Pilots who went on strike let go by PHI
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Well, I guess I got a rise out of this thread! And I do love the map. I also wish good luck to the PHI strikers, who have put their livlihoods on the line for all of us (even the socialists 
)
)
Bristow years ago tried to stay away from small machines....taking the view the potential return on investment as compared to medium or large machines just did not make it worth it. There will be some need for small machines if for no other reason than to meet a customers total needs and thus facilitate large contracts.
As the work progresses further offshore....Jetrangers and such will gradually go the way of the Buffalo. Thank Goodness!
As the work progresses further offshore....Jetrangers and such will gradually go the way of the Buffalo. Thank Goodness!
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-Stan-
Gatvol
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"As the work progresses further offshore....Jetrangers and such will gradually go the way of the Buffalo. Thank Goodness!"
Whoa, Remember Sasless, everything we flew in the Army is now in a Museum......except us.
Whoa, Remember Sasless, everything we flew in the Army is now in a Museum......except us.
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The concept of losing money on each aircraft contracted but making it up with volume compounds to greater losses in my opinion so likewise seems to be failed business logic.
If Gonsoulin really has no intentions to downsize, then why did he state, in more than one meeting at bases, that he had no problem doing that? He has said that he will never rehire any striking pilot, and that he is happy to have a much smaller company. Is he speaking out of both sides of his mouth? His 'insider' employees are now claiming the opposite, but how can anyone believe them?
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Sikorsky
Now that Sikorsky pilots are flying as scabs, I will never again say anything good about Sikorsky, Sikorsky aircraft, Sikorsky pilots, or anyone who flies, or has ever flown, for Sikorsky. I hope there is a special place in hell for Pino, who sent them down. I also hope anyone considering the purchase of new equipment will look elsewhere, or suggest their employers look elsewhere. There is plenty of competition, all of it capable of doing the work.
Gatvol
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"I will never again say anything good about Sikorsky, Sikorsky aircraft, Sikorsky pilots, or anyone who flies, or has ever flown, for Sikorsky."
That may just translate to sticking ones head in the sand using maximum force..
Sikorsky does what it does for what reason?? To sell Aircraft. The Pilots go where they are told to go or are also replaced (except with no union). I cant believe they will have any affect on the job action.
That may just translate to sticking ones head in the sand using maximum force..
Sikorsky does what it does for what reason?? To sell Aircraft. The Pilots go where they are told to go or are also replaced (except with no union). I cant believe they will have any affect on the job action.
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Now that Sikorsky pilots are flying as scabs, I will never again say anything good about Sikorsky, Sikorsky aircraft, Sikorsky pilots, or anyone who flies, or has ever flown, for Sikorsky. I hope there is a special place in hell for Pino, who sent them down. I also hope anyone considering the purchase of new equipment will look elsewhere, or suggest their employers look elsewhere. There is plenty of competition, all of it capable of doing the work.
For those of you that are backstabbed by scabs, I fully understand your anger. However, there might also be Sikorsky/Flight Safety pilots that declined to fly for PHI during the strike, and they have my respect. If the names of the scabs are well known, someone should approach them and politely explain that they are not very welcome these days.
....or remind them how fortunate they are that this is not an old time Teamsters Strike!
The Sikorsky pilots are in an awkward position. I would assume they are non-union and must therefore adhere to their employer's determination of what their job description is. They, being non-union, have no axe to grind in the PHI fuss extant as without fail, their paycheck far exceeds that of the pilots they are replacing.
That being said, they are helicopter pilots, and thus have every involvement in the campaign by helicopter pilots to improve the lot of helicopter pilots at PHI, which also affects helicopter pilots throughout the US Helicopter industry.
Now I would bet a doughnut to a dog dropping, and let you hold the stakes in your mouth, that these Yankee Carpet Baggers are not staying in PHI crew quarters....that would be way too plebian for them. Perhaps a polite chat over an adult malt beverage would be in order for someone to tell them of the issues at hand, and ask them nicely to head home back up North.
The Sikorsky pilots are in an awkward position. I would assume they are non-union and must therefore adhere to their employer's determination of what their job description is. They, being non-union, have no axe to grind in the PHI fuss extant as without fail, their paycheck far exceeds that of the pilots they are replacing.
