Helitech 2001 - disappointing
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Helitech 2001 - disappointing
Some Helicopter Industry 'showcase'
- with no helicopter flying displays!!
Was this Duxford's fault - in which case let's go back to Redhill, mud or no mud.
Or the organisers choice - in which case, I'm baffled.
If it hadn't been for MW Helicopters flying Gazelle demo flights non-stop for potential buyers, and a large number of their existing customers flying Gazelles in and out, it would have been completely dead. MW even brought in a second helicopter (an ex-mil version) the second day which added some interest to the flying.
The Blue Eagles were limited to a formation departure - what a waste!
Someone needs to get their knuckles rapped. Who?
- with no helicopter flying displays!!
Was this Duxford's fault - in which case let's go back to Redhill, mud or no mud.
Or the organisers choice - in which case, I'm baffled.
If it hadn't been for MW Helicopters flying Gazelle demo flights non-stop for potential buyers, and a large number of their existing customers flying Gazelles in and out, it would have been completely dead. MW even brought in a second helicopter (an ex-mil version) the second day which added some interest to the flying.
The Blue Eagles were limited to a formation departure - what a waste!
Someone needs to get their knuckles rapped. Who?
I quite agree it would have been nice to see more flying but surely the clue is in the name - Helitech says to me that it's more about examining the products and gathering contacts for those that seem worthwhile. I know one can eventually visit the websites and talk to the salesmen but there's no substitute for picking up some of this kit. Sadly there wasn't as great a range of this stuff as one might have hoped - very little in the way of digital recording and mapping systems for example.
On a note of personal interest, do we know if the two air ambulances and one police aircraft there on Wednesday pm were operationally available?
On a note of personal interest, do we know if the two air ambulances and one police aircraft there on Wednesday pm were operationally available?
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Can anyone who attended give an opnion if it was anywhere near what they hyped it up to be.
I spoke to a lot of people who said they were not going because of the happenings in NYC. Did it look like there were many people there. Just curious.
Pac Rotors
I spoke to a lot of people who said they were not going because of the happenings in NYC. Did it look like there were many people there. Just curious.
Pac Rotors
This was the fifth I've attended and on the evidence of one afternoon I'd say it was slightly less well attended with slightly fewer exhibits than the last four - still a good expo but not quite enough of everything.
Iwas there all four days.
Overall figures were clearly down but the show was probably better for it [business wise]. There were access problems but only because this was assessed on whether foreigners and those south of Watford could get there. Coming from Sussex by air in a single is said to be not good news.
Lots of U.S. dropped out [even though it must be the safest time to fly] including Frank Robinson who had a major part to play in the event. Equally there were lots there and all due credit to them.
One exhibitor notified a loss of a CEO in the Twin Towers - but they still turned up.
A major blow must have been that Westland pulled out 'late'. I guess the organisers did not lose out from that financially but there was a lot of shuffling before the day. Westland camped in the Sloane chalet. Part of this pull out may have been that they had a [successful] show at DSEI in ExCel Docklands just two weeks earlier and may have been pretty whacked [I guess - and make excuses for them!]. Anyway there were lots of late gaps through other 'no shows' and a few additional partition moves and 'rest areas'.
As for outside, Suffolk Police 135 and the Anglian Air Ambulance 105 were on call but pulled for Thursday/Friday. Thames Valley A109E was pulled after Wednesday [better things to do, train to catch?].
As for whether there should be air displays beyond the many demo flights, I think not. I recall with great pleasure the K-Max display at Redhill .... but how many K-Max's did it sell? No, unfortunately, this is not an air show it is a place to do business and some think that it should be like HAI and moved to ExCel like DSEI.
Mind you I did like the regular throaty roar of the Merlin [engine].......
Overall figures were clearly down but the show was probably better for it [business wise]. There were access problems but only because this was assessed on whether foreigners and those south of Watford could get there. Coming from Sussex by air in a single is said to be not good news.
Lots of U.S. dropped out [even though it must be the safest time to fly] including Frank Robinson who had a major part to play in the event. Equally there were lots there and all due credit to them.
One exhibitor notified a loss of a CEO in the Twin Towers - but they still turned up.
