Stranded pilot refused fuel in Antarctica
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autosync,
I just hope for you, you never have to fly over hostile terrain and ALWAYS have ALL emergency/technical landing spots adviced, loaded with fuel or at least willing to sell it to you!
Merry christmas and lots of populated area and densly controlled airspace!
3top
I just hope for you, you never have to fly over hostile terrain and ALWAYS have ALL emergency/technical landing spots adviced, loaded with fuel or at least willing to sell it to you!
Merry christmas and lots of populated area and densly controlled airspace!
3top
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Thanks for your concern, but me personally I wouldn't fly over places like that unless I had to, neither would I rely and expect others to risk there lives for me.
Call me old Fashioned..............
This fella likes to call himself an adventurer for doing a day long flight over the cap, the real adventurers are the people living down there,.
Merry Christmas
Call me old Fashioned..............
This fella likes to call himself an adventurer for doing a day long flight over the cap, the real adventurers are the people living down there,.
Merry Christmas
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vfrpilotpb and Redwine,
You are seeing the true Nick!
I don't begrudge the attempt, or the failure! I begrudge the whining over accepting the consequences. I must believe that the press release was one the pilot sparked to try and embarass the authorities into giving him gas, making them out as the bad guys (They refuse him aid!! What heartless people!!)
In reality, he did it to himself, and he should just pack up his plane and go home, no whining or complaining. Instead, he takes the folks who are feeding him and blames them.
Is it really an adventure to fly the aircraft over a dangerous place? What about time, distance and speed do we not understand about all this? Is flying over a bad place an adventure? Is misplanning the gas required a triumph? Give me a break. There are a dozen ppruners who do more dangerous stuff for a living, daily, unless night rig approaches and SAR hoists have suddenly gotten easy.
Now, with regard to adventure, anytime you'd like to compare adventures with me, buy me 2 beers and maybe I'll help share my adventures (isn't "adventure" the given name to a screw-up we were allowed to survive as a lesson to others?)
You are seeing the true Nick!
I don't begrudge the attempt, or the failure! I begrudge the whining over accepting the consequences. I must believe that the press release was one the pilot sparked to try and embarass the authorities into giving him gas, making them out as the bad guys (They refuse him aid!! What heartless people!!)
In reality, he did it to himself, and he should just pack up his plane and go home, no whining or complaining. Instead, he takes the folks who are feeding him and blames them.
Is it really an adventure to fly the aircraft over a dangerous place? What about time, distance and speed do we not understand about all this? Is flying over a bad place an adventure? Is misplanning the gas required a triumph? Give me a break. There are a dozen ppruners who do more dangerous stuff for a living, daily, unless night rig approaches and SAR hoists have suddenly gotten easy.
Now, with regard to adventure, anytime you'd like to compare adventures with me, buy me 2 beers and maybe I'll help share my adventures (isn't "adventure" the given name to a screw-up we were allowed to survive as a lesson to others?)
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Earlier this year, a Twin Otter was sent from Canada to a U.S. Antarctic base, to carry out a sick American doctor. Story Were the Americans foolish to set up an Antarctic base without equipping it with a full hospital? Were the Canadians foolish to rescue the American?
Coincidentally, the rescued doctor is described as "an adventurer who flew his own stunt plane and traveled worldwide."
Perhaps the policies have more to do with territorial claims than the cost of providing humanitarian acts.
Coincidentally, the rescued doctor is described as "an adventurer who flew his own stunt plane and traveled worldwide."
Perhaps the policies have more to do with territorial claims than the cost of providing humanitarian acts.
Bureaucrats can be obtuse at times....like all times actually....but in this case they seem to be a bit thicker than usual. The cost of allowing some flimsies onboard the next cargo flight....and some highly priced room and board....throw in a couple of UK style landing fees and it would seem our stalwart hero could be on his way without a lot of muss and fuss. We can not all be born Farmer's Son's thus the class envy or whatever is driving this angst by the proprieters at McMurdo seems a bit over the top to me.
Sorry Nick ol' buddy...but we come down on different sides of this fence....although I agree there are times that "cast iron pumps" lofted from a great height are appropriate. If we never pushed the envelope, where would we be? Seems I recall seeing you streaking off into the heavens in some fanciful designs doing some very interesting things. If you would have fetched up on Bert Reynolds place in Jupiter, reckon he would have given you some Jet A to get back to the Completion/Test facility?
