I am mad?
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: LONDON
Posts: 30
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
good one?
what knowledge,.....its life of experiences...not just aviation you pass on....its not all about bleacing your hair and lying on the beach...being loud and brash....and by the way mustard is a soft smooth paste...you dont need to cut it...its spreds quite easily...
The Original Whirly
Join Date: Feb 1999
Location: Belper, Derbyshire, UK
Posts: 4,326
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
No time to write much, as off to the job I love as an instructor. I qualified when the wrong side of 50 - don't admit that often on here, but maybe people NEED to know that getting older doesn't necessarily mean you aren't adaptable, or that your wants and needs in life change, or that you can't live off pot noodles or sleep rough or work long hours or any of those things, OK?!!!!!!! It totally depends on the individual. Now, I'm not earning a lot, and I managed to keep the house, but not an awful lot else. But I can afford to feed me and the cats. My only luxury before I did all this was flying, and now I get paid for doing that, so I don't need that much to live on.
I could explain this better if I had more time, but what I'm saying is, decide what YOU want out of life, have something to fall back on if you can....eg smaller house or flat which you let and which will provide roof later on, maybe??? But ultimately, it's YOUR decision, not someone else's because they can't possibly know how you feel about flying or life or anything else. As for the ageist crap some people write..........(comments censored)
I could explain this better if I had more time, but what I'm saying is, decide what YOU want out of life, have something to fall back on if you can....eg smaller house or flat which you let and which will provide roof later on, maybe??? But ultimately, it's YOUR decision, not someone else's because they can't possibly know how you feel about flying or life or anything else. As for the ageist crap some people write..........(comments censored)
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: west sussex
Age: 59
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Cheers guys
Thanks for your thoughts and comments. All have been really helpful.I gonna take it one step at time.
Steve 76.....thanks for your thoughts but I just feel by your rationale no-one should take up flying!
Steve 76.....thanks for your thoughts but I just feel by your rationale no-one should take up flying!
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: inside
Posts: 72
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
James...with your last comment you sound like you only want positive responses, even though you yourself stated it might be a "mad" move.
If you don't like the answers, don't ask the question IMHO
One good pointer in this industry: Never assume anything. Any pilot will tell you that good research prevents major f*ckups.
Have you done yours ?
If you don't like the answers, don't ask the question IMHO
One good pointer in this industry: Never assume anything. Any pilot will tell you that good research prevents major f*ckups.
Have you done yours ?
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Missouri, USA
Age: 59
Posts: 235
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I've been following this thread from the sidelines with quite a bit of interest since it seems to pertain to a lot of people. The world is full of cheerleaders telling you to follow your dreams. My dreams tend to be filled with unclothed cuties, and I don't recall a helicopter in even one dream. Don't get me wrong, I love flying, and as much as I enjoy flying airplanes, flying helicopters makes flying fixed-wing seem boring by comparison. And I find it incredulous that there are a lot of people making a living at something that I find so enjoyable.
There seems to be a lot of people that get to our age and are tired of the job they dread driving to every morning and want a career change so that they can start enjoying more of their time. 50% of your waking hours are at work so I can't fault anyone for wanting to do something (s)he enjoys. With that said, I hope no one faults Steve76 for his comments because I'm sure much of what he said is true. But more importantly if someone CAN be discouraged from taking the leap they SHOULD be. You'll find a lot of folks cheering you on to quit your job and take up a new career as a pilot. And a lot of them laughing at people that do and fail. I've talked with enough career pilots, most of whom like what they do but are adamant that it isn't for the fainthearted. Even around the hangar here I've discovered that helicopter pilots carry some of the largest egos on two feet, so I can't imagine how bad it gets in the real world.
At this point I'm finishing up my CPL and working toward my IR, then on to CFI, just for fun really. As much as I think I would enjoy turning it into a career I can't disrupt my family, as they've gotten used to seeing my ugly face every night. And I'm kinda fond of seeing them every night. I'm slowly building hours, and while it's not likely, if an opportunity should arise one day I won't be grumbling "if only I'd prepared myself". But I'm having a helluva time with my training and it keeps me distracted from my day job enough.
