Westpac Helicopters NSW ordered to reinstate terminated Pilot
In the. interest of fairness and equality......what say anyone that has anything negative to say about this Pilot's fitness for duty......post their own full Resume as a way of proving their bonafides.
If you wish to pass judgement upon her....the least you can do is prove you have the background and experience at least equal to that she has.
My thoughts on this affair is simple.....had the Training Staff been professional in their duties there would have been ample documentation to support her Dismissal.
My background includes lots of time as an Instructor in both the Military and in Civilian flying as well as instructing at three Factories.
I have failed Students to include the Chief Pilot of an Oil Company and each one of them KNEW their deficiencies and short comings during and at the end of each flight.....with those being documented in their training record.
The Student Pilot was always presented a copy of the Flights Training Record for that flight during the Debrief.
We did that to protect ourselves and our training establishment from any complaints or in future legal actions.
In this case that was not done.....the Court confirmed it....and now the Operator is confronted with lots of spoiled rotten egg on its face.
Any fault that exists is the Training Staff and Operator Management.....and until proven otherwise it should not and can not be attribute to the Pilot.
She is welcome to sit at my end of the Bar anytime she wants.....but then I appreciate confidant, capable, and professional people and take them for who they are.
I certainly respect any Pilot who flies Chinooks or any helicopter in combat as did this Pilot.....two tours in Afghanistan.
If you wish to pass judgement upon her....the least you can do is prove you have the background and experience at least equal to that she has.
My thoughts on this affair is simple.....had the Training Staff been professional in their duties there would have been ample documentation to support her Dismissal.
My background includes lots of time as an Instructor in both the Military and in Civilian flying as well as instructing at three Factories.
I have failed Students to include the Chief Pilot of an Oil Company and each one of them KNEW their deficiencies and short comings during and at the end of each flight.....with those being documented in their training record.
The Student Pilot was always presented a copy of the Flights Training Record for that flight during the Debrief.
We did that to protect ourselves and our training establishment from any complaints or in future legal actions.
In this case that was not done.....the Court confirmed it....and now the Operator is confronted with lots of spoiled rotten egg on its face.
Any fault that exists is the Training Staff and Operator Management.....and until proven otherwise it should not and can not be attribute to the Pilot.
She is welcome to sit at my end of the Bar anytime she wants.....but then I appreciate confidant, capable, and professional people and take them for who they are.
I certainly respect any Pilot who flies Chinooks or any helicopter in combat as did this Pilot.....two tours in Afghanistan.
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I was merely mentioning the “probationary period” some companies had in place and the ability of customers to ask for replacement of crews “without cause.” I have seen some customers abuse this by threatening crews who refused to fly in below limits wx or over max gross/mass for example.
I was not in any way questioning the competency of any person in this specific case nor do I want to nor am I in a position to.
I was merely mentioning the “probationary period” some companies had in place and the ability of customers to ask for replacement of crews “without cause.” I have seen some customers abuse this by threatening crews who refused to fly in below limits wx or over max gross/mass for example.
I was merely mentioning the “probationary period” some companies had in place and the ability of customers to ask for replacement of crews “without cause.” I have seen some customers abuse this by threatening crews who refused to fly in below limits wx or over max gross/mass for example.
Yes me too. Hopefully a historical anomaly that we have passed. Some of the worst abuse I’ve experienced came from a client that supposedly championed safety! But they were happy to let their jet fleet fly into a VFR airfield they owned, using a made up approach we as the aircraft operator had put in the FMS. Often landing in Cat 1 conditions. Then we as the resident rotary (of their owned aircraft) operation got slated for not flying in the same conditions. No guesses who..,,,
A very shaken crew finally arrived at the camp which was located on a relatively flat river plain and was enjoying 1500 broken and 10 miles + vis.
The Capt ( an colonel in the country’s Airforce, which had the annoyingly bad habit of leaving smoking wreckage strewn about ) blamed it all on the co-pilot and flight engineer of course.
Now what error could have lead them to be exactly 60 NM too far North? LOL.
Gee....212Man's comments brought back memories of those years.
We had our own GPS approaches at other locations and with other Clients....all done with very early Garmin (and cheapest the company could buy) units.