Lessee here....at last count....there's what...two of these intelopers running amok down there.....doesen't seem to be like a real flood of them to me? Actually, could it be he ruined his welcome upon arrival by inappropriately voiding what must have been a very distended bladder?
Sorry Nick ol' buddy...but we come down on different sides of this fence....although I agree there are times that "cast iron pumps" lofted from a great height are appropriate. If we never pushed the envelope, where would we be? Seems I recall seeing you streaking off into the heavens in some fanciful designs doing some very interesting things. If you would have fetched up on Bert Reynolds place in Jupiter, reckon he would have given you some Jet A to get back to the Completion/Test facility?
Lessee here....at last count....there's what...two of these intelopers running amok down there.....doesen't seem to be like a real flood of them to me? Actually, could it be he ruined his welcome upon arrival by inappropriately voiding what must have been a very distended bladder?
Last edited by SASless; 14th Dec 2003 at 04:14.
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Cant see what all the fuss is about.
This guy is no fool and has been flying this plane for years.Dont know his achievements ,but i think he has flown around the world and flown over the north pole.
He is an adventurer,something i wouldnt even consider doing ,but hes not alone in this world.
He had planned and was fully equiped,but the weather went against him,Big deal.He had a place to land and top up instead of landing 400k short in the ocean then upsetting people with an expensive rescue mission.
I think maybe hes come from the wrong country.Could you imagine a guy in a 4 wheel drive in the outback who encounters rain and uses more fuel getting through boggy conditions stops at farm house only to be told to wait for a truck due next month he can put his wagon on-------------what a joke.
Whats wrong with the good old "Geez mate,your either game or stupid,but yep ,no probs,we will top you up.Stay a couple of days and we will show you around,but all the good looking penguins are taken-------nice meeting you mate ,glad we could help ,have a safe trip-----------see ya"
Whats the world coming to
This guy is no fool and has been flying this plane for years.Dont know his achievements ,but i think he has flown around the world and flown over the north pole.
He is an adventurer,something i wouldnt even consider doing ,but hes not alone in this world.
He had planned and was fully equiped,but the weather went against him,Big deal.He had a place to land and top up instead of landing 400k short in the ocean then upsetting people with an expensive rescue mission.
I think maybe hes come from the wrong country.Could you imagine a guy in a 4 wheel drive in the outback who encounters rain and uses more fuel getting through boggy conditions stops at farm house only to be told to wait for a truck due next month he can put his wagon on-------------what a joke.
Whats wrong with the good old "Geez mate,your either game or stupid,but yep ,no probs,we will top you up.Stay a couple of days and we will show you around,but all the good looking penguins are taken-------nice meeting you mate ,glad we could help ,have a safe trip-----------see ya"
Whats the world coming to
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Aussie,
100%!
Here some more about the case and the man:
http://www.eaa.org/communications/ea...1211_nasm.html
and
http://www.eaa.org/communications/ea..._johanson.html
and
http://www.eaa.org/communications/ea..._johanson.html
3top
100%!
Here some more about the case and the man:
http://www.eaa.org/communications/ea...1211_nasm.html
and
http://www.eaa.org/communications/ea..._johanson.html
and
http://www.eaa.org/communications/ea..._johanson.html
3top
Last edited by 3top; 14th Dec 2003 at 11:34.
Senis Semper Fidelis
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Nick,
If" This is the real Me" then I am indeed sorry, for you have taken the moral political high ground, normally occupied by people who like to tell others how to live,
The Pilots you refer too as being hero's by landing on a rig at night, or flying Sar missions are in my mind extremely and seriously qualified and experienced pilots, Not Hero's, they choose to fly that sort of employment and are paid for doing so, but because these great flyers are normally all ex mil pilots, they do have the very top experience needed to carry out such tasks.
What makes this guy who has landed safely(Not crashed) different is that he is an individual, who obviously has a high level of skill, but as we know the wx has proved to be his undoing.
Tell us Nick,have you never been caught out by the wx ?
If" This is the real Me" then I am indeed sorry, for you have taken the moral political high ground, normally occupied by people who like to tell others how to live,
The Pilots you refer too as being hero's by landing on a rig at night, or flying Sar missions are in my mind extremely and seriously qualified and experienced pilots, Not Hero's, they choose to fly that sort of employment and are paid for doing so, but because these great flyers are normally all ex mil pilots, they do have the very top experience needed to carry out such tasks.
What makes this guy who has landed safely(Not crashed) different is that he is an individual, who obviously has a high level of skill, but as we know the wx has proved to be his undoing.