There seems to be a lot of people that get to our age and are tired of the job they dread driving to every morning and want a career change so that they can start enjoying more of their time. 50% of your waking hours are at work so I can't fault anyone for wanting to do something (s)he enjoys. With that said, I hope no one faults Steve76 for his comments because I'm sure much of what he said is true. But more importantly if someone CAN be discouraged from taking the leap they SHOULD be. You'll find a lot of folks cheering you on to quit your job and take up a new career as a pilot. And a lot of them laughing at people that do and fail. I've talked with enough career pilots, most of whom like what they do but are adamant that it isn't for the fainthearted. Even around the hangar here I've discovered that helicopter pilots carry some of the largest egos on two feet, so I can't imagine how bad it gets in the real world.
At this point I'm finishing up my CPL and working toward my IR, then on to CFI, just for fun really. As much as I think I would enjoy turning it into a career I can't disrupt my family, as they've gotten used to seeing my ugly face every night. And I'm kinda fond of seeing them every night. I'm slowly building hours, and while it's not likely, if an opportunity should arise one day I won't be grumbling "if only I'd prepared myself". But I'm having a helluva time with my training and it keeps me distracted from my day job enough.
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: inside
Posts: 72
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I've talked with enough career pilots, most of whom like what they do but are adamant that it isn't for the fainthearted. Even around the hangar here I've discovered that helicopter pilots carry some of the largest egos on two feet, so I can't imagine how bad it gets in the real world.
Ego or assertive ? Cautious or insecure ? Big question not easy to answer, but the prejudice you display is not healthy. Lighten up
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Missouri, USA
Age: 59
Posts: 235
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Sorry about that, no offense intended. My only experience with in-person contact with career helicopter pilots has been, like you said, in the training environment, and a couple of EMS pilots. Trust me when I say I'm not confusing ego with assertive. I'm sure it's due to my limited exposure, but a little goes a long way when it comes to "helicopter pilots are better than airplane pilots" crap, along with belittling students' flying skills in front of others and even poking fun at their colleagues' skills. Or maybe that it's just that the midwest has more than its fair share of egotists.
The law of large numbers dictates that even here you'll find a handful of people full of themselves. But for the most part I've found the folks here to be incredibly friendly and helpful. If Rotorheads is typical of the professional pilots population in general...it would make my day. And I would owe everyone here an apology. Again, I'm sorry about that.
The law of large numbers dictates that even here you'll find a handful of people full of themselves. But for the most part I've found the folks here to be incredibly friendly and helpful. If Rotorheads is typical of the professional pilots population in general...it would make my day. And I would owe everyone here an apology. Again, I'm sorry about that.
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: A man of the world
Posts: 128
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I am 41 and just so happy to be where I am. Always looking for better of course, but I know things are good.
When I was looking at a civil aviation career I was at a seminar and a BA B747 Training Captain stood up to address us. His first words (as he stood there in expensive suit and glowing tan) were to tell us not to look at him and expect the same - things would and do change.
So, those of us experienced in the industry cannot have the most pearls of wisdom to pass on to you, James Fleming. Those such as the Whirls' , R1T etc. who are closer to your level will give a more accurate picture of what to expect.
The cynical and the more positive experienced pilots can say how it is today but (with the best will in the world) you are a few years and a lot of cash away from Offshore/HEMS/corporate/police etc. and times change.
Look really carefully - not at a computer screen - but by meeting real people in real jobs and decide carefully. Go around the flying schools and see what it is to be starting out and new; both as a student and as an instructor.
Like I say - I am happy to be where I am - clearly you are less so. Just have realistic expectations for what will be a significant change if you choose to alter heading...
When I was looking at a civil aviation career I was at a seminar and a BA B747 Training Captain stood up to address us. His first words (as he stood there in expensive suit and glowing tan) were to tell us not to look at him and expect the same - things would and do change.
So, those of us experienced in the industry cannot have the most pearls of wisdom to pass on to you, James Fleming. Those such as the Whirls' , R1T etc. who are closer to your level will give a more accurate picture of what to expect.
The cynical and the more positive experienced pilots can say how it is today but (with the best will in the world) you are a few years and a lot of cash away from Offshore/HEMS/corporate/police etc. and times change.
Look really carefully - not at a computer screen - but by meeting real people in real jobs and decide carefully. Go around the flying schools and see what it is to be starting out and new; both as a student and as an instructor.