That being said, they are helicopter pilots, and thus have every involvement in the campaign by helicopter pilots to improve the lot of helicopter pilots at PHI, which also affects helicopter pilots throughout the US Helicopter industry.
Now I would bet a doughnut to a dog dropping, and let you hold the stakes in your mouth, that these Yankee Carpet Baggers are not staying in PHI crew quarters....that would be way too plebian for them. Perhaps a polite chat over an adult malt beverage would be in order for someone to tell them of the issues at hand, and ask them nicely to head home back up North.
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Sikorsky Employee?
The only Sikorsky person I'm aware of has resigned at Sikorsky and signed on at PHI as a contractor. No longer a Sikorsky employee. If there are more than this one, disregard my input.
DT
DT
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DT:
Now I'm not saying this is the case with your reported SK guy, but it kind of reminds me of "sheep dipping". Air force guy resigns from AF. Hires on with CIA proprietary. Does the deal. Deal over. Lo and behold, he's back in the Air Force.
On the subject of the thread, I've had conversations with some of the non-striking pilots and they don't consider themselves scabs because, wait for it - they quit the union prior to the strike being called.
I direct them to the definition of "scab" at wikipedia.
Ron Powell
Now I'm not saying this is the case with your reported SK guy, but it kind of reminds me of "sheep dipping". Air force guy resigns from AF. Hires on with CIA proprietary. Does the deal. Deal over. Lo and behold, he's back in the Air Force.
On the subject of the thread, I've had conversations with some of the non-striking pilots and they don't consider themselves scabs because, wait for it - they quit the union prior to the strike being called.
I direct them to the definition of "scab" at wikipedia.
Ron Powell
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Sad days for fans of Sikorsky
Most of the pilots in the North Sea would probably fall into the category of giving the S92 a thumbs up, based on the track record of the venerable old lady, the S61N. The passengers loved the cabin, and the combination of sound levels and vibration levels being fairly decent it was always a favorite of many pilots in Norway.
It did have drawbacks related to insufficent engine performance in low winds and high temperatures, and a high centre of gravity leading to all pilots expecting any distching to involve upside down under water evacution.....
Unfortunately, the S92 have not proven to be a reliable and safe aircraft yet.
Noise levels in the cockpit, high vibration levels, cracks in the airframe and parts falling off, oil lubrication system failing, loose pitch links have given reason for serious consern. Our customers , our passengers, the pilots and technicians have all had to rethink our intial enthusiasm about the S92.
To many of us this has lead to increased focus on Eurocopter products. Many of us would be inclined to recommend the EC225 to the customer and the passenger organisations if asked. Have no doubt, they do ask for our advice.
If it turns out that factory pilots from Sirkorsky carry out commercial flights for PHI during this time of crisis, this is very serious indeed. it would potentially make it difficult to communicate with the factory on issues relating to work environment and safety.
Would factory pilots from Eurocopter ever sink this low? I doubt it.
If indeed pilots from the Sikorsky plant is performing commercial operations in a company which is involved in legal industrial action, then this would be a time for them to take it easy, relax and find more productive ways of spending their days. How about figuring out how to make the S92 into a smooth aircraft like the S61N? That would keep you busy for quite some time.
It did have drawbacks related to insufficent engine performance in low winds and high temperatures, and a high centre of gravity leading to all pilots expecting any distching to involve upside down under water evacution.....
Unfortunately, the S92 have not proven to be a reliable and safe aircraft yet.
Noise levels in the cockpit, high vibration levels, cracks in the airframe and parts falling off, oil lubrication system failing, loose pitch links have given reason for serious consern. Our customers , our passengers, the pilots and technicians have all had to rethink our intial enthusiasm about the S92.
To many of us this has lead to increased focus on Eurocopter products. Many of us would be inclined to recommend the EC225 to the customer and the passenger organisations if asked. Have no doubt, they do ask for our advice.
If it turns out that factory pilots from Sirkorsky carry out commercial flights for PHI during this time of crisis, this is very serious indeed. it would potentially make it difficult to communicate with the factory on issues relating to work environment and safety.
Would factory pilots from Eurocopter ever sink this low? I doubt it.
If indeed pilots from the Sikorsky plant is performing commercial operations in a company which is involved in legal industrial action, then this would be a time for them to take it easy, relax and find more productive ways of spending their days. How about figuring out how to make the S92 into a smooth aircraft like the S61N? That would keep you busy for quite some time.