His observations follow on from so many others that it would get lost in the crowd.
Thinigs like using canals as reject areas as there dredgings stacked beside the canal would not be graded somewhat level due to cost.
No flight following at night.
Thus no SAR standby on call should an aircraft go missing doing an Emergency flight. (It did happen.)
Tinkering with engine governing systems due to pilot handling issues following conversion to a different and less powerful aircraft.
During one of my Safety training courses I sat transfixed during the presentation about how Management attitudes had to be considered the most insurmountable hurtle to a genuine Safety Culture within an Aviation Operation.
When the Instructor asked the Class if we could provide some real life examples....I could have caused the class schedule to be delayed by days....not mere hours.
We had our own GPS approaches at other locations and with other Clients....all done with very early Garmin (and cheapest the company could buy) units.
His observations follow on from so many others that it would get lost in the crowd.
Thinigs like using canals as reject areas as there dredgings stacked beside the canal would not be graded somewhat level due to cost.
No flight following at night.
Thus no SAR standby on call should an aircraft go missing doing an Emergency flight. (It did happen.)
Tinkering with engine governing systems due to pilot handling issues following conversion to a different and less powerful aircraft.
During one of my Safety training courses I sat transfixed during the presentation about how Management attitudes had to be considered the most insurmountable hurtle to a genuine Safety Culture within an Aviation Operation.
When the Instructor asked the Class if we could provide some real life examples....I could have caused the class schedule to be delayed by days....not mere hours.
Saw one group in a 4 engine turboprop do that at a jungle strip. Their handy-not so dandy hand loaded approach leading them to break unexpectedly out of the clagg deep in a small valley surrounded by mountains exactly 60 nm north of where they expected to be. A demonstration of max power/max rate/max angle climb procedures saved the day. No alarm bells had gone off when 1) They couldn’t contact the camp on the VHF and 2) The WX radar showed nothing but red with the odd flash of magenta and yellow. 3) The ADF was tuned to a music station in the capital far away over the mountain range and probably on ANT not ADF.
A very shaken crew finally arrived at the camp which was located on a relatively flat river plain and was enjoying 1500 broken and 10 miles + vis.
The Capt ( an colonel in the country’s Airforce, which had the annoyingly bad habit of leaving smoking wreckage strewn about ) blamed it all on the co-pilot and flight engineer of course.
Now what error could have lead them to be exactly 60 NM too far North? LOL.
A very shaken crew finally arrived at the camp which was located on a relatively flat river plain and was enjoying 1500 broken and 10 miles + vis.
The Capt ( an colonel in the country’s Airforce, which had the annoyingly bad habit of leaving smoking wreckage strewn about ) blamed it all on the co-pilot and flight engineer of course.
Now what error could have lead them to be exactly 60 NM too far North? LOL.
I'm curious why asking for reinstatement?
I certainly respect any Pilot who flies Chinooks or any helicopter in combat as did this Pilot.....two tours in Afghanistan
- Division Operations Manager
Australian Defence Force Jul 2005 - Dec 2007 · 2 yrs 6 mos Brisbane, Qld-
- Multi-unit operations management from remote locations worldwide including Australia, East Timor, Solomon Islands, Pakistan and Iraq; Coordinate and liaise with civilian agencies on all Army Aviation Search and Rescue Tasks; coordinate counter disaster aviation operations including evacuation of people and resupplying communities isolated by natural disasters; Allocate resources across multi-unit operations and coordinate training and operating programs as well as fleet availability maintainence and logistics support; Managing 24 hr a day response and planning and coordinating operations at a moments notice; and Drafting and implementing standard operating procedures to instate commonality of processes across multiple units in various remote locations.
-
- Traffic Report Pilot
The Helicopter Service Australia Dec 2005 - May 2006 · 6 mos ·-
- Operate Single pilot by day and night in,out of Brisbane controlled airspace to provide live cross to television for all traffic reports; Quick Response to reports of traffic accidents or other news incidents.
-
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I was starting to lose the will to live half way through. Legal s**t has that effect on me. Must be the residual trauma from reading court documents during my divorces.................