Like I say - I am happy to be where I am - clearly you are less so. Just have realistic expectations for what will be a significant change if you choose to alter heading...
You don't need to say sorry because you are quite correct Gerhardt. I think there are a pile of guys who really think their **** doesn't stink in this industry and they carry that for a long while until they meet or have to work around others who their skills and experience pale in comparison too. The circut wonder instructors I have met seem to have the worst attitude and most of my buddies probably think the same of me! hahaha.
There is a time somewhere in ones career when suddenly you wake up and realise this life is not a re-run of Topgun and you are just another pilot. That's the day you get on with being a pilot, provider and the ego disipates.
So, the sentiment seems to be throw caution to the wind and run with your dream. Who really care? I certainly don't and if you will not listen to the advise of guys like 170', Brian, Bert or 540 then take the under 1000hr crowds word and spend. Either way you can't take it when you die...right?
Hillerbee: obviously a 20yr old has more opportunity to recover if it goes wrong and flexibility to drop everything and head wherever the career calls. No offence taken nor intended from moi.
Brian -
who said I have ever had to stop fixing cars! I was a looooong way off 40 at that time and as for low hours: True (we all had in comparison to you) but I probably had more hours than you had when they sent you off in a kahki huey 
By the way - how do you fit 17 pax in a 204?
There is a time somewhere in ones career when suddenly you wake up and realise this life is not a re-run of Topgun and you are just another pilot. That's the day you get on with being a pilot, provider and the ego disipates.
So, the sentiment seems to be throw caution to the wind and run with your dream. Who really care? I certainly don't and if you will not listen to the advise of guys like 170', Brian, Bert or 540 then take the under 1000hr crowds word and spend. Either way you can't take it when you die...right?
Hillerbee: obviously a 20yr old has more opportunity to recover if it goes wrong and flexibility to drop everything and head wherever the career calls. No offence taken nor intended from moi.
Brian -
who said I have ever had to stop fixing cars! I was a looooong way off 40 at that time and as for low hours: True (we all had in comparison to you) but I probably had more hours than you had when they sent you off in a kahki huey By the way - how do you fit 17 pax in a 204?
Hovering AND talking
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Propping up bars in the Lands of D H Lawrence and Bishop Bonner
Age: 59
Posts: 5,705
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Steve76, tell me something.
What do you suggest? I am not criticizing you for removing the rose-coloured spectacles that I'm sure some wannabees possess but you're not offering much in the way of helpful advice especially, er.. forgive me... when most of these come from the UK perspective. Don't give me any **** about global markets; at the low hours stage, the processes are quite different due to differing regulations.
Not every 18 year old has the foresight to know what they want to do for a living. I am, as most know, a Chartered Accountant. That is my second career after I realised that my dream of becoming a world-famous nuclear physicist was not going to happen (Thanks Maggie!). I'm about to embark on a third.
The question is, if you had your time again, would you be a helicopter pilot? If yes, then I would expect a little more in the line of constructive comments. If not, then why don't you go and realise your dream of being ... whatever?
Just remember, not everyone is money motivated; some have been there and done that. You seem to berate the "late starter" for taking jobs away from "career pilots". What's the difference?
It seems to me that you're saying to the IT Manager/Lawyer/Accountant/Stockbroker who wants to change career, "don't" , because you're taking away a job from some poor chap who doesn't have another qualification and can't do anything. Well, if we do? Tough! I'll train them in double-entry bookkeeping if they want!
Cheers
Whirls
What do you suggest? I am not criticizing you for removing the rose-coloured spectacles that I'm sure some wannabees possess but you're not offering much in the way of helpful advice especially, er.. forgive me... when most of these come from the UK perspective. Don't give me any **** about global markets; at the low hours stage, the processes are quite different due to differing regulations.
Not every 18 year old has the foresight to know what they want to do for a living. I am, as most know, a Chartered Accountant. That is my second career after I realised that my dream of becoming a world-famous nuclear physicist was not going to happen (Thanks Maggie!). I'm about to embark on a third.
The question is, if you had your time again, would you be a helicopter pilot? If yes, then I would expect a little more in the line of constructive comments. If not, then why don't you go and realise your dream of being ... whatever?
Just remember, not everyone is money motivated; some have been there and done that. You seem to berate the "late starter" for taking jobs away from "career pilots". What's the difference?