A major blow must have been that Westland pulled out 'late'. I guess the organisers did not lose out from that financially but there was a lot of shuffling before the day. Westland camped in the Sloane chalet. Part of this pull out may have been that they had a [successful] show at DSEI in ExCel Docklands just two weeks earlier and may have been pretty whacked [I guess - and make excuses for them!]. Anyway there were lots of late gaps through other 'no shows' and a few additional partition moves and 'rest areas'.
As for outside, Suffolk Police 135 and the Anglian Air Ambulance 105 were on call but pulled for Thursday/Friday. Thames Valley A109E was pulled after Wednesday [better things to do, train to catch?].
As for whether there should be air displays beyond the many demo flights, I think not. I recall with great pleasure the K-Max display at Redhill .... but how many K-Max's did it sell? No, unfortunately, this is not an air show it is a place to do business and some think that it should be like HAI and moved to ExCel like DSEI.
Mind you I did like the regular throaty roar of the Merlin [engine].......
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I'm 100% with Heliport on the no flying displays point.
If manufacturers decided not to fly displays because the expense isn't justified by extra sales, that's a decision for them. But I can't believe that they all made the same decision to pull out of displays the same year - more likely show organisers decision.
If the latter, it was a stupid decision.
I heard the Blue Eagles were happy to fly but weren't allowed to.
I've always attended Helitech in a 'work' capacity, but regarded the lunchtime flying displays when the show was at Redhill as a very welcome break from the 'business' side of things. As far as I could tell, so did everyone else, if the turnout to watch them was anything to go by.
Thanks to MW Helicopters for helping the atmosphere with lots of Gazelles flying. I looked at the MW Gazelles at their stand. They do a fantastic job and produce beautiful machines. Looked as good as new - or better.
If manufacturers decided not to fly displays because the expense isn't justified by extra sales, that's a decision for them. But I can't believe that they all made the same decision to pull out of displays the same year - more likely show organisers decision.
If the latter, it was a stupid decision.
I heard the Blue Eagles were happy to fly but weren't allowed to.
I've always attended Helitech in a 'work' capacity, but regarded the lunchtime flying displays when the show was at Redhill as a very welcome break from the 'business' side of things. As far as I could tell, so did everyone else, if the turnout to watch them was anything to go by.
Thanks to MW Helicopters for helping the atmosphere with lots of Gazelles flying. I looked at the MW Gazelles at their stand. They do a fantastic job and produce beautiful machines. Looked as good as new - or better.
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The yellow 109 Power air ambulance was not on call while it was at Helitech (Tue/Wed) because the charity behind that operation have not got their fund-raising sorted and they cannot afford 7 day ops quite yet.
And my vote is with "no displays". Do you get demo rides at the Motor Show? No! Helitech is not a jolly, it's a trade show for doing business at and not aimed at the public at all - note that they have withdrawn the public day now and Helitech 2003 will be 3 days and not 4 days.
And my vote is with "no displays". Do you get demo rides at the Motor Show? No! Helitech is not a jolly, it's a trade show for doing business at and not aimed at the public at all - note that they have withdrawn the public day now and Helitech 2003 will be 3 days and not 4 days.
The 'display at lunchtime' comment was interesting .... most days 'lunchtime' was the thing I missed around 4pm!
As an add on I did not realise that there was no display until late Tuesday because it had not happened.
It may be worthwhile writing to Spearhead and ask them why they pulled the display [if they did].
Personally I suspect it was not their call. The Blue Eagles may have been willing but I know of one or two exhibitors that would have spoken against it on principle.
The deletion of the last day to make it a 3 day event is no surprise, day 4 was a bit grim [and very short] but there was still business to be had. But will 'day 4 itis' transfer to day 3 in future?
I never did get to do the museum!
As an add on I did not realise that there was no display until late Tuesday because it had not happened.
It may be worthwhile writing to Spearhead and ask them why they pulled the display [if they did].
Personally I suspect it was not their call. The Blue Eagles may have been willing but I know of one or two exhibitors that would have spoken against it on principle.