Is it me or does it seem there was more to this than straightforward lack of ability and/or misogyny ?
NEO
Is it me or does it seem there was more to this than straightforward lack of ability and/or misogyny ?
NEO
I am thinking this discussion has reached a logical end and the thread should be closed or binned or both.
It seems to me a very decent, capable, and professional person with a great number of abilities has been beat up by a former employer, the media, and far too many of her fellows in the Industry.....and done so in a very foul manner.
I wonder if some who have posted here stick pins into dolls when they think of more capable persons than they.
It seems to me a very decent, capable, and professional person with a great number of abilities has been beat up by a former employer, the media, and far too many of her fellows in the Industry.....and done so in a very foul manner.
I wonder if some who have posted here stick pins into dolls when they think of more capable persons than they.
I am thinking this discussion has reached a logical end and the thread should be closed or binned or both.
It seems to me a very decent, capable, and professional person with a great number of abilities has been beat up by a former employer, the media, and far too many of her fellows in the Industry.....and done so in a very foul manner.
I wonder if some who have posted here stick pins into dolls when they think of more capable persons than they.
It seems to me a very decent, capable, and professional person with a great number of abilities has been beat up by a former employer, the media, and far too many of her fellows in the Industry.....and done so in a very foul manner.
I wonder if some who have posted here stick pins into dolls when they think of more capable persons than they.
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I'm curious why asking for reinstatement?
I understand if she asks for damages, but she is already working as an EMS pilot, why going back to place where they don't want you?
Unless conditions are wastly different between former and current workplace, I'd rather stay somewhere where I don't have to constantly look over my shoulder.
I understand if she asks for damages, but she is already working as an EMS pilot, why going back to place where they don't want you?
Unless conditions are wastly different between former and current workplace, I'd rather stay somewhere where I don't have to constantly look over my shoulder.
Maybe by being reinstated and going on to operate effectively in the job she will demonstrate that the claims were bogus whereas if she'd accepted money there would be those out there who would claim that she had only been in it for the money and that she had been legitimately dismissed!
I wish her all the best and I'm stepping away from this thread now - Like SAS i think it's time it was closed and i think that there are a number of people, who should know better, who should hang their heads in shame at the comments that they have made on this thread.
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Avoid imitations
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I was once put in a situation where an employer tried to shaft me over my contract. The newly appointed department boss told me he was going to change my three year contract to one of a year, after his predecessor insisted that it could only be for a minimum of three years and I’d moved family around and made financial commitments to suit the three years in post.
I took professional legal advice and was told that the union would be very keen to take them to court! Unknown to me, this had previously happened to other employees and the union had sued on their behalf. It got as far as the High Court and the employer lost. It cost them a lot of money.
I elected to negotiate with the employer, on a personal level. The new boss realised he was over a barrel and the three year contract was soon reinstated. However, I was told in person by him that one professional mistake and I would be gone with no notice. At the time the department was in management chaos (much of it down to him) and it was difficult to comply with their ever changing demands. I felt totally under pressure because I knew I was being watched and in the end I resigned. The letter of resignation was very carefully worded, but totally honest and contained a couple of “scorchers”.
I was subsequently politely asked to withdraw my resignation and was offered resolution of contract instead, which was financially beneficial to me and less damaging to the bossman’s career. Boy, was I was glad to get out of there!
In the case of the pilot at the core of this thread, I can’t for the life of me think that she would actually opt to go back and work for Westpac in those circumstances.
I took professional legal advice and was told that the union would be very keen to take them to court! Unknown to me, this had previously happened to other employees and the union had sued on their behalf. It got as far as the High Court and the employer lost. It cost them a lot of money.
I elected to negotiate with the employer, on a personal level. The new boss realised he was over a barrel and the three year contract was soon reinstated. However, I was told in person by him that one professional mistake and I would be gone with no notice. At the time the department was in management chaos (much of it down to him) and it was difficult to comply with their ever changing demands. I felt totally under pressure because I knew I was being watched and in the end I resigned. The letter of resignation was very carefully worded, but totally honest and contained a couple of “scorchers”.
