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Helicopter Crash Vienna

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Helicopter Crash Vienna

Old 21st Nov 2021, 19:10
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Helicopter Crash Vienna

Helicopter crash Vienna
https://volksblatt.at/hubschrauber-i...h-abgestuerzt/
According to the article crashed approaching the fogy airport and burst in flames
Pilot only occupant didn‘t made it out - RIP

Bell 429
https://kurier.at/chronik/niederoest...iert/401813839

Last edited by Flying Bull; 21st Nov 2021 at 20:06.
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Old 22nd Nov 2021, 07:53
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https://www.flightradar24.com/data/a...e-xce#29efacbf
That weird gap in the (ADS-B) log might have something to do with the alleged deboarding of the rich cat at Semmering (a mountain pass) .
source of alleged deboarding https://kurier.at/chronik/niederoest...iert/401813839
"Doch der Bautycoon (Strabag) hatte unglaubliches Glück: Er selbst befand sich nicht in dem Hubschrauber, war kurz zuvor am Semmering ausgestiegen."

W/o that delay they might have made ECET at LOAN. Which still would have meant think fog at the airport, of course.
Interesting fact: LOAN is base of a HEMS service. Allegedly noone noticed the crash,
the HEMS crew did not notice the ball of flames because they even could not see across(!) the runway,
and the helo's hangar is at the east end of the runway (HEMS sits rather close by western end).
They were alerted only by a police phone call referring to an activated ELT.

I'm rather curious to know if there was any radio comm at all prio to landing:
fog, hanger at approach side of runyway, tower at the other end, add in being airborne 7min past ECET...

Last edited by Reely340; 22nd Nov 2021 at 08:57.
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Old 22nd Nov 2021, 10:09
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fog, hanger at approach side of runyway, tower at the other end, add in being airborne 7min past ECET...
why do pilots keep doing this to themselves???? You are in a helicopter not a 747, you can land anywhere and shut down!
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Old 22nd Nov 2021, 19:51
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Some might fear questions, why they went with the weather forecasted, if they land / park somewhere else than an airfield.

But answering questions isn't always coming - picture in the link was me - stood there for a week before I could fly it out again....
No questions from the authority :-)
Helionline.de - German Helicopters

Better safe than sorry ...
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Old 22nd Nov 2021, 23:12
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picture in the link was me - stood there for a week before I could fly it out again...
And thats why you are able to be here today posting on PPRuNe whereas others are not.
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Old 23rd Nov 2021, 05:15
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Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
why do pilots keep doing this to themselves???? You are in a helicopter not a 747, you can land anywhere and shut down!
.

Call it peer pressure or whatever you want ... but to the pilot he also wants to be a good employee as well as a safe one ... look at Flying Bull post #4 ... he obviously did the right thing .... but his boss (or whoever) did not have use of his million dollar helicopter for a week because it was parked in a snowbank somewhere.

.
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Old 23rd Nov 2021, 07:50
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Call it peer pressure or whatever you want ... but to the pilot he also wants to be a good employee as well as a safe one ... look at Flying Bull post #4 ... he obviously did the right thing .... but his boss (or whoever) did not have use of his million dollar helicopter for a week because it was parked in a snowbank somewhere.
better that than the outcome in this case - no helicopter at all and a dead pilot.

Yes, you could get hassle from your boss and it might cost the company a few quid in lost revenue but at least you would be around to justify your actions. This poor guy will have left a sudden hole in a lot of people's lives just because he couldn't or wouldn't make a sensible weather decision.
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Old 23rd Nov 2021, 08:18
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Indeed. Be interesting to know how much pressure came from his fuel status - if the Flight Radar paints a fairly accurate picture, Bolzano to the crash site at Wiener Neustadt is 230nm. Add another 10 minutes for an approach, drop off and departure at ? Semmering and I suspect the pilot had not given himself many options if the weather at WN was bad. Anyone know what the nearby Vienna METAR and TAF was? Low fuel and building fog is a scenario to be avoided.....
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Old 23rd Nov 2021, 10:29
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The crash happened at 16:45 in Fog and darkness Sunset was 16:11, ECT was 16:45 local time. Why the hell would you continue in conditions like this?

"It is unclear why he even attempted the last leg of the flight or attempted a landing in such difficult weather conditions. At the time of the accident around 4:45 p.m. it was not only darkness but also thick fog. According to various sources and based on recordings from the webcam, the visibility was only around 150 meters. If so, instrument flight conditions (IFR) would have existed."

https://www.austrianwings.info/2021/...llt-pilot-tot/


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Old 23rd Nov 2021, 10:34
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Originally Posted by rotorspeed View Post
Indeed. Be interesting to know how much pressure came from his fuel status ..
The intensity of the fire suggests to me he still had a bit of fuel on board.
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Old 24th Nov 2021, 08:26
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Gulli - I wasn’t suggesting he might have run out of fuel or even got close to it, just that it might have been low enough to make a divert to somewhere with known acceptable weather difficult, so adding to pressure to land at WN. I imagine say 100kg of fuel is enough to burn a crashed aircraft well. But certainly not enough to fly much further at night. Clearly bad flight planning, but just pondering as to why a presumably highly experienced pilot got himself in this situation.
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Old 24th Nov 2021, 09:33
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just pondering as to why a presumably highly experienced pilot got himself in this situation.
Unfortunately we keep on having to ask that question on this forum............
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Old 24th Nov 2021, 20:25
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Originally Posted by Flying Bull View Post
Some might fear questions, why they went with the weather forecasted, if they land / park somewhere else than an airfield.
I refuse to believe anyone would consciously throw away their life like that out of a fear of questions. I imagine it to be a mix of blatant misjudgement of the severity of the situation and the natural drive to arrive at a warm and cozy place. Maybe something like fear-induced paralysis also after a certain point.
I think a part of us will almost always know when we're in too deep. We must never forget to try and hear and listen to that little voice, no matter how stressful and unusual the situation. Always fly like you're carrying your loved ones.
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Old 25th Nov 2021, 01:27
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Always fly like you're carrying your loved ones.
Good advice, but even that doesn't prevent accidents where a pilot takes his family on a fatal ride, many a report available of the scenerio.
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Old 25th Nov 2021, 10:01
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As pilots, we all have a certain level of what you could call arrogance but is more a level of belief in our own abilities. The trouble is that the self-belief can suddenly cliff-edge and you go from confidently handling the situation to realising you have probably f***ed up in a very short space of time.

Reliance on 'Well I got in here last time and it was nearly this bad' is a very poor predictor of a safe outcome. Just because you have always got away with it doesn't in any way guarantee this time will be the same.

Don't push to your absolute limits, because it is too easy to exceed them - give your self a safety margin. We used to call it 'Adding a bit for the wife and kids'
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