Yorkshire Air Ambulance Folded ?
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Coo
Yes they are free, all except for hospital to hospital transfers. Everything else is free including taking off and then getting stood down and returning home. It is a common misconception that the SARF charge, they just don't.
Though to be fair there is a charge levied in the Falklands, but I believe that this revenue goes to the Falklands Govt and the military see none of it.
Downwash problems, yep they are heavy and the downwash is more severe, but they can take the strecher bound cas, the relatives, a couple of doctors, nurses etc and then they can fly in the crappest weather and at night to and from a field in the middle of nowhere.
But the most important thing to remeber is that we are all on the same side. As long as the cas gets to hospital asap and in the best condition possible we all win as does the cas.
Yes they are free, all except for hospital to hospital transfers. Everything else is free including taking off and then getting stood down and returning home. It is a common misconception that the SARF charge, they just don't.
Though to be fair there is a charge levied in the Falklands, but I believe that this revenue goes to the Falklands Govt and the military see none of it.
Downwash problems, yep they are heavy and the downwash is more severe, but they can take the strecher bound cas, the relatives, a couple of doctors, nurses etc and then they can fly in the crappest weather and at night to and from a field in the middle of nowhere.
But the most important thing to remeber is that we are all on the same side. As long as the cas gets to hospital asap and in the best condition possible we all win as does the cas.
Apache for HEMS - Strafe those Survivors!
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Oops 78 hits the nail on the head, we are all on the same side and the paramount concern should be providing the most appropriate asset for the task. To go back to my previous point having an air desk coordinating the tasking and keeping the military rescue coord info'd avoids the pointless duplication encountered on many occasions in england and wales (I've been there, it happens). Better coord ensures that the cas gets a good service and avoids silly p***ing contests about who "owns" the cas.
At the risk of attracting friendly(I hope!!) fire, putting the funding on a proper basis removes any temptation by the tasking authority to constantly use the asset inappropriately, just so that it can be visibly "justifying" the high cost involved in providing a helo and generating charitable donations to keep it running. I emphasise, before you all hit me, air ambulances get a big thumbs up from me, I just think the funding and coord could/should be done differently.
[ 28 November 2001: Message edited by: keepin it in trim ]
At the risk of attracting friendly(I hope!!) fire, putting the funding on a proper basis removes any temptation by the tasking authority to constantly use the asset inappropriately, just so that it can be visibly "justifying" the high cost involved in providing a helo and generating charitable donations to keep it running. I emphasise, before you all hit me, air ambulances get a big thumbs up from me, I just think the funding and coord could/should be done differently.
[ 28 November 2001: Message edited by: keepin it in trim ]
Senis Semper Fidelis
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Yet another sensible thread on the merits of the Air Ambuance or emergency Heli service, to look after mainly us mortals who bend metal around our selve's, however, I know that I may be targeted with insults for my next line or two, But, would it not be a wiser and more cost effective system nation wide, if the Pyramidic(could be a new word) Ambulance chiefs linked up with the nearest military heli's, to then achieve total day and night cover?
I am not against any company or individual making a profit from their work, but surely 10 or 15 or even 20 % of all money raised for the current Air Ambulance Helis is taken as profit by the operating company, a simple calculation show's for example, if the op profit of the service company running the Lancahire Air Amb is 20%, then that means volunteers have to work for nearly 11 weeks to beg, and cajole money from the public just to pay the profit side for the service provider, ( I am only using known industry percents, before anyone screams that the service companies do it for 2.5%) what do others think!
[ 30 November 2001: Message edited by: Vfrpilotpb ]
I am not against any company or individual making a profit from their work, but surely 10 or 15 or even 20 % of all money raised for the current Air Ambulance Helis is taken as profit by the operating company, a simple calculation show's for example, if the op profit of the service company running the Lancahire Air Amb is 20%, then that means volunteers have to work for nearly 11 weeks to beg, and cajole money from the public just to pay the profit side for the service provider, ( I am only using known industry percents, before anyone screams that the service companies do it for 2.5%) what do others think!
[ 30 November 2001: Message edited by: Vfrpilotpb ]
HOGE: sory for the delay. I've found the ref. It came from the minutes of our last emergency services meeting with BHAB. I'll contact them and see if the report is available for public disemination yet! 
