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Air Ambulance in UK

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Air Ambulance in UK

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Old 17th Apr 2008, 16:45
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Patient was 6ft 2 in. Didnt go in ambulance. Went in the responders car!

902 has room for 8ft 6in. patient. (6ft 6in, if 2nd medic has to attend to the airway)

(Lincs/Notts was available but Amb Control thought it was a Derbyshire postcode.)


apparently (according to the launch day press release) one of the reasons the Augusta was better was that it could take "an additional patient", compared, presumably, to the local 902's or 135's !

Last edited by Bertie Thruster; 17th Apr 2008 at 17:12.
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Old 17th Apr 2008, 17:40
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What other profession tells as many porkies as journos?

Helicopter Sales Executives will come close
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Old 17th Apr 2008, 18:17
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Helidata has twice run stories on the proposed Avon air ambulance.....it was last due to launch in May,based at Filton but there are funding issues and an argument with the Wilts members who resent efforts to take money raised for their air ambulance to fund the new one.
Helidata also confirmed that an independent fund raiser based in Northants was employed to seek sponsorship but doesn't appear to have been very succesful.
I am not aware that the contract has moved from Sloane to BAS...seems odd given that the Bo105s are going out of service.The last I heard it was still an A109.
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Old 17th Apr 2008, 21:32
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Just an observation Heli1,

but if money is short, a Bo 105 will be a lot cheaper than a shiny new 109.

When Thames Valley started up they began with a 109. After a while they changed to a Bo 105, to save money. I believe they still use that type, although an EC135 is planned soon.

It is presumably more difficult to raise money for an air ambulance that does not actually exist.
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Old 18th Apr 2008, 00:15
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seems odd given that the Bo105s are going out of service.
Still got a year left, time enough to get the contract up and running with a Bolkow and then upgrade to a 135.


Lots of speculation in this thread, and same from the industry media. Interesting to note though that no one has actually confirmed that the contract will be a 109 from Sloanes, even though the paramedics were conducting training with a 109 at Filton last year.
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Old 18th Apr 2008, 01:18
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A109

The A109 we have has an attachment point at the rear middle of the cabin, so if the patient is over 6'0 we can load them diagnaly. We can also swivel the co pilot seat and move it forward.This also helps if we need to load 2 patients. Providing the dual controls are no installed.
I can see the pro and cons for the A109. For our program it works well with Inner Hospital Transfers, and organ harvest flights. Awful in muddy fields!
Just my thoughts...
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Old 18th Apr 2008, 11:20
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just noticed on the derbyshire rutland & leicestershire air ambulance website that they are using G-MEDS A109 so if this is the case what machine is being used by warks & northants air ambulance. G-MEDS was theirs & G-WNAA was the spare wonder if this has been changed

thanks
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Old 28th Apr 2008, 12:37
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The 109 earmarked for Bristol has gone to Rutland, Sloanes couldnt wait anylonger. BAS will be providing the A/C for Bristol.
The individual who is in charge of setting the Bristol air ambulance does not know what he is doing. He is messing everybody around and people are getting fed up with him. GWAS have got thier eye on the money from the Wiltshire air ambulnce, and this is how they are going to part fund the Avon air ambulance for it to get off the ground.
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Old 28th Apr 2008, 17:13
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Welcome to the thread, KK. First post after 8 years of lurking on PPRuNe!
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Old 28th Apr 2008, 18:55
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KK,

I had heard that the GWAS were trying to do what you suggest. However, there are some problems with that.

The money given by the good folk of Wiltshire was given to a charitabke trust quite clearly set up to provide an air ambulance for the good folk of Wiltshire. The air ambulance trust is not controlled or owned by the NHS whichever set of never-ending management reorganisations of that moribund organisation is currently in place.

It seems to me that if the newly created Great Western Ambulance Service wants to set up and run an air ambulance it needs to do one of two things:

- pay for it itself;
- get someone to set up a new charitable trust with the goal of fundraising for the new activity

AS you indicated, I believe someone has moved from another air ambulance trust or setup and promised to raise the funds for the GW air ambulance. I had also heard that there had been lots of promises but precious little action so far.

Whoever is involved in this new venture may well expect some resistance to the idea of taking money from another charity just like that. I am defintely no expert but I believe that charities have trustees who manage the money on behalf of the charity. I would be surprised if they just rolled over, and handed over the money.........

It would be like Cancer Research giving all their funds to Green Peace.
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Old 28th Apr 2008, 19:35
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Indeed, Helinut is correct. Trustees have a rubbish job: it's not paid,yet they can go to jail if things go wrong. It sounds to me like the Articles of Association of the charity state 'for the county of Wiltshire' and until these are changed, that's all the funds can be used for.

I - for my sins - am a trustee of another Air Ambulance trust, who set out to raise funds in another county with a view to launching a second machine in this county once enough funds had been raised...in that county. We're very nearly there after just 12 months!
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Old 28th Apr 2008, 20:40
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It all seems to get very confusing when an ambulance trust becomes part of an air ambulance charity!

Bit like if the MCA ran the RNLI!

http://www.thisiswiltshire.co.uk/new...nt&cid=1469355
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Old 29th Apr 2008, 20:55
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Thanks for the link, Bertie - good to see the topic is being kept alive in Wilts.

I've heard quite a few opinions about Ambulance Authorities which get themselves involved in the running of Air Ambulance charities. Same goes for trusts which take the wages of the ambulance staff out of the charity funds. Couldn't possibly comment myself, mind.
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Old 29th Apr 2008, 21:25
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Thud,

"Same goes for trusts which take the wages of the ambulance staff out of the charity funds."

Care to expand on that?
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Old 1st May 2008, 14:23
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Its fact that the air ambulance charity in wiltshire pay for the paramedics wages. The Great western Ambulance Service, who are the trustees of the Wiltshire charity are well aware of this and are happy with the arrangement because no one has challanged them.
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Old 1st May 2008, 15:02
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KK,

I am not in a position to challenge you on this, but I rather thought that a trustee of a charity had to be a person rather than a limited company or a chunk of the NHS.

It is quite cheeky if the air ambo pays for the paramedics - I am pretty sure there was some sort of central agreement that paramedics would be paid by the NHS - is that your understanding too?
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Old 1st May 2008, 16:18
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Yes your right. What happened in wiltshire was that the old trustees agreed that the charity would the paramedics wages for only six month and that it would be paid back. in those six months the great western ambulance trust took set up a umbrella charity with the wiltshire air ambulance appeal trust under it. They then changed the trustees and have not honoured that agreement. I believe now they are hoping that it folds and then they take charge of the money and that is how they are going to help to finance the bristol air ambulance. Mind you that is only my thoughts!!!!!
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Old 1st May 2008, 18:59
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Hmmmm.... The Charity Commission might be interested in this....
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Old 1st May 2008, 19:41
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I think there were, and still are, also odd goings on with the air ambos in your old neck of the woods, What Limits!


eg a fund raising 'organisation' to harvest the cash off the willing punters with this cash then passed onto the 'charity' that runs the air ambos. Strangely though, the trustees of this charity are exactly the same people as the board of directors of the local NHS ambulance trust!!
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Old 1st May 2008, 20:10
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206 Jock,

Apologies for not replying straight away; my shift pattern doesn't always allow me time in the evenings to go online.

I think the replies that have come in since will adequately answer the question you asked me. Food for thought, eh?
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