Tell us Nick,have you never been caught out by the wx ?
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ABC online report
But, can you believe this?
Newstalk ZB report
Officials at Antarctica have found another way to hamper the efforts of stranded Australian Jon Johanson to fly off the ice.
Since he landed at McMurdo Station last week requesting extra fuel, American and New Zealand officials have refused to help him.
Mr Johanson's plane is now refuelled and set to go, when the weather is suitable.
The only catch is Antarctica officials won't give him any weather forecasts.
His partner Sue Ball is trying to provide information from Australia. She says he won't take off until he is confident he can get back safely. At present he's likely to take off late today, and reach Invercargill tomorrow morning.
Whatever the rights or wrongs of what's gone before, I hope this isn't true. 
Australian adventurer Jon Johanson has spent what could be his last night at the American base in the Antarctic, after accepting the offer of free fuel from a fellow aviator, Polly Vacher, who had to abandon her own charity flight.
Her generosity means he will now be able to fly his plane to New Zealand, before coming home to Australia.
The United States and New Zealand had refused to sell him any fuel, on the grounds that that would only encourage more Antarctic adventurers.
Speaking from McMurdo Base in the Antarctic, Jon Johanson told Alison Caldwell about his overwhelming feelings of gratitude towards Polly Vacher.
Her generosity means he will now be able to fly his plane to New Zealand, before coming home to Australia.
The United States and New Zealand had refused to sell him any fuel, on the grounds that that would only encourage more Antarctic adventurers.
Speaking from McMurdo Base in the Antarctic, Jon Johanson told Alison Caldwell about his overwhelming feelings of gratitude towards Polly Vacher.
Newstalk ZB report
Officials refuse weather forecasts
Officials at Antarctica have found another way to hamper the efforts of stranded Australian Jon Johanson to fly off the ice.
Since he landed at McMurdo Station last week requesting extra fuel, American and New Zealand officials have refused to help him.
Mr Johanson's plane is now refuelled and set to go, when the weather is suitable.
The only catch is Antarctica officials won't give him any weather forecasts.
His partner Sue Ball is trying to provide information from Australia. She says he won't take off until he is confident he can get back safely. At present he's likely to take off late today, and reach Invercargill tomorrow morning.
Last edited by Heliport; 14th Dec 2003 at 17:41.
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Amazing.
Been sitting here waiting and thinking why my first statement has to be a negative one.
[I have erased my previous comments].
But the arrogance of the Kiwi's and the Americans is typical and shameful.
[I have erased my previous comments].
But the arrogance of the Kiwi's and the Americans is typical and shameful.
Last edited by Aussie Mate; 14th Dec 2003 at 18:48.
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What an utterly pathetic state of affairs, the Yanks and New Zealanders who are involved should hang their heads in shame. Jon wasn't asking for charity, but was asking to buy fuel, just handing over some wx reports can't hurt anybody.
It's nice to see that a sense of deceny and human kindness still reigns especially in somewhere so inhospitable.
What on earth goes on down there that needs such rabid isolationism?
It's nice to see that a sense of deceny and human kindness still reigns especially in somewhere so inhospitable.
What on earth goes on down there that needs such rabid isolationism?
The Original Whirly
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The reactions of many people to this strike me as highly illogical. Adventurers like this guy are just that - adventurers. They won't be put off because officialdom decides to make things more difficult for them. And non-adventurers are highly unlikely to say: Oh wow, if I go round the world and get stranded in Antarctica I'll get given fuel". People just don't think like that.
Jon didn't get stranded deliberately. The easiest thing to do, all round, is to sell him fuel, give him a weather forecast, and send him on his way. Anything else makes no real sense, whether you agree with what he's doing or not.
Many thanks to Polly Vacher for helping him out. She's a lovely person, and this makes me think so even more. But what happened to her flight? Why is she giving up? I haven't heard the details.
Jon didn't get stranded deliberately. The easiest thing to do, all round, is to sell him fuel, give him a weather forecast, and send him on his way. Anything else makes no real sense, whether you agree with what he's doing or not.
Many thanks to Polly Vacher for helping him out. She's a lovely person, and this makes me think so even more. But what happened to her flight? Why is she giving up? I haven't heard the details.
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Whirlybird
Polly Vacher is unable to continue her flight across Antarctica as, for logistical reasons, she is unable to secure fuel at Patriot Hills, despite making plans to do so from the outset.