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The idea that the military SAR will allow themselves to enter into the NHS market and allocate a large proportion of their budget to serving the needs of the NHS is totally wrong, this can be seen from the Scottish experience , where in the past the SAR service was much as it is today in the rest of the UK,but once the Scottish Ambulance service got a proper EMS service provided by a combination of Fixed and rotary wing aircraft back in the early ninety's (instead of the previous Loganair Positioning Service which had existed )then things rapidly changed . The miltary commanders became aware that they were only used for out of hours work, island transfers and other expensive non essential operations that were outside the restricted operating hours of the Scottish Air Ambulance Service. This came to a head very quickly and the Air Force and Navy refused to fly outer island patients beyond the Oban or Fort William hospitals, which was the nearest hospital . Once their, they demanded that the Scottish ambulance service took back responsibility and either transferred the patient by road or waited until the next day when the air ambulance would be back on 8-5 duty
The old charge rate to the SAS of 1200 pounds per hour was abolished and all tranfers were charged at full rate of nearly 5000 pounds per hour.
Dont be decieved for one moment into beleiving that the Military officials in Whitehall will pick up the tab for ambulance service failings
And remember the main reason that most of the ambulance services want a helicopter is that without it they cannot possibly meet the ORCON (Call out)requirements to which they are bound and as a final thought, there is only one person making money fron the Yorkshire ambulance helicopter and that is the company who lease the aircraft to them and provide pilots and maintenance, where is their charity? ( Police/ Medical Aviation Services )
The old charge rate to the SAS of 1200 pounds per hour was abolished and all tranfers were charged at full rate of nearly 5000 pounds per hour.
Dont be decieved for one moment into beleiving that the Military officials in Whitehall will pick up the tab for ambulance service failings
And remember the main reason that most of the ambulance services want a helicopter is that without it they cannot possibly meet the ORCON (Call out)requirements to which they are bound and as a final thought, there is only one person making money fron the Yorkshire ambulance helicopter and that is the company who lease the aircraft to them and provide pilots and maintenance, where is their charity? ( Police/ Medical Aviation Services )
Senis Semper Fidelis
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BTi,
I don't think anyone is against any company making a profit, in fact without profit no one would advance, but when it comes to the care and attention for the public at large in the UK we should have a central Government fund to provide things like the Hems Copters, Our Government can always find instant money to attack with our military might(?)some bad people in far of countries, however just the value of one Tomahawk Cruise Missile would pay all the yearly running costs of the Lancashire Hems Helicopter, how many did we fire at the *******s just of late 40 or 50 at a rough guess, just a small percent of that would cover the entire UK with enough Heli-air cover so as to allow the service to run without the constant threat of the service provider withdrawing because there is not enough "Brass in the pot". In analysis my own opinion is that if we as a Country want to play with the Big Boys, then we should be able to look after our own civvies as well, without any form of charity being used to provide what after all is a seriously useful tool to save life!
Edit??
The Asterisked word seems to have been edited by some outside influence, I did not think the the description of a poorly dressed head, would need that sort of protection or censorship, are we going PC mad!
[ 04 December 2001: Message edited by: Vfrpilotpb ]
I don't think anyone is against any company making a profit, in fact without profit no one would advance, but when it comes to the care and attention for the public at large in the UK we should have a central Government fund to provide things like the Hems Copters, Our Government can always find instant money to attack with our military might(?)some bad people in far of countries, however just the value of one Tomahawk Cruise Missile would pay all the yearly running costs of the Lancashire Hems Helicopter, how many did we fire at the *******s just of late 40 or 50 at a rough guess, just a small percent of that would cover the entire UK with enough Heli-air cover so as to allow the service to run without the constant threat of the service provider withdrawing because there is not enough "Brass in the pot". In analysis my own opinion is that if we as a Country want to play with the Big Boys, then we should be able to look after our own civvies as well, without any form of charity being used to provide what after all is a seriously useful tool to save life!
Edit??
The Asterisked word seems to have been edited by some outside influence, I did not think the the description of a poorly dressed head, would need that sort of protection or censorship, are we going PC mad!
[ 04 December 2001: Message edited by: Vfrpilotpb ]
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vfr,
I agree entirely, but trying to get President Blair to fund the deal, well it would be easier to find Bin Laden.
The Nicholson report and another currently in progress will show that The National Ambulance service can not meet Government targets without Air ambulances, so central funding will be forthcoming.
I may have retired for the second time by then!
I agree entirely, but trying to get President Blair to fund the deal, well it would be easier to find Bin Laden.
The Nicholson report and another currently in progress will show that The National Ambulance service can not meet Government targets without Air ambulances, so central funding will be forthcoming.
I may have retired for the second time by then!