The deletion of the last day to make it a 3 day event is no surprise, day 4 was a bit grim [and very short] but there was still business to be had. But will 'day 4 itis' transfer to day 3 in future?
I never did get to do the museum!
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PAnews
Your profile is "Retired Policeman, Editor, Journalist". If it doesn't affect your anonymity to tell us, what were you selling?
PAnews / PP Heli
As someone has pointed out, nobody was ever forced to watch the displays if they didn't want to.
Why are you against them if other people think they add to the atmosphere of the show?
What do you see as the disadvantage?
As for demo flights for potential customers - PPHeli seems to be against even those - why?
McAlpines and MW Helicopters obviously thought the demos were cost effective becuase they flew nonstop when wx allowed. They are both very successful companies so it seems reasonable to assume they knew what they were doing.
[ 03 October 2001: Message edited by: Heliport ]
Your profile is "Retired Policeman, Editor, Journalist". If it doesn't affect your anonymity to tell us, what were you selling?
PAnews / PP Heli
As someone has pointed out, nobody was ever forced to watch the displays if they didn't want to.
Why are you against them if other people think they add to the atmosphere of the show?
What do you see as the disadvantage?
As for demo flights for potential customers - PPHeli seems to be against even those - why?
McAlpines and MW Helicopters obviously thought the demos were cost effective becuase they flew nonstop when wx allowed. They are both very successful companies so it seems reasonable to assume they knew what they were doing.
[ 03 October 2001: Message edited by: Heliport ]
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Surely the only reason for doing a display is to attract the public visitor, which is precisely what the organisers are aiming to avoid. Yes, sure, I don't *need* to watch it, but if they intentionally put on a flying display, the anoraks would crawl out of the woodwork and they don't bring business to anyone! Then again, the visitors they are aiming at ("the trade") see helicopters every day in the course of their jobs and it could be argued they don't *need* displays either. (OK, I'm being a bit provocative there!). This is of course all supposition - we haven't got an answer from the organisers and it could have been the CAA who said "no". Surely not!
Demo flights - maybe I self-tripped there. Yes, they can be useful, and I agree with Heliport that the two companies who did a lot of flying are the ones also doing lots of selling. But did the sales come first to fund the flying? And how many of the pax were just there for the ride and not genuine "potential customers"?
Demo flights - maybe I self-tripped there. Yes, they can be useful, and I agree with Heliport that the two companies who did a lot of flying are the ones also doing lots of selling. But did the sales come first to fund the flying?
And how many of the pax were just there for the ride and not genuine "potential customers"?
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I used to like the displays - as they did break up the day. Farnborough doesn't restrict it's displays to "Public" days, I would suspect the majority of the displays are not to attract new customers but to entertain, and why not? I'll admit that HeliTech is a "Trade" show (what does that honestly mean?) but it's also a chance to show off our peculiar little branch of aviation too.
OUCH!!!!!
'PAnews
Your profile is "Retired Policeman, Editor, Journalist". If it doesn't affect your anonymity to tell us, what were you selling?
PAnews / PP Heli'
Guilty. I was selling 'me' and digging for stories for the next few issues..... Retired policeman does not have to mean brain dead and PAN is the whiz in my life. Nearly everything I write has my name on it because I am not ashamed of it [even when found wrong] and I project that attitude onto PPrune. That is why my handle is very transparent. Note also that PACRotors has a similar policy. I doubt we are the only 'press' around PPrune.
'As someone has pointed out, nobody was ever forced to watch the displays if they didn't want to.
'Why are you against them if other people think they add to the atmosphere of the show?
What do you see as the disadvantage?'
I think that this has been answered. There were a number of spotters on site anyway and they seemed happy enough with what they were getting even if they did not get a conventional display. I just understand that exhibitors believe there are 'better' things to be had at Helitech than a display by 'yesterdays' helicopters. You should sample some of the feedback I am getting from a range of pilots who flew the EC130 at the show. The number of pilots able to fly any of the aircraft available for 5-10 minutes would be severely effected by deleting an hour or more a day for sheer [solo] exhibitionism.
'McAlpines and MW Helicopters obviously thought the demos were cost effective because they flew nonstop when allowed.'