The Argentinian Air Force has laid on a special flight to get fuel for Polly into Marambio so she can return to Ushuaia
Once back in Ushuaia, she will be retracing her steps through South America and the USA to California where she will fly across the Pacific to South Island, New Zealand to continue with her original route from Dunedin as planned.
It should be pointed out that Polly's help to Johansen has been with the agreement of Shell which owns her fuel. Shell has released two barrels of her fuel stored at McMurdo to enable Johansen to fly back to New Zealand.
Well done, both Polly Vacher (British pilot) and Shell, for resolving the deadlock. The authorities have kept their 'dignity' and Johansen is able to fly home.
Polly Vacher is unable to continue her flight across Antarctica as, for logistical reasons, she is unable to secure fuel at Patriot Hills, despite making plans to do so from the outset.
The Argentinian Air Force has laid on a special flight to get fuel for Polly into Marambio so she can return to Ushuaia
Once back in Ushuaia, she will be retracing her steps through South America and the USA to California where she will fly across the Pacific to South Island, New Zealand to continue with her original route from Dunedin as planned.
It should be pointed out that Polly's help to Johansen has been with the agreement of Shell which owns her fuel. Shell has released two barrels of her fuel stored at McMurdo to enable Johansen to fly back to New Zealand.
Well done, both Polly Vacher (British pilot) and Shell, for resolving the deadlock. The authorities have kept their 'dignity' and Johansen is able to fly home.
Last edited by Flying Lawyer; 14th Dec 2003 at 20:06.
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I've been reading all the posts and can see both sides of the argument but have to say that one thing hasn't been brought up yet.
That is that the policy of not providing help to visitors and adventurers by NZ/USa at the south pole station is no secret and has been publicised for at least 7 years (I think I first read about the policy in either National Geographic or maybe Australian Geographic magazine. I even recall David Attenborough who did a show about antarctica on TV several years ago talking about the policy as he and crew were refused use of the station's facility's.
Like it or not I can see that if they didn't stick to their guns on the policy next month there'd be another "adventurer" turning up on the doorstep wanting fuel and then another and then another.
So when it came to planning this adventurer really should have acted as if the fuel wasn't available and got a couple of drums flown in before the event or had plans made so that if he had to land the drums could be flown in. Planning for headwinds is part of normal long flight planning so should have been thought of first. This was not an unforeseeabe event despite the prttests of some of the posts
Just my 2c worth
That is that the policy of not providing help to visitors and adventurers by NZ/USa at the south pole station is no secret and has been publicised for at least 7 years (I think I first read about the policy in either National Geographic or maybe Australian Geographic magazine. I even recall David Attenborough who did a show about antarctica on TV several years ago talking about the policy as he and crew were refused use of the station's facility's.
Like it or not I can see that if they didn't stick to their guns on the policy next month there'd be another "adventurer" turning up on the doorstep wanting fuel and then another and then another.
So when it came to planning this adventurer really should have acted as if the fuel wasn't available and got a couple of drums flown in before the event or had plans made so that if he had to land the drums could be flown in. Planning for headwinds is part of normal long flight planning so should have been thought of first. This was not an unforeseeabe event despite the prttests of some of the posts
Just my 2c worth
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Reading Jon's local paper "The Advertiser" and letters to the editor today, one writer familiar with the antartic base stated Avgas was no longer kept on site as all machinery ran on the JP4 or 5 stuff anyway. Maybe the US and Kiwis could'nt help with the fuel and this whole thing got blown out of proportion.
"Peace be with you"..........well it is Sunday.
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If that's true, it's surprising none of the official statements mentioned it. Possible, but seems unlikely.
Anyway, a British damsel has now come to the aid of the Knight in distress.
Anyway, a British damsel has now come to the aid of the Knight in distress.
What a fascinating world we live in.
The NZ government won't help out an Australian adventurer, yet the Argentinian government will help out a British adventuress.
The only bit I find unsurprising is that one adventurer will help out another. They probably understand each others situations better than anybody else.
G
The NZ government won't help out an Australian adventurer, yet the Argentinian government will help out a British adventuress.
The only bit I find unsurprising is that one adventurer will help out another. They probably understand each others situations better than anybody else.
G
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If the policy of the McMurdo station is to not provide fuel for "recreational flyers," I can understand and even support that policy decision. However, to refuse weather information... a critical safety measure... is completely ridiculous and infuriating!