It seems to me that you're saying to the IT Manager/Lawyer/Accountant/Stockbroker who wants to change career, "don't" , because you're taking away a job from some poor chap who doesn't have another qualification and can't do anything. Well, if we do? Tough! I'll train them in double-entry bookkeeping if they want!
Cheers
Whirls
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: UK
Posts: 215
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Yes, you're mad. We're all mad!
I did it fixed wing as a career-changer. Currently working as an Instructor earning next to nothing compared to what I used to earn...and I sold the house to fund it. If I get the best job offer in the world tomorrow, I still won't have the money I used to have. How am I going to fund my retirement?? Dunno!! Flying's great most of the time but flying for fun on a PPL isn't the same as flying for a living. Think carefully before you leap. It might look glamorous but it ain't really.
I did it fixed wing as a career-changer. Currently working as an Instructor earning next to nothing compared to what I used to earn...and I sold the house to fund it. If I get the best job offer in the world tomorrow, I still won't have the money I used to have. How am I going to fund my retirement?? Dunno!! Flying's great most of the time but flying for fun on a PPL isn't the same as flying for a living. Think carefully before you leap. It might look glamorous but it ain't really.
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Sale, Australia
Age: 80
Posts: 3,832
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
James, while the advice given here is well intentioned the only person who can make the decision whether to go for it is your good self. I've admired the guys like Steve who had spouse and kids to provide for taking on the lottery that is getting a leg up as a professional aviator. And there has been quite a few of them when I think about it, and it says something of the families who supported them during the low pay, poor conditions days of their carreers. Not all make it. One of Steves weekly passengers was a very high houred fixed wing GA corporate pilot (not much money) who's ambition to crack airlines never came to fruition. There was so much competition in his era that he was just unfortunate that though he was eminately qualified his name just never came out of the hat. He finally took up a job in the oil industry in order to provide for the family in a reasonable manner. 747 captains have given up their jobs to move on to something they personally found more rewarding, one I heard of flying helos cattle mustering and another to become a priest. Met a chap a couple of weeks ago who sold out of highly successful IT company to become a professional skydiver earning the princely sum of $45,000 (Oz) a year. You cant win if you dont take a ticket in the lottery, as Whirls intimates money aint everything though it does help. The very best of luck in whatever you decide.
PS Steve - 205 2 pilots, 2 gunners, 13 little Asians
PS Steve - 205 2 pilots, 2 gunners, 13 little Asians
Gatvol
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: KLAS/TIST/FAJS/KFAI
Posts: 4,195
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
"13 little Asians"
Some here can no doubt top that one. Good friend of mine with the 25th Division pulled no less than 6 plus crew off a mountain in an OH-6 during a conflict. Got him a Silver Star.
Some here can no doubt top that one. Good friend of mine with the 25th Division pulled no less than 6 plus crew off a mountain in an OH-6 during a conflict. Got him a Silver Star.
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Sydney, Australia
Age: 61
Posts: 122
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
How about the part-time route? That way you can hang onto your day job and pay the mortgage? A friend of mine works in IT during the week and flies joyrides at weekends in Tiger Moths and a Pitts S-2C, then trades his flying pay to buy more hours. He's currently getting his Instructor's rating and ATPL. He probably flies 5 times the hours I do in the Pitts, and he doesn't lose any pay for doing it. Mind you he doesn't have any family so it's more achievable. When I was his age I was either working weekends in a commission only sales job, or navigating a racing yacht (yacht-racing is the most expensive and the cheapest sport in the world - cheapest if you're crew; most expensive if your the owner).
Had I worked it out I should have done what he did... after the RN declined to fund my hobby any further I decided to go and earn the money to do it myself. I may be able to afford to pursue my passion financially but finding the time is much harder now...
Had I worked it out I should have done what he did... after the RN declined to fund my hobby any further I decided to go and earn the money to do it myself. I may be able to afford to pursue my passion financially but finding the time is much harder now...
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: uk
Posts: 13
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
big risk
I was 42 when I converted to rotary. I had a fixwing and did a lot of single engine trans-Atlantic ferry work, but it's dangerous and lonely.
I am now 51, and have 4000+ hours of rotary turbine time. I got lucky.
My son is just doing his CPLH, and I have had to invest a lot of money in him - he is lucky.
