally Posted by industry insider (Post 10639360)


No, that one was in Canada. Regardless of the circumstances the parameters were approximately:

1700fpm ROD, 10 KTS, 30’ off the water and pulled 145% torque drooping to 78% NR, both ACs off line and that S-92 still flew home.

It’s one tough aircraft.

Insider, I think you are talking about the Cougar incident after takeoff from a rig some years ago. IMC after takeoff, too much pitch up, FD coupled with airspeed dropping (and decoupled), descent IMC at very low airspeed at high rate and then VMC, overtorque...
The incident I mentioned was this year, during approach, "sudden" loss of height and then NR drop combined with heading change (probably rapid collective increase), but I couldn't find the source.
Agree with you, very tough aircraft.

helicrazi 14th Dec 2019 08:15


Originally Posted by Jimmy. (Post 10639391)
Insider, I think you are talking about the Cougar incident after takeoff from a rig some years ago. IMC after takeoff, too much pitch up, FD coupled with airspeed dropping (and decoupled), descent IMC at very low airspeed at high rate and then VMC, overtorque...
The incident I mentioned was this year, during approach, "sudden" loss of height and then NR drop combined with heading change (probably rapid collective increase), but I couldn't find the source.
Agree with you, very tough aircraft.

no, Insider was referring to the much more recent incident, which occurred on approach.

Jimmy. 14th Dec 2019 12:01


Originally Posted by helicrazi (Post 10639520)
no, Insider was referring to the much more recent incident, which occurred on approach.

Thanks! Do you have a link, please?

212man 14th Dec 2019 14:12


Originally Posted by Jimmy. (Post 10639668)
Thanks! Do you have a link, please?

https://www.cnsopb.ns.ca/news/update...ter-occurrence

Jimmy. 14th Dec 2019 15:09

Thank you, 212man.

pilotmike 15th Dec 2019 09:51


Originally Posted by helicrazi (Post 10639116)
High RoD n landing and heavy landing are 2 very different things

Well go on then, we're all ears. Sounds crazi.

SASless 15th Dec 2019 12:08

Explored the linked sites data.....came away thinking the Canadians must have some serious problems with excessive gravity with all the "Collided With Terrain" investigations.

The other thing that posed some interest was the "Collided With Trees" as compared to "Collided With Terrain"......whats the difference I wonder?


212man 15th Dec 2019 12:09


Originally Posted by pilotmike (Post 10640309)
Well go on then, we're all ears. Sounds crazi.

Doesn’t seem difficult - a hard landing is where you have a high rate of descent during the touchdown. Depending on the actual rate, and the subsequent forces exerted, that may or may not exceed the design limits and result in structural damage. A high rate of descent during the landing ‘phase’ can be arrested prior to touchdown or a missed approach carried out. The circumstances behind how and why the high rate of descent occurred might constitute a ‘serious incident’ and warrant an investigation - I’m guessing that’s what is happening here.

OvertHawk 15th Dec 2019 16:35

Julie

From your wording it's fairly plain that you think you know more about this than you're letting on.

There was a serious incident - that much is plain otherwise AAIB would not be looking into it.

It was reported by the crew - it's being investigated.

I'm not invloved with the operator and never have been. Nor am I going to suggest people don't speculate - this is, as you say a rumour network.

You however are not speculating - you're clearly trolling and one has to consider your motivation.

OH

JulieAndrews 15th Dec 2019 17:04

TOH
Not sure if I know anything more than anyone else in the UK Onshore Industry whom uses Pprune, waiting to see..........
Also - waiting to see how this incident fits within the scope of CAA’s recent report of the industry and it’s safety levels.
I’ve attended various seminars, briefings and functions where a lot of back slapping goes on but the old spectre of commercial pressure remains. Couple that with the helicopter pilots’ natural eagerness to ‘push on’ and we get the repeat headlines - irregardless of how many CAA Industry Reports are published.
Personally, I will be disappointed if it turns out to be another case of a crew thinking they did not require a dynamic risk assessment and ‘pushed on’, leading to an incident, further CAA restrictions and bad press for the industry.

Maybe if you hear more details you can share them with us in a timely manner, rather than having to wait for the investigation report etc etc - which is the whole purpose of the thread; which, to be frank, I thought was fairly obvious?
From what I have learnt since starting the thread is that there are various accounts of the information you have shared already.




Sir Niall Dementia 16th Dec 2019 13:32

And WHOOPEE!! CAA SOC16 arrives in your in-box, to be completed by 31 December detailing how you conduct night off-airfield landings.

SND

Robbo Jock 16th Dec 2019 14:14

SASless, about twenty to thirty feet I'd guess :8

cyclic 16th Dec 2019 22:07


Originally Posted by Sir Niall Dementia (Post 10641184)
And WHOOPEE!! CAA SOC16 arrives in your in-box, to be completed by 31 December detailing how you conduct night off-airfield landings.

SND

....it is making the industry a safer place though.


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