See my previous comment .....
'....they knew what they were doing.'
You said it!
'PAnews
Your profile is "Retired Policeman, Editor, Journalist". If it doesn't affect your anonymity to tell us, what were you selling?
PAnews / PP Heli'
Guilty. I was selling 'me' and digging for stories for the next few issues..... Retired policeman does not have to mean brain dead and PAN is the whiz in my life. Nearly everything I write has my name on it because I am not ashamed of it [even when found wrong] and I project that attitude onto PPrune. That is why my handle is very transparent. Note also that PACRotors has a similar policy. I doubt we are the only 'press' around PPrune.
'As someone has pointed out, nobody was ever forced to watch the displays if they didn't want to.
'Why are you against them if other people think they add to the atmosphere of the show?
What do you see as the disadvantage?'
I think that this has been answered. There were a number of spotters on site anyway and they seemed happy enough with what they were getting even if they did not get a conventional display. I just understand that exhibitors believe there are 'better' things to be had at Helitech than a display by 'yesterdays' helicopters. You should sample some of the feedback I am getting from a range of pilots who flew the EC130 at the show. The number of pilots able to fly any of the aircraft available for 5-10 minutes would be severely effected by deleting an hour or more a day for sheer [solo] exhibitionism.
'McAlpines and MW Helicopters obviously thought the demos were cost effective because they flew nonstop when allowed.'
See my previous comment .....
'....they knew what they were doing.'
You said it!
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Sorry you took offence. I can assure you none was intended - I don't assume that all policemen have the limited brain power of traffic cops!!
It was a genuine question. I wondered what you were selling.
"Yesterday's helicopters" can be fun to watch (the Army Lynx display is still amazing, as is a Gazelle in the right hands) but I meant displays of the latest models by company display pilots.
We'll have to agree to differ - I don't think it's only the 'spotters' who enjoy a good display. After many years in the industry, I still enjoy them - sad isn't it!
It was a genuine question. I wondered what you were selling.
"Yesterday's helicopters" can be fun to watch (the Army Lynx display is still amazing, as is a Gazelle in the right hands) but I meant displays of the latest models by company display pilots.
We'll have to agree to differ - I don't think it's only the 'spotters' who enjoy a good display. After many years in the industry, I still enjoy them - sad isn't it!
No offence taken [I ducked] - you cannot really put a broad grin on writing and this is just one instance of that problem!
It was just that I have not been 'assaulted' with my past and present so comprehensively for ages!
I do not see it as an agree to differ point, its just that participant companies would prefer not to have its important demo flights disrupted by a display ... The Eurocopter alternate for Farnborough started with displays in year one, but that was soon deleted.
Which all places the number of venues at which UK helicopter fans can see machines in action in the strictly 'limited' category. Potentially Middle Wallop for a degreee of action and the Grand Prix for numbers.
A great pity whatever your feelings.
It was just that I have not been 'assaulted' with my past and present so comprehensively for ages!
I do not see it as an agree to differ point, its just that participant companies would prefer not to have its important demo flights disrupted by a display ... The Eurocopter alternate for Farnborough started with displays in year one, but that was soon deleted.
Which all places the number of venues at which UK helicopter fans can see machines in action in the strictly 'limited' category. Potentially Middle Wallop for a degreee of action and the Grand Prix for numbers.
A great pity whatever your feelings.
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The organisers of Helitech stated their objective two years ago as being to weed out the tyre-kickers, freebie-locusts and spotters who took up all the valuable time for which exhibitors had paid good money. They certainly did that. I went to check out the price of doors for a Robinson on Wednesday and the guy's first question was "How big is your fleet?" When I engaged Honeywell in conversation about their Executive Observer, which is chipped to Ordnance Survey but happens to cost £10,000, their man kept looking over my shoulder for a bloke in a business suit or a burnoose whose decimal point was further right than mine. Spotters got their money's worth anyway, just watching the incoming. The sad thing for the rest of us was that there was nothing new there at all (apart from the EC130 which is only semi-new) and of course the tilt-rotors, which seemed to have so much promise last time round, were totally absent. They're looking more and more like a blind alley.