Some one will employ him - for peanuts, they will be lucky.
Do you feel lucky ?
I am now 51, and have 4000+ hours of rotary turbine time. I got lucky.
My son is just doing his CPLH, and I have had to invest a lot of money in him - he is lucky.
Some one will employ him - for peanuts, they will be lucky.
Do you feel lucky ?
No time for girls
James,
if you want to PM me then go for it. I can give you my account of it all having been there myself without getting into a girly debate about whether a monkey can fly at the age of three.
Regards,
if you want to PM me then go for it. I can give you my account of it all having been there myself without getting into a girly debate about whether a monkey can fly at the age of three.
Regards,
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: mostly in the jungle...
Age: 59
Posts: 502
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Jim, mate,
just make sure you got the financial part sorted!
Age is a non-issue for employment, I'd rather get a cooled off 40ish than a hot-shot 20.
I got my ticket with 27, but was a 16-year old fool at heart, learned my lessons though and am alive to tell - some of the lessons thaught me also that I am religious after all....
Again, make sure you got the quid to go through to CFII, because like it or not, your first job is going to be Instructor (unless you have your own business, a rich uncle, etc.) You can make good money as an instructor, but it is a lot of work.
When you start, dig in and pull it through, but again, make sure you can do it financially. Nothing worse than having to cut halfway to get back to some job you don't like to pay your creditline....
In the US (or any Non-EU place) count on about US$ 50K until you get your first job. Don't fool yourself with cheap offers, you still have to get the Student-Visa, you need to travel to the school, you need to rent at least a room, you might need transportation and you definitely need to buy spagetti, 2min-noodle soop, and Kraft-ready to heat/eat (shamless opy from previous post).
Sit down with yourself and search your soul and heart, whether you really cannot live without being a proffessional pilot (meaning helicopter flying being your source of income....).
Maybe doing your private and enjoying a couple of hours every month would do the trick....
Don't want to discourage you, but until you are a North-Sea Captain or a EMS-lifesaving Angel, or a Log-lifting precision-longline-jockey will take you closer to your 50s than you think....
First step to help with decision making, get a first class aviation medical.
No need to agravate over other issues if you are not fit in the first place....
Good luck,
3top
PS:
Just as a sample, I am 42, have 9000+ hrs in a lot of different environments. I am heading out to ge my IFR next.
BUT the reson I am not elegible for a the biggest operator on the globe is lack of twin-experience.... how will you ever get if no one gets you on the other seat....
Unless they run out of personal, no joy...
just make sure you got the financial part sorted!
Age is a non-issue for employment, I'd rather get a cooled off 40ish than a hot-shot 20.
I got my ticket with 27, but was a 16-year old fool at heart, learned my lessons though and am alive to tell - some of the lessons thaught me also that I am religious after all....
Again, make sure you got the quid to go through to CFII, because like it or not, your first job is going to be Instructor (unless you have your own business, a rich uncle, etc.) You can make good money as an instructor, but it is a lot of work.
When you start, dig in and pull it through, but again, make sure you can do it financially. Nothing worse than having to cut halfway to get back to some job you don't like to pay your creditline....
In the US (or any Non-EU place) count on about US$ 50K until you get your first job. Don't fool yourself with cheap offers, you still have to get the Student-Visa, you need to travel to the school, you need to rent at least a room, you might need transportation and you definitely need to buy spagetti, 2min-noodle soop, and Kraft-ready to heat/eat (shamless opy from previous post
).Sit down with yourself and search your soul and heart, whether you really cannot live without being a proffessional pilot (meaning helicopter flying being your source of income....).
Maybe doing your private and enjoying a couple of hours every month would do the trick....
Don't want to discourage you, but until you are a North-Sea Captain or a EMS-lifesaving Angel, or a Log-lifting precision-longline-jockey will take you closer to your 50s than you think....
First step to help with decision making, get a first class aviation medical.
No need to agravate over other issues if you are not fit in the first place....
Good luck,
3top
PS:
Just as a sample, I am 42, have 9000+ hrs in a lot of different environments. I am heading out to ge my IFR next.
BUT the reson I am not elegible for a the biggest operator on the globe is lack of twin-experience.... how will you ever get if no one gets you on the other seat....
Unless they run out of personal, no joy...