I think the pilot got caught short, and didn't prepare adequately. I think it was proper to refuse fuel, as a matter of policy, to discourage similar flights (the purpose of the policy). In contrast, it now appears that McMurdo is going out of their way to be obstructionary. He's learned his lesson, the point was made, the policy was enforced... let's not take it to a$$inine extremes!
I think the pilot got caught short, and didn't prepare adequately. I think it was proper to refuse fuel, as a matter of policy, to discourage similar flights (the purpose of the policy). In contrast, it now appears that McMurdo is going out of their way to be obstructionary. He's learned his lesson, the point was made, the policy was enforced... let's not take it to a$$inine extremes!
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Obviously we dont know what is going on down there, but I assume this guy has Internet access and that how he is getting his word out, if he really wanted the weather forcast he could get it from the internet.
From what I can see, based on this thread (not research)
He is in a warm station at the bottom of the world, eating other peoples rations, sleeping in other peoples beds has the basic creature comforts being kindly provided for by the taxpayers of other countries, and bitchin and moaning to the world about how they aren't helping him get out of a mess he got himself into.
From what I can see, based on this thread (not research)
He is in a warm station at the bottom of the world, eating other peoples rations, sleeping in other peoples beds has the basic creature comforts being kindly provided for by the taxpayers of other countries, and bitchin and moaning to the world about how they aren't helping him get out of a mess he got himself into.
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WOB
"Obviously we dont know what is going on down there ........"
The rest of us do. Obviously you haven't been reading the reports, which may explain your post.
Extract from today's NZ Herald
(or tomorrow's if you're in this part of the world)
"Obviously we dont know what is going on down there ........"
The rest of us do. Obviously you haven't been reading the reports, which may explain your post.
Extract from today's NZ Herald
(or tomorrow's if you're in this part of the world)
Weather latest worry for pilot
15.12.2003
Australian pilot Jon Johanson was waiting for a break in the weather this morning to take off from Antarctica in his homebuilt plane for a 12-hour trip to Invercargill.
Weather forecasters in New Zealand and Australia teamed up last night to give him a clearer picture of the conditions he was concerned about, over the sub-Antarctic islands closer to New Zealand.
Mr Johanson, 47, has been stranded at McMurdo Sound since December 8 when lack of fuel forced him to abandon a flight from Invercargill to Argentina after circling the Pole.
United States and New Zealand Government officials in Antarctica refused to give him fuel, saying it was policy not to supply private expeditions.
But on Friday, British pilot Polly Vacher came to his rescue with an offer of fuel that she had stored for her own cross-polar flight.
Antarctica New Zealand chief executive Lou Sanson said New Zealanders carried the fuel from Ms Vacher's stores at Scott Base to McMurdo airbase and helped to pump it onboard Mr Johanson's plane.
Getting a weather forecast for his flight was the next problem for the Adelaide-based pilot.
New Zealand does not have forecasters in the Antarctic and relies on the United States base forecasters.
But Mr Sanson said the US had a long-standing policy of providing forecasts only for national programmes, because of "a liability issue".
Mr Johanson's plight was among issues discussed by Foreign Affairs Minister Phil Goff and his Australian counterpart, Alexander Downer.
15.12.2003
Australian pilot Jon Johanson was waiting for a break in the weather this morning to take off from Antarctica in his homebuilt plane for a 12-hour trip to Invercargill.
Weather forecasters in New Zealand and Australia teamed up last night to give him a clearer picture of the conditions he was concerned about, over the sub-Antarctic islands closer to New Zealand.
Mr Johanson, 47, has been stranded at McMurdo Sound since December 8 when lack of fuel forced him to abandon a flight from Invercargill to Argentina after circling the Pole.
United States and New Zealand Government officials in Antarctica refused to give him fuel, saying it was policy not to supply private expeditions.
But on Friday, British pilot Polly Vacher came to his rescue with an offer of fuel that she had stored for her own cross-polar flight.
Antarctica New Zealand chief executive Lou Sanson said New Zealanders carried the fuel from Ms Vacher's stores at Scott Base to McMurdo airbase and helped to pump it onboard Mr Johanson's plane.
Getting a weather forecast for his flight was the next problem for the Adelaide-based pilot.
New Zealand does not have forecasters in the Antarctic and relies on the United States base forecasters.
But Mr Sanson said the US had a long-standing policy of providing forecasts only for national programmes, because of "a liability issue".
Mr Johanson's plight was among issues discussed by Foreign Affairs Minister Phil Goff and his Australian counterpart, Alexander Downer.
Last edited by Heliport; 15th Dec 2003 at 02:48.