Last edited by chc&proud; 2nd Oct 2006 at 18:06. Reason: poor spelling
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Invalid Comparisions
With all due respect, I cannot help but feel that chc's discourses about Unionism's social acceptance, successes,and salaries, in his European enviornment, are somewhat like the old expression of comparing apples and oranges.
Like it or not and for better or worse, the USA is not (yet?) similar to the the Common Market enviornment, even after Ms Thatcher's impact.
The fact that in the USA, sufficient sentiment still supports right to work laws in several states, and insufficient favorable support makes recent French large labor actions and boycotts seem highly improbable here in 'the Colonies'.
Additionally. Sikorsky not only operates within this different enviornment, but also suffers from a competitive lack of Eurocopter's generous subsidies.
These just two of the most glaring reasons that I personally believe his arguments although very well presented, are not valid.
Just my opinion, respectfully submitted.
Like it or not and for better or worse, the USA is not (yet?) similar to the the Common Market enviornment, even after Ms Thatcher's impact.
The fact that in the USA, sufficient sentiment still supports right to work laws in several states, and insufficient favorable support makes recent French large labor actions and boycotts seem highly improbable here in 'the Colonies'.
Additionally. Sikorsky not only operates within this different enviornment, but also suffers from a competitive lack of Eurocopter's generous subsidies.
These just two of the most glaring reasons that I personally believe his arguments although very well presented, are not valid.
Just my opinion, respectfully submitted.
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I think of unions as a "chamber of commerce" for the pilots. That's got everything todo with social acceptance, successes,and salaries.
How come US airlinepilots have figured it out, but the majority of helipilots (US) haven't ?
How come US airlinepilots have figured it out, but the majority of helipilots (US) haven't ?
From GLS Night Pilot
"Now that Sikorsky pilots are flying as scabs, I will never again say anything good about Sikorsky, Sikorsky aircraft, Sikorsky pilots, or anyone who flies, or has ever flown, for Sikorsky. I hope there is a special place in hell for Pino, who sent them down. I also hope anyone considering the purchase of new equipment will look elsewhere, or suggest their employers look elsewhere."
GLS
Your extreme anger is quite apparent and to some extent understandable. The products made by Sikorsky have flown many military and civilian hours as well as having saved many lives. Many pilots on this forum would not agree with you about Sikorsky products.
From your viewpoint, it is unfortunate that some pilots, including some who are not direct PHI employees have crossed lines to keep some flights operating. However, to consign the Sikorsky President to hell and to trash their products purely because they have engaged in actions with which you disagree is not a structured or cogent argument. Just because you perceive that Sikorsly supports PHI does not overnight change the fabric or continuity of their products.
In fact, it could be interpreted as an act of desparation and lead people to the conclusion that the company's refusal to give in to union demands is causing considerable duress. I am sure that the striking union members would like to maintain a just and reasoned argument in order to ensure continued support from many fellow pilots on this forum.
"Now that Sikorsky pilots are flying as scabs, I will never again say anything good about Sikorsky, Sikorsky aircraft, Sikorsky pilots, or anyone who flies, or has ever flown, for Sikorsky. I hope there is a special place in hell for Pino, who sent them down. I also hope anyone considering the purchase of new equipment will look elsewhere, or suggest their employers look elsewhere."
GLS
Your extreme anger is quite apparent and to some extent understandable. The products made by Sikorsky have flown many military and civilian hours as well as having saved many lives. Many pilots on this forum would not agree with you about Sikorsky products.
From your viewpoint, it is unfortunate that some pilots, including some who are not direct PHI employees have crossed lines to keep some flights operating. However, to consign the Sikorsky President to hell and to trash their products purely because they have engaged in actions with which you disagree is not a structured or cogent argument. Just because you perceive that Sikorsly supports PHI does not overnight change the fabric or continuity of their products.
In fact, it could be interpreted as an act of desparation and lead people to the conclusion that the company's refusal to give in to union demands is causing considerable duress. I am sure that the striking union members would like to maintain a just and reasoned argument in order to ensure continued support from many fellow pilots on this forum.
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Focus on Europe?
Europe is not a big place when you look at a map, but is inhabited by more than 500 million people in the EU alone, almost twice as many as the US. The countries have different languages, and vast differences in cultures and traditions.
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It's too bad so many US helicopter pilots still hold on to the silly notion that being a loyal member of a pilot union might make Jimmy Hoffa come alive.