I was subsequently politely asked to withdraw my resignation and was offered resolution of contract instead, which was financially beneficial to me and less damaging to the bossman’s career. Boy, was I was glad to get out of there!
In the case of the pilot at the core of this thread, I can’t for the life of me think that she would actually opt to go back and work for Westpac in those circumstances.
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I was once put in a situation where an employer tried to shaft me over my contract. The newly appointed department boss told me he was going to change my three year contract to one of a year, after his predecessor insisted that it could only be for a minimum of three years and I’d moved family around and made financial commitments to suit the three years in post.
I took professional legal advice and was told that the union would be very keen to take them to court! Unknown to me, this had previously happened to other employees and the union had sued on their behalf. It got as far as the High Court and the employer lost. It cost them a lot of money.
I elected to negotiate with the employer, on a personal level. The new boss realised he was over a barrel and the three year contract was soon reinstated. However, I was told in person by him that one professional mistake and I would be gone with no notice. At the time the department was in management chaos (much of it down to him) and it was difficult to comply with their ever changing demands. I felt totally under pressure because I knew I was being watched and in the end I resigned. The letter of resignation was very carefully worded, but totally honest and contained a couple of “scorchers”.
I was subsequently politely asked to withdraw my resignation and was offered resolution of contract instead, which was financially beneficial to me and less damaging to the bossman’s career. Boy, was I was glad to get out of there!
In the case of the pilot at the core of this thread, I can’t for the life of me think that she would actually opt to go back and work for Westpac in those circumstances.
I took professional legal advice and was told that the union would be very keen to take them to court! Unknown to me, this had previously happened to other employees and the union had sued on their behalf. It got as far as the High Court and the employer lost. It cost them a lot of money.
I elected to negotiate with the employer, on a personal level. The new boss realised he was over a barrel and the three year contract was soon reinstated. However, I was told in person by him that one professional mistake and I would be gone with no notice. At the time the department was in management chaos (much of it down to him) and it was difficult to comply with their ever changing demands. I felt totally under pressure because I knew I was being watched and in the end I resigned. The letter of resignation was very carefully worded, but totally honest and contained a couple of “scorchers”.
I was subsequently politely asked to withdraw my resignation and was offered resolution of contract instead, which was financially beneficial to me and less damaging to the bossman’s career. Boy, was I was glad to get out of there!
In the case of the pilot at the core of this thread, I can’t for the life of me think that she would actually opt to go back and work for Westpac in those circumstances.
I doubt she ever wanted to actually go back, more likely she simply wanted the record put straight by reinstatement and thus the episode expunged.
My understanding is that she didn’t seek financial compensation from Westpac.
My understanding is that she didn’t seek financial compensation from Westpac.
The Lady is a much nicer person than I am and has got far more character it seems......I would have sued for every Penny I could get....take the money....and make very good use of it leaving the Management to know how much their shoddy ways cost them for no good reason.
Perhaps, the Board of Directors might decide that the current management team needs some weeding out of some very expensive hired help.
Sometimes standing for Principle is the courageous thing to do especially when it comes at a cost to you personally.
I admire people with that kind of integrity and ethical standards.
Westpac would not like having me on their Board as I would take a very dim view of what transpired.
That no one got sacked over this is telling......doesn't sound like a place I would like to work.
Just as in the military....when your superiors lose faith in your ability to lead and command a unit....you get fired from that position and your FitRep reflects the reasons why.
Perhaps, the Board of Directors might decide that the current management team needs some weeding out of some very expensive hired help.
Sometimes standing for Principle is the courageous thing to do especially when it comes at a cost to you personally.
I admire people with that kind of integrity and ethical standards.
Westpac would not like having me on their Board as I would take a very dim view of what transpired.
That no one got sacked over this is telling......doesn't sound like a place I would like to work.
Just as in the military....when your superiors lose faith in your ability to lead and command a unit....you get fired from that position and your FitRep reflects the reasons why.
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Didn't she ask for backpay (not sure whether for just the period being unemployed or until reinstated) and got rejected on that?
when your superiors lose faith in your ability to lead and command a unit....you get fired from that position and your FitRep reflects the reasons why
Mr Shepherd, who resigned with effect on 9 June 2022