Contrary to the misconseptions of some ill informed people in the US most of the union pilots in Europe place their vote with conservative parties come election time. Party politics have little or nothing to do with the term UNION when it comes to pilot unions. Please wise up, those of you who are still asleep. Have you never heard of the Seven Sisters? Have you never heard of Guilds? Those entities are as much unions as any pilot union will ever be, in my opinion.
Anyway, how are the guys and gals doing at PHI.....? Is the strike having an impact on productivity in the GOM?
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It's too bad so many US helicopter pilots still hold on to the silly notion that being a loyal member of a pilot union might make Jimmy Hoffa come alive.
Contrary to the misconseptions of some ill informed people in the US most of the union pilots in Europe place their vote with conservative parties come election time. Party politics have little or nothing to do with the term UNION when it comes to pilot unions. Please wise up, those of you who are still asleep. Have you never heard of the Seven Sisters? Have you never heard of Guilds? Those entities are as much unions as any pilot union will ever be, in my opinion.
Anyway, how are the guys and gals doing at PHI.....? Is the strike having an impact on productivity in the GOM?
Gatvol
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"How come US airlinepilots have figured it out, but the majority of helipilots (US) haven't ?"
I was awaitin for that bait. Lets look at all those Airline Pilots today. I mean those real rich guys who are making a ton of money. Ask them where their Pension plans have gone......Im talking like Vanished overnight. Some guys with upwards of a Million dollars in Pension.......zippo, Goo bye, Zap. CEOs and their crowd are OK, because they make the rules. And all they may get from the ALPA is Sympathy.....
Sort of like our Politicians. They dont "Steal" anything, they legislate it into their pockets. Their constituency is a bit more stupid as they re-elect these mopes. I guess in essence, we get what we deserve.
The world is a seriously fast changing place today and not many folks are going to make careers out of one employer anymore. Just dont tell me the Airlines are all that great.
I was awaitin for that bait. Lets look at all those Airline Pilots today. I mean those real rich guys who are making a ton of money. Ask them where their Pension plans have gone......Im talking like Vanished overnight. Some guys with upwards of a Million dollars in Pension.......zippo, Goo bye, Zap. CEOs and their crowd are OK, because they make the rules. And all they may get from the ALPA is Sympathy.....
Sort of like our Politicians. They dont "Steal" anything, they legislate it into their pockets. Their constituency is a bit more stupid as they re-elect these mopes. I guess in essence, we get what we deserve.
The world is a seriously fast changing place today and not many folks are going to make careers out of one employer anymore. Just dont tell me the Airlines are all that great.
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Heavy turbulence in the airline industry
I agree that mr. B Sousa has a valid point in oh so many ways when it comes to the US airlines. They are flying through heavy turbulence, seeking protection from creditors through Chapter 11, trying to stay airborne.
Still, the pilot salaries and pension plans might not be the main reason for the problems.
The airline pilots are still unionized and remain members of US-ALPA or similar. Looking into my crystal ball, I see ALPA working hard to control damages and to protect the interests of the membership, and I see them eventually finding solutions to the huge challenges they are facing today.
ALPA traditionally has tried to work with management to sort out problems in times of crisis. When times are good ALPA will of course seek improvements to terms and conditions.
I wonder how our friends at PHI are doing?
Still, the pilot salaries and pension plans might not be the main reason for the problems.
The airline pilots are still unionized and remain members of US-ALPA or similar. Looking into my crystal ball, I see ALPA working hard to control damages and to protect the interests of the membership, and I see them eventually finding solutions to the huge challenges they are facing today.
ALPA traditionally has tried to work with management to sort out problems in times of crisis. When times are good ALPA will of course seek improvements to terms and conditions.
I wonder how our friends at PHI are doing?
Last edited by chc&proud; 2nd Oct 2006 at 22:27. Reason: poor spelling, as always.
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Yeah, no doubt airlines have taken a hit along with their pilots. But then, I guess it's just who you work for flying big iron.
http://www.dmnews.com/cms/dm-news/di...ail/38109.html
Nice 8 year contract with signing bonuses of between $34-60K USD.
Ron Powell
http://www.dmnews.com/cms/dm-news/di...ail/38109.html
Nice 8 year contract with signing bonuses of between $34-60K USD.
Ron Powell